What goes on?

[sobresaliente]

Greetings,
I have been to a few of these Charismatic services at a church in my area. I am not sure of all the things that go on there, I can find no biblical evidence for the uses that many of the people that go there claim the Holy Spirit does. It is possible that I am not looking hard enough.

How do you explain:

Convulsions

Screaming

Animal noises

strange dances

uncontrollable laughter

inability to walk



I am not planning on posting anymore, I am just wondering how you can explain all this in light of scripture. Definitions of the above phrases/sounds would be nice too, and any other ones I may have forgottent as well. There should be a FAQ forum in this place.

Sobresaliente

 

[Jim B]

I know, sobre.

There are some of these things that can be explained from scripture. That doesn’t mean what you may have experienced is the same thing, but those things did happen. In fact, some of them have happened to me. So I know there is reality in some of it. I am not given to demonstrations.

That said, I would like to add that I have been hanging around Pentecostals and Charismatics for forty years and I still cannot explain why some of the things that go on in a P/C rally are allowed to go on in the name of the Lord . I know there is a reluctance among P/Cs to call a physical “manifestation” in a church service anything but “a move of the Spirit.” But, I wonder if it’s a sin against the Spirit to blame some of this stuff on Him? Anyhow, to each his/her own. If it blesses you, great. Just don’t include me. If it happens, it happens and I welcome it; if it don’t, I am not diminished in any way in my relationship to Jesus Christ my Lord.

\o/

 

[sobresaliente]

That's good to know Jim...thanks

 

[enoch son]

I don't know about it one way or the other. But it sound better then going to a chruch and sitting in a pew dead! "Alway learning and never coming to truth." DOES IT? At lest God as something to work with other then someone with the ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ!

 

[BK]

I go to an Assembly of God church where some pretty interesting things have happened such as tongues with interpretations and healings. Last Sunday a woman broke out into what they call "Holy Laughter" I've never heard of this before, but I guess it's becoming more and more common. There is no scriptural backing for this behavior. It was very disruptive. Our church is televised and had to be put on hold until she stopped. There is not supposed to be demonstrations that put the church into a state of confusion. I would always bump what your asking about against the Bible, I can't recall anything on your list ever occuring in scripture except for the dancing part. David danced for the Lord with all his might and it was acceptable. People held celebrations played instruments and danced for the Lord all the time and it was pleasing to Him.

God bless

 

[Jim B]

I don't know about it one way or the other. But it sound better then going to a chruch and sitting in a pew dead! "Alway learning and never coming to truth." DOES IT? At lest God as something to work with other then someone with the ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ!

Peace and quiet or pandemonium? Take your pick. I'd go with peace every time. Riots are for soccer games.
\o/

 

[Jack_Racz]

Convulsions

Screaming

Animal noises

strange dances

uncontrollable laughter

inability to walk

I've gone to a Methodist church all my life and have never seen these

Maybe I'm missing out on something... or maybe it's just my churches

 

[HumbleMan]

I belong to the Church of God, Cleveland, and I can tell you that most of those manifestations are not biblical. Joyous dancing can occur, because we are so glad in the presence of God that we just want to dance. Animal sounds? Screaming? Uncontrollable laughter? Remember, God is not a God of confusion. Any manifestation of the Spirit is to edify God.

 

[Svt4Him]

God is not a God of confusion is a pretty misused verse. If someone comes asking questions is that confusion? If someone doesn't understand something, is that confusion? I don't understand how my car runs, and I can't find a voltswagon in the Bible, so does that mean it's not from God? You won't find me putting up too much of an argument for that, yet others will swear by them. Is this confusion? And ever manifestation of the Spirit is to edify God? Can you give me a verse for that?

When I first became a Christian, before I learned these things are from the devil, I received a fit of laughing. It was amazing, and when it happened, I was instantly set free from a drug habbit of about five years. Now I'm confused again, and God is not the God of confusion, so did the devil set me free?

 

[SavedByGrace3]

How about people flying around the room, fire blazing above heads, rooms filling with smoke, blood appearing out of nowhere, lightning crashing, and buildings shaking?????

The Spirit is not a tame little dove. He is a raging fire full of power and knock you down glory.

Oh boy! I am a kid in a candy shop!

But the coming days are not going to be for the timid.

Take a deep breath, grab hold of something and hang on!!!!


Weeeee!!!!!!

 

[Jim B]

I belong to the Church of God, Cleveland, and I can tell you that most of those manifestations are not biblical. Joyous dancing can occur, because we are so glad in the presence of God that we just want to dance. Animal sounds? Screaming? Uncontrollable laughter? Remember, God is not a God of confusion. Any manifestation of the Spirit is to edify God.

Why do we call these sometimes off-the-wall acts “manifestations,” or worse, “manifestations of the Spirit?”

The Bible doesn’t.

Sometimes it is the Spirit of God but, that said, I have found that all too often it is just plain weirdness with a capital ‘W’. So-called “free” meetings often attract people who think that means “bizarre” and members of free churches don’t seem to be discerning enough to correct them. Sometimes it is nothing more than sheer exhibitionism.

So, in our fear of “quenching the Spirit” we do nothing and, in fact, quench the Spirit by doing nothing. The Spirit is often not allowed to work as He wills for people “getting free in the spirit” (please note small ‘s’).

\o/

 

[Trish1947]

Sounded like pandamonium to me on the Day of Penticost!!!

"And suddenly there came a sound from Heaven as of a rushing might wind, and filled all the house where they were sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.

Must have been pretty "out of control" because in v 14 of Acts Peter lifts up his voice and said "these men are not drunk:...

OH YES, LETS DO IT AGAIN!!!!!!

 

[flyfishing]

God is not a God of confusion is a pretty misused verse. If someone comes asking questions is that confusion? If someone doesn't understand something, is that confusion? I don't understand how my car runs, and I can't find a voltswagon in the Bible, so does that mean it's not from God? You won't find me putting up too much of an argument for that, yet others will swear by them. Is this confusion? And ever manifestation of the Spirit is to edify God? Can you give me a verse for that?

When I first became a Christian, before I learned these things are from the devil, I received a fit of laughing. It was amazing, and when it happened, I was instantly set free from a drug habbit of about five years. Now I'm confused again, and God is not the God of confusion, so did the devil set me free?

Brother i have had a similar experience to you when i was first infilled with the Holy spirit.. It was CHRIST who set you free. Continue to rejoice in His salvation...I was laughing not uncontrollably but for a day and a half. Any mention of the name of jesus brought a sweet presence of the LORd and a joy undescribable. The spirit of the prophets are subject to the prophets so in my case I knew it was the LORD by his presence...

 

[flyfishing]

I go to an Assembly of God church where some pretty interesting things have happened such as tongues with interpretations and healings. Last Sunday a woman broke out into what they call "Holy Laughter" I've never heard of this before, but I guess it's becoming more and more common. There is no scriptural backing for this behavior. It was very disruptive. Our church is televised and had to be put on hold until she stopped. There is not supposed to be demonstrations that put the church into a state of confusion. I would always bump what your asking about against the Bible, I can't recall anything on your list ever occuring in scripture except for the dancing part. David danced for the Lord with all his might and it was acceptable. People held celebrations played instruments and danced for the Lord all the time and it was pleasing to Him.

God bless

This description troubles me somewhat. You had to put the tv time on hold because the LORd wanted to set people free... That sounds to me very much like religion not BIBLE..

 

[flyfishing]

How about people flying around the room, fire blazing above heads, rooms filling with smoke, blood appearing out of nowhere, lightning crashing, and buildings shaking?????

The Spirit is not a tame little dove. He is a raging fire full of power and knock you down glory.

Oh boy! I am a kid in a candy shop!

But the coming days are not going to be for the timid.

Take a deep breath, grab hold of something and hang on!!!!


Weeeee!!!!!!

Where are these manifestations occuring??? I agree with the premise but have to see for myself to judge.. We do need to be careful in these last days. One of the first things i use to judge is how much CHRIST is mentioned and glorifyed in such services. i also know the LORDS presence..


But something to be very cautious about in church services.. Ezekiel 14 tells us that God decieves people with the idols in thier hearts.. When these manifestations occur do pople fall on their knees in repentance?? Cause God aint visiting his people unless he is calling them to a need to repent.. Check every scripture when a special manifestation of "GODS kingdom" happens and what was the result. Isaiah falls on his face and sees his unworthiness..ETC!!!

 

[HumbleMan]

God is not a God of confusion is a pretty misused verse. If someone comes asking questions is that confusion? If someone doesn't understand something, is that confusion? I don't understand how my car runs, and I can't find a voltswagon in the Bible, so does that mean it's not from God? You won't find me putting up too much of an argument for that, yet others will swear by them. Is this confusion? And ever manifestation of the Spirit is to edify God? Can you give me a verse for that?

When I first became a Christian, before I learned these things are from the devil, I received a fit of laughing. It was amazing, and when it happened, I was instantly set free from a drug habbit of about five years. Now I'm confused again, and God is not the God of confusion, so did the devil set me free?

God does not cause confusion in His church, and I think you will find that most of these things the OP mentioned would cause confusion among the body of believers.

I believe in tongues, I've been slain, I believe in healings, in fact I believe in everything the Bible says the Spirit will bring. I also believe that the Spirit works in people according to His will, and uses the gifts as He chooses.

I sincerely apologize if I've caused any discord here, but I am merely stating what I believe.

 

[Svt4Him]

God does not cause confusion in His church, and I think you will find that most of these things the OP mentioned would cause confusion among the body of believers.

I believe in tongues, I've been slain, I believe in healings, in fact I believe in everything the Bible says the Spirit will bring. I also believe that the Spirit works in people according to His will, and uses the gifts as He chooses.

I sincerely apologize if I've caused any discord here, but I am merely stating what I believe.

Let's say you were in a church service, and two people dropped dead. Do you think that would cause confusion? I'd be willing to bet it would. It still does today when people read how God did that in Acts. So was it God or wasn't it?

And did the people viewing Pentacost get confused? Again, yes. So was it really God? A lot of times we don't really understand when we read a story in the Bible that there were actual people there, and they felt actual emotions. The guys who thought the people were drunk were real people. And if I was in church and I thought everyone was drunk, you bet I'd be confused.

My caution then is to wait to see the fruit. Although again this is a misunderstood verse, it is apropos here. If you want to jump at the moon and roll around on the grass, I couldn't care less if it brings you freedom. But don't judge whether it does or doesn't unless you know what's happening in those people's lives.

 

[Jim B]

Sounded like pandamonium to me on the Day of Penticost!!!

"And suddenly there came a sound from Heaven as of a rushing might wind, and filled all the house where they were sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.

Must have been pretty "out of control" because in v 14 of Acts Peter lifts up his voice and said "these men are not drunk:...

OH YES, LETS DO IT AGAIN!!!!!!

I understand where you’re coming from, but don’t miss my point. The fact that some “weird” (my word) stuff goes on in Charismatic meetings does not mean that some of it is not authentic. But when we allow anything and everything to go on in a service it can actually quench what the Spirit wants to do in a meeting.

I recall one person who “got free” in a convention of successful Charismatic pastors I was attending (I was not one of the successful ones ). He took over the meeting and did some pretty bizarre things but no one (and these were pastors) interfered with him for fear of “quenching” what the Spirit was doing. Some even took the opportunity to “get free” themselves. It was a disaster (IMHO) but some thought, at the time, it was a “move of God”. Come to find out, the man was a schizophrenic off his medication. He turned out to be the blind leading the blind (or worse).

It was a real lesson in discernment.

 

[PatrickM]

Let's say you were in a church service, and two people dropped dead. Do you think that would cause confusion? I'd be willing to bet it would. It still does today when people read how God did that in Acts. So was it God or wasn't it?

Well, 1Cor14 actually reads, "God is not the author of confusion. If this scenario took place, wonder and awe should not be "confused" with confusion, I would think.

And did the people viewing Pentacost get confused? Again, yes. So was it really God? A lot of times we don't really understand when we read a story in the Bible that there were actual people there, and they felt actual emotions. The guys who thought the people were drunk were real people. And if I was in church and I thought everyone was drunk, you bet I'd be confused.

Again, excitement, even clamour, isn't exactly the same thing as confusion. The original is "akatastasia", or tumult, disorder of a dissenting form. If people act in an excitable way, I don't think this would qualify as Biblical confusion.

My caution then is to wait to see the fruit. Although again this is a misunderstood verse, it is apropos here. If you want to jump at the moon and roll around on the grass, I couldn't care less if it brings you freedom. But don't judge whether it does or doesn't unless you know what's happening in those people's lives.

Wouldn't the fruit be evident in the, let's say, extra-Biblical acts themselves? Don't get me wrong, the Spirit can and does move on entire congregations at once, and the effects, such as singing in the Spirit and prophesy, can be wonderful.

But, remember, "let all things be done in a decent and orderly manner."

 

[sobresaliente]

Would it be possible for someone to simply live for these Charismatic Manifestations?