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Actually frog, Hebrews does mention baptism by water...
Hebrews 10:22
let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, with our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water.
Really? Then why would an evangelist, say he was not sent to baptize?
Again, elemental teachings don't require further explanation. They were detailed in chapter 2. It says they were obedient, so therefore they were baptised as it was commanded.
I've already shown that the early church fathers knew of no such thing as a "water free conversion". Historically speaking, who do you think would have the highest change of getting it right - the earliest church fathers, or Luther, who came along 1500 years later?
Are you saying to be in the body, one has to be baptized, or he can't be in the church? Are unbaptized the outcasts?
:o
No, it's not strange. The book is written to saved believers that have already been baptised for the forgiveness of their sins. Being a straight-forward elemental teaching with no hidden meaning, it doesn't need to be covered again.
Here's a question for you: do you think the early church fathers got it wrong when they said:
120-205 AD IRENAEUS "This class of men have been instigated by Satan to a denial of that baptism which is regeneration to God, and thus to a renunciation of the whole faith." (Against Heresies, bk. 1, chap. 21, sec. 1, Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. 1, pg. 345.)
Unfortunately, you yourself belong to "this class of men" of which they speak.
I wouldn't call them outcasts. They can go to church, pray, tithe, etc, but until they have "put on" Christ in baptism, they are not "in Him".
They are not saved, because they have not been baptised "FOR" the forgiveness of sins.
Maybe it will help if I make it green?
Because he has not had his sins forgiven. Baptism is
FOR
the forgiveness of sins. Acts 2:38
(I think I just blew out an eardrum)
Bob - I got it you are all worked up, but you might want to read with some discernment. I am actually on your side in this discussion. Read my post that you chopped most of it out on. My quote you posted in context was saying that Peter had those 3,000 baptized without any understanding of what baptism really was. He just told them, repent and be baptized. They learned about it and the other commands of Christ after the fact.
No charismatic words - Trinity Lutheran Church.interesting, and yes, not too many, but glad there is yours.
I was wondering, without giving the name for privacy concerns, is there a Charismatic type of word in your church name?
Might very well be.In my town there is a Holy Ghost Lutheran church, so you got me wondering if maybe they are charismatic too?
Yes. Some Conservative Lutherans are looking at me like I got 2 heads.Aslo, do you catch hastle from non Charismatic Lutherans?
Oh, please.I am just curious, no need to reply if you don't want to, thanks! frog.
No, we are seated in the heavnelies, that is spiritual, it does not take water, it says by the glory of the father in 6, He does not need a lake, pond, river, or a baptismal, not even the long island sound.
You are fusing the natural, to the supernatural.
Are win In HIM spiritually, or naturally?
ahhhhh..but the new cov was inaugurated at the sprinkling..just like the old.
Heb 9:. 19 For when every commandment of the law had been declared by Moses to all the people, he took the blood of calves and goats, with water and scarlet wool and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book itself and all the people,
Heb 12:24 and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.
soooo without going down that road, countless people know what it means, no baptism needed to be in Christ.
oh please... I see you may not have had experiences with people in casts, tubes, electric monitoring devices, pumps, cathaters, oxygen tanks, none of which are water suitable.
Leave Luther alone, i have shown text where they were saved..then baptized.
same thing, you are mandating works salvation against the SOP.
im not frogster but im in for a penny lolFrogster, can you please answer why these faith filled believers were not saved?
Matt 7:21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’
The fact they had faith is obvious. They called Jesus their Lord. They were filled with the external dwelling of the Holy Spirit and performed many miracles, the same as the many members of the Corinthian church whom Paul had to rebuke.
No charismatic words - Trinity Lutheran Church.
Might very well be.
It is a fascinating combination of charismatic flavor and liturgical service.
Every song, almost every song, is a charismatic type. People clap and raise hands. (The most I do is tap the back of the front pew).
Pastor wears a robe.
And Communion IS important.
One thing you should watch out for - ELCA synod. They accept this same sex nonsense and the Bible "contains" the word of God and is not the word of God in its entirety.
Most of Lutheran churches are ELCA synod. Shame.
I left ELCA because of that.
Yes. Some Conservative Lutherans are looking at me like I got 2 heads.
What the conservative Lutherans feel very "funny" about is tongues.
This whole topic of tongues needs to be revisited anyway.
Oh, please.
I have no secrets (that I know of) and very comfortable being there.
Besides, they all love me and women feed me bagels and coffee ... and you should see our coffee hour.
God is Spirit, so I presume spiritually. What is important is not how it happens, just that it has happened.
I know you're not against me! I appreciate all the support you've given.
However, in Acts 2:40, it says Peter said "With many other words he warned them". He preached the gospel to them, and they were baptised afterwards. I don't think 3000 people would get baptised if they didn't know the purpose behind it.
40 With many other words he warned them; and he pleaded with them, “Save yourselves from this corrupt generation.” 41 Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.
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