What Covenant did Israel break with the Golden Calf

[Studyman]

Recently there was a discussion regarding the so called "Mosiac Law" that was closed. This caused the discussion, an important one in my view, to stop, including ridding me of the opportunity to respond to a reply. There is a lot of confusion surrounding this issue, and it seems prudent to study it.

Yes, the Covenant of Abraham that God furthered on to the Children of Israel, which Covenant they Broke.

GDL; The Children of Israel, a.k.a. Moses and Israel broke the Abrahamic Covenant?

Moses didn't, that is why God said after the Golden calf, " And the LORD said unto Moses, I have seen this people, and, behold, it is a stiffnecked people: Now therefore let me alone, that my wrath may wax hot against them, and that I may consume them: and I will make of thee a great nation.

But Israel did.

And the Covenant God made directly with Israel, "because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord." (Heb. 8)

GDL; What Covenant God made directly with Israel? Do you mean with Moses & Israel?

Moses was chosen by God to be a mediator between God and the Children of Israel. After the Golden calf, there was no Covenant between God and Israel, but there still was between God and Moses.

30 And it came to pass on the morrow, that Moses said unto the people, Ye have sinned a great sin: and now I will go up unto the LORD; peradventure I shall make an atonement for your sin.

It was after this that Levi was "Separated" from all of Israel to minister before God in the Priest's Office. So instead of becoming a kingdom of Priests, God placed a Priesthood over them.

Duet. 18: 1 The priests the Levites, and all the tribe of Levi, shall have no part nor inheritance with Israel: they shall eat the offerings of the LORD made by fire, and his inheritance. 2 Therefore shall they have no inheritance among their brethren: the LORD is their inheritance, as he hath said unto them.

So God's Covenant He brought Abraham into, is what the Children of Israel, not Moses, Broke.

"Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

But after the golden calf, a different Law was "ADDED", as God Separated Levi from Israel, to be a Kingdom of Priests for them, until the true High Priest of God should come.

Moses interceded on their behalf. If another Covenant wasn't needed, why did Moses have to "and now I will go up unto the LORD; peradventure I shall make an atonement for your sin."(Ex. 32)

GDL; Is this where you come up with the goats covenant "Ministry of death"?

"The goats covenant"??? Mocking God and HIS Law is most common among the "many" who come in Christ's Name. You know better than this, but you can't control your flesh.

Nevertheless, not to repay evil for evil, I will show you where I find the Priesthood Covenant which requires animal sacrifice for remission of sins.

Lev. 4: 27 And if any one of the common people sin through ignorance, while he doeth somewhat against any of the commandments of the LORD concerning things which ought not to be done, and be guilty; 28 Or if his sin, which he hath sinned, come to his knowledge: then he shall bring his offering, a kid of the goats, a female without blemish, for his sin which he hath sinned. 29 And he shall lay his hand upon the head of the sin offering, and slay the sin offering in the place of the burnt offering. 30 And the priest shall take of the blood thereof with his finger, and put it upon the horns of the altar of burnt offering, and shall pour out all the blood thereof at the bottom of the altar. 31 And he shall take away all the fat thereof, as the fat is taken away from off the sacrifice of peace offerings; and the priest shall burn it upon the altar for a sweet savour unto the LORD; and the priest shall make an atonement for him, and it shall be forgiven him.

The reason why you and the Pharisees can't accept this truth, is not because it isn't true, but because the philosophies of the religious sects and businesses of this world you doth have adopted, could not stand if you accepted this truth.

GDL; You have a lot of meaningless opinions which I'm going to bypass for the moment.

The mainstream preachers of Christ's Time thought the same about HIM, when HE pointed out the hypocrisy in the religion they had adopted. It's perfectly normal to hide from the Light in order to preserve religious tradition.

The separation between the Priesthood Covenant God gave Levi, and God's Statutes, Judgments Laws and Commandments Abraham and his Children were given, is clearly there

GDL; And this is the point where your view comes together. I'm going to add the NC part as I understand you from elsewhere. You can correct me if you see the need. :

1. God made a Covenant with Abraham brought Abraham into HIS Covenant.

Gen. 17: 1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect. 2 And I will make "my covenant" between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly.

1. God gave Abraham His Law

Yes, God gave Abraham "HIS LAW", so that Abraham would know the "Way of the Lord" in order to "Keep it".

Gen. 18: 19 For I know him, that he will command his children and his household after him, and they shall keep the way of the LORD, to do justice and judgment; that the LORD may bring upon Abraham that which he hath spoken of him.

Gen. 26: 4 And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; 5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

1. God passed the Covenant with Abraham and His Law to the nation Israel. Abraham's Children.

Gen. 15: 13 And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety "that thy seed" (Abraham's Children) shall be a stranger in a land that is not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years;

God Himself said "Ex. 19:5 Now therefore, if ye will obey "my voice indeed", (Like Abraham your father) and keep my covenant, "then" ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: 6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, "and" an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

1. Israel broke the Covenant and Laws God made with Abraham God's Laws and God's Covenant (at the Golden Calf incident).

Ex. 20: 22 And the LORD said unto Moses, Thus thou shalt say unto the children of Israel, Ye have seen that I have talked with you from heaven. 23 Ye shall not make with me gods of silver, neither shall ye make unto you gods of gold.

1. God made a Priesthood Covenant with Levi (a.k.a. the goats sacrifices) AKA, "The Levitical Priesthood".
2. In the NC God changed the Priesthood Law (Heb7) from Levi to Christ from the "Order of Aaron", to the "Order of Melchizedek" and transferred to sent Jesus Christ the Law He gave to Abraham. to administer before God in the Priest's Office. Where HE still is.

Mark 16: 19 So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.

1. God is writing the Law He gave to Abraham "HIS LAW" on our hearts. on the hearts of them who repent and turn to Him from the heart.

So:

1. The "old" and "first" covenant of Heb8 & Heb9 Heb. 7-10, is the Priesthood Covenant, correct?

The God of the Bible said in HIS Definition of HIS New Covenant, that 2 things changed.

#1. The manner in which God's Laws are received.

#2. The manner in which forgiveness of Sin, is provided for.

Both duties of the Levitical Priesthood.

1. Is all the Law that God gave to Moses except for the Priesthood section the Law God gave to Abraham?

If you mean "Is God's instruction in Righteousness, judgment and Justice that He gave Abraham, the same as God's instruction in righteousness, judgment and justice HE gave to Abraham's Children? I find no evidence that HE gives children different instructions than HE gave their fathers.

Only that the manner in which we receive God's instruction, and the manner in which transgressions are forgiven, has changed, at least according to Scriptures.

1. Is the Law of Christ the same as the Law God gave to Abraham?

John 8: 56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.

John 10: 30 I and my Father are one.

John 17: For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

 

[Clare73]

Recently there was a discussion regarding the so called "Mosiac Law" that was closed. This caused the discussion, an important one in my view, to stop, including ridding me of the opportunity to respond to a reply. There is a lot of confusion surrounding this issue, and it seems prudent to study it.

In Ex 32:8, Israel broke the Mosaic covenant (Ex 24), which was temporarily added to the Abrahamic covenant until the time of Christ (Gal 3:19).

 

[biblelesson]

Recently there was a discussion regarding the so called "Mosiac Law" that was closed. This caused the discussion, an important one in my view, to stop, including ridding me of the opportunity to respond to a reply. There is a lot of confusion surrounding this issue, and it seems prudent to study it.





Moses didn't, that is why God said after the Golden calf, " And the LORD said unto Moses, I have seen this people, and, behold, it is a stiffnecked people: Now therefore let me alone, that my wrath may wax hot against them, and that I may consume them: and I will make of thee a great nation.

But Israel did.




Moses was chosen by God to be a mediator between God and the Children of Israel. After the Golden calf, there was no Covenant between God and Israel, but there still was between God and Moses.

30 And it came to pass on the morrow, that Moses said unto the people, Ye have sinned a great sin: and now I will go up unto the LORD; peradventure I shall make an atonement for your sin.

It was after this that Levi was "Separated" from all of Israel to minister before God in the Priest's Office. So instead of becoming a kingdom of Priests, God placed a Priesthood over them.

Duet. 18: 1 The priests the Levites, and all the tribe of Levi, shall have no part nor inheritance with Israel: they shall eat the offerings of the LORD made by fire, and his inheritance. 2 Therefore shall they have no inheritance among their brethren: the LORD is their inheritance, as he hath said unto them.

So God's Covenant He brought Abraham into, is what the Children of Israel, not Moses, Broke.

"Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

But after the golden calf, a different Law was "ADDED", as God Separated Levi from Israel, to be a Kingdom of Priests for them, until the true High Priest of God should come.




"The goats covenant"??? Mocking God and HIS Law is most common among the "many" who come in Christ's Name. You know better than this, but you can't control your flesh.

Nevertheless, not to repay evil for evil, I will show you where I find the Priesthood Covenant which requires animal sacrifice for remission of sins.

Lev. 4: 27 And if any one of the common people sin through ignorance, while he doeth somewhat against any of the commandments of the LORD concerning things which ought not to be done, and be guilty; 28 Or if his sin, which he hath sinned, come to his knowledge: then he shall bring his offering, a kid of the goats, a female without blemish, for his sin which he hath sinned. 29 And he shall lay his hand upon the head of the sin offering, and slay the sin offering in the place of the burnt offering. 30 And the priest shall take of the blood thereof with his finger, and put it upon the horns of the altar of burnt offering, and shall pour out all the blood thereof at the bottom of the altar. 31 And he shall take away all the fat thereof, as the fat is taken away from off the sacrifice of peace offerings; and the priest shall burn it upon the altar for a sweet savour unto the LORD; and the priest shall make an atonement for him, and it shall be forgiven him.






The mainstream preachers of Christ's Time thought the same about HIM, when HE pointed out the hypocrisy in the religion they had adopted. It's perfectly normal to hide from the Light in order to preserve religious tradition.





Gen. 17: 1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect. 2 And I will make "my covenant" between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly.


Yes, God gave Abraham "HIS LAW", so that Abraham would know the "Way of the Lord" in order to "Keep it".

Gen. 18: 19 For I know him, that he will command his children and his household after him, and they shall keep the way of the LORD, to do justice and judgment; that the LORD may bring upon Abraham that which he hath spoken of him.

Gen. 26: 4 And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; 5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.


Gen. 15: 13 And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety "that thy seed" (Abraham's Children) shall be a stranger in a land that is not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years;

God Himself said "Ex. 19:5 Now therefore, if ye will obey "my voice indeed", (Like Abraham your father) and keep my covenant, "then" ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: 6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, "and" an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

Ex. 20: 22 And the LORD said unto Moses, Thus thou shalt say unto the children of Israel, Ye have seen that I have talked with you from heaven. 23 Ye shall not make with me gods of silver, neither shall ye make unto you gods of gold.

Mark 16: 19 So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.


The God of the Bible said in HIS Definition of HIS New Covenant, that 2 things changed.

#1. The manner in which God's Laws are received.

#2. The manner in which forgiveness of Sin, is provided for.

Both duties of the Levitical Priesthood.


If you mean "Is God's instruction in Righteousness, judgment and Justice that He gave Abraham, the same as God's instruction in righteousness, judgment and justice HE gave to Abraham's Children? I find no evidence that HE gives children different instructions than HE gave their fathers.

Only that the manner in which we receive God's instruction, and the manner in which transgressions are forgiven, has changed, at least according to Scriptures.


John 8: 56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.

John 10: 30 I and my Father are one.

John 17: For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

You said a lot! The Holy Spirit gives discernment of the word of God, therefore pray for understanding. All of us must do so!

Galatians 3:19 KJV, Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. The first mediator was Moses. The second mediator is Christ.

The Covenant Israel broke with the Golden Calf is the 10 Commandments, which is only part of the covenant Israel was under: Thou shalt have no other gods before me…, Exodus 20:3-5 KJV.

The Covenant God made with Abraham was not the Old Covenant. It was the New Covenant. Abraham’s covenant does not cross over into the covenant God gave to Israel, as one is of works (Israel), and one is of grace (Abraham).

You will not find in the Bible where God made a New Covenant after the Old Covenant. In fact the New Covenant came first. How is that possible? Well, because in Abraham, God was establishing salvation through grace for all the world, based on the faith of Abraham. However to assure the promised seed (Christ), God through Abraham seed, that is his children and grand children, established the law (Old Covenant) until the promised seed would come (Christ). So it was temporary.

So, after God established the New Covenant in Abraham, which would become in full force in Christ Jesus, He then established the Old Covenant which did not happen until 430 years later, Galatians 3:17 KJV.

So, the issue is there are two covenants that are not being understood. Additionally, Moses as God’s mediator between God and the Children of Israel is not being understood.

God set out to save the Hebrew people (Israelites) who were slaves in Egypt, where He said He heard their cries, Exodus 3:7 KJV. Therefore God chose a mediator for this express reason, to save the Hebrews out of the hands of Pharaoh in Egypt. So, He chose Moses to do the Job, Exodus 9:1 KJV. Moses was a mediator between God and Israel.
Proof Moses was a mediator and the laws were given to Israel- God told Moses many times, “Thus thou shalt say to the Children of Israel,” or “speak unto the children of Israel.”

Exodus 20:22 KJV, “And the LORD said unto Moses, Thus thou shalt say unto the children of Israel, Ye have seen that I have talked with you from heaven.”

Leviticus 1:2 KJV, “Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, If any man of you bring an offering unto the LORD, ye shall bring your offering of the cattle, even of the herd, and of the flock.

Leviticus 4:2 KJV, “Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a soul shall sin through ignorance against any of the commandments of the LORD concerning things which ought not to be done, and shall do against any of them:”

Leviticus 8:5 KJV, “And Moses said unto the congregation, This is the thing which the LORD commanded to be done.”

Leviticus 11:1-2 KJV, 1 “And the LORD spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying unto them,” 2 “Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth.”

There are many scriptures like this. Read all of Leviticus to help you understand that the covenant was given to Israel, which included Moses and the Levites. Moses had the role as a Mediator. And Aaron, and the Levites had the role as Priests to administer the temple ordinances.

Understanding the two covenants will guide your understanding around when they were established, and for who.

 

[Studyman]

In Ex 32:8, Israel broke the Mosaic covenant (Ex 24), which was temporarily added to the Abrahamic covenant until the time of Christ (Gal 3:19).

No! Israel broke God's Covenant HE brought Abraham and Israel under.

Ex. 19: 4 Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself.

5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: 6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel. 7 And Moses came and called for the elders of the people, and laid before their faces all these words which the LORD commanded him. 8 And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.

This is the Agreement God made with Israel that they Broke. Moses had to go up again and secure another Covenant. It was this Covenant that God "ADDED" a Priesthood to rule over Israel, which included men killing animals for their own sins.

Heb. 8: 9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

At least according to the Law and Prophets.


Jer. 7: 22 For I spake not unto your fathers, nor commanded them in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices: (No, these sacrificial "works of the Law" were not added until after the great transgression you spoke of.)

23 But this thing commanded I them, saying, Obey my voice, and I will be your God, and ye shall be my people: and walk ye in all the ways that I have commanded you, that it may be well unto you.

This was the same agreement God had made with Abraham.

Gen. 17: 1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect. 2 And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly.

Israel broke this Covenant, so God made another one with them, only this time, "ADDED" sacrificial "works of the law", as described by Moses in Leviticus, "concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices".

 

[Studyman]

You said a lot! The Holy Spirit gives discernment of the word of God, therefore pray for understanding. All of us must do so!

Galatians 3:19 KJV, Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. The first mediator was Moses. The second mediator is Christ.

The Covenant Israel broke with the Golden Calf is the 10 Commandments, which is only part of the covenant Israel was under: Thou shalt have no other gods before me…, Exodus 20:3-5 KJV.

A Covenant is an agreement between two or more parties. The 10 commandments are not a covenant, they define God's Righteousness. If there was not one human alive in existence, God's commandments would still be His Righteousness. But no Covenant between men and God would exist.

God had proposed His Covenant to Abraham's Children in Egypt.

Ex. 19: 5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: 6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

Israel answered God's Proposal.

8 And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.

This is the Agreement or Covenant they broke.

The Covenant God made with Abraham was not the Old Covenant. It was the New Covenant. Abraham’s covenant does not cross over into the covenant God gave to Israel, as one is of works (Israel), and one is of grace (Abraham).

This is simply not true.

Gen. 17: 1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect. 2 And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly.

And we know Abraham "Walked before God" in perfection, according to God's Judgment, because of what God Himself said to Abraham's son;

Gen. 26: 4 And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;

5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

In your religion, if Abraham had chosen to do the "Works" of Israel, as defined by the Prophets;

Ez. 20: 13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.

Would God have done to Abraham, as HE did to Sodom?

You will not find in the Bible where God made a New Covenant after the Old Covenant. In fact the New Covenant came first. How is that possible?

My friend, since you have not been taught the difference between God's instruction in righteousness, and the Agreements God makes with men, you are in error.

Please, out of love for the brethren, go learn the difference between "Covenant" and "commandment", and then you can come back and fellowship from the position of knowledge.

 

[Clare73]

No! Israel broke God's Covenant HE brought Abraham and Israel under.
Ex. 19: 4 Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself.
5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: 6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel. 7 And Moses came and called for the elders of the people, and laid before their faces all these words which the LORD commanded him. 8 And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.

This is the Agreement God made with Israel that they Broke. Moses had to go up again and secure another Covenant. It was this Covenant that God "ADDED" a Priesthood to rule over Israel, which included men killing animals for their own sins.

Ex 19:5 refers to the Mosaic covenant which God added to the Abrahamic covenant until Christ (Gal 3:19).

Heb. 8:9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

The book of Hebrews is about the New Covenant being superior to the Old (Mosaic) Covenant, it is not about the Abrahamic covenant.
Heb 8:9 refers to the Old (Mosaic) covenant which was made obsolete (Heb 8:13) and replaced with the New Covenant.

At least according to the Law and Prophets.
Jer. 7: 22 For I spake not unto your fathers, nor commanded them in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices: (No, these sacrificial "works of the Law" were not added until after the great transgression you spoke of.)
23 But this thing commanded I them, saying, Obey my voice, and I will be your God, and ye shall be my people: and walk ye in all the ways that I have commanded you, that it may be well unto you.
This was the same agreement God had made with Abraham.

And also at Sinai (Ex 19:5, Lev 26:3, 12), the Mosaic covenant being an addition (Gal 3:19) to the Abrahamic covenant.

Gen. 17: 1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect. 2 And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly.

Israel broke this Covenant, so God made another one with them, only this time, "ADDED" sacrificial "works of the law", as described by Moses in Leviticus, "concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices".

Not according to Gal 3:19 where "the law (Mosaic covenant) introduced 430 years later did not set aside the (Abrahamic) covenant previously established," but was added to reveal sin (Ro 3:20), to teach them the meaning of sin and its remedy (Lev 1-7), blood sacrifice.

 

[biblelesson]

See other reply!

 

[biblelesson]

A Covenant is an agreement between two or more parties. The 10 commandments are not a covenant, they define God's Righteousness. If there was not one human alive in existence, God's commandments would still be His Righteousness. But no Covenant between men and God would exist.

God had proposed His Covenant to Abraham's Children in Egypt.

Ex. 19: 5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: 6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

Israel answered God's Proposal.

8 And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.

This is the Agreement or Covenant they broke.



This is simply not true.

Gen. 17: 1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect. 2 And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly.

And we know Abraham "Walked before God" in perfection, according to God's Judgment, because of what God Himself said to Abraham's son;

Gen. 26: 4 And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;

5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

In your religion, if Abraham had chosen to do the "Works" of Israel, as defined by the Prophets;

Ez. 20: 13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.

Would God have done to Abraham, as HE did to Sodom?




My friend, since you have not been taught the difference between God's instruction in righteousness, and the Agreements God makes with men, you are in error.

Please, out of love for the brethren, go learn the difference between "Covenant" and "commandment", and then you can come back and fellowship from the position of knowledge.

A lot of your post and how you are using scripture is not accurate.

 

[HIM]

A Covenant is an agreement between two or more parties. The 10 commandments are not a covenant,

Moses through God says different.
Exod 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

 

[HIM]

Ex 19:5 refers to the Mosaic covenant which God added to the Abrahamic covenant until Christ (Gal 3:19).

No mention of a Mosaic covenant in any of those verses. God's Covenant in Exodus and Galatians speaks of the Law not the Covenant. There is a difference

 

[Cribstyl]

No mention of a Mosaic covenant in any of those verses. God's Covenant in Exodus and Galatians speaks of the Law not the Covenant. There is a difference

The words of the covenant is the law

 

[Studyman]

Ex 19:5 refers to the Mosaic covenant which God added to the Abrahamic covenant until Christ (Gal 3:19).

The Covenant in Ex. 19:5 was broken. In Ex. 32, Israel was under NO Covenant.

Ex. 32: 10 Now therefore let me alone, that my wrath may wax hot against them, and that I may consume them: and I will make of thee a great nation.

So even if something was "ADDED" here, which there wasn't, it is irrelevant because this agreement was broken and another one took its place.

This is simply undeniable Biblical truth. Shall we not accept what is actually written?


You are wrong about God "ADDING" the so called Mosiac covenant to the so called Abrahamic Covenant. Even the terms, found no where in Scriptures, are created by religious men "who come in Christ's Name". But this is the religious philosophy of this world, so I understand where you get it.

Here is what God actually said.

Ex. 19: 4 Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself.

5 Now therefore, if ye will "obey my voice" indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: 6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

God offered to them "HIS covenant", just as HE did Abraham.

Gen. 17: 1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.

2 And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly.

But Abraham didn't break God's Covenant.

Gen. 26: 4 And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;

5 Because that Abraham obeyed "my voice", and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

The book of Hebrews is about the New Covenant being superior to the Old (Mosaic) Covenant, not about the Abrahamic covenant.
Heb 8:9 refers to the Old (Mosaic) covenant which was made obsolete (Heb 8:13) and replaced with the New Covenant.

According to what Hebrews actually says, Heb. 7-10 was about the Priesthood Covenant God brought Israel under, after the Golden Calf. His Covenant with LEVI and the Priesthood God Separated him from the rest of Israel to administer before HIM in.

Look for yourself.

Heb. 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

2 Things are changed.

#1. The manner in which God's Laws are received.

#2. The manner in which sins are forgiven.

It's right there, all a man needs is belief.

Heb. 7: 11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (Abraham didn't have) (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?

12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

13 For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.

14 For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Juda; of which tribe Moses spake nothing concerning priesthood.

15 And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,

16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, (Priesthood Law) but after the power of an endless life.

Where is even the mention of the 10 Commandments? Or "Love God or Love your neighbor" or don't eat Blood mentioned in Heb. 7-10?

You are being led astray by this world's religions. Follow the Christ "Of the Bible" and "SEEK the Kingdom of God and HIS Righteousness", Don't follow the philosophies and traditions of this world, created by the very people Jesus warned us about.

And also at Sinai (Ex 19:5, Lev 26:3, 12), the Mosaic covenant being an addition (Gal 3:19) to the Abrahamic covenant.

No my friend, it was the Levitical Priesthood with it's sacrificial "works of the Law" that was "ADDED" because of transgressions "Til the SEED should come".

Not according to Gal 3:19 where "the law (Mosaic covenant) introduced 430 years later did not set aside the (Abrahamic) covenant previously established,"

This is almost true. Abraham was justified because he believed God. The evidence of his belief, was his "works" which were obedience to God. This is the very definition of Faith as shown by the examples in Heb. 11. Was Abraham required by God to bring a goat to a Levite Priest, and then kill it, before his sins could be forgiven? No, Abraham was justified by Belief/Faith. Levi wasn't even born yet. This Priesthood wasn't even created until 430 years after Abraham.

But God's Statutes, God's Laws, God's Commandments which define SIN, did exist. Abraham's son was blessed because when Abraham heard God's commandments, he obeyed, Sodom was destroyed because when Sodom heard God's commandments, Sodom disobeyed.

Sin still exists in the world today. Surely you know this. Therefore, God's Commandments that define sin, still exist. What became obsolete wasn't God's definition of Righteousness and therefore sin, but the Priesthood Covenant God made with Levi 430 years after God said "that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws."

but was added to reveal sin (Ro 3:20), to teach them the meaning of sin and its remedy (Lev 1-7), blood sacrifice.

"Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

So let's take this and inject the rest of Paul's Teaching.

Therefore by the deeds of the law for justification given to Moses after the Golden calf (Lev. 1-7), Added 430 years after God said that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws, shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Now answer some simple questions?

Did Abraham know what sin was?

Did Sodom know what sin was?

Did Cain know what sin was?

Did Abimelec know what Sin was?

Did Noah know what sin was?


God's Law defining sin was revealed to EVERY MAN. The preaching, popular as it is, that God destroyed men for Transgressing His Laws they had not been given, is foolishness. Paul tells us why men actually believe and promote such foolishness. But like Jesus said, "Men love darkness".

Rom. 1: 16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; (Including Abraham) to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein (Within the Gospel of Christ) is the righteousness of God revealed from faith (of Abel) to faith (of Malichi): as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, (within the Gospel of Christ) who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. (Cain and Able, Noah and the world, Abraham and Sodom etc., ALL knew about God, His Righteousness, and His Wrath)

20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

Now here is the result.

23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, (Long haired men's hair shampoo model) and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, (Golden Calf) and creeping things.

24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature (They created) more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

Truly there is no new thing under the sun.

 

[Clare73]

No mention of a Mosaic covenant in any of those verses. God's Covenant in Exodus and Galatians speaks of the Law not the Covenant. There is a difference

The law (Ex 19-24) was the condition (Ex 19:5) to receive ithe blessings of the Mosaic covenant, whereby violation of the covenant resulted in death (Ex 32:25-35; see Mt 10:37).

 

[Clare73]

The Covenant in Ex. 19:5 was broken. In Ex. 32, Israel was under NO Covenant.

Violation of the covenant did not result in termination of the covenant, violation of the covenant resulted in death (Ex 32:25-35).
Israel remained under the one and only Mosaic covenant, which was added to the Abrahamic covenant until Christ (Gal 3:29).

Scripture presents no "second" Mosaic covenant.
That is an invention of man.

 

[Studyman]

Moses through God says different.
Exod 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

You are missing an important Biblical truth here.

Ex. 34: 8 And Moses made haste, and bowed his head toward the earth, and worshipped.

9 And he said, If now I have found grace in thy sight, O Lord, let my Lord, I pray thee, go among us; for it is a stiffnecked people; and pardon our iniquity and our sin, and take us for thine inheritance.

God goes on to tell Moses the terms for His Forgiveness.


10 And he said, Behold, I make a covenant: before all thy people I will do marvels, such as have not been done in all the earth, nor in any nation: and all the people among which thou art shall see the work of the LORD: for it is a terrible thing that I will do with thee.

11 Observe thou that which I command thee this day: behold, I drive out before thee the Amorite, and the Canaanite, and the Hittite, and the Perizzite, and the Hivite, and the Jebusite.

12 Take heed to thyself, lest thou make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land whither thou goest, lest it be for a snare in the midst of thee:

13 But ye shall destroy their altars, break their images, and cut down their groves:

14 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:

15 Lest thou make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land, and they go a whoring after their gods, and do sacrifice unto their gods, and one call thee, and thou eat of his sacrifice;

16 And thou take of their daughters unto thy sons, and their daughters go a whoring after their gods, and make thy sons go a whoring after their gods.

17 Thou shalt make thee no molten gods.

18 The feast of unleavened bread shalt thou keep. Seven days thou shalt eat unleavened bread, as I commanded thee, in the time of the month Abib: for in the month Abib thou camest out from Egypt.

19 All that openeth the matrix is mine; and every firstling among thy cattle, whether ox or sheep, that is male.

20 But the firstling of an ass thou shalt redeem with a lamb: and if thou redeem him not, then shalt thou break his neck. All the firstborn of thy sons thou shalt redeem. And none shall appear before me empty.

21 Six days thou shalt work, but on the seventh day thou shalt rest: in earing time and in harvest thou shalt rest.

22 And thou shalt observe the feast of weeks, of the firstfruits of wheat harvest, and the feast of ingathering at the year's end.

23 Thrice in the year shall all your men children appear before the Lord GOD, the God of Israel.

24 For I will cast out the nations before thee, and enlarge thy borders: neither shall any man desire thy land, when thou shalt go up to appear before the LORD thy God thrice in the year.

25 Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leaven; neither shall the sacrifice of the feast of the passover be left unto the morning.

26 The first of the firstfruits of thy land thou shalt bring unto the house of the LORD thy God. Thou shalt not seethe a kid in his mother's milk.

27 And the LORD said unto Moses, Write thou these words: for after the tenor of these words I have made a covenant with thee and with Israel.

28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

It's important sometimes to include more than just one verse, or one chapter when Seeking the Kingdom of God and His Righteousness.

The 10 Commandments are simply God's instruction in Righteousness revealed to all men.

What was written down here, were the terms of God's Forgiveness for the Golden Calf. At least according to Moses.

 

[Clare73]

You are missing an important Biblical truth here.
Ex. 34: 8 And Moses made haste, and bowed his head toward the earth, and worshipped.
9 And he said, If now I have found grace in thy sight, O Lord, let my Lord, I pray thee, go among us; for it is a stiffnecked people; and pardon our iniquity and our sin, and take us for thine inheritance.
God goes on to tell Moses the terms for His Forgiveness.
10 And he said, Behold, I make a covenant: before all thy people I will do marvels, such as have not been done in all the earth, nor in any nation: and all the people among which thou art shall see the work of the LORD: for it is a terrible thing that I will do with thee.
11 Observe thou that which I command thee this day: behold, I drive out before thee the Amorite, and the Canaanite, and the Hittite, and the Perizzite, and the Hivite, and the Jebusite.
12 Take heed to thyself, lest thou make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land whither thou goest, lest it be for a snare in the midst of thee:
13 But ye shall destroy their altars, break their images, and cut down their groves:
14 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:
15 Lest thou make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land, and they go a whoring after their gods, and do sacrifice unto their gods, and one call thee, and thou eat of his sacrifice;
16 And thou take of their daughters unto thy sons, and their daughters go a whoring after their gods, and make thy sons go a whoring after their gods.
17 Thou shalt make thee no molten gods.
18 The feast of unleavened bread shalt thou keep. Seven days thou shalt eat unleavened bread, as I commanded thee, in the time of the month Abib: for in the month Abib thou camest out from Egypt.
19 All that openeth the matrix is mine; and every firstling among thy cattle, whether ox or sheep, that is male.
20 But the firstling of an ass thou shalt redeem with a lamb: and if thou redeem him not, then shalt thou break his neck. All the firstborn of thy sons thou shalt redeem. And none shall appear before me empty.
21 Six days thou shalt work, but on the seventh day thou shalt rest: in earing time and in harvest thou shalt rest.
22 And thou shalt observe the feast of weeks, of the firstfruits of wheat harvest, and the feast of ingathering at the year's end.
23 Thrice in the year shall all your men children appear before the Lord GOD, the God of Israel.
24 For I will cast out the nations before thee, and enlarge thy borders: neither shall any man desire thy land, when thou shalt go up to appear before the LORD thy God thrice in the year.
25 Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leaven; neither shall the sacrifice of the feast of the passover be left unto the morning.
26 The first of the firstfruits of thy land thou shalt bring unto the house of the LORD thy God. Thou shalt not seethe a kid in his mother's milk.
27 And the LORD said unto Moses, Write thou these words: for after the tenor of these words I have made a covenant with thee and with Israel.

I see this as a renewal of the covenant of Ex 19-24.
The vv. 10-26, above, are quoted almost verbatim from previous sections of Ex, as in vv. 18-26 above and Ex 23:14-19.

28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.
It's important sometimes to include more than just one verse, or one chapter when Seeking the Kingdom of God and His Righteousness.
The 10 Commandments are simply God's instruction in Righteousness revealed to all men.
What was written down here, were the terms of God's Forgiveness for the Golden Calf. At least according to Moses.

 

[Studyman]

Violation of the covenant did not result in termination of the covenant, violation of the covenant resulted in death (Ex 32:25-35).

So then, in your religion God wiped all who broke the covenant out, and started all over again with Moses?

Israel remained under the one and only Mosaic covenant, which was added to the Abrahamic covenant until Christ (Gal 3:29).

In the religion you have adopted, this might be true. But not according to the Scriptures.

Scripture presents no "second" Mosaic covenant.

Heb. 8: 9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

The religions of this world have led you astray. I implore you to turn from them and consider what is actually written.

Ex. 34: 10 And he said, Behold, I make a covenant: before all thy people I will do marvels, such as have not been done in all the earth, nor in any nation: and all the people among which thou art shall see the work of the LORD: for it is a terrible thing that I will do with thee.

Surely different than:

Ex. 19: 5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine:

6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

That is an invention of man.

No, it exposes this world's religions, which are inventions of men.

 

[daq]

I see this as a renewal of the covenant of Ex 19-24.
The vv. 10-26, above, are quoted almost verbatim from previous sections of Ex, as in vv. 18-26 above and Ex 23:14-19.

Good if you see that passage as a renewal of the covenant: but then what changed?

Mosheh hints at the answer in Deuteronomy 32:6.
See also Jeremiah 3, Will you not from that time call Me Abbi? (my Father)?

No more wifey, (otherwise how will one be placed among His sons? Jer 3:19).

 

[Studyman]

I see this as a renewal of the covenant of Ex 19-24.
The vv. 10-26, above, are quoted almost verbatim from previous sections of Ex, as in vv. 18-26 above and Ex 23:14-19.

In part, as God didn't change His Instruction in righteousness, as that never changes. But the Levitical Priesthood "works of the Law", concerning burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin, that God placed Israel under after the Golden calf, is what was "ADDED". Neither Abraham, nor Israel before the Golden Calf, was required to kill a goat in front of a Levite Priest, before their sins could be forgiven.

This is simply undeniable Biblical Truth.


I know this world's religions don't teach this, as prophesied. But if a man trusts the Jesus "of the Bible" and considers "EVERY WORD" that proceeds out of the mouth of God, you would find what I found.

Jer. 7: 22 For I spake not unto your fathers, nor commanded them in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices:

23 But this thing commanded I them, saying, Obey my voice, and I will be your God, and ye shall be my people: and walk ye in all the ways that I have commanded you, that it may be well unto you.

 

[Clare73]

So then, in your religion God wiped all who broke the covenant out, and started all over again with Moses?

1) Do we know that every man, woman, child and suckling worshiped the idol?

2) God destroyed those who sinned (Ex 32:33-35), which death is the consequence for transgression, as it was in the Garden (Ge 2:17).

In the religion you have adopted, this might be true. But not according to the Scriptures.

Heb. 8: 9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

Yes, God turned away from them, killing all who sinned (Ex 32:33).

The religions of this world have led you astray. I implore you to turn from them and consider what is actually written.

Ex. 34: 10 And he said, Behold, I make a covenant: before all thy people I will do marvels, such as have not been done in all the earth, nor in any nation: and all the people among which thou art shall see the work of the LORD: for it is a terrible thing that I will do with thee.

"And the rest of the story." You omitted v.11: "Obey what I command you today."

Which I see as a renewal of the covenant of Ex 19-24, as seen in Ex 34:10-27, where Ex 34:18-26 are quoted almost verbatim from the previous Ex 23:14-19.

Surely different than:

Ex. 19: 5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine:

6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

I see Ex 34:10 as a renewal of Ex 19:5-6 because both are conditioned on the same Mosaic laws.