What do you think of Joel Osteen?

[SavedByGrace3]

Yes, it is His grace which saves us and His grace also provides us faith which is the assurance that He indeed saved us.

Without this assurance that we are saved, we can't meditate, confess and proclaim.

Confession is the natural (spiritual) result of belief. From the abundance of the heart the mouth spesaks.

2 Corinthians 4
13 We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak;

Luke 6
45 A good man brings good things out of the good stored up in his heart, and an evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in his heart. For the mouth speaks what the heart is full of.

Romans 10
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

 

[IT REALLY SAYS]

There is always people slammng word of faith teachers. Creflo Dollar and his airplane, now Joel Osteen b/c he has a large church in Houston. I read on yahoo today that he passed the collection plate at his church. What say you? I enjoy his teachings, every teacher seems to have something he is particularly good at like Jesse Duplantis, Kenneth Copeland and Creflo.

Since mostly his sheep buy his books my question to you is this.... is it the job of the pastor to become wealthy off the sheep?

 

[Si_monfaith]

When joel was asked on tv by larry king if jews or muslims will go to hell if they dont have jesus (as savior) joels answer should of been - Yes they must have Jesus as savior, yet joel is more afraid of man than God when he sells out by saying - I dont like to judge... excuse me joel but telling people they need Jesus to stay out of hell isnt judgeing anyone, its called selling out the name of Christ and denying him in front of men. With sayings like.. I am what it says I am...lol really?? He doesnt even teach the milk of the word right.....

So these sinners are left to believe their ok without Christ

The elect of God will surely be saved as they have been elected by His will. So God is going to use you to preach the gospel as it was He who put such a burden in your heart.

 

[Si_monfaith]

Everyone on this site is a master (teacher) and will be judged more harshly..... anyone who has added (to the word) has also taken away

Judgment belongs to those who are under the law. But if one is set free from the law according to Romans 7: 4, 6, there is no judgment.

 

[hhodgson]

Since mostly his sheep buy his books my question to you is this.... is it the job of the pastor to become wealthy off the sheep?

Good question! However... purchasing books from any pastor of any (denom/teacher) with their sheep... one could also ask them the same question, right? Sometimes...we judge by what we see, or what we "think" we see. God judges by the spirit of the inner man. Are you a sheep? Do you have a pastor or favorite teacher? If you were to, or ever have purchased a book from (anyone)... would you ask them the same question?

Keyword: (IF!)

 

[hhodgson]

If someone thinks that he becomes wealthy off the sheep, then he hasn't yet known that wealth is given by God through the works of His Son on the cross.

Right on target sir! (you get a winner on that) I do not know of ANY of the teachers of the Word (mostly WOF), that I watch and listen to that thinks that way. But, as I said previously... God judges the spirit of the inner man. And, as you say, "If someone thinks"...

(again) Keyword: (IF!)

 

[SavedByGrace3]

I have dozens of books. I sell them because, hey, it is expensive to write, edit, proof, publish, print, and mail books. I won't apolgize for selling books. I could be selling fish or digging ditches.
Books are good thinigs!

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Psalms 35:27 KJV
27 Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.

Who am I to deny God a pleasure?

 

[Traveling teacher]

I listened to Joel Olstiens dad back in the 80s and 90s
One of the most humble and godly preachers i knew at the time...and did his best to reach the poor and bridge the division between charismatic and noncharismatic christians......

The love of money is the root of all evil.....
Beware when all men think well of you....luke 6:26

In my lifetime and throughout the bible very few men have been able to handle too much authority, too much applause and too big a ministry..too much fame and money
Billy graham said in his book his biggest failure was neglecting his family while letting his ministry take over his life
Best to keep a small ministry and stay humble.......

 

[Si_monfaith]

No I have not ever read anyones book, I no longer use a study bible nor want footnotes... i do know that when jesus says foxes have holes but the son of man has no place to lay his head is a far cry from wof teachings.. and something about freely give for it was freely given to you somewhere. But my thing with joel is he wont stand up for Christ on larry king live because he was afraid of men king a jew and muslims, I seem to remember some verse about if you deny me in front of men I'll deny you before God or some such wording... telling someone they will go to hell if they dont have Jesus as savior is Not judging anyone but was used as an excuse by joel..... and I'm not talking about others who sell books to their sheep but feel free to add their names also as I dont play favorites...

"jesus says foxes have holes but the son of man has no place to lay his head"

2 Corinthians 8:9 For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich.

 

[hhodgson]

Yes, it is His grace which saves us and His grace also provides us faith which is the assurance that He indeed saved us.

Actually, [and] for (teaching purposes)... It's grace (through) faith... that saves us. Neither one by themselves. But, together, Grace (is) the door (Jesus)... and faith (opens) the door to receive Him as Lord and Savior.

"Grace also provides us faith"... (by) hearing His Word and (exercising, acting on, or applying our faith).

Romans 10:17
"So then faith cometh by hearing and hearing the word of God."​

 

[Si_monfaith]

Actually, [and] for (teaching purposes)... It's grace (through) faith... that saves us. Neither one by themselves. But, together, Grace (is) the door (Jesus)... and faith (opens) the door to receive Him as Lord and Savior.

"Grace also provides us faith"... (by) hearing His Word and (exercising, acting on, or applying our faith).

Romans 10:17
"So then faith cometh by hearing and hearing the word of God."​

1 Timothy 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.

The answer is not just in Rom 10:17. The above verse must also be included for a rounded answer.

So without His grace faith doesn't come by hearing. That is why not all have faith (2 Thess 3:2: "for not everyone has faith").

Faith is the assurance that Jesus indeed justified us by His blood.

Confession follows faith.

 

[hhodgson]

1 Timothy 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.

The answer is not just in Rom 10:17. The above verse must also be included for a rounded answer.

So without His grace faith doesn't come by hearing. That is why not all have faith (2 Thess 3:2: "for not everyone has faith").

That's what were saying... it's the (balance) of grace and faith working together... [with] Love. When All three work together, that pleases God.

 

[Si_monfaith]

That's what were saying... it's the (balance) of grace and faith working together... [with] Love. When All three work together, that pleases God.

The point is that without God's grace, no one gets the free gift of faith.

Now, grace is not shown to all but only to the elect according to His will. Rom 9:15.

Grace/mercy follows God's will. God's election is based on His will and not His grace/mercy. God wills to show grace/mercy.

So the rest can't believe even if they hear the word.

 

[hhodgson]

The point is that without God's grace, no one gets the free gift of faith.

We've acknowledged that point several times in this thread. The bigger point is (listen up everybody)... "without God's Grace"... Jesus would not exist!

Now, grace is not shown to all but only to the elect according to His will. Rom 9:15. Grace/mercy follows God's will. God's election is based on His will and not His grace/mercy. God wills to show grace/mercy. So the rest can't believe even if they hear the word.

I will respond with this (once) and this only... for we are (way off) topic of the OP's question about Joel Osteen. I'm sure you understand.

This elect is according to the foreknowledge of God the Father (1 Peter 1:2), which simply means God chose us (even before the foundation of the world). He didn’t choose us independently of our free will.

 

[Si_monfaith]

Thats not the question that was asked, is it the job of the pastor to become wealthy off his sheep?

No sheep can make any pastor wealthy. It is God's will that only His elect will have this faith to believe that they are blessed by the promises given through the death of the Son of God who co-exists with the Father.

 

[Si_monfaith]

How do they make their money? Booksales? They are selling their doctrine and getting rich. They also get very high salaries.

Riches come from God as He has willed to elect those to whom riches are given through His promises given by the death of His Son on the cross and who co-exists eternally with the Father.

If anyone thinks that riches come in a different way, either he/she is not an elect or an elect but yet to be sanctified from false beliefs.

 

[Blade]

There is always people slammng word of faith teachers. Creflo Dollar and his airplane, now Joel Osteen b/c he has a large church in Houston. I read on yahoo today that he passed the collection plate at his church. What say you? I enjoy his teachings, every teacher seems to have something he is particularly good at like Jesse Duplantis, Kenneth Copeland and Creflo.

As we have seen and even here. Each has there own personal views. Yet its not Gods word. For me..its foolish to just look at the out side and then judge someone. I have seen a place when the late Oral Roberts was alive. They like we see on youtube and other places slamming bashing him for something he said. They the "tapes" shows.. what ever. Yet.. for me.. Oral was not there to defend answer back. So me being no body went to the man himself and asked him. And he did infact talk to me as it some other great names. NOT TO BOAST..for I am no body. But..God ALWAYS opens the doors..if its of GOD.

So I asked Oral about it.. He didnt have to answer me. Yet he did.. wow if people had just asked him. It was nothing like what they were going on about. I can SEE the riches of some of these people. Yet.. I dont know them. A tv show a few videos.. really? And we KNOW THEM? Take Copeland. Yet.. house planes. Yet fire around our house one year in Colorado Springs.. we get this phone call. Copeland ministries. "is there ANYTHING you need? Anything.. we well get it to you". HOW in the world did they get my phone number and others? Yet.. NO ONE ELSE from any other "ministry" called us. NOT defending him or them. Yet take duplantis.. WHO pays for the JET FUEL? Not ONE DIME comes form his Church. No.. not playing some game here that.. the Church pays him.. then he uses that money to pay for fuel. No.. he uses his own personally money. Do you know how much that FUEL costs? I can keep going.

See I can listen to them and see my Jesus. I just dont agree with everything they do or say. I can listen to Graham or baptist preacher and see my Jesus just not agree with all they say. Not sure why YOU or ME can sin and still love Jesus yet others cant.

So.. see the GOOD in the 1st. Like Joel.. what GOOD does he do around him. What does he do in 3rd world nations? You think GODS salvation is based on you being POOR or RICH? My Father..is REAL! I cant change anyone. And my personal belief is NOT the Gospel.

Last..FORGIVE ME..but we dont hear this. Ask those that "expose" and what ever. How many people did you lead to Christ today? Yesterday? Last month? Well the number from just ONE of these people listed in over 4k a day. That come to Christ. Paul said it best "the gospel is being preached". God uses ANYONE that says HERE I AM USE ME! He does not wait till your PERFECT or sinless. LOL.. wow..

So.. if I see a problem and error.. I call them email .. see them talk to them about it. I love them..thats how I would want to be treated and this is written. And last but not least. These no matter what I personally think ...these CHILDREN? yeah.. belong to a GOD. And since I know JESUS..that gives me NO RIGHT to treat HIS kids not mine.. but HIS..any way I FEEL. For me.. if I love Jesus. I love them. I dont care how far they fall miss it. I will get dirty if I have to and reach down.. get down with them and pick them up. NO ONE but no one should EVER be taken away from the Father forever. He died so that would not happen. If I love Him.. I will love them the same way and treat them the same way He treats me. The 12 were called in to a office that MOST are not. So when they judged.. it was just. They walked in 1st cor 13 Phil. They prayed 24/7 read 24/7. Most of us do not.. love you see the good in them 1st..then talk...but remember..there not here cant defend them selfs

 

[hhodgson]

As we have seen and even here. Each has there own personal views. Yet its not Gods word. For me.. its foolish to just look at the out side and then judge someone. I have seen a place when the late Oral Roberts was alive. They like we see on youtube and other places slamming bashing him for something he said. They the "tapes" shows.. what ever. Yet.. for me.. Oral was not there to defend answer back. So me being no body went to the man himself and asked him. And he did in fact talk to me as it some other great names. NOT TO BOAST.. for I am no body. But.. God ALWAYS opens the doors.. if its of GOD.

So I asked Oral about it.. He didn't have to answer me. Yet he did.. wow if people had just asked him. It was nothing like what they were going on about. I can SEE the riches of some of these people. Yet.. I don't know them. A tv show a few videos.. really? And we KNOW THEM? Take Copeland. Yet.. house planes. Yet fire around our house one year in Colorado Springs.. we get this phone call. Copeland ministries. "is there ANYTHING you need? Anything.. we well get it to you". HOW in the world did they get my phone number and others? Yet.. NO ONE ELSE from any other "ministry" called us. NOT defending him or them. Yet take Duplantis.. WHO pays for the JET FUEL? Not ONE DIME comes form his Church. No.. not playing some game here that.. the Church pays him.. then he uses that money to pay for fuel. No.. he uses his own personally money. Do you know how much that FUEL costs? I can keep going.

See I can listen to them and see my Jesus. I just don't agree with everything they do or say. I can listen to Graham or Baptist preacher and see my Jesus just not agree with all they say. Not sure why YOU or ME can sin and still love Jesus yet others cant.

So.. see the GOOD in the 1st. Like Joel.. what GOOD does he do around him. What does he do in 3rd world nations? You think GODS salvation is based on you being POOR or RICH? My Father..is REAL! I cant change anyone. And my personal belief is NOT the Gospel.

Last.. FORGIVE ME.. but we don't hear this. Ask those that "expose" and what ever. How many people did you lead to Christ today? Yesterday? Last month? Well the number from just ONE of these people listed in over 4k a day. That come to Christ. Paul said it best "the gospel is being preached". God uses ANYONE that says HERE I AM USE ME! He does not wait till your PERFECT or sinless. LOL.. wow..

So.. if I see a problem and error.. I call them email .. see them talk to them about it. I love them.. that's how I would want to be treated and this is written. And last but not least. These no matter what I personally think ...these CHILDREN? yeah.. belong to a GOD. And since I know JESUS.. that gives me NO RIGHT to treat HIS kids not mine.. but HIS.. any way I FEEL. For me.. if I love Jesus. I love them. I don't care how far they fall miss it. I will get dirty if I have to and reach down.. get down with them and pick them up. NO ONE but no one should EVER be taken away from the Father forever. He died so that would not happen. If I love Him.. I will love them the same way and treat them the same way He treats me. The 12 were called in to a office that MOST are not. So when they judged.. it was just. They walked in 1st Cor 13 Phil. They prayed 24/7 read 24/7. Most of us do not.. love you see the good in them 1st..then talk...but remember.. there not here cant defend themselves.

A lot of truth here Blade. Good post. But... NONE of us will pray and read the Word 24/7. I don't know about you but I have to get some sleep (in-between) there somewhere!

Good to here from you...

 

[Simon the Tanner]

I loved Joel's dad John. Saw him once at Lakewood in 1981 and at Kenneth Hagin's Campmeeting in Tulsa around 1983. For the sake of his dad I like Joel, but he has his flaws. He's weak on theology, and considers Mormons Christians because they say they believe in Jesus. Not good. He also lacks the discernment to know that Oprah Winfrey is not a Christian. Her beliefs are linked to the New Age and New Thought. Joel should avoid her like the plague. I would also like to see Joel step it up in the area of original sin, eternal judgment, and salvation by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone. I understand that he didn't plan on being a minister, but he's had 18 years now to develop his theological chops.

Having said all of that, most of the criticism of Joel Osteen comes from cessationists and jealous ministers, and is baseless. I lived in Houston in 1978 and drove past the building that is now Lakewood Church. (Back then it was called The Summit, and later it was Compaq Center.) It's right off of HWY 59 SW of downtown Houston, and HW 59 was underwater when Lakewood issued the notice that their church was inaccessible. They got 3 feet of rain in 3 days, and somehow these nimrods thought that Lakewood wasn't affected. Go figger.

Joel Osteen and Lakewood have a reputation for being there for victims of disaster in Houston. They took in 3,000 people during tropical storm Allison back in 2001. They also took the lead role in assisting victims of Katrina, even though that was in New Orleans. During Harvey they coordinated their efforts with the city of Houston as they always do in these situations, and they were asked to direct people to the convention center downtown, and act as a distribution center and a backup evacuation center, which they did as soon as it was safe to do so.

Something else that most people won't acknowledge is that Joel Osteen hasn't taken a salary since 2005. His book Your Best Life Now was published in 2004 and unexpectedly sold millions of copies, making him a wealthy man. That's how he's able to afford a $10 million house. He didn't get it from taking an excessive salary or a cut of the tithes and offerings, so the idea that he's getting rich off of his congregation is bogus.

Joel has his faults, but he also is extremely gifted. He connects with people better than anybody I've ever seen in my life. Part of that is his background in television, and part of it is his natural cheerful demeanor and his infectious smile. Add that to his decades of listening to his dad telling these jokes and stories and you've got a guy who is tailor made for televangelism. Even Reformed preacher Paul Washer admits that you can learn some things from Joel Osteen. He's a phenomenon of modern Christianity.