What is the reason for the massive retail looting?

[TLK Valentine]

Where did you come by this estimate?

The Economic Policy Institute's study: https://www.epi.org/publication/employers-steal-billions-from-workers-paychecks-each-year/

And I see i am quite mistaken -- the $8 billion figure comes from their study of only 10 US states -- the the actual number must be far greater...

 

[grasping the after wind]

The Economic Policy Institute's study: Employers steal billions from workers’ paychecks each year: Survey data show millions of workers are paid less than the minimum wage, at significant cost to taxpayers and state economies

And I see i am quite mistaken -- the $8 billion figure comes from their study of only 10 US states -- the the actual number must be far greater...

What are the credentials of the Ecomnmic Policy Institute that would make me consider that surveys done by the Economic Policy Instutiture are valid and reliable? I would check what they say about themselves but I refuse to give them my email.

Additonally, does the survey show that the people and companies being stolen from by the organized ganfgs of theives are the same employers that the Economic Policy Institute's survey respondents claim are stealing form their employees. Further, were these gang members the people that the Econmic Policy Institute's survey responsdents show were harmed by the people and companies they are stealing from?

 

[TLK Valentine]

What are the credentials of the Ecomnmic Policy Institute that would make me consider that surveys done by the Economic Policy Instutiture are valid and reliable?

Better than your own by a country mile, i would be willing to wager.

Of course, you are free to Google "wage theft" on your own and choose whichever study has credentials to your satisfaction... nevertheless, there are no shortage of workers who have been cheated by the system, and for every one of them, there are a hundred who think they've been cheated...

This of course in no way excuses or justifies their looting; merely points out the inevitability of it -- after all, we've all seen what happens when people think they've been cheated out of something far less significant than a paycheck...

 

[RDKirk]

When a person is posting in a forum, I don't think that post causes federal law enforcement to decide a crime it is not a federal responsibility. Therefore, I am not about to get overly concerned when the word looting is used in such a context.

I'm talking about how the law enforcement authorities categorize it, which is the issue people are posting about. How the law enforcement authorities categorize it tells us how they plan to handle it.

They won't call it "looting" for good reason, but their hesitancy to call it "organized crime" is IMO a problem.

 

[grasping the after wind]

Better than your own by a country mile, i would be willing to wager.

I suppose you believe what they say on faith alone then? Yet you seem unable to produce a basis for having that faith. BTW what do I have to do with this? I haven't put forward any surveys for anyone to check the reliability of validity of. Are you suggesting that there is no difference between checking the reliability and validity of my opinions and checking the validity and reliability of the claims of facts in the surveys of the Economic Policy Institute?


Did you have anything to add in regard to the rest of my post concerning whether the thieves were one and the same as those respondents that claimed that employers stole from the employees?

 

[grasping the after wind]

I'm talking about how the law enforcement authorities categorize it, which is the issue people are posting about. How the law enforcement authorities categorize it tells us how they plan to handle it.

They won't call it "looting" for good reason, but their hesitancy to call it "organized crime" is IMO a problem.

Could you expand on that? Who is being hesitant to call it organized crime? Why is that a problem? Is there a definition of organized crime that fits what is going on but that might not fit the public's perception of what organized crime is?

 

[Astrid]

(1) I suppose that the looters are letting of emotional stress by believing that they are getting back at the white power structure that has worked against them for 400+ years.
(2) I guess the looters achieve some small economic gain by looting, though probably not much.

I do agree that opportunism is a big factor, as police have resigned and retired all across the country in recent months. However, I still stand by George Floyd's death and related police issues as the main reason behind all this. Albion, all I can can say about your comment is, God help us, if this spreads to small towns and rural areas.

I think when owners start shooting the looters
it will look less profitable.

 

[durangodawood]

I think when owners start shooting the looters
it will look less profitable.

I dont see it. High end malls and shopping streets would rather suffer losses than be known as a zone of sudden gunfights.

 

[98cwitr]

No doubt there are multiple reasons. Some will blame all this on the pandemic and others on inflation, while some will even point to a reduction in police ranks around the country. Personally, I am 100% convinced that the key reason is the death of George Floyd at the hands of Minneapolis police and related cases like it. What think the rest of you?

Lack of consequence

 

[Astrid]

I dont see it. High end malls and shopping streets would rather suffer losses than be known as a zone of sudden gunfights.

I was referring to the " spread to small towns"

 

[durangodawood]

I was referring to the " spread to small towns"

I dont see organized retail theft descending on the "Family Dollar" store.

 

[grasping the after wind]

I dont see it. High end malls and shopping streets would rather suffer losses than be known as a zone of sudden gunfights.

More likely they will simply move out of the areas where such activity is allowed to continue. As usual the real victims will not be large companies but small local owned businesses and especially the law-abiding citizens stuck in the areas where those in government don't care about the real problems they face.

 

[durangodawood]

More likely they will simply move out of the areas where such activity is allowed to continue. As usual the real victims will not be large companies but small local owned businesses and especially the law-abiding citizens stuck in the areas where those in government don't care about the real problems they face.

I'm pretty sure law enforcement is all over this issue. But its hard to be everywhere at once. And the shotgun behind the counter is not going to fly at the Hermes boutique.

The real problem storefront retail faces is e-commerce. What is the govt doing about that? What should it do?

 

[Astrid]

I dont see organized retail theft descending on the "Family Dollar" store.

Whatevs. But meeting force with overwhelming counterforce is
sometimes the only way.

 

[RDKirk]

I dont see organized retail theft descending on the "Family Dollar" store.

Except at levels we've seen before. We've seen cases before where a bunch of teenagers have run into a store, grabbed nominal items off shelves, and run back out again.

But when we're talking about high-value items intended for fencing...that's not going down to the Family Dollar level. Not even to the WalMart level.

 

[RDKirk]

Whatevs. But meeting force with overwhelming counterforce is
sometimes the only way.

One of the unsung problems with killing in self-defense in the US is that even if you win the case, that successful defense is likely to break you financially. There is special insurance for it for private individuals (I carry such insurance myself), but coverage specifics are narrow...there is a lot of small print.

 

[Astrid]

One of the unsung problems with killing in self-defense in the US is that even if you win the case, that successful defense is likely to break you financially. There is special insurance for it for private individuals (I carry such insurance myself), but coverage specifics are narrow...there is a lot of small print.

At one time i owned a gun. In the USA, that is. Here its awful unlawful.
A friend gave it to me, after I was assaulted.
I learned to use it, thinking, " Never again, he will die or I will die first".

Not happy times In my life!

Any possible court costs would not have been a problem,
but, the more I think now the more I see the massive emotional
devastation that would result.
Hardly needed to go with the PTSD symptoms that so haunted
me back then!

 

[cow451]

1. Organized crime
2. People are poor.
3. Little reprocussion

#1 being the #1 thing.

 

[Astrid]

#1 being the #1 thing.

Depends on what you ate.

 

[rambot]

Depends on what you ate.

cute...but you may be thinking of #2