What if you can't love your enemies?

[CGL1023]

To love those who hate you and to whom you hate back; who can do this? I could never be a Christian; I'm too hateful.

I was moved by a Syrian Christian Bishop reported in Breitbart News, who berated some fellow Syrian fighters; they had captured ISIS soldiers and burned them just as ISIS has been doing right along. It was as if he were saying, "We,as Christians are better than to sink to the depth of ISIS. We have to present ourselves as Christians even on the battlefield, facing an enemy as evil as ISIS." I didn't get the idea that they would turn the other cheek on the battlefield -- rather it was that the Christians were to be distinguishable from ISIS, even in the war setting.
I am still thinking about this report.

 

[MishSill]

Can you explain what is holy or just about what he has done or said here? this does not even scratch the surface of the things he has done to us humans

Holiness is about the sanctification from Evil. God is a Holy God. He cannot even look upon evil.

All those scriptures you quoted are of people worshipping pagan gods and being moved by the spirits of those gods to perform evil acts.

God always gives His warnings first through His prophets then He removes His hand and leaves them to the enemy to devour... and if you think satan loves those people, think again.

There is nothing evil about a Holy and just God who chooses to take His hand of protection off those who, by their own choices, turn their back on Him.

 

[MishSill]

Do you mean He doesn't hate some people? Scripture states that He does.

Can you please point out the scripture that says God hates the people as opposed to the acts they carry out.

 

[oi_antz]

Can you please point out the scripture that says God hates the people as opposed to the acts they carry out.

http://biblehub.com/psalms/5-5.htm
That's the most explicit that comes to mind. There's also the scripture about the types of people who will have a place in the fire. Though, when witnessing what goes on in the world out there, I reckon hate should be expected. It is also written that He loved Jacob and hated Esau. More examples can be found by researching. It should also go without saying (though rhetoric might require it to be said) that one can have both love and hate for a person at the same time.

 

[MishSill]

http://biblehub.com/psalms/5-5.htm
That's the most explicit that comes to mind. There's also the scripture about the types of people who will have a place in the fire. Though, when witnessing what goes on in the world out there, I reckon hate should be expected. It is also written that He loved Jacob and hated Esau. More examples can be found by researching. It should also go without saying (though rhetoric might require it to be said) that one can have both love and hate for a person at the same time.

God cannot look upon evil or invite it in heaven....otherwise we would live in eternal pain and suffering.

Psalm 5 points out the acts of those people.

 

[oi_antz]

God cannot look upon evil or invite it in heaven....otherwise we would live in eternal pain and suffering.

Psalm 5 points out the acts of those people.

OK, thanks for that. It always is interesting to see when a person wishes to remove from Him a normal and justified right to hate someone, because they do not like to admit that He can. I immediately want to know why.

 

[razzelflabben]

To love those who hate you and to whom you hate back; who can do this? I could never be a Christian; I'm too hateful.

we all are, that is why it takes the working of the HS within to be a true believer that follows the ways of Christ

 

[MishSill]

OK, thanks for that. It always is interesting to see when a person wishes to remove from Him a normal and justified right to hate someone, because they do not like to admit that He can. I immediately want to know why.

Considering that God wishes that none perish and all come into eternal life... and His long delay in bringing about the end of the world, not to mention sending His only Son, Jesus to save the world, I would consider all that an enormous display of His love for the world...

God said He was a jealous God so that's telling us that He has feelings. I would think that when God has to turn His back on those who reject Him, He would be feeling enormous sorrow rather than hate. Loves the sinner hates the sin so to speak.

 

[razzelflabben]

I must disagree. I will stand by my statement. I do agree we can keep the OT Ten Commandments, I do not agree that we can rise to the level of the Two. The Ten give us very specific things to do or refrain from doing that we as humans have the physical and mental capacity to accomplish. The Two require a change of the basic character and nature of humanity. There is no specific task only an ongoing state of being that is necessary and inevitably that state of being would lead to acting in the correct way without exception. We surely can and often do make the effort necessary to from time to time act as if we love our neighbor as much as we love ourselves but that is one or two actions done in an attempt to truly love our neighbor as ourselves. Being sometimes able to imitate an action that we would always perform if we were in an actual state of being where we love our neighbor as ourself is not the same as actually loving our neighbor as much as ourselves. Again we may attempt to love God with endless consistently in order to love him with all our heart and mind and soul but we are just simply not capable of being that selfless or committed. If we insist that we are able to love our neighbor as much as we love ourselves and love God with all our heart and mind and soul then we are telling the world that should anyone fall short of those things it is because they are not as worthy as we are rather than telling the world none of us is worthy and only God's intervention saves us from our unworthiness. I recognize the core of self centeredness that resides within me and realize I am helpless to remove it on my own. As for someone not trying because they know they cannot attain perfection, I think using that excuse is proof that they weren't going to try anyway so having an excuse makes them feel better about it. People committed to a goal do not simply give up because they won't fulfill it perfectly. IMO the goal of the Christian path is not to make oneself perfect it is to become humble in the face of the perfect love of God. The best motivator for me in attempting to follow the Two is knowledge that even if I never become any more loving than I have ever been, God will love me anyway. I know that I will never totally succeed in loving my neighbor as much as I love myself or of loving God with the singlemindedness required by Jesus' command but knowing that God is capable of that sort of love makes me more able to move in that direction in response not because of my own strength of character but because of God's.

I am just now finding this thread and reading every post, so please forgive the lateness of my response.

First and foremost, amen and amen.
Secondly, I wanted to go into a bit more detail about humility. We have been in deep, full time study of biblical Love for about 7 years now and still going strong, most people equate hatred with being the opposite of Love, but it is NOT. The core of Love (capital Love meaning Biblical Love) is humility, making the opposite of Love pride. That being said, God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble, He humbles us, bringing us low so that we are able to actually Love.

Most recently, God has challenged my own humility and ability to Love through two clear examples of putting others above myself in an act of humility. The first revolves around the lung spasms I am pron to. They have gotten so bad and are so painful and draining that I have stopped going to church if I am having lung spasms on Sat. night or Sun. morning. One Sat. night, I was having severe spasms and told my husband I would not being going to church with him in the morning, about that time, I got a phone call from a friend who has been away from the church because of hurts for some time. Her daughter had been living in defiance of her covenant with God and wanted to come to church but wanted to sit with me so she felt safe, could she sit with me. Humility demands that I go, that I sit with her, no matter how bad I feel (not contagious). I am certainly justified not to go, but to Love her as I Love myself, means, I go.

The other situation was from someone very very close to me. He said and did some things that were very hurtful and I was angry with a righteous anger. Yet humility demands that I set aside that righteous anger to bear upon myself the pain that he is and was feeling that caused him to react the way he did. It is the way Christ Loved, the way Biblical Love is commanded and the Love we are called to. The problem is as you have wisely said, this type of humility is not natural to mankind and needs a supernatural working in order to set aside our own interests in order to Love another as ourselves, to Love an enemy with that kind of Love is harder yet. (Got some stories about learning that lesson as well)

 

[razzelflabben]

Hate is the natural response to being hurt by someone. How does one find the strength to not hate the killer of one's spouse or one's child or one's best friend? There are some recent examples of people being able to rise above that reaction but the norm is quite different.

agreed, but it is also more times than not, a natural reaction to fear as well.

 

[razzelflabben]

well hate is a natural human emotion that is no good to deny as it will seep out one way or another but to get to the source of it you gotta dig deep inside yourself...maybe its just the person has terrible tendencies, or maybe behaviors that have hurt you in younger years, maybe even as ive been noticing in more recent days qualities in yourself that you may have a hard time dealing with or keeping in control and seeing these qualities in another sets you off. whatever the cause just understand people are as lost or as confused as you are and really cannot see themselves as for some reason the hardest thing to see is ourselves....and if you want to know a secret that most people here will deny..god has a lot of hate himself...murderous hate to be exact

Cursed be he who does the Lords work remissly, cursed he who holds back his sword from blood. (Jeremiah 48:10 NAB)

I will make Mount Seir utterly desolate, killing off all who try to escape and any who return. I will fill your mountains with the dead. Your hills, your valleys, and your streams will be filled with people slaughtered by the sword. I will make you desolate forever. Your cities will never be rebuilt. Then you will know that I am the LORD. (Ezekiel 35:7-9 NLT)

You Ethiopians will also be slaughtered by my sword," says the LORD. And the LORD will strike the lands of the north with his fist. He will destroy Assyria and make its great capital, Nineveh, a desolate wasteland, parched like a desert. The city that once was so proud will become a pasture for sheep and cattle. All sorts of wild animals will settle there. Owls of many kinds will live among the ruins of its palaces, hooting from the gaping windows. Rubble will block all the doorways, and the cedar paneling will lie open to the wind and weather. This is the fate of that boisterous city, once so secure. "In all the world there is no city as great as I," it boasted. But now, look how it has become an utter ruin, a place where animals live! Everyone passing that way will laugh in derision or shake a defiant fist. (Zephaniah 2:12-15 NLT)


now how can he be so angry with us when he created us? it really seems like he hates his creations no?

This is evidence of what I said about the opposite of Love not being hate but being pride. Thanks for posting that evidence.

 

[razzelflabben]

No He doesn't... a Holy God is a just God or else He wouldn't be Holy.

Just and hate are no more opposites than Love and hate are. Nor are Holy and hate opposites.

 

[razzelflabben]

Love isn't an emotion, thankfully. It is simply an action. Treat your enemies with kindness regardless of how you feel about them. It heaps hot coals on their heads.

Actually, not to stir up trouble, but Biblical Love is emotion, action, attitude and more, it involves the whole man, not just parts of man. That is why it is not only said in scripture to be the greatest, but why it changes situations while transforming lives.

 

[Chicken Little]

"hated Esau" maybe with in Esau, maybe what God is seeing has little to do with the person Esau.. But when he saw Esau God also saw the seeds of rebellion and ages and ages of rebellion and hate and pain and murder and deeds which will only increase man's hell on earth and his debt to death in the after life. I know I would hate the fruit of such seeds if I saw them too ! thus I would hate the seeds also. but that can be person great or even wonderful as a person.
But men have been given choices and maybe even just a few will be saved to represent all of Esau in the next ages. there is still two ages and just a few of his may make it and increase in the 7th day and make it all the way through to the 8th day and be great when it is all over. we don't know the end yet.

 

[razzelflabben]

"hated Esau" maybe with in Esau maybe what God is seeing has little to do with the person Esau.. But when he saw Esau was also saw the seeds of rebellion and ages and ages of rebellion and hate and pain and murder and deeds which will only increase man's hell on earth and his debt to death in the after life. I know I would hate the fruit of such seeds ! thus I would hate the seeds also.
But men have been given choices and maybe even just a few will be saved to represent all of Esau in the next ages. there is still two ages and just a few of his may make it and increase in the 7th day and make it all the way through and be great when it is all over. we don't know the end yet.

My father was a bitter, hateful man who recently died. He professed Christ and lived as if he never even heard of Him much less ever met the Christ. For a long time, especially in the last days and weeks of his life, I struggled with praying for him. Time after time, he was told and shown the Love of God and still he refused to listen. Time after time he would be called on his crap and he would cry then before the tears were dry, would return to doing the exact same things as if no one had ever said a word. Then, one day, I realized why I was having so much trouble praying for him. It wasn't that I wanted harm to come to him, I had forgiven long long ago, rather, it was because I was unable to separate him from his sin.

My point in sharing that with you is that until Christ separates us from our sins by clothing us with the new man, God can't separate us from our sins either. When God says He hates sin, that sin is detestable to Him, the question we have to ask ourselves is, "what does He see when He looks upon us?" Does He see our sin, a sin that He hates, a sin that detestable, or does He see the righteousness of Christ? Sure He hated Esau's sin and Loved Esau enough to desire that He live in righteousness that would allow Him to fellowship with him, but the truth of the whole thing is this, Esau would not separate himself from his sin and therefore, God saw sin when He looked upon Esau.

Go back to the OT to see this idea further. Why was the animal sacrifice so important? Because blood was necessary for covering over the sins so that God could fellowship and look upon the people. Since Love and hate are NOT opposites, they can reside side by side. It is only if they were opposites that this would be a quandary to work out, but the opposite of Love is pride, not hate and so there is not contradiction in understanding that God both Loved Esau and hated him. This is an important concept for people to figure out if they hope to understand how to Love an enemy. And yes, it begins with forgiving, but that is only the beginning.

 

[illuminatorofevil]

Holiness is about the sanctification from Evil. God is a Holy God. He cannot even look upon evil.

All those scriptures you quoted are of people worshipping pagan gods and being moved by the spirits of those gods to perform evil acts.

God always gives His warnings first through His prophets then He removes His hand and leaves them to the enemy to devour... and if you think satan loves those people, think again.

There is nothing evil about a Holy and just God who chooses to take His hand of protection off those who, by their own choices, turn their back on Him.

so what about cain and able? why didnt god like cain he never gave a reason other than he was a farmer. also what did the pagan gods do in the first place? and he is also saying that he is going to or send someone else to do the slaughtering. why didnt he just teach them or open them up to the "truth" wheres is the holy and just god in that? and what about the inquisition where many people pagan and catholic were just brutally murdered/tortured for the simpliest suspicion of one being possesed or having a free thought for that matter all in the name of god.

 

[oi_antz]

Considering that God wishes that none perish and all come into eternal life... and His long delay in bringing about the end of the world, not to mention sending His only Son, Jesus to save the world, I would consider all that an enormous display of His love for the world...

God said He was a jealous God so that's telling us that He has feelings. I would think that when God has to turn His back on those who reject Him, He would be feeling enormous sorrow rather than hate. Loves the sinner hates the sin so to speak.

It is challenging your beliefs, so we should leave it there. Love and hate are not mutually exclusive though.

 

[Masihi]

To love those who hate you and to whom you hate back; who can do this? I could never be a Christian; I'm too hateful.

This statement was not meant to stumble anyone.
This statement exemplifies godliness.
God understands that most people cannot fulfill this doctrine of Christ that is the reason God gave us repentance. If you try to love your neighbor but find yourself not doing so on a some occasion, repent to be at peace with Gd again. Repent and try again. Of most importance is being at peace with Gd thru repentance. This is not an excuse to sin, as Paul stipulated in his book of Romans chapter 6. But rather a Christian will strive to live up to Christ's teachings and if he/she fails, we have an advocate on our behalf, Christ.

 

[razzelflabben]

so what about cain and able? why didnt god like cain he never gave a reason other than he was a farmer. also what did the pagan gods do in the first place? and he is also saying that he is going to or send someone else to do the slaughtering. why didnt he just teach them or open them up to the "truth" wheres is the holy and just god in that? and what about the inquisition where many people pagan and catholic were just brutally murdered/tortured for the simpliest suspicion of one being possesed or having a free thought for that matter all in the name of god.

to answer these questions requires us to see things 1. through God's perspective and 2. with an understanding of what Biblical Love is, both of which I fear is off topic. and not directed at me specifically

 

[illuminatorofevil]

It is challenging your beliefs, so we should leave it there. Love and hate are not mutually exclusive though.

to answer these questions requires us to see things 1. through God's perspective and 2. with an understanding of what Biblical Love is, both of which I fear is off topic. and not directed at me specifically

I have much to say about this but 1) my comment would probably get deleted as it has on other threads 2) you guys would just go around or not answer them and 3) if you do answer them there wont be a straight answer given from anyones personal, free thought but here it goes.

My belifes are not challenged by this on any level rather i feel your rationality to what is being said right before your that you try to twist into something good and holy. I mean have you ever taken a step back and thought about this? and are you sure about that "yes i have" that you tell yourself?

Since this topic is about loving your enemies it seems not to be to far off topic or more of loving your creations which you seem to hate and punish excesivley because you made them imperfect. As for seeing things 1) through gods perspective what does that mean exactly his hypocrisy in not practicing what he preachs? his blatant hate for some humans and love for others for irrational reasons? and 2) can you define biblical love after reading the bible from cover to cover? because after reading it myself im quite confused as to what you mean