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Where did I say anything, in my reply to you, about the Pope in Rome?
It was Luther's sarcasm at its best.
One might say that a certain capacity of authority resides in such disparate groups as the JW's and the LDS because they also have some things in common with Christendom.
That would be completely inaccurate, because those aren’t Christian churches, they are heretical, oppressive cults. And there is no basis for likening the Roman Catholic or Eastern Orthodox churches to them. Doing so would be akin to likening a Covenanting Presbyterian (a capella exclusive psalmody, like the Reformed Presbyterian Church in North America) church to Islam because of the lack of iconography, which is to say, fallacious.
I don’t think any authentic, Nicene Christian denomination with normal worship services can be likened to a non-Christian religion, because you are comparing two entirely different things on the basis of a non-existant common denominator.
Just to be clear, I actually like and enjoy your posts and regard you as a friend; I particularly enjoyed our recent discussion of Philip Johnston and the Four Seasons restaurant think you are in error on this particular point. But please do not take this as personal criticism: my objection is only with your argument, and not you.
Please note that I did not link either of these cults with the RCC or the EOC. My comment was merely to point out the obvious.
Similarity of beliefs can be ranged on a spectrum with complete uniformity at one end and utter disparity at the other. Toward the first end we will find groups such as the EOC and RCC, as well as the various Lutheran denominations compared with each other and not others, various Anglican branches, etc. At the other end we can find comparison between groups such as the LDS and the RCC - virtually nothing in common other than verbiage.
Oh, okay. I am sorry brother, I totally misread your post. Please accept my apologies.
The Small Catechism says it all in the Third Article of the Apostle's Creed:Correct me if I am wrong, but I get a very strong sense that orthodox Lutheranism, at least as understood by the LCMS/LCC, is not monergistic. (WELS on the other hand might be monergistic)
The Small Catechism says it all in the Third Article of the Apostle's Creed:
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3rd Article
05 Of Sanctification.
I believe in the Holy Ghost; one holy Christian Church, the communion of saints; the forgiveness of sins; the resurrection of the body; and the life everlasting. Amen.
06 What does this mean? — Answer.
I believe that I cannot by my own reason or strength believe in Jesus Christ, my Lord, or come to Him; but the Holy Ghost has called me by the Gospel, enlightened me with His gifts, sanctified and kept me in the true faith; even as He calls, gathers, enlightens, and sanctifies the whole Christian Church on earth, and keeps it with Jesus Christ in the one true faith; in which Christian Church He forgives daily and richly all sins to me and all believers, and at the last day will raise up me and all the dead, and will give to me and to all believers in Christ everlasting life. This is most certainly true.
You be the judge.
So true, because of free will and the stain of original sin, we can only reject God, it is only by the Holy Spirit calling us.Well, I believe that, and I am not monergist. There are basically three monergistic belief systems, only one of which can be considered doctrinally non-heterodox, Calvinism; the others are Pelagianism and Universalism.
My understanding is that in the orthodox Lutheran understanding of the faith, one still has free will and could reject the calling of the Holy Ghost, and people are thus not foreordained to damnation as in Calvinism, although Lutheranism edges slightly closer to Monergism than the Arminian Remonstrants, or the Methodists, or the Eastern Orthodox churches (for that matter, Roman Catholicism edges closer to monergism than Eastern Orthodoxy, however, neither church is monergistic).
I want to be sure we are understanding monergism the same way, because when I say I have come to reject monergism, I still believe the grace of the Holy Spirit is required in order for us to be able to choose to follow our Lord, because otherwise our corrupt nature would tend to preclude us from being able to have faith. However, I believe that God wants us to be able to choose willingly to love Him, and so He (in the person of Jesus Christ) sent us the Holy Spirit to serve as our Paraclete, enabling us to make that decision. I positively reject the idea of Pelagianism; we humans cannot save ourselves, and it is due to the action of the Holy Spirit that we can be saved.
So true, because of free will and the stain of original sin, we can only reject God, it is only by the Holy Spirit calling us.
I agree 100 %; the "stain", while covered by Grace remains until we depart this world. The Word and the Sacraments, Baptism, Confession and Absolution, the Eucharist, (and yes, maybe even Holy Orders, due to the need for the Sacraments to be administered) so that this grace continues to be imparted to the faithful.Indeed, this is the case. However, I do believe that once we are called by the Holy Spirit, we can improve, through His grace, both that imparted directly and in answer to our prayers, and also the sacramental grace we receive in the Church through Baptism, the Eucharist and the various other things which I think we could at least agree are sacramentals. This is what Wesley called Entire Sanctification, or what the Orthodox call Theosis, but it is only possible for those who answer the call of the Holy Spirit and repent.
I agree 100 %; the "stain", while covered by Grace remains until we depart this world. The Word and the Sacraments, Baptism, Confession and Absolution, the Eucharist, (and yes, maybe even Holy Orders, due to the need for the Sacraments to be administered) so that this grace continues to be imparted to the faithful.
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