What is it to be a True Believer?

[timothyu]

It's delusional.

Because it became a theological mindset rather than a movement of servitude to not only each other but the will of God. No wonder it has become so splintered.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

What difference does it make. Fake is fake, and it can't be improved as far as being authentic. Clearly the apostasy was apparent at least 1800 years ago. Today the religion is comprised of tens of thousands of differing denominations, with no two exactly alike in interpretation and understanding of the same biblical or scriptural testimony. It's a marketplace of counterfeiters. They are strangers to God and truth. It's more comfortable for them this way. I'm not trying to be a fault finding hard case. But should I entrust my eternal soul to such a fraud as what stands before me, offering salvation. If Gods house is one of order, where there is no variableness or shadow of turning. Then what is this creature that presents itself as Christianity when there is no continuity in it. There is no one Christ or head to it. It is tens of thousands of different heads, all jabbering different things. It's delusional. So it is safer for its captives to abide in the comfort ones own denomination for the cause of peace, than to consider the madness of the whole.

What difference does it make?

And Mormons AREN'T just another one of the tens of thousands of differing denominations? How are Mormons not just another choice, or even just another fraud?

I think you're historically confused.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Because it became a theological mindset rather than a movement of servitude to not only each other but the will of God. No wonder it has become so splintered.

It has also become splintered for the simple fact that the Bible isn't a comprehensive, unified textbook, nor was it given to humanity in that form.

If people want that sort of view about Divine Revelation having come straight down out of Heaven in written form, they need to become a Muslim.

 

[timothyu]

the Bible isn't a comprehensive, unified textbook, nor was it given to humanity in that form.

True enough. Even the order of the OT was changed and the NT was assembled so as not to pit Peter and Paul against each other in back to back books.

 

[Injeun]

What difference does it make?

And Mormons AREN'T just another one of the tens of thousands of differing denominations? How are Mormons not just another choice, or even just another fraud?

I think you're historically confused.

Historically, I think I'm in the ball park. The LDS Church isn't another bible based Church, and doesn't follow the tradition of bible based religion. Even this forum doesn't recognize the LDS Church or myself as Christian or party to what they deem to be Christian. Where traditional Christianity is what men make of the bible, the LDS Church was restored by God thru the prophet Joseph Smith. So the LDS Church is led by a prophet and twelve apostles as in the bible. And it teaches one gospel, one Christ and one God as opposed to the tens of thousands taught in bible based religion. The LDS Church also has another testimony of Jesus Christ called the Book of Mormon to go with the holy bible. So it is two testimonies of the same Christ. The LDS Church also teaches more thru its prophets than what's in the bible because it is the progression of Gods work as opposed to rehashing what he has already accomplished which is what traditional Christianity tries to accomplish via the assumption that Jesus Christs great sacrifice is the end of his Fathers work. It is not the end, but it is pivotal. Speaking favorably of my own Church is likely to either get this post deleted or myself banned by admin. So I won't say more.

 

[David Lamb]

Gods house is a house of order. There is only one true God, Christ and gospel. So there can only be one true Church. Which of the tens of thousands of differing denominations in bible based religion is that one true Church? You can't name it and neither can they. It is called Christianity but it doesn't have a head or unition in Christ. Amos said that God does nothing but thru his prophets. (Amos 3:7) So where is the prophet at the head of Christianity? There isn't one. It is headless. So they say, well, Christ is our head and there is no more need for a prophet. But they aren't united in Christ either. So that blows that excuse away. Not to mention the fact that Jesus Christ himself said that others would come later in his name who would do more than he because his mission was finished and he had to return to his Father. (John 14:12) So Jesus isn't the final prophet in the ongoing work of God as Christians say, so as to seek refuge in their marketplace of counterfeiters. With God and the biblical testimony aside, that traditional Christianity is a giant hoax is self evident. It is disconnected from God, and is involved in trying to fabricate an image of the original, each going their own way, as one might do in life, but now even in religion, and scattered all the more.

What you say is just not so. There are local churches in a variety of denominations which are indeed united in the Lord Jesus Christ as their Head. I don't know what you mean by "traditional Christianity," but there are churches and Christians who do not believe in "giant hoaxes", but in the bible, the very word of God Himself.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Historically, I think I'm in the ball park. The LDS Church isn't another bible based Church, and doesn't follow the tradition of bible based religion. Even this forum doesn't recognize the LDS Church or myself as Christian or party to what they deem to be Christian. Where traditional Christianity is what men make of the bible, the LDS Church was restored by God thru the prophet Joseph Smith. So the LDS Church is led by a prophet and twelve apostles as in the bible. And it teaches one gospel, one Christ and one God as opposed to the tens of thousands taught in bible based religion. The LDS Church also has another testimony of Jesus Christ called the Book of Mormon to go with the holy bible. So it is two testimonies of the same Christ. The LDS Church also teaches more thru its prophets than what's in the bible because it is the progression of Gods work as opposed to rehashing what he has already accomplished which is what traditional Christianity tries to accomplish via the assumption that Jesus Christs great sacrifice is the end of his Fathers work. It is not the end, but it is pivotal. Speaking favorably of my own Church is likely to either get this post deleted or myself banned by admin. So I won't say more.

You're obviously a True Mormon Believer. For my part, I can't just put all of my chips in and 'bet' on one person's assertions (like those of Joseph Smith), especially when someone like yourself offers no evidence but rather sheer assertions.

Besides, I know very well that Joseph Smith was no polymath. He also wasn't a prophet.

 

[Fervent]

A true believer is one who has surrendered themselves to God. They no longer seek anything but what is written in the Word to convey Truth to them, and they trust the repository of Truth that God has provided with them. They must first exceed the limits of human skepticism and find the Truth that there is but one Foundation to build upon. A True Believer is one who looks at the world and says, "This can't be all there is."

 

[timothyu]

A True Believer is one who looks at the world and says, "This can't be all there is."

A true believer then says, wow are we ever backwards in our thinking, having built our world on the basis of sin which is selfishness, serving self rather than in the ways we are taught of the kingdom, which says rather than focus on self, serve the needs of all, caring for each other without making a business or power structure out of it.

 

[partinobodycular]

A true believer is one who has surrendered themselves to God. They no longer seek anything but what is written in the Word to convey Truth to them, and they trust the repository of Truth that God has provided with them. They must first exceed the limits of human skepticism and find the Truth that there is but one Foundation to build upon. A True Believer is one who looks at the world and says, "This can't be all there is."

A true believer then says, wow are we ever backwards in our thinking, having built our world on the basis of sin which is selfishness, serving self rather than in the ways we are taught of the kingdom, which says rather than focus on self, serve the needs of all, caring for each other without making a business or power structure out of it.

To me these are both examples of people who have fallen victim to their own narcissistic delusions, and believe that they've found an answer that's somehow eluded pretty much everybody else.

How about we just go with 'Love thy neighbor' and leave the esoteric bits to the more anally inclined.

 

[Fervent]

To me these are both examples of people who have fallen victim to their own narcissistic delusions, and believe that they've found an answer that's somehow eluded pretty much everybody else.

There are many who have discovered this truth, though perhaps not been able to articulate it as such. Many surrender to faith and move on from there. It's all a matter of what point the surrender is made.

How about we just go with 'Love thy neighbor' and leave the esoteric bits to the more anally inclined.

Seeking to justify themselves, people are bound to ask...who is my neighbor?

 

[timothyu]

believe that they've found an answer that's somehow eluded pretty much everybody else.

Nothing the Gospel of the Kingdom doesn't clearly state in scripture. Not so much found in the religion though created in man's image..

 

[timothyu]

Seeking to justify themselves, people are bound to ask...who is my neighbor?

Exactly.. then using the knowledge of good and evil, redefine both love and neighbour to suit themselves.

 

[timothyu]

and believe that they've found an answer that's somehow eluded pretty much everybody else.

Compared to tradition which is the blind leading the blind?

 

[partinobodycular]

Seeking to justify themselves, people are bound to ask...who is my neighbor?

Ah well, perhaps we should try to answer that question... Christ's own words may be of some help in that regard.

Or we could just do what I do, and assume that everyone is my neighbor. After all, if they weren't before, maybe they will be after.

 

[Fervent]

A true believer then says, wow are we ever backwards in our thinking, having built our world on the basis of sin which is selfishness, serving self rather than in the ways we are taught of the kingdom, which says rather than focus on self, serve the needs of all, caring for each other without making a business or power structure out of it.

But when you give to someone in need, don’t let your left hand know what your right hand is doing.(Matt. 6:3 NLT)

 

[Fervent]

Ah well, perhaps we should try to answer that question... Christ's own words may be of some help in that regard.

Yes, they certainly are.

Or we could just do what I do, and assume that everyone is my neighbor. After all, if they weren't before, maybe they will be after.

That is the pathway to personal debasement or blatant hypocrasy. Some people would rather snuff out the light than admit to their own short comings. They would rather define Truth for themselves than admit that God is Truth.

 

[timothyu]

Everything man touches, we corrupt. We cannot help but try and make everything over in our own image, especially those who cannot see past the self serving ways of mankind, not having grasped the ways of the Kingdom. This applies especially to Christianity which eventually at one time rejected the Kingdom to re-join the world of man and has not repented since. These blind teaching the blind to do likewise. But grain can still be found among the tares. Discernment within Christianity of what is Kingdom and what is influenced by man.

 

[partinobodycular]

That is the pathway to personal debasement or blatant hypocrasy. Some people would rather snuff out the light than admit to their own short comings. They would rather define Truth for themselves than admit that God is Truth.

So do you believe that God is going to judge me adversely if I love someone who isn't actually my neighbor? Somehow I don't find that to be in keeping with the philosophy of His Son.

 

[partinobodycular]

But grain can still be found among the tares. Discernment within Christianity of what is Kingdom and what is influenced by man.

Well I certainly hope that you're happy with your philosophy. But if you don't mind, I think that I'll stick with Micah 6:8.