What did Jesus mean when he said "If you love me you will keep my commandments?"

yeshuaslavejeff

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The language they used was in keeping with what they knew and believed. Almost all the early converts were Jewish and so would not of even considered anything that was Biblically unclean to even be food. If I said to you lets go have a burger, you're not going to expect I will give you a squid burger or a tarantula burger, right? I don't have to because we are of the same culture and to us a burger is beef.
YEAH!
But beware or be aware - no longer is a burger beef in many places. Nutritious OR toxic substitutes have been made without advertising the fact, OFTEN. (even in some 'nice' medium expensive restaurants)
Even not just in burgers, but in Lasagnas , and in soups, and in chili, and in perhaps most menu items (not sure how many percentage-wise; but in the grocery store, way MORE than half)

So Better ask first in some (any) places though - now artificial and manmade and synthetic things are being used,
as well as ADDITIVES you almost really don't want to know about ! (medically or socially or righteously)
 
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ToBeLoved

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To love God with all our hearts was also given to the Israelite's in the OT ... so was loving our neighbour. These were just a synopsis of the Decalogue.. the first 4 are loving God with all our heart and the last 6 are loving our neighbours.
I don’t agree. Jesus told us that that is the higher calling that was to have happened, but it didn’t.
 
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EastCoastRemnant

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I don’t agree. Jesus told us that that is the higher calling that was to have happened, but it didn’t.
You are well within your rights as a free will agent to disagree with what scripture says....
 
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EastCoastRemnant

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Peter's vision had nothing to do with food... notice that it was stated it was a "vision". This denoted metaphorical language, not literal. Also, we have the witness of Peter as to what the vision signified. In verse 17 of Acts 10 Peter is pondering what the vision he just say could mean.... it wasn't "obvious" to Peter that it referenced food, because he knew the vision was a symbol of something. In verse 34, Peter states what it is that he now understands the vision to mean... that God is no respecter of persons.

As a second witness to the meaning of the vision, we are given it in chapter 11, verses 1-17..

1 And the apostles and brethren that were in Judaea heard that the Gentiles had also received the word of God.

2 And when Peter was come up to Jerusalem, they that were of the circumcision contended with him,

3 Saying, Thou wentest in to men uncircumcised, and didst eat with them.

4 But Peter rehearsed the matter from the beginning, and expounded it by order unto them, saying,

5 I was in the city of Joppa praying: and in a trance I saw a vision, A certain vessel descend, as it had been a great sheet, let down from heaven by four corners; and it came even to me:

6 Upon the which when I had fastened mine eyes, I considered, and saw fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air.

7 And I heard a voice saying unto me, Arise, Peter; slay and eat.

8 But I said, Not so, Lord: for nothing common or unclean hath at any time entered into my mouth.

9 But the voice answered me again from heaven, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.

10 And this was done three times: and all were drawn up again into heaven.

11 And, behold, immediately there were three men already come unto the house where I was, sent from Caesarea unto me.

12 And the Spirit bade me go with them, nothing doubting. Moreover these six brethren accompanied me, and we entered into the man's house:

13 And he shewed us how he had seen an angel in his house, which stood and said unto him, Send men to Joppa, and call for Simon, whose surname is Peter;

14 Who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved.

15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.

16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.

17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?

The issue in chapter 11 was the brethren were unhappy with Peter because he associated with a gentile and when Peter told them of the vision he had, the rejoiced because now they could see that God was not calling the gentiles "unclean" and that they could take the message to them. Nothing in the two chapters dealing with this vision, does it insinuate it is talking about what foods we are able to eat. Of course, that hasn't stopped countless millions of Christians from following the desires of their heart and reading into it what they want.



 
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Most magisterial Protestants and evangelicals would see it that way, traditionally, as well. The Law for a Christian believer has an entirely different function than the Law for a Jew. What was once a sacramental system now serves as a mirror to show us our dependence upon grace, to contextualize what grace looks like in a sinful world.
I was listening to Ephesians on my way to work today (90 minute commute). Paul effectively hammers home the grace message there. You know, it's almost as, just as Pharaoh was raised up to be what he was, some of us were raised up to be His followers, and if we're trying hard to be good and afraid that some bad thing we do is gonna force us out, we're doing it wrong.

It's a bit like a Ford being afraid that if it is not diligently working hard to be a Ford, it will turn into a Chevy. It doesn't have to to work at being a Ford, but it may have to work hard at being a GOOD Ford.
 
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The language they used was in keeping with what they knew and believed. Almost all the early converts were Jewish and so would not of even considered anything that was Biblically unclean to even be food. If I said to you lets go have a burger, you're not going to expect I will give you a squid burger or a tarantula burger, right? I don't have to because we are of the same culture and to us a burger is beef.
Paul preached to the Gentiles.
 
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Peter's vision had nothing to do with food... notice that it was stated it was a "vision". This denoted metaphorical language, not literal. Also, we have the witness of Peter as to what the vision signified. In verse 17 of Acts 10 Peter is pondering what the vision he just say could mean.... it wasn't "obvious" to Peter that it referenced food, because he knew the vision was a symbol of something. In verse 34, Peter states what it is that he now understands the vision to mean... that God is no respecter of persons.

As a second witness to the meaning of the vision, we are given it in chapter 11, verses 1-17..

1 And the apostles and brethren that were in Judaea heard that the Gentiles had also received the word of God.

2 And when Peter was come up to Jerusalem, they that were of the circumcision contended with him,

3 Saying, Thou wentest in to men uncircumcised, and didst eat with them.

4 But Peter rehearsed the matter from the beginning, and expounded it by order unto them, saying,

5 I was in the city of Joppa praying: and in a trance I saw a vision, A certain vessel descend, as it had been a great sheet, let down from heaven by four corners; and it came even to me:

6 Upon the which when I had fastened mine eyes, I considered, and saw fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air.

7 And I heard a voice saying unto me, Arise, Peter; slay and eat.

8 But I said, Not so, Lord: for nothing common or unclean hath at any time entered into my mouth.

9 But the voice answered me again from heaven, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.

10 And this was done three times: and all were drawn up again into heaven.

11 And, behold, immediately there were three men already come unto the house where I was, sent from Caesarea unto me.

12 And the Spirit bade me go with them, nothing doubting. Moreover these six brethren accompanied me, and we entered into the man's house:

13 And he shewed us how he had seen an angel in his house, which stood and said unto him, Send men to Joppa, and call for Simon, whose surname is Peter;

14 Who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved.

15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.

16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.

17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?

The issue in chapter 11 was the brethren were unhappy with Peter because he associated with a gentile and when Peter told them of the vision he had, the rejoiced because now they could see that God was not calling the gentiles "unclean" and that they could take the message to them. Nothing in the two chapters dealing with this vision, does it insinuate it is talking about what foods we are able to eat. Of course, that hasn't stopped countless millions of Christians from following the desires of their heart and reading into it what they want.


I just threw in the Peter vision. It was not my main point for exactly the reasons you pointed out.
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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Paul preached to the Gentiles.
Paul preached to Jews also, and it might be noted that
the gentiles in the OT who joined Yahweh's people honored Sabbath and [all] Torah as they learned it from the Jews.
Guess what ?
Same in the NT, although maybe not all, especially later when they were becoming a religion of the world opposed to Yahweh's Word and a threat to Yahweh's people instead of a blessing.
 
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Paul preached to Jews also, and it might be noted that
the gentiles in the OT who joined Yahweh's people honored Sabbath and [all] Torah as they learned it from the Jews.
Guess what ?
Same in the NT, although maybe not all, especially later when they were becoming a religion of the world opposed to Yahweh's Word and a threat to Yahweh's people instead of a blessing.
I can see you have some pet topics. ;)

I have one as well. It's outlined here: Believe What the Jewish Apostles Taught -- Why Conditional Immortality Is True and Biblical
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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I was listening to Ephesians on my way to work today (90 minute commute). Paul effectively hammers home the grace message there. You know, it's almost as, just as Pharaoh was raised up to be what he was, some of us were raised up to be His followers, and if we're trying hard to be good and afraid that some bad thing we do is gonna force us out, we're doing it wrong.
?
There are bad things people do and can do that indicate they are not followers of Jesus. i.e. not exactly 'force out', but willingly going out from among ekklesia/us, as written in Scripture.
Those things are written out in detail in the Epistles, et al.
 
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There are bad things people do and can do that indicate they are not followers of Jesus. i.e. not exactly 'force out', but willingly going out from among ekklesia/us, as written in Scripture.
Those things are written out in detail in the Epistles, et al.
See tag line.
 
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It is called Yahweh, Yahushua, and Yahweh's Word.
Contrary to some of yours.
Opinions vary.

BTW, did you know the word "scripture" basically means, "something written down"? i.e. all "old" writings, by ANYONE can be called scripture. And back in the day, not all that much was actually written down, at least by today's standards.
 
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ToBeLoved

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You are well within your rights as a free will agent to disagree with what scripture says....
Read Matthew 23. Jesus says that love is the higher calling of the law. That was chastising those who taught the law and weren’t living nor teaching the higher aspects which is Love

Then tell me what scripture says
 
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Soyeong

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In John 14:15 Jesus says "If you love me you will keep my commandments" what exactly did Jesus mean by this? What are the commandments of Jesus? Are they the two commandments he gave at the last supper? To love God with all your heart soul and mind and to love others as Jesus loved you? It seems there's more than just to love God because Jesus would have said something like if you love me you will love others as well as me. John says in 1 john that Jesus's commandments were to believe in Jesus and to love others. So are those the commandments Jesus was talking about in John 14:15?

In John 14:23-24, Jesus said that if we love him, then we will obey his teachings and that his teachings were not his own, but that of the Father, so his commands did not depart in the slightest from what the Father had commanded, and I see no reason to think that he was in disagreement with the Father about which commands we should follow. Jesus said that all of the other laws hang on the greatest two commandments, so the greatest two are the greatest because they summarize all of the other commands and all of the other commands are the explanation for how to correctly obey the greatest two. Jesus could have equivalently said that if we love him, then we will love others as well as me, as long as you understand that the entire Law is God's instructions for how He wants us to love others and Him.
 
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Soyeong

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Jesus actually gave quite a few "commandments". There are various lists with varying degrees of accuracy. Here is a list of 31: What commandments did Jesus give us? | Christian Apologetics & Research Ministry

I have a list of over 40 on a vinyl clad page at home. It's similar to the list above, but a bit larger.

And it really is wise to keep His commandments. Love is a decision. Love is an action.

In John 14:23-24, Jesus said that his teachings were not his own, but that of the Father, so we should not look at the commands of Jesus as though he were teaching his own thing in disagreement with the Father, but can simply look at everything that the Father taught to figure out what Jesus taught.
 
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Soyeong

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Other than "follow him" (and he is the perfect model of obedience we are to follow)

Deuteronomy 18:15-19 “The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your brothers—it is to him you shall listen— 16 just as you desired of the Lord your God at Horeb on the day of the assembly, when you said, ‘Let me not hear again the voice of the Lord my God or see this great fire any more, lest I die.’ 17 And the Lord said to me, ‘They are right in what they have spoken. 18 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers. And I will put my words in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him. 19 And whoever will not listen to my words that he shall speak in my name, I myself will require it of him.
 
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In John 14:23-24, Jesus said that his teachings were not his own, but that of the Father, so we should not look at the commands of Jesus as though he were teaching his own thing in disagreement with the Father, but can simply look at everything that the Father taught to figure out what Jesus taught.
Conceptually, I agree fully. However, to clarify, he did say that He and the Father are one. So they would be expected to be in complete harmony.
 
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Ken Rank

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We believe that the feasts have been fulfilled and that the seventh day Sabbath was a sign of covenant between God and His people, that we recognize the Creator through the day He blessed and sanctified at creation.

We also believe that the 1000 years will be the redeemed saints in Heaven with Christ, having the books of record opened to us to vindicate the Justice of God in the strange work God will do after the 1000 years are expired. We will understand why those that we thought were saved were not a part of the first resurrection and must be dealt with according to the judgement.
That's fine... I don't believe we have to see eye to eye on this now. If we knew each other enough and knew we could ask each other questions without fear of division or strife, I would probably ask how you all reconcile Zechariah 14:16-19 in light of your beliefs. Beyond that, I don't believe any one person or group is 100% correct on all things and so I see no need for either of us to convince the other. We are bound by the core aspects of our faith, beyond that, I believe.... we need to allow each other the freedom to come to our own conclusions.

By the way, I believe the Sabbath is a sign of the covenant as well.
 
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