What are God's reasons for sending someone to hell?

talquin · Mar 21, 2015

Do you consider going to hell to be eternal torment in which one will suffer endlessly?

Do you believe God sends some people to such a hell?

If so, why would God do such a thing?

There are really only three reasons to punish someone:

1) To show to others that a particular action or behavior is wrong

2) To prevent the person from doing such action again - whether it be by locking them up or punishing them in such a manner that they'll have incentive to not commit such atrocities again.

3) To get revenge (AKA vengeance)

If God does send some people to hell:

a) we can rule out #1, as us on earth don't know who has gone to hell and who hasn't.

b) we can rule out #2, as if hell is eternal or permanent, then the culprit wouldn't be able to be in a position where it would matter if he could avoid committing such atrocities again.

That leaves #3. So the sole reason God sends people to hell is for vengeance. Why would a loving God do such a thing?

Mickiel · Mar 21, 2015

talquin said:
Do you consider going to hell to be eternal torment in which one will suffer endlessly?

Do you believe God sends some people to such a hell?

If so, why would God do such a thing?

There are really only three reasons to punish someone:

1) To show to others that a particular action or behavior is wrong

2) To prevent the person from doing such action again - whether it be by locking them up or punishing them in such a manner that they'll have incentive to not commit such atrocities again.

3) To get revenge (AKA vengeance)

If God does send some people to hell:

a) we can rule out #1, as us on earth don't know who has gone to hell and who hasn't.

b) we can rule out #2, as if hell is eternal or permanent, then the culprit wouldn't be able to be in a position where it would matter if he could avoid committing such atrocities again.

That leaves #3. So the sole reason God sends people to hell is for vengeance. Why would a loving God do such a thing?

Hell is a Christian misunderstanding and myth; there is no hell likened to how Christians describe it in the bible. The bible describes hell as the grave. And God does not punish forever, such a thing would be insane to torture a human forever, and God is not insane; the doctrines of some of his believers is what is insane.

Tree of Life · Mar 21, 2015

You're talking a little bit about the difference between retributive and restorative justice. Hell is about retribution.

A loving God must avenge evil. How could a loving God sit idly by when wicked men are oppressing the poor? Love demands that God would set the world to rights. And this means retribution.

talquin · Mar 21, 2015

Tree of Life said:
You're talking a little bit about the difference between retributive and restorative justice. Hell is about retribution.

A loving God must avenge evil. How could a loving God sit idly by when wicked men are oppressing the poor? Love demands that God would set the world to rights. And this means retribution.

Why wait until the child molester dies to punish him? Why not stop him before he molests the child and punish him then?

Ken-1122 · Mar 22, 2015

Tree of Life said:
You're talking a little bit about the difference between retributive and restorative justice. Hell is about retribution.

A loving God must avenge evil. How could a loving God sit idly by when wicked men are oppressing the poor? Love demands that God would set the world to rights. And this means retribution.

Your avenging evil argument fails because Hell isn't for those who do bad, Hell is for those who don't believe! There are plenty of people who do bad, but because they believe and ask for forgiveness, they are not punished.

Ken

terryjohn · Mar 22, 2015

If you punish someone before the crime wouldn't you be unjust?

talquin · Mar 22, 2015

terryjohn said:
If you punish someone before the crime wouldn't you be unjust?

If you knew a rapist was about to rape a small child in your town, would you stop the rapist from doing so or would you do nothing?

ThinkForYourself · Mar 22, 2015

terryjohn said:
If you punish someone before the crime wouldn't you be unjust?

You would think so, wouldn't you?

But not according to the bible, God considers thought crimes to be amongst the worst crimes.

Mickiel · Mar 22, 2015

Tree of Life said:
You're talking a little bit about the difference between retributive and restorative justice. Hell is about retribution.

.

Hell is about Christian attitude, Christian judgment, Christian merciless, Christian doctrine and Christian desire. Its Christian created, Christian defended, Christians are hoping for it, preaching and teaching it, teaching it to children, using it for motivation, Christians actually believe that punishment is eternal, that God will allow misery and suffering to go on for 999,776,806,321 Trillion, billion, quadrillion years - times infinity, and never, never, ever, EVER, NEVER end!!

Hell is about how the human believing mind can be seduced into believing insanity. And then try to call the evil of that insanity, love? Such a thing is an insult to the integrity of our most Loving and Gracious and Forgiving God; God is not demented, religion is.

Eudaimonist · Mar 22, 2015

talquin said:
Why not stop him before he molests the child and punish him then?

Or during the attempt itself, protecting the child from harm.

It is an odd retribution that waits until after death for a retribution that isn't visible and knowable in this lifetime. It's the most inefficient justice system ever.

eudaimonia,

Mark

Colter · Mar 22, 2015

talquin said:
Do you consider going to hell to be eternal torment in which one will suffer endlessly?

Do you believe God sends some people to such a hell?

If so, why would God do such a thing?

There are really only three reasons to punish someone:

1) To show to others that a particular action or behavior is wrong

2) To prevent the person from doing such action again - whether it be by locking them up or punishing them in such a manner that they'll have incentive to not commit such atrocities again.

3) To get revenge (AKA vengeance)

If God does send some people to hell:

a) we can rule out #1, as us on earth don't know who has gone to hell and who hasn't.

b) we can rule out #2, as if hell is eternal or permanent, then the culprit wouldn't be able to be in a position where it would matter if he could avoid committing such atrocities again.

That leaves #3. So the sole reason God sends people to hell is for vengeance. Why would a loving God do such a thing?

Hell is a mythical byproduct of evolutionary religion. There is either eternal life or cessation of existence, deleted. Those who reject the gift of becoming the possibility of what God has given them do not continue on.

stevevw · Mar 22, 2015

Hell is being apart from God. I think the description of hell by some that it is an eternal fire is a man made idea. I think this is based on the word (Gehenna). This is some rubbish pit that was outside Jerusalem where everyone took their rubbish and the dead to be burnt. It was always burning and therefore became the symbol for hell.

But like some said Hell is like life on this planet. Its the decaying life that we see now. Everything is subject to the conditions of this world where people suffer and feel pain and sorrow. That is why Jesus says to not be conformed to this world but store up your riches in Heaven. As a Christian you have to be willing to give up all the desires and pleasures of this world. You have to be willing to lose your life in this world for the glory of life in Gods Kingdom. So hell is really living in this world and being apart from God and knowing the difference.

talquin · Mar 22, 2015

Colter said:
Hell is a mythical byproduct of evolutionary religion. There is either eternal life or cessation of existence, deleted. Those who reject the gift of becoming the possibility of what God has given them do not continue on.

Why would God create a world in which those whose beliefs are based on a rational and responsible examination of the available evidence not be allowed to continue on while others do?

talquin · Mar 22, 2015

stevevw said:
Hell is being apart from God.

Christians claim that God is everywhere. How could hell be apart from God if God is everywhere?

I think the description of hell by some that it is an eternal fire is a man made idea. I think this is based on the word (Gehenna). This is some rubbish pit that was outside Jerusalem where everyone took their rubbish and the dead to be burnt. It was always burning and therefore became the symbol for hell.

But like some said Hell is like life on this planet. Its the decaying life that we see now. Everything is subject to the conditions of this world where people suffer and feel pain and sorrow. That is why Jesus says to not be conformed to this world but store up your riches in Heaven. As a Christian you have to be willing to give up all the desires and pleasures of this world. You have to be willing to lose your life in this world for the glory of life in Gods Kingdom. So hell is really living in this world and being apart from God and knowing the difference.

Well we don't see Christians killing themselves all the time. And we see Christians going to such exaggerated lengths to prolong their temporal lives. So either they don't really believe in "Gods Kingdom" or they fear that what lies beyond their death is far worse than their temporal life.

Colter · Mar 22, 2015

talquin said:
Why would God create a world in which those whose beliefs are based on a rational and responsible examination of the available evidence not be allowed to continue on while others do?

He didn't create the world of your conceptualizing. Your consciousness transcends the purely material world of your skepticism.

Tree of Life · Mar 22, 2015

talquin said:
Why wait until the child molester dies to punish him? Why not stop him before he molests the child and punish him then?

God, in his mercy, is suspending judgment until the appointed time. He allows wicked sinners like you and I to keep living on his land until he will judge all people finally. In the meantime there is time to repent and trust Christ who faced judgement on our behalf. By his grace we can escape the judgment that's due - not just to child molesters but to all of us.

johnford · Mar 22, 2015

talquin said:
Why would God create a world in which those whose beliefs are based on a rational and responsible examination of the available evidence not be allowed to continue on while others do?

You actually answer your own question.

Rational and logic thinking would demand some sense of justice, some obligation to the God of Creation.

But if you accept materialist determinism then you have to prove that such thinking is rational and logic ... which is difficult.

In other words, your thinking is constrained by a 'belief' that God is irrational and that it is likewise 'irrational' to expect that God should have any sense of divine justice.

lisah · Mar 22, 2015

talquin said:
So the sole reason God sends people to hell is for vengeance. Why would a loving God do such a thing?

According to Swedenborg, God does not send anyone to heaven or to hell. One migrates to a state/place where their true nature is drawn.

I haven't read all of Swedenborg's writings on Heaven and Hell, but it makes more sense than other things that I have read. He also describes, in length, the levels of Heaven, etc.

PsychoSarah · Mar 22, 2015

Tree of Life said:
God, in his mercy, is suspending judgment until the appointed time. He allows wicked sinners like you and I to keep living on his land until he will judge all people finally. In the meantime there is time to repent and trust Christ who faced judgement on our behalf. By his grace we can escape the judgment that's due - not just to child molesters but to all of us.

Problem: repentence doesn't undo the damage of a crime. How would it be just to withhold punishment on a belief basis rather than an action basis? Additionally, Christ did not face judgement on our behalf. If he had, then he would still be suffering in hell to this day so that NO ONE HAS TO GO THERE. Which btw, I can't think of anything less just than to have an innocent person suffer for the crimes of others. It would be like drowning an adulterer's baby to absolve them of the adultery; it is more horrific than the crime it is supposedly absolving.

johnford · Mar 22, 2015

PsychoSarah said:
Problem: repentence doesn't undo the damage of a crime. How would it be just to withhold punishment on a belief basis rather than an action basis?

Fortunately we have been given time because, like everyone else, I too would be judged less than worthy. Repentance in this sense is the recognition that we all 'sin and fall short' of what is expected.

The materialist law of the land is but a pale shadow of divine justice and because we live in a broken world such justice will likewise remain broken, despite our best attempts.

Additionally, Christ did not face judgement on our behalf. If he had, then he would still be suffering in hell to this day so that NO ONE HAS TO GO THERE. Which btw, I can't think of anything less just than to have an innocent person suffer for the crimes of others. It would be like drowning an adulterer's baby to absolve them of the adultery; it is more horrific than the crime it is supposedly absolving.

The divine justice for sin is death .... permanent. The fact that Christ died to circumvent that eventuality is why, as Christians, we give God our praise and worship .... we could not have achieved it through our own efforts.

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