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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
Wendy Wright and Richard Dawkins
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Mr Strawberry
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Given that it's hard to name any part of the real world (that's the thing that exists outside your head) you don't have to ignore to maintain your beliefs, it would be a surprise at this stage if you chose to open your eyes.
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Everytime Mars turns another year old, Earth turns 1.88 years old, and Venus turns 3.057 years old.
Three different years-old ... same amount of time in existence.
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You mean like an empty tomb? a literal Genesis 1? Israel as the "Promised Land"?
Do those sound familiar? or do you ignore them and hope they'll go away?
The mirror hurts, doesn't it?
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Mr Strawberry
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You seem very confused as to which is the real world and which are stories in the Bible.
I'm aware of them as stories in your favourite book, yes.
You haven't held up a mirror, you have held up a snapshot of the inside of your head, which seems very mixed up.
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TLK Valentine
I've already read the books you want burned.
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Three different measurements of "years" based on three different reference points. You like that because it's easier for you to weasel with semantics than with reality -- including the reality that the only definition of "year" that has any relevance is the one measured here on Earth... where we all currently live.
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R
rikerjoe
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Seriously? Wrong on all levels.
When Mars turns another year old, earth turns another year old too and so does Venus.
No, the time it takes to complete an orbit around the sun, does not impact its age!
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Without facts or formulas to post, you guys' true colors show; don't they?
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Speaking of relevant years, how can anyone say the BB happened 13.7 billion years ago, when there was no earth or sun as yet?
10 billion years ago, had the earth gone around the sun 3.7 billion times?
Of course not, so ... um ... speaking of 'weaseling with semantics.'
The mirror hurts, doesn't it?
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Mr Strawberry
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It's not our fault if the real world comes as an unpleasant surprise to you. Blame the people responsible for keeping you in a protective bubble.
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Yes, indeed -- seriously.
And yet I got those figures from the AV2013 Internet scientist's bible (Wikipedia).
And yet there are times when Mars turns another year old, yet Earth turns another two years old ... same for Venus.
Which is my point, chief.No, the time it takes to complete an orbit around the sun, does not impact its age!
Three different ages (impacted or otherwise), same amount of time in existence.
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Lucy Stulz
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You do realize that time is not measured by number of orbits aroundt he sun, right?
If you would like a very robust measurement of time I suggest you, again, turn to science.
In the SI system time-units (the basic one in metric is the second) are defined very specifically in a manner unrelated to planet's orbits.
Now back in the olden days it was defined by solar days, but since about 1967 it has been defined as:
[FONT=Myriad Roman,Syntax,Gill,Gill Sans,Arial,Helvetica]The second is the duration of 9 192 631 770 periods of the radiation corresponding to the transition between the two hyperfine levels of the ground state of the cesium 133 atom.[/FONT]
(NIST)
You can calculate other time units from this.
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Lucy Stulz
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So why do you still try to make a point using solar days? But more importantly if one relies on solar days then why isn't it obvious how long that time is for our planet ergo you still have a stable unit of time that can be extrapolated out to any other place or time in the universe?
(Granted I would be willing to entertain the concept that "time" in the first few microseconds of the big bang was somewhat different in that space-time was still forming....but...)
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If there's something I said in my post that was erroneous, please feel free to correct it.
And you're most certainly welcome to state my point for me, if you think you can do a better job.
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Um ... I think this can be taken more than one way.
Without facts or formulas, the truth shines through quite brightly, does it?
I've been saying that here for almost seven years now!
(Only I tend to capitalize "truth".)
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Lucy Stulz
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If there's something I said in my post that was erroneous, please feel free to correct it.
And you're most certainly welcome to state my point for me, if you think you can do a better job.
So what, exactly, does this mean?
Indeed they are not three different "years old", they are the same. No matter how you wish to parse it. And since cosmology doesn't use "Martian Solar Years" as a basis but rather, for the past nearly 50 years, they've relied on SI units of time this point seems...well....pointless.
You would do much better to question "time" in a relativisitic sense, but again since we aren't publishing intergalactically yet it is probably OK to assume that when an earth scientist (you may call them e-scientists) uses a time unit it is related to how earth scientists measure time.
Your reliance on "Trips around the sun" to support your "Embedded Age Arguments" are one thing but now it seems you are trying to extrapolate out from that into other areas of science.
I just want to remind you that scientists do have a relatively robust, "planet-independent" method of measuring time.
Just a friendly FYI.
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