What are your thoughts on this?

[Bradskii]

Once you go down that road you leave the door open for the government to usurp that power and restrict any speech they deem unacceptable

But we're not talking about what 'the government' decides. We're talking about what we think is acceptable. 'The government' should reflect the will of the people. If it doesn't then that doesn't mean the will of the people is wrong. It shouldn't change our view.

 

[BPPLEE]

But we're not talking about what 'the government' decides. We're talking about what we think is acceptable. 'The government' should reflect the will of the people. If it doesn't then that doesn't mean the will of the people is wrong. It shouldn't change our view.

Well it’s not acceptable to say that someone deserves death

 

[ozso]

Good grief, no. It doesn't preference anyone. It protects people.

What did you mean by nominating then?

 

[ozso]

Well it’s not acceptable to say that someone deserves death

It seems like you've been having to repeat that a lot.

 

[BPPLEE]

It seems like you've been having to repeat that a lot.

If you’re not clear people tend to put words in your mouth

 

[ozso]

If you’re not clear people tend to put words in your mouth

That tends to happen to me even when I am clear.

 

[ToddNotTodd]

I’m sorry but a man in a dress who wants to be around children should be a red flag to any parent

I find Christian men who want to be around children to be a red flag. To each their own I guess…

 

[Bradskii]

What did you mean by nominating then?

Because people think of some minorities or people who are 'not like them', as people they can abuse simply by them being different, it has to be spelled out that it's not acceptable to discriminate in those situations. We unfortunately have to write laws that say to the misogynists, homophobes, racists etc 'Hey, we're talking to you'.

'Treat everyone equally' just doesn't seem to cut it with some people.

 

[BPPLEE]

Because people think of some minorities or people who are 'not like them', as people they can abuse simply by them being different, it has to be spelled out that it's not acceptable to discriminate in those situations. We unfortunately have to write laws that say to the misogynists, homophobes, racists etc 'Hey, we're talking to you'.

'Treat everyone equally' just doesn't seem to cut it with some people.

I try to but everyone doesn’t act equally

 

[Bradskii]

Well it’s not acceptable to say that someone deserves death

But we have had members of this forum who specifically quote that part of the bible and then shrug their shoulders and say 'well, I'm only quoting scripture'. And others who compare gay people to those who indulge in bestiality. Because hey, they're all grouped together in scripture. So I'm afraid that because of people like that, there will be some restrictions on religious speech. If you want to complain about it, then those are the people to whom you should be complaining.

 

[BPPLEE]

But we have had members of this forum who specifically quote that part of the bible and then shrug their shoulders and say 'well, I'm only quoting scripture'. And others who compare gay people to those who indulge in inappropriate behavior with animals. Because hey, they're all grouped together in scripture. So I'm afraid that because of people like that, there will be some restrictions on religious speech. If you want to complain about it, then those are the people to whom you should be complaining.

Heterosexual people are in that group as well. No matter what you believe you shouldn’t discriminate. And you’re not going to win anyone over by telling them they deserve to die

 

[Bradskii]

I try to but everyone doesn’t act equally

That's precisely what I was saying. People are being abused simply by them being different to the person doing the abusing. None of us act equally. My lifestyle is probably significantly different to yours. There are a lot of people who have lifestyles with which I disagree. But it's their call how they live their lives, as long as it doesn't impact negatively on others. "I don't like that' or 'I think that's disgusting' isn't an excuse to abuse others.

That said, if you have evidence that there is someone who is likely to harm others then speak out. Whether it's a priest, a school teacher, a guy in drag or a scout leader. But what we get is the equivalent of 'All (insert your person of choice here) are paedophiles. They have too much access to our children!'

 

[Bradskii]

Heterosexual people are in that group as well.

If people were being abused simply by being heterosexual then they'd be included. But it was at least heartening that the two members speaking as they did as I mentioned above (and I'm not going to name them) were called out by their fellow Christians. But unfortunately, not very many. Just two or three from memory.

 

[BPPLEE]

That's precisely what I was saying. People are being abused simply by them being different to the person doing the abusing. None of us act equally. My lifestyle is probably significantly different to yours. There are a lot of people who have lifestyles with which I disagree. But it's their call how they live their lives, as long as it doesn't impact negatively on others. "I don't like that' or 'I think that's disgusting' isn't an excuse to abuse others.

That said, if you have evidence that there is someone who is likely to harm others then speak out. Whether it's a priest, a school teacher, a guy in drag or a scout leader. But what we get is the equivalent of 'All (insert your person of choice here) are paedophiles. They have too much access to our children!'

I don’t disagree with most of what you say. I don’t treat anyone differently than anyone else. But some people make it difficult and I’m not talking about LGBTQ people, just some people in general

 

[BPPLEE]

If people were being abused simply by being heterosexual then they'd be included. But it was at least heartening that the two members speaking as they did as I mentioned above (and I'm not going to name them) were called out by their fellow Christians. But unfortunately, not very many. Just two or three from memory.

I was talking about in the scriptures, more than gay people are called out for their behavior

 

[Bradskii]

I was talking about in the scriptures, more than gay people are called out for their behavior

Yes, they are. But gay people are then included into this group and told 'you are just as bad as murderers and people who have sex with animals'. As if two middle aged women who are married can be compared to that.

And the other argument? If someone is told that what people do with their lives is absolutely nothing to do with them, just as what I do is nothing to do with them, then we get the utterly risible argument that they are taking pride in what they do. When what some of them are doing is saying 'we are not ashamed of what we are'. And what's the opposite of shame? Yeah, pride. It's a reaction to the abuse they get.

It's exactly the reaction I would have if a significant number of people were abusive to the Welsh. I was born Welsh and I'm proud of my heritage but I don't make a song and dance about it. But if there were forum comments and articles and people in the street would shout derogatory remarks and if people were physically attacked simply for being Welsh then I'd react. My Welsh flag would be hung outside the house. I'd speak Welsh at every opportunity. I'd wear the Welsh rugby jersey when I went out. With pride. I'd want to organise a march on St. David's Day to rival St. Patricks. It would be my middle finger to all those who thought it was OK to abuse people from Wales simply because that's where they come from.

And then if people came to their senses and some said 'Hey I've got Welsh friends and they're just like us, so quit those remarks', then the flag would go back into the basement, the jumper would go back in the drawer and we'd all get on with our lives.

We just need more people saying that they have friends like that, so watch what you say.

 

[ozso]

Because people think of some minorities or people who are 'not like them', as people they can abuse simply by them being different, it has to be spelled out that it's not acceptable to discriminate in those situations. We unfortunately have to write laws that say to the misogynists, homophobes, racists etc 'Hey, we're talking to you'.

'Treat everyone equally' just doesn't seem to cut it with some people.

To what further lengths does it need to be taken for LGBT though?

 

[Bradskii]

To what further lengths does it need to be taken for LGBT though?

No more than any group that is being disparaged simply for who they are.

 

[ozso]

No more than any group that is being disparaged simply for who they are.

Is LGBT on an equal plane with other groups?

 

[Bradskii]

Is LGBT on an equal plane with other groups?

I just said no more than any group that is being disparaged simply for who they are. That's your answer. So rather than keep poking and prodding and rewording questions until you get your gotcha, why not state your point directly. I'm really not into these games.