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What do u believe Hell to be like?

Discussion in 'Exploring Christianity' started by ForsakenGirl, Sep 3, 2017.

  1. Lazarus Short

    Lazarus Short Well-Known Member

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    Are you certain you want it summed up? OK, after two years of research into every book, chapter and verse of the KJV, using a variety of reference books and www tools, I wrote notes that grew into a book of 217 pages. This is my boiled-down conclusion:

    A CONDENSATION OF CONCLUSIONS

    1. There is no mention of Hell in God’s Creation - therefore, Hell is uncreated by God or anyone else. See Genesis 1:1, Isaiah 65:17, Jeremiah 7:31, 19:5, John 1:3, and many instances of “heaven and earth” paired together…without “hell.”

    2. In the first chapter of Genesis, it is stated six times that God saw that what He had made was good, excluding Hell as being possible, as the Creation could not have been wholly good had Hell been in existence. See Genesis 1:10,12,18,21,25,31.

    3. The Creation is properly a hierarchy, not a contested prize, fought over by God and Satan. See Genesis 1:1, Job 1 & 2, John 1:3, Philippians 2:10, Revelation 5:13.

    4. God made both good and evil – therefore, Satan did not make or create evil. See Genesis 2:9, Isaiah 45:7, Lamentations 3:38, Amos 3:6.

    5. The Bible makes no connection between Satan and Hell. See Job 1:6-7, 2:1-2, Zechariah 3:1-2, Revelation 2:13, 12:9.

    6. The prince of Tyre in Ezekiel 28 is not Satan, as it specifically refers to him as a man. See Ezekiel 26 - 28.

    7. God warns of death, but not of Hell. See Genesis 2:17, 3:3, Romans 6:23.

    8. All people die, but none of them go to ECT – only to the grave/pit. See every instance of personal death in the Bible, with “hell” (if present) properly replaced with “sheol” or “hades,” as so often noted in the CCR.

    9. For the Hebrews, “sheol,” hidden, covered and unknown, was the state, condition or place of the dead. It was where the body returned to the dust and the spirit returned to God (Who gave it). See Genesis 3:19, Ecclesiastes 12:7.

    10. ECT depends on the concept of the Immortality of the Soul, and that comes, not from the Bible, but from Greek philosophy, from Socrates and Plato.

    11. The Law given to Moses does not specify punishment in Hell, or warn of it. Punishments are delivered in the real world. See Exodus through Deuteronomy.

    12. All the consequences of human disobedience to God are worked out in the real, here-and-now world – not in Hell. This includes destruction, perishing, God’s wrath and His cursings. See Deuteronomy 28:15-68, 30:19, Ezekiel 32:32, Romans 13:4.

    13. Hell, by definition, opposes the Gospel (the Good News) because Hell can only be Bad News for those sent there – and thus, for most of living humanity.

    14. Hell violates God’s Law, specifically the Law of the Jubilee, which sets all those in servitude free. See Leviticus 25:8-13, Romans 6:7,16.

    15. The idea of damnation of people to Hell is at least absurd, and possibly blasphemous. See Genesis 1:26-27, 2:7,3:19, Ecclesiastes 12:7.

    16. Hell, like Babylon, is confusion. Hell is hot, but it’s cold as…Hell. Hell is bright with fire, but it is dark. Hell is separation from God, but MK Baxter has Jesus touring Hell, chiding the damned. To go to Hell, you must be dead, but to be in ECT, you must be alive, but you’re dead, and on and on…

    17. God’s plan for the wicked is to destroy their wickedness, not send them to Hell. See Psalm 1:6, 7:9, Isaiah 1:18, Jeremiah 3:12, Habakkuk 1:12, Philippians 3:21, Hebrews 10:26-27.

    18. Those who die are freed from sin, as prophesied by the Law of the Jubilee. See Leviticus 25:8-13, Isaiah 1:18, Romans 6:7.

    19. God speaks of ransoming/redeeming ALL from death and the grave – without exception. See Psalm 49:15, Ezekiel 16:55, Romans 6:23, Ephesians 1:10.

    20. God is both willing AND able to save all. Given that He is omnipotent, we can ALL look forward with confidence to our eventual salvation. See Psalm 49:15, 86:13, 103:8-14, 136, Isaiah 1:18, 6:7, 25:7-8, 26:19, 33:24, 43:25, 44:22, 45:8, 55:8-9, 57:16, 64:6-9, Jeremiah 3:12. Lamentations 3:26-32, Ezekiel 11:19, 16:55, Hosea 13:14, Micah 4:5, 7:18-19, Ephesians 1:10, Philipians 3:21, Colossians 1:19-20, I Thessalonians 1:10, I Timothy 1:15, 2:4-6, 4:10, 6:13, II Peter 3:9.

    21. God compares Himself to a cleansing or refining agent – either fire or soap. Therefore, all instances of supernatural fire should be interpreted as being for refining and/or purification, not damnation. Fire in the Bible is never Hellfire, but natural fire or God’s Fire. See Malachi 3:2-3, Matthew 3:10-12, I Corinthians 3:15.

    22. If God’s Fire is for baptism and refining, then that which is burned must be our carnal, sinful nature. It is symbolized by unfruitful trees, tares, chaff, wood, hay and stubble – by anything unable to endure the Fire. See Matthew 3:10-12, I Corinthians 3:11-15.

    23. Christians should not follow the Hell of the ancient, pagan religions, but follow the truth of God’s Word, which does not contain either the concept of Hell or even the word “hell,” except in imperfect translations.

    24. When we dig out mistranslations and peel away misinterpretations, we find that Hell is a 404. With Hell so deconstructed, the Bible and God are both silent on Hell. See Numbers 23:19, John 14:2.
     
  2. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Ok, I find your work interesting, but I almost don't want to ask if you would want a refutation or not, because my guess is you wouldn't. But while I wouldn't be trying to embarrass you if I gave my responses, there are some severe holes in your logic. I've only read through the first seven or so, and only one or two of them would escape exposure.

    But I can see you're working towards arriving at the truth, and I certainly commend you for that. :oldthumbsup:
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2017
  3. Lukaris

    Lukaris Orthodox Christian Supporter

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    I do not know what hell is like; perhaps the parable of Lazarus & the rich man (previously mentioned) is an example. It is definitely something to be feared. The Lord Jesus Christ clearly warns us of it ( John 5:22-30 , Matthew 25:31-46 etc. ); from His warning we should note that He will determine those who were good or bad in this life and determine who is saved or unsaved.
     
  4. BNR32FAN

    BNR32FAN He’s a Way of life Supporter

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    I believe hell will be exactly like Dallas traffic at around 5:30pm.
     
  5. Noxot

    Noxot tohu and bohu Supporter

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    hell is the confusion of beings that don't exist with enough divine love and wisdom and like heaven what occurs there depends on the beings that exist there. the outer reality in the other world expresses symbols of the kinds of conditions that we are in. our appearance shall be what we are on the inside because that is our celestial body. when we die we will find ourselves in that world which is symbolized by a "rising again". the tomb is a symbol for our fleshly body.

    John 5:28-29 (YLT)
    `Wonder not at this, because there doth come an hour in which all those in the tombs shall hear his voice, and they shall come forth; those who did the good things to a rising again of life, and those who practised the evil things to a rising again of judgment.
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2017
  6. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    "I also maintain that those who are punished in Gehenna are scourged by the scourge of love. For what is so bitter and vehement as the punishment of love? I mean that those who have become conscious that they have sinned against love suffer greater torment from this than from any fear of punishment. For the sorrow caused in the heart by sin against love is sharper than any torment that can be. It would be improper for a man to think that sinners in Gehenna are deprived of the love of God. Love is the offspring of knowledge of the truth which, as is commonly confessed, is given to all. The power of love works in two ways: it torments those who have played the fool, even as happens here when a friend suffers from a friend; but it becomes a source of joy for those who have observed its duties. Thus I say that this is the torment of Gehenna: bitter regret. But love inebriates the souls of the sons of Heaven by its delectability." - St. Isaac the Syrian

    "The whole difficulty of understanding Hell is that the thing to be understood is so nearly Nothing. But ye'll have had experiences . . . it begins with a grumbling mood, and yourself still distinct from it: perhaps criticising it. And yourself, in a dark hour, may will that mood, embrace it. Ye can repent and come out of it again. But there may come a day when you can do that no longer. Then there will be no you left to criticise the mood, nor even to enjoy it, but just the grumble itself going on forever like a machine." - C.S. Lewis, The Great Divorce

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  7. Lazarus Short

    Lazarus Short Well-Known Member

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    I don't know which dismays me more - you considering my conclusions as logical swiss cheese, or another who tagged them as "Winner." In either case, there is a body of study which the 24 conclusions may or may not do justice to. In either case, long study should precede acceptance or rejection, and all listed verses should be read in context before agreeing or disagreeing. In any case, be aware that I have no denominational ax to grind, and my conclusions are my own.
     
  8. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member Supporter

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    PM sent.
     
  9. aiki

    aiki Regular Member

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    If the Bible is correct - and I believe it is - then those punished in Hell will be very hot and very, very lonely in its endless darkness. Those in Hell will wail and gnash their teeth and the smoke of their torment will rise forever. This is what the Bible says. Thanks be to God, then, that He has made a way for any who want to escape this destiny to do so. How good He is!
     
  10. Hawkins

    Hawkins Member Supporter

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    I think that you are right about Hades. Hell is when Hades and death are finally thrown to the Lake of Fire.

    As written by Jewish historian Josephus some 2000 years ago,

    An Extract Out of Josephus’ Discourse to the Greeks Concerning Hades:
    1. Now as to Hades, wherein the souls of the of the good things they see, and rejoice in the righteous and unrighteous are detained, it is necessary to speak of it. Hades is a place in the world not regularly finished; a subterraneous region, wherein the light of this world does not shine; from which circumstance, that in this region the light does not shine, it cannot be but there must be in it perpetual darkness. This region is allotted as a place of custody for souls, ill which angels are appointed as guardians to them, who distribute to them temporary punishments, agreeable to every one's behavior and manners.

    2. In this region there is a certain place set apart, as a lake of unquenchable fire, whereinto we suppose no one hath hitherto been cast; but it is prepared for a day afore-determined by God, in which one righteous sentence shall deservedly be passed upon all men; when the unjust, and those that have been disobedient to God, and have given honor to such idols as have been the vain operations of the hands of men as to God himself, shall be adjudged to this everlasting punishment, as having been the causes of defilement; while the just shall obtain an incorruptible and never-fading kingdom. These are now indeed confined in Hades, but not in the same place wherein the unjust are confined.
     
  11. Lazarus Short

    Lazarus Short Well-Known Member

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    OTOH, should our views of the afterlife be based on Josephus?
     
  12. Hawkins

    Hawkins Member Supporter

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    Josephus is a Pharisee. The Jews in majority back then held a Pharisaic view of soul immortality, eternal hell and etc. That's the significance.
     
  13. Hawkins

    Hawkins Member Supporter

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    I myself somehow stayed in Hades for a while so I can tell the following from my own speculation.

    1. It is an adjacent dimension/space for our souls to naturally descend to right after death.
    2. It's air in nature however visually like under water.
    3. Souls there are invisible (I conclude that a soul is invisible to other souls of humans), but you can hear them talking. They all speak in your native tongue (that's something truly odd and strange).
    4. By chance you may encounter fallen angels there.

    I believe that Hades resembles under sea. The 'deeper' you go, the darker it will be. The fallen angels are supposed to be chained in one of the darkest region called pit or Abyss. However somehow they may wander off that region and go into the region of human souls.
     
  14. Phil 1:21

    Phil 1:21 Well-Known Member

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    A total separation from God.
     
  15. Ronald

    Ronald Exhortations Supporter

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    [
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2018
  16. Goatee

    Goatee Jesus, please forgive me, a sinner.

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    For many, Hell, is on earth!
     
  17. Lazarus Short

    Lazarus Short Well-Known Member

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    As you say, speculation, and you don't have a soul, you are a soul. Refer to the creation of Adam in Genesis.
     
  18. Hawkins

    Hawkins Member Supporter

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    You should listen to Jesus instead. He didn't correct the Jewish concept back then. He actually employed and extended that concept.
     
  19. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    "Where can I go to flee from Your presence? ... if I make my bed in She'ol, You are there!" (Psalm 139:7-8)

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  20. DreamerOfTheHeart

    DreamerOfTheHeart I Am What I Am

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    Belief about things we should have no confidence for is delusion.

    The fires and worm of Hell straightens human beings out. Many can speak of it today, while still alive.

    But, to the beliefs at the core of human being's being, it is fiery far beyond what mortals can speak of "shame", and good for destroying all doubt.
     
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