What do you think is required to be saved?

[Mark Quayle]

Neither did the thief receive the Holy Spirit. The thief died under the old covenant.

How does the fact it doesn't mention the Holy Spirit mean the thief did not?

 

[AubreyM]

In case you never heard this before.

Jesus Christ told the thief on the cross that today He would be with him paradise.

Where is paradise? It is in She'ol / Hell. (She'ol had a paradise part and a prison part of it) All prophets from moses even the Lord Jesus Christ went here.)

Jesus Christ told the thief that he would be with him that day.

They both died and went to the same place. She'ol / Hell.

(Jesus Christ overcame this place Hell/She'ol - When God raised him from the dead.)

Have you ever been told this, or have you ever recognized this before?

 

[BNR32FAN]

Seems clear enough and with no contradictions.

Ok so are you saying that those who heard His words and followed but don’t continue to hear and follow still receive eternal life? Are we not required to abide in Christ in order to receive salvation?

 

[BNR32FAN]

You are saying that the unnamed thief on the cross arrived in "paradise" on that day alone and without the Holy Spirit?

So what is the spiritual destination of a human baby who perishes shortly after birth without being baptized?

(Sorry if this is taking the thread far afield)

Newborn babies have not sinned so they go straight to heaven.

 

[Mark Quayle]

Hello you; thank you for coming to check out this thread.

The video above is a total time of 1:13; hopefully the direct delivery will help.

What do you think is required to be saved?

The question is asked rather vaguely. Do you mean, what is required of God, or what is required of man, or what results from salvation / what are necessary evidences?

I can only assume you mean, what must man do to be saved? Two ways, one of which is impossible, the other which is impossible for man but possible for god to do in man.

1. Live in complete perfect obedience, never rebelling, never disobeying.

2. The substitution of Christ on our behalf.and being 'born again' (John 3) by the Spirit of God.

1 will not happen, whether anyone says it is theoretically possible or not.
2 will not happen by the will of man, but of God. Man is incapable of pleasing God on his own, But God can do anything he pleases.

 

[Albion]

Ok so are you saying that those who heard His words and followed but don’t continue to hear and follow still receive eternal life?

No, I'm saying that the Biblical evidence seems to show us that God does have his Elect and that it's not the case that all of us are equally "on our own" with our free will.

 

[BNR32FAN]

In case you never heard this before.

Jesus Christ told the thief on the cross that today He would be with him paradise.

Where is paradise? It is in She'ol / Hell. (She'ol had a paradise part and a prison part of it) All prophets from moses even the Lord Jesus Christ went here.)

Jesus Christ told the thief that he would be with him that day.

They both died and went to the same place. She'ol / Hell.

(Jesus Christ overcame this place Hell/She'ol - When God raised him from the dead.)

Have you ever been told this, or have you ever recognized this before?

Now this part I’m not 100% certain about. I’m not sure if people entered heaven after Christ’s crucifixion before His resurrection or only entered after His resurrection but I am fairly certain that after His resurrection people have entered heaven. I don’t believe that people are waiting in Sheol for judgement day.

 

[BNR32FAN]

No, I'm saying that the Biblical evidence seems to show us that God does have his Elect and that it's not the case that all of us are equally "on our own" with our free will.

John 15 refutes the idea of God’s elect otherwise Jesus would’ve never said in verse 7 “IF you abide in Me”.

 

[Albion]

John 15 refutes the idea of God’s elect otherwise Jesus would’ve never said in verse 7 “IF you abide in Me”.

The Elect will abide in Him. That doesn't mean that they become sinless, are immune to temptations, or anything like that.

 

[AubreyM]

@Mark Quayle if you listen to the message; my words speak of if you have heard the Gospel of the life, death, and resurrection and accept what it has to offer to have a prayer life and connection with God.

What else do you think is required to be saved? - believe on the Lord Jesus Christ that God raised him from the dead.

Or Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ - and what ever else traditions teach - apocolypse, or whatever else someone might place upon a person they 'must do or believe in' disregarding the Lord Jesus Christ alone.

After this is up to the person who is seeking what they do with their faith, their love of God and love towards others.

And the bible will teach you if you go and read the word of God, because do encourage to continue in their faith and Love God, and Love Others - living by the spirit.

Even suffering for the Lord Jesus Christ (which is not taught a lot.)

Love in the (agape) sense.


Thank you for your comment.

 

[aiki]

Hello you; thank you for coming to check out this thread.

The video above is a total time of 1:13; hopefully the direct delivery will help.

What do you think is required to be saved?

Why would you believe that Christ died for your sins and was raised from the dead by God? Why would these things be necessary to your salvation? Why did Jesus have to die at all? What am I saved from by believing in Jesus? What am I saved to, in trusting in Christ as my Saviour and Lord? What does being "saved" mean, exactly? How do I know Jesus was who he said he was and could die for my sins as the Gospel asserts?

If you just walked up to someone on the street and said, "You gotta' believe Jesus died for your sins and was raised from the dead by God so you can be saved," that someone, if s/he had any thinking capacity at all, would want answers to the questions above (and likely many others, besides). Even the apostle Paul arrived at Romans 10:9-10 only after nine other chapters of explanation and argument in support of what he wrote in Romans 10:9-10.

The idea of repentance, which Jesus and his disciples coupled to the Gospel consistently (Matthew 3:2; Matthew 4:17; Matthew 11:20; Mark 6:12; Luke 13:3-5; Acts 2:38; Acts 3:19, etc.), fundamentally has to do with changing one's mind about a thing. Certainly, the Jews to whom Jesus (and later, his disciples) preached had to undergo a serious "re-think" about the prophesied Messiah and their understanding of many of the things they'd been taught to believe about God's redemption of Israel in order to accept the Gospel. Really, there was no way they could come to faith in Christ as Saviour and Messiah apart from this "re-think" and adoption of a new understanding of the prophecies and teachings of OT scripture (ie. repentance). This is recognized by Paul in his comprehensive arguments for the Gospel and the divinity of Christ in his various epistles. He didn't just say, "Believe!" but offered a rationale for why his audience should abandon their old way of thinking for a new way shaped to the truths of the Gospel. Peter does the same in Acts 2:14-40.

So, repentance - and by this term I don't mean the many things that rise out of repentance (conviction of sin, contrition, confession of sin) - but a change of one's thinking is necessary to salvation.

It is also necessary, as Scripture explains, that God draw sinners to the Saviour (John 6:44), that the Holy Spirit convict and illuminate their minds to the truth of the Gospel (John 16:8; John 16:13), and that God "give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth." (2 Timothy 2:25) But God having done all these necessary things, the sinner must choose to receive God's gift of salvation in Christ, or not. God does not compel anyone to accept His gift - whatever the Calvinist might (wrongly) assert.

See: www.soteriology101.com

 

[John Mullally]

The question is asked rather vaguely. Do you mean, what is required of God, or what is required of man, or what results from salvation / what are necessary evidences?

I can only assume you mean, what must man do to be saved? Two ways, one of which is impossible, the other which is impossible for man but possible for god to do in man.

1. Live in complete perfect obedience, never rebelling, never disobeying.

2. The substitution of Christ on our behalf.and being 'born again' (John 3) by the Spirit of God.

Peter preaching the Gospel by the Holy Spirit in Acts 2 pleads with the crowd to “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

Here we see that salvation is a promise to those who believe and choose to repent. So if someone asks what must I do to be saved, you can give them Acts 2 and Romans 10:9-10. You don't need even mention election or it being impossible to men - Peter didn't.

 

[BNR32FAN]

The Elect will abide in Him. That doesn't mean that they become sinless, are immune to temptations, or anything like that.

You have the cause & effect backwards brother. They are elect because they abide they don’t abide because they are elect.

Two questions

1 were the apostles elect?
2 if the elect will abide in Christ why does Jesus tell His 11 faithful apostles to abide in Him and why does He say the words “IF you abide in Me” in verse 7?

If they are incapable of failing to abide in Him then this entire message is useless and John 15:6 is an impossibility because “no one can come to Me unless The Father draws him”.


I’ve already shown proof that grace does not guarantee salvation. Luke 13:6-9 is another prime example.

“And He began telling this parable: “A man had a fig tree which had been planted in his vineyard; and he came looking for fruit on it and did not find any. And he said to the vineyard-keeper, ‘Behold, for three years I have come looking for fruit on this fig tree without finding any. Cut it down! Why does it even use up the ground?’ And he answered and said to him, ‘Let it alone, sir, for this year too, until I dig around it and put in fertilizer; and if it bears fruit next year, fine; but if not, cut it down.’ ””
‭‭Luke‬ ‭13:6-9‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Notice that even despite Christ giving special attention to the tree the outcome is still uncertain whether or not it will bear fruit or if it will be chopped down.

 

[Albion]

You have the cause & effect backwards brother. They are elect because they abide they don’t abide because they are elect.

All you've done there is assign your own meaning in place of the Bible's meaning and that of Christians who speak of the Elect. In fact, it's worse. What it does is render the term itself useless, meaningless. If we were to call them the Elect because they earned salvation by their own striving rather than having been chosen by God, there would be no point in calling them "Elect."

Two questions

1 were the apostles elect?

God alone knows his Elect, but we always do assume that the Apostles were among them.

2 if the elect will abide in Christ why does Jesus tell His 11 faithful apostles to abide in Him and why does He say the words “IF you abide in Me” in verse 7?

That's a generalized observation, not a challenge. Suppose I say "If you're Irish, you surely like music." Am I saying that I'm giving some guarantee in your case or that you won't like music if you are of some other nationality?" Of course not.

 

[AubreyM]

There are several ways of looking at the Election.

Either it is the children of Israel, Nation of Israel.

When you look at the introductions of the letters are always written to them, then.

However today, people will take the scriptures and apply it to themselves now today.

It is a choice of perception, people may have their view if they desire to make for us today if they do so.

Personally do not believe that is the correct view but a person has to make a choice for themselves of what they are going to believe.

You can see for example this of // Who is the letter being written to?

1 Peter 1:

Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ,

To God’s elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, 2 who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood:

Grace and peace be yours in abundance.

 

[BNR32FAN]

All you've done there is assign your own meaning in place of the Bible's meaning and that of Christians who speak of the Elect. In fact, it's worse. What it does is render the term itself useless, meaningless. If we were to call them the Elect because they earned salvation by their own striving rather than having been chosen by God, there would be no point in calling them "Elect."

Not at all, the word elect means chosen.

“Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, T o those who reside as aliens, scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, who are chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, by the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to obey Jesus Christ and be sprinkled with His blood: May grace and peace be yours in the fullest measure.”
‭‭1 Peter‬ ‭1:1-2‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

The elect are chosen according to God’s foreknowledge of those who will abide in Christ.

 

[AubreyM]

Believe now God calls people now too.

They have a choice to choose God, or not Choose God.

There was a chosen elect - like 1 Peter 1 or even other letters.

Now people have a an ability to Choose God and the Lord Jesus Christ. They can choose and even fall away.

 

[Albion]

Not at all, the word elect means chosen.

Exactly.

But chosen to...what? It's not as though every selection made by anyone guarantees salvation. IN CONTEXT, the word refers to those who apparently have been "chosen" by God before their births to receive Faith and be saved. We don't have to subscribe to this view of things, but we ought at least know what the claim is.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Hello you; thank you for coming to check out this thread.

The video above is a total time of 1:13; hopefully the direct delivery will help.

What do you think is required to be saved?

When I read the Scriptures, I see 4 different aspects of salvation described.

#1. Provisional Atonement (not "Calvinism's Limited Atonement").
(A 100% Work of God alone that can only be applied personally to an individual's life via by being saved by God's grace and Sanctification).
This is Jesus paying the price for the sins of the entire world so as to offer mankind the free gift of salvation (if they so choose to accept it); Note: Christ's resurrection (to give us a new body not tainted by sin one day), and the ascension to the Father (after Christ telling Mary not to touch Him), and his entering the holy temple by his blood (to be our Heavenly High Priest) is also included in the Provisional Atonement, too. (For Provisional Atonement verses, see: John 1:29, 1 John 2:2, 1 Timothy 2:6, 2 Corinthians 5:19, Romans 5:6-8.) (Note: The best way to describe the Provisional Atonement is like a person paying the price so as to hand you a check to pay off your debts. For your debt is paid (in a manner of speaking) if someone offers you an alternate route of escape for you to be debt free. But to apply the Provisional Atonement personally to your life, you have to receive the check, deposit it into your bank, and pay off those you are in debt to; The word “provision” is like if I provided you with a provision of food so you that can survive for several months; But the choice is up to you if you want to accept such a provision or not).

#2. God's Grace Through Faith in Jesus Christ as the Savior
(Initial Salvation, and or Foundational Salvation).
(The 1st synergistic work of GOD done in a believer).
Being saved by God's grace through faith in Jesus as ones Savior is the entrance gate to salvation, and it is the foundation of our salvation (by faith) upon which we stand. Being saved by God's grace is believing the gospel (Which is the power of God unto salvation to everyone who believes it - Romans 1:16). According to 1 Corinthians 15:1-4: The gospel is you believing that Jesus Christ died for your sins, He was buried, and He had risen again three days later for your salvation (Note: Do not let anyone sell you on another gospel besides this one). Depending on a person’s access or exposure to the Word: Being saved by God's grace will also generally include receiving Jesus as your Savior (John 1:12), and calling upon the name of the Lord (i.e. confessing with your mouth the words: “Lord Jesus” or similar equivalent - Romans 10:9) as a part of seeking forgiveness of your sins with Him by way of prayer (Romans 10:13) (Luke 15:18-21) (Luke 18:9-14). This process of salvation is without the deeds of the Law or works because it is based upon God’s mercy and grace and His redemptive work. As a result: One is born again spiritually (Note: Born again by the Spirit, and born again by water (i.e. the Scriptures - Romans 10:17, 1 Peter 1:23)). A person is foundationally or ultimately saved by God’s grace because if they happen to sin on rare occasion in their Christian walk, they do not do a good work to absolve that sin, but they confess of their sins to Jesus in order to be forgiven of that sin (1 John 1:9) (1 John 2:1) (Hebrews 4:16) (For verses on being saved by God's grace, see: Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 4:1-6, Titus 3:4-7, 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, Luke 18:9-14, Romans 5:1-2).

#3. Sanctification of the Spirit to Live a Holy Life
(The Next Step or Phase in the Salvation Process).
(The 2nd synergistic work of God done in a believer).
Sanctification of the Spirit to Live a Holy Life is the next step or phase in Salvation for a believer who lives out their faith; This is the work of God moving in a believer's life so as to help them to live holy, and to do good works and to put away the lusts of the flesh. These good works are the works of God done through the believer, and so all boasting or praise is given to the Lord. Therefore, there is no boasting in one's own work because they are ultimately the works of God done through the believer. A believer today who obeys the Lord looks to the commands of Jesus and His followers within the New Testament primarily. For believers today are not under the 613 Laws of Moses as a whole package deal (even though certain laws have carried over into the New Testament). Basically all ceremonial laws and judicial laws in the Old Testament no longer apply. For example: Believers do not have to keep the Saturday Sabbath, circumcision, dietary laws, animal sacrifices, holy days, etc.; However, believers must keep God's Moral Laws like: Do not murder, do not steal, do not covet, do not lie, do commit adultery, etc.; Two of the greatest commands that we should focus on daily is to love God and love our neighbor which is more fully described in Mark 12:29-31. We need to worship or adore the Lord our God, preach the gospel, help the poor, love the brethren, love our enemies, and live holy lives, etc. (For Sanctification verses, see: James 2:24, James 2:17-18, Titus 1:16, Hebrews 5:9, 2 Thessalonians 2:13, Hebrews 12:14, Romans 8:1 (KJV), 1 Corinthians 16:22, Romans 8:13, etc.).

#4. Glorification (The Future Salvation of the Truly Faithful Believer).
(A 100% Work of God alone that can only be applied personally to an individual's life via by being saved by God's grace and by properly applying the Sanctification of the Spirit to Live a Holy Life).
Glorification is when God takes the believer home to be with Him in His kingdom and He gives Him a new resurrected body that is not tainted by sin. This process of salvation (in being taken home) is a by product automatically for those believers who properly God's grace through faith in Christ, and Sanctification to their lives (For Glorification verses, see: 1 Peter 5:4, 1 Peter 1:4, 1 Corinthians 15:51-57, 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17, Romans 13:11, Philippians 3:20-21, Hebrews 9:28).


Conclusion:

God's grace, and then Sanctification is what we as believers need to be focused on. For if we are saved by His grace, and sanctified (which is only made possible by the Provisional Atonement), then we will be glorified.

 

[Albion]

Believe now God calls people now too.

They have a choice to choose God, or not Choose God.

There was a chosen elect - like 1 Peter 1 or even other letters.

Now people have a an ability to Choose God and the Lord Jesus Christ. They can choose and even fall away.

If all that is so, we are not talking about an Elect. We are saying that, on the contrary, everyone is called. It's meaningless to talk as though there is a select group of designees, but every last person is in it.