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Featured Was I in the wrong in the way I tried to defend God?

Discussion in 'Christian Advice' started by ChristianityIsTrue!, Feb 12, 2019.

  1. ChristianityIsTrue!

    ChristianityIsTrue! New Member

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    So my mother claims to be Christian, but she recently said that a certain part of the Bible was wrong. This isn't the first time that she's said some seriously wrong things about the scripture. However, this time I told her, as soon as she said it, that she was going to hell (it was kind of spontaneous because I was fed up with her making these little jabs at scripture all the same). Then I told her that I was serious and she responded with a "Wow...". Then, I told her, "Well, let me rephrase that. What you said is worthy of hell" and then I questioned her about if she even believes at all, saying because Christians will not go to hell. I question from time to time if she's even Christian and it feels like I'm coming closer and closer to a realization that she's not and it makes me so sad. Did I make a mistake or should I stick to my guns and tell her that I'm not sorry for defending God's word and that I'm sick of her speaking evil of it (even though she claims to be Christian!).
     
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  2. Sketcher

    Sketcher Born Imperishable

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    From what you shared, you have likely lost spiritual influence in her life.

    What I would have done is demonstrate why she is wrong about that particular passage by asking her why she thinks it is "wrong," listened to her answer, and followed up with more questions and more truth about the context in a way that makes a better case for it being right, and I wouldn't take any shortcuts there.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2019
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  3. ChristianityIsTrue!

    ChristianityIsTrue! New Member

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    "Nice work"... Wow, just wow. Thanks for your "help". I'm wrong for trying to defend the Bible against her blasphemy that she still refuses to recant? No, she's losing spiritual influence with ME. The more she blasphemes and speaks evil of dignities, the more she's driving me away. I have tried to show her! However, she just doesn't care man. This is why I finally got frustrated with her making ANOTHER jab at God and said you know what... and the rest is history.
     
  4. Sketcher

    Sketcher Born Imperishable

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    What does James 1:19-20 say? And given the way you described the incident, do you think it is reasonable for people to believe that you failed to live up to that in this interaction?
     
  5. crossnote

    crossnote Berean Supporter

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    Out of the mouth the heart speaks. I would not tell her she is not a Christian but would quietly treat her as if she isn't, until proven otherwise. E.G. pray for her, help her out, be a true witness etc.
     
  6. miamited

    miamited Ted Supporter

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    Hi CT,

    I can understand your impatience and this may well be God's sanctifying work in you. God's instruction is that we correct error with gentleness and respect. Telling someone that they are going to hell is actually one of the things that Jesus expressly cautions us against. You might owe her an apology and certainly I'd encourage you to take it up with the Lord in prayer and seek forgiveness.

    We all sin from time to time. I believe even the children of God are prone to sin. There is quite a lot written in the new covenant writings about believers sinning and what they should do if they find that they have.

    Of course, this won't change the truth or lack thereof of your mother's claim about the Scriptures, but you really should work on being patient and kind and respectful in your correction. So, the final answer: No, you were not wrong in correcting your mother, but likely should have gone about it differently to please God.

    As far as parents specifically, the Scriptures teach that children are to respect their parents. This doesn't mean that you have to believe as they do or agree with their 'truth', but it must be handled respectfully.

    God bless,
    In Christ, ted
     
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  7. ChristianityIsTrue!

    ChristianityIsTrue! New Member

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    How does that apply to me when I'm trying to defend the Bible against blasphemy? This isn't the first time. I didn't just "fly" off the handle. This has been happening for YEARS. The Bible says that blasphemy is worthy of death in the OT, for example. That's how serious this thing is we're talking about. Look, you don't seem to understand. I'm two seconds away from telling her, you know what? If you don't stop insulting God's word, then I'm going to leave. It's getting to the point that I can't even tell if she's Christian or not. Do you understand how bad this is? If anyone comes to you speaking ANOTHER GOSPEL then what does the Bible tell you to do, for example?
     
  8. Mark Quayle

    Mark Quayle Well-Known Member Supporter

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    In spite of your perspective, you do realize this isn't about you, right?

    It sounds like you are not listening to those who you have asked for help.
     
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  9. ChristianityIsTrue!

    ChristianityIsTrue! New Member

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    Why is it not respectful to tell your parents that you're doing something so bad that God commanded people to be put to death for it in the OT? I admit that I probably messed up telling her that she's going to hell, because, if you believe on Jesus, you won't. However, I mean, but if she's not Christian, then am I wrong!?!? What kind of Christian rejects what God says in the Bible and says that the word of God is evil!? I have tried to do this in patience before, MANY TIMES. However, it's been YEARS where she's done this over and over and over.

    As for how I should of gone about it, what about rebuking sharply? What about how it says in Luke 12:53, "The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law"?
     
  10. ChristianityIsTrue!

    ChristianityIsTrue! New Member

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    Well then who's it about? If it's not about me and my mother, then I don't know who it's about then. She blasphemes again. I get mad and tell her that what she did was wrong. Then, apparently, according to some of you, at the end of the day, I'm apparently doing all the damage here. This is like a quasi-universe I'm living in here with some of you... Is this even real? I admit that MAYBE I should not of said that you're going to hell. However, if a person calls God's word EVIL, then am I even wrong!?!?!? Is she even Christian at all? I was perfectly happy today, everything was going fine, then, out of nowhere, my OWN MOTHER attacks the words of Jesus Christ! WHAT KIND OF WORLD AM I LIVING IN.
     
  11. ChristianityIsTrue!

    ChristianityIsTrue! New Member

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    You and Miamited seem to be at least willing to take me seriously, unlike the one guy who's like "Nice work." What do you suggest that I should do?
     
  12. Sketcher

    Sketcher Born Imperishable

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    No, I don't understand the depth of the situation with your mother, because you hadn't adequately explained it. Furthermore, without details as to which passage she criticized, or what her criticism was, how am I supposed to grade your reaction any other way.

    That passage still applies to you. It especially applies to you in a witnessing context. There's a time and a place for saying someone is worthy of Hell, but the way you described the situation, that doesn't sound like it.
     
  13. AvgJoe

    AvgJoe Member since 2005 Supporter

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    Much more detail, of exactly what happened, is needed to make an accurate assessment of the situation.
     
  14. Mark Quayle

    Mark Quayle Well-Known Member Supporter

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    It's about God. You do not have a "right to get mad". You may have a responsibility to correct falsehood, and even a natural inclination to defend God and truth. "You get mad"?

    Are you by chance a contentious person?

    Do you exhibit the fruit of the spirit?

    If you are in the right, you do have a responsibility to represent Christ. There is a time to answer falsehood, and there is a time to exhibit Christ in you. He did not go often to the temple to throw out the vendors and money-changers. If your mother indeed is not a believer, you have made your position known, and continued antagonism will only alienate her, I'm guessing.

    Show her by your life how the Bible is true, and how being born again changes a person.
     
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  15. topher694

    topher694 Go Turtle!

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    That can be a tricky question to answer in detail without understanding the situation, history and personalities involved better. But in general what I always encourage people with is this:

    The best way to convince people of the truth is to live it and demonstrate it. You will get far more traction with that than you will with telling someone they are wrong. When she says things like this which really bother you, instead of focusing on what she's doing wrong focus on what you are trying to do right. Say something like, "I'm really trying to learn and grow/be a better person, and when you stay things like that in front of me it makes it harder." It's true, but the focus is different, more uplifting.
     
  16. ChristianityIsTrue!

    ChristianityIsTrue! New Member

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    There's really nothing more to say. The Bible says that part of the role of a wife is to submit to her husband. It says it flat out all over the place. A preacher in a video was referencing this kind of scripture and she overheard it and then she essentially called that crap and I said, "How can you say that if the Bible is true? Are you saying that parts of the word of God are wrong?" Then she said something to the effect of, "Yes, the parts that command that are." That's just about the only part that I left out in all of this. There isn't anymore detail that I can think of unless I start to go into all the other times she's said things, such as the OT is not important and that parts of it are just writings by mere men and things like that.
     
  17. ChristianityIsTrue!

    ChristianityIsTrue! New Member

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    What about how the Bible says to rebuke sharply that others may fear? What about what the Bible says about how bad blasphemy is? And, ok, then I was thinking about apologizing for saying that she was going to hell. I'd then tell her that I don't know if you are or not because that's between you and God if you really believe. Then I'd say that blasphemy is not funny and that if you continue to do it, then it will damage our relationship and that I may have to leave and not talk to her anymore if you're going to continue to speak badly of God's word. I mean, if I tell her I'm sorry for telling her that what she said is worthy of hell, then I might as well be apologizing for telling her that blasphemy is something God takes so seriously that people were EXECUTED for it at one time in our religion, during the Old Covenant.

    Here's the bottom line. I refuse to apologize for telling her that you can't blaspheme and that it was horribly wrong and that I'm tired of it. Beyond that, what wiggle room should I have and what should I say? I do plan to say that of course I love you mother (definitely). I'm sorry for being so hasty (maybe), but I can't take this anymore and you can't keep blaspheming like that (definitely) or something like that.
     
  18. Sketcher

    Sketcher Born Imperishable

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    OK, thank you for the additional information.

    What we have here is a woman reacting to a preacher who may or may not have been rightly preaching on what it means to submit, and who may not have had a right understanding of what it means to submit herself. But what you said didn't frame the preacher's preaching as the point of contention, it framed the Bible as the point of contention. Furthermore, what you said didn't get into why she had a problem to begin with. She probably had reasons for disagreeing with what the preacher said, and if she disagrees with what Scripture says on top of that, she has her reasons for that too. You need to undo those reasons. The way you undo those reasons is you find them out first of all, and then, where she misunderstands what it means to submit, let her know the truth. In this case, submission is the way a wife manifests obedience to Philippians 2:1-8, it is the core ethic that must motivate both submission in a wife, and headship in a husband. And that humility must also be present when you share this truth with her, or you're not going to come across as believable.
     
  19. Oscarr

    Oscarr Senior Veteran Supporter

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    What we have to realise is that we were all sinners, rebelling against Christ before He, through His mercy and grace made the gospel clear to us, and showed us the way to the narrow gate and gave us guidance on how to get through it to eternal life. It was the goodness of God that led us to repentance.

    There is nothing in the New Testament that we have to defend God in any way. But it does say that we need to be prepared to give an account of our faith in Christ when the need arises.

    We all have done what you have done. If I point the finger at you, I have three fingers pointing back at me. I told one of my students once that there was a cell in the local prison with his name on it! I now know that was a totally graceless comment to him.

    Your mother will read you before she will read the Bible. If she sees, love, joy, peace, gentleness, kindness, patience, goodness, faithfulness, and self control in you, then when you tell her what Jesus has done for you in your life, she will warm to that because she will see the change and progress in you. Then she will be more likely to take the Bible more seriously.

    Just remember, a person can be religious but not truly born again, so their understanding of the Bible may be naturally but not spiritual discerned.

    My advice to you is to cool it with your mother, show the fruit of the Spirit in her presence, without giving any more spiritual lectures, and allow things to calm down and for her to see your good works in Christ and that may cause her to start glorifying God in you.
     
  20. Sketcher

    Sketcher Born Imperishable

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    That was specifically given for dealing with church leaders who are supposed to know better. Is she a church leader?
     
  21. ChristianityIsTrue!

    ChristianityIsTrue! New Member

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    Well, he wasn't preaching on the meaning beyond saying that the Bible says wives submit to your husbands, period. Also, this isn't new to her. She's made these kinds of comments in the past. I've quoted to her clear scriptures in response about the roles of husband and wife and she just brushes it off and has called it wrong. I mean, this isn't the only time. Like I also pointed out, she's mocked/said it was the writings of men (if I can remember right) the story of Job and how he was in the belly of the sea creature as just one example of something she says are just the mere writings of men in the OT. At this point, I feel like telling her that you need to stop blaspheming God. It's not a joke and this is serious. If I didn't care for my mother, then I wouldn't even be telling her it's wrong. I'd do what the world does and go right along with the evil deed.
     
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