What Is The Truth About God?

[RaymondG]

lol so much I want to say but I will refrain...btw 2 Timothy 2:15 tells us to actually dig into the word and study it, there are ways to do that while insuring we have the right understanding, it's called rightly dividing the word.

lol, I dont doubt for a second that you have much to say. I would encourage you to, after saying all you have to say, take some time to listen.

"If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him."

 

[razzelflabben]

Just got your second reply after I posted mine......You cant agree with me, because i gave you nothing to agree or disagree with....Only quoted a scripture and asked a question.

further study would not be fruitful for me, as my carnal mind is enmity against God and it cannot understand the things of the spirit....And it is in spirit that God requires worship. I no longer wish to stand on my own understandings....so I much remove my sandals and go in with no thoughts.

I find no fault in anything you have said.

well, part of the problem is that evil was added to my words which were not part of the original context and so you were playing into the reinventing game another poster is playing...it really stumps me why people think it is okay to reinvent what others say but it happens a lot on these boards.

 

[razzelflabben]

lol, I dont doubt for a second that you have much to say. I would encourage you to, after saying all you have to say, take some time to listen.

"If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him."

lol I spend most of my time listening...it's to the point of ridiculous how much I listen only to be told that what I have to say is not worth being heard...you know, like taking my words out of context and reinventing what I said is a form of telling my my words are not worth listening to...so maybe next time you can take your own advice and listen before speaking?

 

[PeaceJoyLove]

read the context, some things are created when something else happens...for example, if I put flour and sugar together with an egg and some flavoring I create a cake...that does not mean that I have some magical power to create something from nothing. Man created the suffering in the world not by "magically creating" something from nothing but rather a situation was created by man's introducing sin into the otherwise perfect creation God made.

This part of this post makes it seem like you want to argue that God created sin which is not a "something" as in substance that is associated with something created...like saying, God created my thoughts or something obscure like that...Did God create the capacity for man to sin? Sure...Did He create sin? No but as I said above, we are not creating something new we are introducing sin into what was already created and if you read my words in context you will know that without question is what I said.

Now...I do not tolerate people reinventing what I say by twisting it, taking it out of context, etc. So either address what I said in context or stop responding to me. Who creates your thoughts? Who creates your desires to sin? Who creates the thought you will have in 10 days 6 hours and 15 mins from now? Sure God created the ability for man to think but He would never "create" an evil thought for you to act on...

Which all has to do with where one is 'seeing' from...as in the question God asked Adam, "Where art thou?" The truth (being revealed within) narrows down to ONE...there is no place God is not. God is either an absolute or he is not; either knowledge rules over you, or (Christ within) you rule over knowledge...an issue of soul... (which the woman who God separated from Adam is a picture of...one became two...that now must become ONE again.) Amazing plan HE purposed in Himself from the beginning...

All things work together for good...When did Adam and the woman first perceive such a thing as evil? Which is the same truth in relation to our very soul and how/where we are seeing (and eating) from...

He has brought me to the place where I see no suffering...that God fills all in all...is father of us all...that God's will is always done whether anyone does God's will...to bring about completion of His plan purposed from the beginning...all is good...



Psalm 139:1 O lord, thou hast searched me, and known me.

2 Thou knowest my downsitting and mine uprising, thou understandest my thought afar off.

3 Thou compassest my path and my lying down, and art acquainted with all my ways.

4 For there is not a word in my tongue, but, lo, O Lord, thou knowest it altogether.

5 Thou hast beset me behind and before, and laid thine hand upon me.

6 Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high, I cannot attain unto it.

7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?

8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.

9 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea;

10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.

11 If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me.

12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee.

13 For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb.

14 I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well.

15 My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.

16 Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.

17 How precious also are thy thoughts unto me, O God! how great is the sum of them!

 

[PeaceJoyLove]

I don't know what you want to talk about to know what point you are trying to make which is why I asked you how it relates and I still don't know. As to suffering...the two passages above as well as others show that scripture itself understands the word suffering, the question is why don't you understand the word meaning?

Why did God ask Adam "Where art thou?" after the eyesight change in the garden? This question is very important as it relates to these words Jesus spoke. I have told you these things so that in Me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation. But take courage; I have overcome the world!"

Suffering came after the fall/eyesight change/sin entered the world... Jesus said to them, If you were blind, you should have no sin: but now you say, We see; therefore your sin remains.

Everything to do with how we 'see' in relation to what happened in the garden...

Yep...when we are face to face with God in heaven...in fact, scripture warns us to not listen to those that proclaim this to have already come.

And where does Jesus say heaven is?

For Paul, this was the truth of reality he already saw within himself....Galatians 1:12 I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.
(And what did Paul say the mystery now being revealed was? "Christ in you...")

Galatians 1:15 But when God, who set me apart from my mother’s womb and called me by His grace, was pleased 16 to reveal His Son in me...

Why do you suppose Jesus said these words? Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.

God's kingdom has always been...and 'seeing' it has everything to do with perception. The five senses perceive it outside/separate, not inward/inner-being truth...We are the dwelling place of God/temple not made with human hands...Isaiah 6...His glory fills the temple (when we have eye to 'see'...)

The truth of God is likened to a seed that grows ...just as looking in a glass dimly at first, the image being revealed by the same spirit that rose Jesus from the grave...lives in you/being revealed in you...as scripture says.

The Day of the LORD goes from darkness/Night to light/Day...As Jacob wrestled with God from dark of night til dawn, refusing to let go until he received the promise...though it wounded him in the flesh...is a picture of this journey of our soul...holding on/believing in the promise

 

[razzelflabben]

Which all has to do with where one is 'seeing' from...as in the question God asked Adam, "Where art thou?"

I beg to differ...our perspective has absolutely no bearing on the truth of scripture. I provided 3 different passages that testify to what I said about man being the one that brought sin into the world and with that sin, suffering...you dismiss that because of something about perspective and I disagree....Scripture does not rely on my perspective to be truth. Now if you want to show me how scripture is wrong or how I understand the scripture (though it is plainly stated) is wrong, please do but do not ask me to throw scripture out just to accept your idea that perspective changes what scripture says. Now before you take that out of context, yes, the HS interprets for us, iow's the spiritually minded person has a different perspective than the unbeliever but we are not talking about that right now, we are talking about what scripture plainly states not some spiritual meaning.

The truth (being revealed within) narrows down to ONE...there is no place God is not. God is either an absolute or he is not; either knowledge rules over you, or (Christ within) you rule over knowledge...an issue of soul... (which the woman who God separated from Adam is a picture of...one became two...that now must become ONE again.) Amazing plan HE purposed in Himself from the beginning...

I have no idea how you think that addresses how suffering came into our world and the only possible thought I had you made no comment on, so I got nothing....that being said, God is absolute...that wasn't being discussed in that part of the discussion either

All things work together for good...When did Adam and the woman first perceive such a thing as evil? Which is the same truth in relation to our very soul and how/where we are seeing (and eating) from...

He has brought me to the place where I see no suffering...that God fills all in all...is father of us all...that God's will is always done whether anyone does God's will...to bring about completion of His plan purposed from the beginning...all is good...

huh? More dismissing of scripture? I just don't get why you are so obsessed with dismissing what scripture says on the matter of how suffering came into the world.

Psalm 139:1 O lord, thou hast searched me, and known me.

2 Thou knowest my downsitting and mine uprising, thou understandest my thought afar off.

3 Thou compassest my path and my lying down, and art acquainted with all my ways.

4 For there is not a word in my tongue, but, lo, O Lord, thou knowest it altogether.

5 Thou hast beset me behind and before, and laid thine hand upon me.

6 Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high, I cannot attain unto it.

7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?

8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.

9 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea;

10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.

11 If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me.

12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee.

13 For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb.

14 I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well.

15 My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.

16 Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.

17 How precious also are thy thoughts unto me, O God! how great is the sum of them!

yep, but none of that says He puts the individual thoughts into your head, which is what I asked you for....interesting deflection.

 

[razzelflabben]

Why did God ask Adam "Where art thou?" after the eyesight change in the garden? This question is very important as it relates to these words Jesus spoke. I have told you these things so that in Me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation. But take courage; I have overcome the world!"

Suffering came after the fall/eyesight change/sin entered the world... Jesus said to them, If you were blind, you should have no sin: but now you say, We see; therefore your sin remains.

Everything to do with how we 'see' in relation to what happened in the garden...

and so you refuse the scripture that says man brought sin into the world...I am sorry but I can't dismiss passages just because they don't fit what I want them to say.

As to the above, we are given sight...as in the light shines in the darkness, etc. but that is a totally different topic so it needs to wait till we change the topic.

And where does Jesus say heaven is?

I believe the passage you are referring to shows in context that Jesus is talking about whether or not the Kingdom has already come and the answer He gives is no.

For Paul, this was the truth of reality he already saw within himself....Galatians 1:12 I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.
(And what did Paul say the mystery now being revealed was? "Christ in you...")

now you change the topic to mystery revealed...in time we can get to that topic but for now we are still trying to figure out what you want to say about how suffering entered into our world.

Galatians 1:15 But when God, who set me apart from my mother’s womb and called me by His grace, was pleased 16 to reveal His Son in me...

Why do you suppose Jesus said these words? Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.

God's kingdom has always been...and 'seeing' it has everything to do with perception. The five senses perceive it outside/separate, not inward/inner-being truth...We are the dwelling place of God/temple not made with human hands...Isaiah 6...His glory fills the temple (when we have eye to 'see'...)

see above...We (believers unto salvation) are the temple of the Living God but the temple and the Kingdom are not the same thing as you seem to be suggesting....when we are ready to discuss the temple vs. the Kingdom we can look at scripture to see that I am right on the matter.

The truth of God is likened to a seed that grows ...just as looking in a glass dimly at first, the image being revealed by the same spirit that rose Jesus from the grave...lives in you/being revealed in you...as scripture says.

The Day of the LORD goes from darkness/Night to light/Day...As Jacob wrestled with God from dark of night til dawn, refusing to let go until he received the promise...though it wounded him in the flesh...is a picture of this journey of our soul...holding on/believing in the promise

now you are back to talking about light and dark or another way of saying the same thing, given sight...you are so confusing when you jump all over the place like this and refuse scripture in the process.

 

[PeaceJoyLove]

as I said...read my comment in the context it was given not take it out of context and thus reinvent what I said...Man created suffering by introducing sin into our world...that is what I said...the rest was reinvented and you would be well served to ignore posters who reinvent and stick with what was really said....so do you also want to throw out the passages that tell us that man introduced sin into our world?

Yes, as I suggested a long long long time ago, God does bring disaster/bad times/calamity/suffering into our lives but that He is not the one that introduced such into our world in the first place.

God said it wasn't good for for man to be alone (before he placed Adam in a deep slumber to take out the woman who prepared the feast he ate) in contrast to when God proclaimed all that He had made as 'Very good.'

Your statement seemed to imply that God had no idea and Adam/man acted outside the will of God. I don't disagree that Adam's action began our journey of soul...It was not good for man to be alone, and yet God knew His remedy for this would bring Adam/man to a death.

so are you suggesting here that God creating woman from man was the beginning of suffering in the world? Cause I have an issue with that from the biblical standpoint.

It all speaks to the duality within...that was part of the plan/purpose God purposed in Himself before the foundation of the world...HE knew what HE was doing from the beginning. Or are you saying God did not know what HE was doing?

Adam was one, alone, with God...Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. (ONE...until God placed him in deep slumber, wounded his side to take out the woman...

For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it pierces even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow. It is able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.


What happened with the woman at the tree in light of this:

James 1:14 But each one is tempted when by his own evil desires he is lured away and enticed. 15 Then after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is fully grown, it gives birth to death. 16 Do not be deceived, my beloved brothers. 17 Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, with whom there is no change or shifting shadow. 18 He chose to give us birth through the word of truth, that we would be a kind of firstfruits of His creation. 19 My beloved brothers, understand this: Everyone should be quick to listen, slow to speak, and slow to anger, 20 for man's anger does not bring about the righteousness that God desires. 21 Therefore, get rid of all moral filth and every expression of evil, and humbly receive the word planted in you, which can save your souls. 22 Be doers of the word, and not hearers only. Otherwise, you are deceiving yourselves. 23 For anyone who hears the word but does not carry it out is like a man who looks at his face in a mirror, 24 and after observing himself goes away and immediately forgets what he looks like.


He who has the bride is the bridegroom...in light of what Adam said after he saw the woman God took out of him...Genesis 2:24 (Adam did not name her Eve until after the fall...)

Isaiah 54:5 For your husband is your Maker...as it relates to our soul and becoming ONE (again)...the plan God purposed from the beginning...

All inward truth...

 

[PeaceJoyLove]

and so you refuse the scripture that says man brought sin into the world...I am sorry but I can't dismiss passages just because they don't fit what I want them to say.

As to the above, we are given sight...as in the light shines in the darkness, etc. but that is a totally different topic so it needs to wait till we change the topic. I believe the passage you are referring to shows in context that Jesus is talking about whether or not the Kingdom has already come and the answer He gives is no. now you change the topic to mystery revealed...in time we can get to that topic but for now we are still trying to figure out what you want to say about how suffering entered into our world. see above...We (believers unto salvation) are the temple of the Living God but the temple and the Kingdom are not the same thing as you seem to be suggesting....when we are ready to discuss the temple vs. the Kingdom we can look at scripture to see that I am right on the matter. now you are back to talking about light and dark or another way of saying the same thing, given sight...you are so confusing when you jump all over the place like this and refuse scripture in the process.

It is all one truth that goes back to the beginning. I see God in everything, HE is good.

No matter what or how I say it, you are not hearing what has been said. But that is okay. You are exactly where you need to be. Nothing out of order.

 

[razzelflabben]

It all speaks to the duality within...that was part of the plan/purpose God purposed in Himself before the foundation of the world...HE knew what HE was doing from the beginning. Or are you saying God did not know what HE was doing?

???? of course He knew what He was doing from the beginning. Even the creation account is a testimony to God's plan for man...but that IS NOT what is being talked about. We are talking about How suffering entered the world and scripture is very clear on this matter that it came because of man's sin...

Adam was one, alone, with God...Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. (ONE...until God placed him in deep slumber, wounded his side to take out the woman...

For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it pierces even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow. It is able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.

I am sorry, the only thing I can figure out that you insert this for is to suggest that Adam needing a help mate is what brought suffering into the world and I refuse to agree with you on that since scripture clearly says it was man's sin that brought suffering.

What happened with the woman at the tree in light of this:

James 1:14 But each one is tempted when by his own evil desires he is lured away and enticed. 15 Then after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is fully grown, it gives birth to death. 16 Do not be deceived, my beloved brothers. 17 Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, with whom there is no change or shifting shadow. 18 He chose to give us birth through the word of truth, that we would be a kind of firstfruits of His creation. 19 My beloved brothers, understand this: Everyone should be quick to listen, slow to speak, and slow to anger, 20 for man's anger does not bring about the righteousness that God desires. 21 Therefore, get rid of all moral filth and every expression of evil, and humbly receive the word planted in you, which can save your souls. 22 Be doers of the word, and not hearers only. Otherwise, you are deceiving yourselves. 23 For anyone who hears the word but does not carry it out is like a man who looks at his face in a mirror, 24 and after observing himself goes away and immediately forgets what he looks like.

amen to scripture especially when it confirms what I have said as this one does. Even though it is off topic again.

He who has the bride is the bridegroom...in light of what Adam said after he saw the woman God took out of him...Genesis 2:24 (Adam did not name her Eve until after the fall...)

Isaiah 54:5 For your husband is your Maker...as it relates to our soul and becoming ONE (again)...the plan God purposed from the beginning...

All inward truth...

again off topic...please either stay on topic or stop quoting my responses so that everyone knows it's a free for all.

 

[razzelflabben]

It is all one truth that goes back to the beginning. I see God in everything, HE is good.

No matter what or how I say it, you are not hearing what has been said. But that is okay. You are exactly where you need to be. Nothing out of order.

lol of my...I have said God was in it but insist that what scripture says is that answer we must give and that somehow makes me wrong...why would God tell us something if He wanted us to believe something different?

 

[mozo41]

sin/serpent entered into the garden/soul by a commandment/law spoken/created ...

 

[PeaceJoyLove]

???? of course He knew what He was doing from the beginning. Even the creation account is a testimony to God's plan for man...but that IS NOT what is being talked about. We are talking about How suffering entered the world and scripture is very clear on this matter that it came because of man's sin... I am sorry, the only thing I can figure out that you insert this for is to suggest that Adam needing a help mate is what brought suffering into the world and I refuse to agree with you on that since scripture clearly says it was man's sin that brought suffering. amen to scripture especially when it confirms what I have said as this one does. Even though it is off topic again.again off topic...please either stay on topic or stop quoting my responses so that everyone knows it's a free for all.

I've not gone off topic. The title of this thread "What is the Truth About God"...is that not what is being spoken here?

The whole book, cover to cover, speaks to the truth and why we 'see' suffering in the world (which has a purpose, this suffering, for a time) and the promise of how it ends...which takes us back to the beginning that has no end in sight. All ONE topic...the journey of our very soul...

 

[razzelflabben]

I've not gone off topic. The title of this thread "What is the Truth About God"...is that not what is being spoken here?

The whole book, cover to cover, speaks to the truth and why we 'see' suffering in the world (which has a purpose, this suffering, for a time) and the promise of how it ends...which takes us back to the beginning that has no end in sight. All ONE topic...the journey of our very soul...

I was asked a specific question and I answered it...you then came and quoted from that answer to go off on some tangent that is quite frankly disturbing to what I was asked and answered...we are done since you show no evidence of trying to stay on topic when quoting me.

 

[mozo41]

I've not gone off topic. The title of this thread "What is the Truth About God"...is that not what is being spoken here?

The whole book, cover to cover, speaks to the truth and why we 'see' suffering in the world (which has a purpose, this suffering, for a time) and the promise of how it ends...which takes us back to the beginning that has no end in sight. All ONE topic...the journey of our very soul...

when i got my bible i dived in with much enthusiasm and about 15 mm of pages in i realized i had not understood even one sentence ... so i stopped reading it

 

[razzelflabben]

sin/serpent entered into the garden/soul by a commandment/law spoken/created ...

scripture says that sin entered through ONE MAN that is what I'm sticking with, you can believe whatever you want.

 

[faroukfarouk]

one of my all time favorite passages, memorized it years ago

Yes, it's good to memorize Scripture.

 

[faroukfarouk]

when i got my bible i dived in with much enthusiasm and about 15 mm of pages in i realized i had not understood even one sentence ... so i stopped reading it

Read John chapter 1: it's in clear, straightforward language. If this clear, straightforward language is too difficult for the average reader, it says more about the reader than the Book.

 

[mozo41]

scripture says that sin entered through ONE MAN that is what I'm sticking with, you can believe whatever you want.

i am not disagreeing with you only expanding on the how ...

 

[mozo41]

Read John chapter 1: it's in clear, straightforward language. If this clear, straightforward language is too difficult for the average reader, it says more about the reader than the Book.

pass ... i study GODS word as and when He reveals it to me