What do you think is required to be saved?

[BNR32FAN]

"I give them eternal life, and they will never perish ..."

Those who hear his words and follow not those who hurt his words and followed

 

[AubreyM]

@BNR32FAN

Sorry : I actually just assumed what you were trying to talk about.

What is it you are trying to explain to everyone from your point of view?

 

[adderbolt]

the Holy Spirit is only given to those who are baptized.

one ... group of people receiving the Holy Spirit in the presence of the apostles prior to baptism.

That seems to be walking on both sides of the fence at the same time?

 

[BNR32FAN]

I notice that you discarded the rest of that verse in which we are told that "I give them eternal life, and they will never perish...."

It's definite and uncompromising language, that choice of words.

So, in answer to your question about the meaning of the verse, I'd have to say "yes," it does mean that the rabbit won't be lost.

To whom does He give eternal life? To those who hear and follow or to those who heard and followed?

 

[Albion]

Those who hear his words and follow not those who hurt his words and followed

We have the Bible's words, and they do not say what your alterations make them say.

 

[adderbolt]

I notice that you discarded the rest of that verse in which we are told that "I give them eternal life, and they will never perish...."

It's definite and uncompromising language, that choice of words.

So, in answer to your question about the meaning of the verse, I'd have to say "yes," it does mean that the rabbit won't be lost.

Glad I'm not a rabbit and lunch for eagles, owls, foxes, rattlesnakes, etc.

 

[BNR32FAN]

@BNR32FAN

Sorry : I actually just assumed what you were trying to talk about.

What is it you are trying to explain to everyone from your point of view?

When God bestows grace upon someone they still must choose to cooperate with the Holy Spirit in order to receive salvation. Here’s a prime example.

“Or do you think lightly of the riches of His kindness and tolerance and patience, not knowing that the kindness of God leads you to repentance? But because of your stubbornness and unrepentant heart you are storing up wrath for yourself in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God,”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:4-5‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Despite God granting these people grace leading them to repentance they are storing up His righteous judgement and wrath because of their stubbornness and unwillingness to comply and repent.

 

[BNR32FAN]

We have the Bible's words, and they do not say what your alterations make them say.

Really let’s just see about that shall we?

“My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.”
‭‭John‬ ‭10:27-28‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

It’s right there in verse 27 right before the verse you quoted.

 

[Albion]

Really let’s just see about that shall we?

“My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.”
‭‭John‬ ‭10:27-28‬ ‭ the verse you quoted.

Seems clear enough and with no contradictions.

 

[AubreyM]

Thank you Bnr32Fan,

For sharing more of your of what your viewpoint is.

Believe that it is a persons choice to give their heart to God, or give their heart to the world.

There are people who will believe for a short time and they may go back to their old ways.

At least in my belief ; People can choose to totally give up on God if they so choose to.​

What are your thoughts about this @BNR32FAN

 

[AubreyM]

Hello @Albion,

That was most certainly true for his disciples. No one would pluck his chosen disciples from his hands.

Now us today, it is different, we can choose to give up on God completely if we desire to.

What would you say to this notion?

 

[BNR32FAN]

Hello @HTacianas, @adderbolt,

Would like to share you guys some scriptures here.

Romans 5 : 1 Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

2 Through him we have also obtained access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

3 Not only that, but we rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance,

4 and endurance produces character, and character produces hope,

5 and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us.

@Albion:: @BNR32FAN: Is trying to explain that people who give up on God due to some tragic thing that happens in their life.

This does happen, people can get choked out by the world and the cares of it. Which Jesus Christ spoke about.

Seekers though will continue to seek to have a relationship with God and the Lord Jesus Christ.

There scriptures tells us that when we have faith we are justified, and God gives us the holy spirit.

Thank you for all of your comments and post.

Amen Colossians 1:22-24 is another good example as well as John 15:1-7. Notice in John 15 Jesus is speaking only to His 11 faithful apostles when He tells them to remain in Him then He tells them why they must remain in Him then He tells them the consequences if they don’t remain in Him then He tells them what they can expect IF they remain in Him.

 

[HTacianas]

That seems to be walking on both sides of the fence at the same time?

No. It isn't. Jesus said, "he who believes and is baptized shall be saved", and then, "...go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them...". But the men of Samaria believed and were baptized yet did not receive the Holy Spirit until they were chrismated by Peter and John.

As I said in my first reply to this thread, anything else leads to contradiction.

 

[Jesus is YHWH]

Hello adderbolt,

So your premise is that people are saved by Gods divine choice, and no one in their life has the ability to seek God?

If this is what you are saying, why is it from your perspective that no one can go and look for God at anytime in their life?

Below is mans natural state in which he is born and Scripture declares Salvation is of, by and through the Lord.

1)man has a heart that is deceitful (Jeremiah 17:9)
2)man is full of evil (Mark 7:21-23)
3)man loves darkness (John 3:19),
4)man does not seek for God (Romans 3:10-12),
5)man is ungodly (Romans 5:6),
6)man is a sinner (Romans 5:12)
7)man is dead in his sins (Ephesians 2:1),
8)man by nature a child of wrath (Ephesians 2:3),
9)man cannot understand spiritual things (1 Corinthians 2:14),
10)man is a slave of sin (Romans 6:16-20)
11)man is sinful in the womb (Psalms 51:5)
12)man is conceived in sin(Psalms 51:5)
13)man cannot do good(Romans 3:10)
14) man hates God (Romans 8:7)
15)man loves sin (1 John 3:19)
16)man heart is corrupt and his thoughts are and evil continually (Genesis 6:5)

 

[BNR32FAN]

Hello @Albion,

That was most certainly true for his disciples. No one would pluck his chosen disciples from his hands.

Now us today, it is different, we can choose to give up on God completely if we desire to.

What would you say to this notion?

John 15 shows that even His disciples had a choice to make

 

[John Mullally]

No one had received the Holy Spirit. Not even the apostles.

The Holy Spirit was not given to the Apostles until Pentecost.

Peter speaking speaking by the Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost preached on the conditions for receiving the remission of sins and receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit, which is analogous to salvation. Notice that although this invitation had conditions it was to "every one of you" and "to you and your children, and to all who are afar off".

Acts 2:36 “Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ.” 37 Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Men and brethren, what shall we do?” 38 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” 40 And with many other words he testified and exhorted them, saying, “Be saved from this perverse generation.” 41 Then those who gladly received his word were baptized; and that day about three thousand souls were added to them.
​

 

[Dkh587]

Faith & obedience

 

[Albion]

Hello @Albion,

That was most certainly true for his disciples. No one would pluck his chosen disciples from his hands.

Now us today, it is different, we can choose to give up on God completely if we desire to.

What would you say to this notion?

I'd say that there is no reason to interpret the wording that way. And His own disciples weren't all in that category anyhow.

Before we lose sight of it, this discussion asks if God has an Elect...of if he doesn't. It's isn't about us identifying the Elect.

 

[Jesus is YHWH]

Hello you; thank you for coming to check out this thread.

The video above is a total time of 1:13; hopefully the direct delivery will help.

What do you think is required to be saved?

Salvation is all of, by and through the Lord by His grace as we read below from both Testaments. Below we see that it is God who is active and man is passive in regeneration/ salvation.


Deuteronomy 30:6
And the LORD your God will circumcise your heart and the heart of your offspring, so that you will love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul, that you may live.

Ezekiel 26:25-27
I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean from all your uncleannesses, and from all your idols I will cleanse you…27 And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules.

Ezekiel 36:26
And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh.

John 1:13
But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

Acts 11:8
When they heard this, they quieted down and glorified God, saying, "Well then, God has granted to the Gentiles also the repentance that leads to life."

Acts 13:48 “as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed.”

Ephesians 2:5
even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved—

Philippians 1:29
For it has been granted to you on behalf of Christ not only to believe in him, but also to suffer for him,

Colossians 2:13
And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses,

Titus 3:5
He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

2 Timothy 2:25
Opponents must be gently instructed, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth,

James 1:18
Of his own will he brought us forth by the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

1 Peter 1:3
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

hope this helps !!!

 

[AubreyM]

Hello Albion,

Okay thank you for sharing your viewpoint.

~

@Jesus is YHWH,

Thank you for sharing all of these scriptures.