Wave and Scan Credit Cards

[christianfilmcrew]

No it's not the mark of the beast, but this is an interesting development...

I would have cut and pasted the story from CNN that we ran in our newscast tonight but it's probably available on CNN's website now...

American Express and a couple of other credit card companies have developed now credit cards that you just 'wave' over the scanner and it will complete the transaction...

Not too far off implanting this type of stuff I'd say...

 

[christianfilmcrew]

Yep sure enough it's on their site...

http://money.cnn.com/2005/05/19/news/economy/express_pay/index.htm

 

[bitwise]

Not too far off implanting this type of stuff I'd say...

So what your saying is that if it became "implantable", then it would become the mark of the beast?

-bitwise

 

[Brain Damage]

No it's not the mark of the beast, but this is an interesting development...

I would have cut and pasted the story from CNN that we ran in our newscast tonight but it's probably available on CNN's website now...

American Express and a couple of other credit card companies have developed now credit cards that you just 'wave' over the scanner and it will complete the transaction...

Not too far off implanting this type of stuff I'd say...

Yep , cards can be stolen or lost , some kind of implant would be an obvious choice to this .

But where to place such an implant ?

There are three places on the human body that are not covered in clothing and would make easy access for scanning , the face and the left and right hands.

But if we only had one implant for example on one hand , and you had an accident and lost your hand , then you would loose your ID and power to preform monitary transactions , and that would not be good.

So i think it would be good if we had two implants , but if the implants are in both hands and you loose your hands due to an accident , then you would have the same problem , no ID or monitary power.

I have however come up with a great idea , what if we had an implant in one hand and one somewhere on your face , then if you loose your hand well..........

But if you had an accident and were decapitated , then i don't think you would be very concerned about your ID or buying power anyway...lol

Yes i certainly do think that this is the way to go , i just wish they would hurry this up , as i couldn't find my card the other day and oh man the hassles i had to go through.

 

[HomeBound]

So credit cards don't become the mark until they are implanted? But before their implanted their fine?

 

[christianfilmcrew]

nah credit cards are the mark of the beast, lol but they sure feel like something demonic sometimes when we get the bills lol

All I'm saying is the technology is getting closer. Look for a combining of data into a chip like biometric data (such as DNA code - for medical treatment purposes), unique ID code for identifying individuals (to make sure they're not terrorists), financial stuff (so people aren't robbed as easily), and GPS tracking (to make sure your elderly parents and children can be found quickly when they wander off)...

You know all benign stuff and for our benefit... But imagine the same technology in the hands of the Anti Christ...

Knowing everything about everyone... Satan isn't omnipotent so it would make sense for him to make use of technology to be able to keep tabs on anyone he wants to (i.e. through the Anti Christ)... Makes sense that if you don't take the mark you're basicall messed up because you'll be branded as a dissenter and a troublemaker who has something to hide...

It's interesting stuff to mull over.

 

[HomeBound]

Yes, very interesting.

 

[Dee Dee Warren]

All I'm saying is the technology is getting closer. Look for a combining of data into a chip like biometric data (such as DNA code - for medical treatment purposes), unique ID code for identifying individuals (to make sure they're not terrorists), financial stuff (so people aren't robbed as easily), and GPS tracking (to make sure your elderly parents and children can be found quickly when they wander off)...

And where is anything like this in Revelation? The "technology" required for the "mark of the beast" if it were a physical mark was available in the first century. It is called a tatoo or a brand.

What technology is Jesus going to require for the mark of the Lamb?

Personally I would not get anything embedded in me but it has zero to do with me thinking Revelation is unfolding. I resent intrusions into my privacy. I would likely refuse a drug test for a job, not because of course I do any drugs but because I would not allow my employer to search my house, neither will I allow them to search my blood (my type of work is nothing to do with safety etc).

 

[jamesrwright3]

I saw this and this concerned me as well.
I think this is the beginning of something bad..
Pretty soon you won't even need to wave these things. They will probably have scanners on the way out of the store that will detect what is in your cart and then will debit your account... Who knows how far this will go.

 

[OhhJim]

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_cul8.htm

It seems that some people don't think that implants can do that magical stuff.

 

[visionary]

I am sure that it will have a role in the NWO. IT will still boil down to our relationship with the Lord, for in Him will we find the resources and strength to resist the overwhelming odds.

 

[christianfilmcrew]

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_cul8.htm

It seems that some people don't think that implants can do that magical stuff.

Soon enough Jim soon enough. So many people have a mentality of it's not here yet so it's never going to happen... I still don't understand why there are those on earth can't see the forest for the trees, they only think about today and not tomorrow, so they write all this stuff off...

How many years have people been talking about implantable chips? Over 20 years, how many years have implantable chips been around, a couple of years...

It frustrates me when people can't see the bigger picture of what's happening and what's coming...

 

[bobbichan]

Well, I don't like the idea of scan credit cards (which later lead to...), biometrics, and having something like that implanted in you. It's an invasion of privacy. However, none of this is the mark of the beast. I used to think it was myself, but it's not. What does the Bible say about the aspects of the mark?

"And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:” – Rev 13:16.

What is the Right Hand?

“And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off…” – Mat 5:30
If your actions are causing you to sin, then cease from doing them, and remove that sin from your life.

Jesus also said, “If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.” Luke 9:23. To deny yourself means not only to deny your sinful inclinations and lusts, but to deny your own works and your own righteousness. A man may deny his sinful lusts and ungodliness, but fail to pronounce himself an unprofitable servant (Luke 17:10) He may think that the religious duties he does are acceptable unto God and worthy of salvation, but if he does not see his need for Christ, then all his righteousness was but filthy rags before Him (Isa 64:6).

What is the forehead?

“And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.” – Rev 22:4

Forehead is thoughts, or in the mind of.

Exodus 28:38 And it shall be upon Aaron's forehead, that Aaron may bear the iniquity of the holy things, which the children of Israel shall hallow in all their holy gifts; and it shall be always upon his forehead, that they may be accepted before the LORD. (were these words written or implanted literally in his forehead? No! It was upon his mind!)

Revelation 17:4 And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. (is this a woman who literally has this block of text literally written on her forehead? No! Her mind is set upon these things!)

What about buying and selling?

“And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.” – Rev 13:17

“Buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding.” – Pro 23:23.

"Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto treasure hid in a field; the which when a man hath found, he hideth, and for joy thereof goeth and selleth all that he hath, and buyeth that field.” – Mat 13:44

"Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls: Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it.” – Mat 13:45-46.

To buy the Truth, means to search it out with all your heart, strive for it, pray about it, read the Word, apply it to your life, and set a high value upon it. All your life is devoted to obtaining the Truth and you will defend it at all cost, and never let go of it, which is meant by, sell it not, or never get rid of it, as to sell it off, or neglect it. Do this also with wisdom, instruction, and understanding. Those who have the mark of the beast buy a lie, and sell it continually. This is a complete reversal of what the true worshipper has done. The true worshipper buys the Truth, and sells it not; whereas, those with the mark of the beast, buy a lie (i.e. they don’t buy the Truth), and they sell the lie repeatedly.

So while having a microchip implanted in you is not something good, your salvation does not depend on it. However, it depends on denying yourself (your sins and your own righteousness), taking up the cross and following Christ daily.

 

[Brain Damage]

On the other hand , buy and sell could mean just that.

Jas 4:13 - Show Context Come now, you who say, "Today or tomorrow we will go to such and such a city, spend a year there, buy and sell, and make a profit";

 

[bitwise]

On the other hand , buy and sell could mean just that.

Jas 4:13 - Show Context Come now, you who say, "Today or tomorrow we will go to such and such a city, spend a year there, buy and sell, and make a profit";

However, what you have done, is taken a verse (James 4:13) that speaks about literally buying and selling and have presupposed that it should then clarify Rev 13:7. However, you haven’t proved anything, nor have you shown that this is HOW we should seek to understand the verse. You merely quoted a verse, and then said, "See, buying and selling can be literal". Well, we all know that.

What we should do, is start out with the idea that the buying and selling in Rev 13:7 is not literal, and then see if we can gain new insight from other Scripture. You must keep in mind that the PROPHECTIC language of the Bible is vastly different than the literal language of the Bible. No parable or metaphor would ever make sense if you interpreted it using a literal lexicon.

We must build the PROPHECTIC lexicon that the Bible has given us and then use the Bible to define the terms for us. For example, the Bible uses the word "sword" literally many times throughout itself. However, in the PROPHECTIC language of the Bible the "sword" means the Word of God.

"For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword..." - Heb 4:12.

"...the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:" - Ep 6:17.

"…out of his [Jesus’] mouth went a sharp twoedged sword” – Rev 1:16.


Now, if in some portion of Scripture the Bible is using the word “sword” metaphorically, then it would be great folly to interpret it literally because you will miss the entire meaning of the text, and how will you truly and Spiritually profit from your understanding? You won’t.

Now, looking at the words “buying” and “selling” in Scripture we find that they do NOT always speak about a literal buying and selling. Take for example,

“Buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding.” – Pro 23:23. What does that mean?

In MANY of the parables of Jesus Christ, he used the terms of buying and selling to explain spiritual realities. For example,

“Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto treasure hid in a field; the which when a man hath found, he hideth, and for joy thereof goeth and selleth all that he hath, and buyeth that field.” – Mat 13:44. What does that mean?

“Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls: 46 Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it.” – Mat 13:45-46. What does that mean?

“But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.” – Mat 25:9. What does that mean?

Etc. etc…

As a result, in the PROPHECTIC language of the Bible, when it speaks in parables and metaphors, we see that the buying and selling means something altogether different than buying groceries and merchandise.

Simply try to think about the Scriptures differently than how you have been taught by the Pop-Prophecy preachers of modern day religion. Indeed, as Peter said, they will make merchandise of you. (2Pet 2:3).

-bit

 

[OhhJim]

Soon enough Jim soon enough. So many people have a mentality of it's not here yet so it's never going to happen... I still don't understand why there are those on earth can't see the forest for the trees, they only think about today and not tomorrow, so they write all this stuff off...

"Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof." -Jesus Christ-

Plenty of time to worry about it when it gets closer. I don't claim that stuff like this will NEVER happen, just that it hasn't happened yet.

 

[TheSensitive1]

It frustrates me when people can't see the bigger picture of what's happening and what's coming...

I agree, I think that this whole "implant thing" is SCARY stuff!!!!

 

[Just The Facts]

Hi

The Mark can not be the chip only those who refuse the mark are at the first resurrection if it is the chip that excludes the Apostles and Saints and Martyrs of the early rain.

I agree with Brain it literally means buy and sell

The Mark is expressed in the form of a government document that says the leader of the government is God………how do I know this for sure….because scripture and history tell us this.

11: And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Notice they are TO BE KILLED as the Saints and Apostles were killed.

Well how did they get killed………………for not having this government paper …………………..Called a certificate of Sacrifice.

here is what it says

To the Commissioners of Sacrifice of the Village of Alexander’s Island:
From Aurelius Diogenes, the son of Satabus, of the Village of Alexander’s Island, aged 72 years: ---scar on his right eyebrow.
I have always sacrificed regularly to the gods, and now, in your presence, in accordance with the edict, I have done sacrifice, and poured the drink offering, and tasted of the sacrifices, and I request you to certify the same. Farewell.
-----Handed in by me, Aurelius Diogenes.
-----I certify that I saw him sacrificing [signature obliterated].
Done in the first year of the Emperor, Caesar Gaius Messius Quintus Trajanus Decius Pius Felix Augustus, second of the month Epith. [June 26, 250 A.D.]



You had to present this certificate to enter into the village square where people bought and sold their goods without it you could not buy and sell………………many Christians bought these certificates in an attempt to still be able to buy and sell yet not have to say Caesar is Lord.. If you were caught without this certificate you were arrested and forced to say Cesar is Lord and sacrifice to him as God.

That is why Paul say to people

11: And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

You see if you refused to say Caesar is lord then it meant you were put in the arena to be killed…………….

So it will be for the Saints of the latter rain…..as their fellow brethren were killed……………you will be forced to make a choice .you will be forced to say that you believe the AC is God. And there by violating rule #1.

 

[On the Narrow Road]

Great discussion! I personally don't believe you should have to try to find some other interpretation for "buy and sell". If the Bible is not obviously using a parable or metaphor, it should be taken literally and in context. I find it unlikley that the "buy and sell" passage is meant to interpreted as anything other than that: to literally buy and sell goods. To try to add interpretation to every phrase in the Bible would seem to me to be folly...why not question every use of every word that at one time or another was used as a metaphor??? If it appears literal, take it literally. If it's obviously meant to be symbolic, research it's meaning further.

That said, I am very interested in the technology which you have been discussing here. Note that the VeriChip is an implantable microchip which can contain all sorts of data. Most of you are likely familiar with it's application in tracking pets. The chip is implanted in dogs between the shoulders and contains ID information used to find the owner if the dog is lost. This chip has been approved by the FDA for implantation in humans. Note that for this application it can contain identification information, banking info, address, etc.

The precursors are in place for beginning to use this chip on a wide scale. Currently, Walmart is requiring all of it's major suppliers to place RFID (radio frequency identification devices) chips on all their inventory. The nice thing about this is that each item, each pallet, etc. can have it's own chip. Imagine driving a semi through a large scanner and all of the inventory on that semi is automatically scanned into your inventory. The same holds true on the sale of an item, where it passes through a scanner and is removed from inventory.

These RFID chips have made their way into credit cards and as of September 2005, they will be included in all passports. I am guessing that soon they will make their way into driver's licenses. The next logical step (to prevent identity theft) will be to implant a chip containing all of this information. If you are pulled over by the police they could scan your chip and verify driver's license, banking, criminal records, occupation, etc. This seems like a very logical progression to the mark of the anti-christ. What better way to control a population than to require them to enter the computer system, without which, they have not power to buy, sell, travel, live....short of becoming Grizzly Adams.

The technology is here, it is only a matter of time before the public is in love with the convenience and accepting of it. Then at some point the government (likely world at that point) will require all people to have it.

 

[TheSensitive1]

I agree, I think that this whole "implant thing" is SCARY stuff!!!!

This article that was posted is about a credit card with a chip on the card itself...PLEASE correct me if I read it wrong....God BlessNon the less, I am not for the IMPLANTING a chip in the human body.
http://money.cnn.com/2005/05/19/news/economy/express_pay/index.htm