Want Input from LCMS Members

[QuiltAngel]

Sorry to limit this so much. If you have a similar thing though, feel free to give your input.

My question has to do with the NYG. I am wondering what other youth groups do. Do they attend most, if not all of the sessions? When do they do sightseeing? Before? During? After?

The youth group in my church has been a source of frustration for me since we have been here (almost 8 years). Also, for my husband.

They tend to do what they want and how they want. Don't include the Pastor in things. The last 4 or so years, it is really a group that does fundraising (yes I am going to say fundraising) to go to the NYG. This will be the 3rd time with the same chaperones and they take time out of the event and go sightseeing.

My youngest is a Senior and is not going this time as we learned after the first time, that kids who have graduated would be better off not going as the chaperones treat the kids like 5 year olds. Rules are good, don't get me wrong.

This came up with me today as I have spend the better part of the morning preparings food items for the soup dinner tomorrow. I would have less of a problem with it if they actually attended the NYG or much of it.

I know I am ranting and I am sorry about that. Just want to get an idea of what your youth groups do. I have been to a NYG and know that there is so much there that our kids have been missing out on. A part of me would rather they do a mission/servant trip, but they are so tied to the NYG.

Thanks

 

[DaRev]

I have only been to one NYG and there was enough there to keep everyone occupied without having to go "sightseeing" during the event. Our group raised enough funds and planned on an extra full day after the gathering to go to Universal Studios park.

Our kids had an absolute ball at the gathering.
It was good, except for president Keischnick bringing his wife up to speak in the middle of his sermon during the Divine Service, and the absolute hideous way they administered the Lord's Supper.

I don't have a group going this year. I have one girl who is going down with another youth group in our district.

 

[filosofer]

[FONT= "Book Antiqua"]
We took a group to the SoCal gathering (back in the mid 1970's). Although not as long, there was always something to do.

We also took a group to Denver in 1989. We were the last ones off Red Rock during the severe storm (about 3 AM).

Anyway, we didn't give the option about sightseeing during gathering, although they had choices afterward, since we were only 200 miles from Denver, that gave us a few more options.

I guess the bottom line is this: It is meant as a spiritual gathering, not the latest amusement distraction. Youth in the congregation should not be raising money for that. And the congregation should not give to such activity.

From a grumpy old coldger...

In Christ's love,
filo
[/font]

 

[Studeclunker]

Forgive my ignorance please, what is the NYG?

 

[QuiltAngel]

National Youth Gathering. This year being held in Orlando, was to be New Orleans but when Board for Youth Ministries had to make a decision following hurricane Katrina, they moved it to Orlando. It was in Orlando three years ago.

filo, I agree with you. It is the adults who make the decision to do the sight seeing during it. They claim it gets too long for the kids if they go a day or two before or stay a day or two after. The last two, they had to miss Wednesday morning as they schedule a noon/1 p.m. flight.

I and my oldest went to Atlanta when we were in another church. We arrived on Thursday mid day and did the sight seeing fun stuff that evening, Friday and Saturday afternoon, then had requirements as to what they did during the Youth Gathering as far as attendance.

Now here, the two that go are both retired (on just retired). I say it is them that can't last longer. There was a last minute change as to who was going and these two are going again. I had volunteered but for some reason, I am not allowed to go.

I kow that there are several members who are not thrilled with what happens. I know I prefer not to support this. I think it is time that the Elders and Council make guidelines for these trips. I have an in with the Pastor, I just need to remember to suggest that he get guidelines from the council for furture trips. I am guessing the airline tickets have been purchased already, it not, it may not be too late for this one. When it looked like there were going to be different adults going, it did not seem to be a problem.

Guess I am also a grumpy old ager who has my priorities somewhat right.

 

[QuiltAngel]

Found out the tickets are bought or at least a deposit on them. One of the leaders of the congregation (I am not sure of his office right now or he may not have one this year) was asking me how much the trip was costing but since my son is not going I could not answer him. We did have a long talk. I think there may be changes for the next one.

My son said he has heard this will be the last one. Does anyone know about that?

 

[seajoy]

Even though I'm WELS, and not LCMS, I do have some input for this thread.
Just about a half and hour ago I got an email from from an old LCMS friend, looking to have me contribute to a fund raiser for her 2 kids to go to the very thing you guys are talking about.

We are really 'Christmas card' friends, and I don't know her children at all. I'm not quite sure how I feel about this, as my kids were in a lutheran marching band that traveled around the country every summer, and no one paid for it but me.
(it was not cheap).

I think I'll pass on this one, but I thought it was interesting since you folks were discussing it.

 

[QuiltAngel]

I don't mind supporting the kids to go as long as they attend the event. It is when groups make it a vacation and take the focus away from the event is what I object to.

 

[seajoy]

I don't mind supporting the kids to go as long as they attend the event. It is when groups make it a vacation and take the focus away from the event is what I object to.

agreed

 

[filosofer]

Even though I'm WELS, and not LCMS, I do have some input for this thread.
Just about a half and hour ago I got an email from from an old LCMS friend, looking to have me contribute to a fund raiser for her 2 kids to go to the very thing you guys are talking about.

We are really 'Christmas card' friends, and I don't know her children at all. I'm not quite sure how I feel about this, as my kids were in a lutheran marching band that traveled around the country every summer, and no one paid for it but me.
(it was not cheap).

I think I'll pass on this one, but I thought it was interesting since you folks were discussing it.

[FONT= "Book Antiqua"]
IMNSHO, that is very chessy to ask for your contribution. I wouldn't give it a thought. Probably would be my last "Christmas card" friendship, too.

How have we lost sight of what it means to be "Church"? What's the difference between that youth group and the PTA or the FFA or 4H or...? At least those groups know why they exist.

From a still grumpy old codger...

In Christ's love,
filo
[/font]

 

[QuiltAngel]

filo, You got me to thinking. I have gone on several short term mission trips. I do not go soliciting funds to help me pay for these. Now, my church helped to pay for one and I received support from my District LWML as they have funds available for short term missions. I am thankful for the support I have received.

I think part of my problem is that I am so tired of groups raising funds for trips. It goes on at school as well. I am asked to provide food or to buy things. When I donate food, then one is also to put money in the freewill bucket. I would rather take that money I spend and pay it directly for my kid.

My last of 3 kids graduates from high school in May and I am going to be so glad to be done with all this.

seajoy, I find that interesting that these people are being asked to ask anybody they know for money for this. Since my kid is not going, you don't have to worry about me asking for money.

 

[seajoy]

seajoy, I find that interesting that these people are being asked to ask anybody they know for money for this. Since my kid is not going, you don't have to worry about me asking for money.

I wasn't worried about you !

 

[DaRev]

Could this be the last NYG?
I doubt it.

But one of the things that has been bantered around is whether or not there would be smaller, regional gatherings in more than one location, like maybe east coast/west coast or north/south.
The problem is that the gatherings have grown so much that there are only two locations that can logistically host the gathering: Orlando and New Orleans. While there certainly other convention centers that can hold the actual events, its the accomodations that are the problem. And in reality, New Orleans is actually better than Orlando because the hotels are closer to the dome there than the ones in the Orlando area are to the Orange County convention center.

There has also been a suggestion that it be split into two sessions in the same location, similar to what the ELCA does with their youth gatherings.

I don't think it will go away anytime soon, but the format will likely change.

I think I would like to investigate the Higher Things conferences in the future as possible events for our youth. The problem is that next year we are scheduled to host our district youth gathering. The problem we are having, though, is that the church's current financial crisis may result in the church closing before then!

 

[QuiltAngel]

I have been hearing rumblings about regional ones for a while now. I am to the point that I will believe it when I see it. I do agree that the format more than likely needs to change. I know they considered going back to Atlanta for this one, but either could not get the dates or the cost was higher or something.

DaRev, I am sorry to hear about your church's financial crisis. I know that is hard to deal with and is hard on you.

 

[Studeclunker]

Ah, the temptations, the siren call of the world. Yeah, Angel, I have to agree with you. The youth are there for the event, not sightseeing.

As to the solicitation of funds, there are a lot of young people who are unable to go to things like this without it. My four were among them. These kind of events were always out of our reach. Not all of us make much above subsistance level income. I know that mine has never been above subsistance. There have often been times when I was afraid of drowning in meeting the demands of raising a family and meeting the mortgage.

I know that the fund raising thing has gotten out of hand. Many institutions now days have lost sight of their core function. Since when does any High School praise their academic stars and cheer them on like they do the atheletes?

Still, and however, be patient, please. Some of us must beg alms for our children to participate in events the rest of the Christian community take for granted.

 

[QuiltAngel]

Stude
I don't mind helping the kids with expenses to go to the Gathering. Yet, if they say they are raising funds to attend the event, then I expect them to attend it. I don't even mind helping them go to one sight seeing place as long as they do it before or after the Gathering. It is when they go to half of it or less then go to 3 or 4 sight seeing plces instead that I get a little grouchy.

I think I am totallly burned out on donating all the time. Our school is really into raising funds for the Junior Class to put on the Prom and the Senior Class to go on a class trip. Now the kids are being required to sell for the Dollars for Scholars (it use to be a teacher/parent project).

My two oldest did not go on the class trips as one had graduated at the semester and the other chose not to for many different reasons. We were still expected to donate food, work and then put money in the freewill box because they were in the class.

I guess I am getting old and grumpy. I want to decide what to do with my money and what to support.

 

[Studeclunker]

I don't blame you Angel. Between the insane requirements that the feds are puting on our schools, and the even more insane demands from the court system, the schools are increasingly finding it difficult to make ends meet. Add to that, the extracurricular activities that they expect everyone to 'donate' to, it gets old fast. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, our schools have lost sight of what they are, and what they're supposed to do.

As for the sight-seeing issue, I agree with you. They really aren't there for sight seeing at all. My youngster would get told to concentrate on why he's there, not what there is to distract him. I'm one of those curmudgeons who would give the chaperones an earfull about wandering around town instead of concentrating on what they were there for in the first place.

 

[ctay]

The schools make kids sell stuff that's expensive. My kids would bring home pamplets with stuff to sell in them, I didn't push it, most people I knew couldn't afford the stuff they were selling.

I remember going to a gathering in I think 76 in New Orleans, my pastor didn't think they had one back then down there. We got to do a little sight seeing

 

[filosofer]

[FONT= "Book Antiqua"]
At my last church, I convinced them to include a line item in the budget each year for the Youth Gathering, which would accumulate (unlike other budget items). This would cover half of the cost. This also set the tone that the congregation was committed to supporting the youth for the Gathering (not sight-seeing) every year. This also demonstratives a positive stewardship emphasis within the congregation and teaches the youth to plan ahead as well.

Then the youth were expected to earn the rest of the money - not through "fund raising". They actually had to legitimately work/perform a service to earn money.



In Christ's love,
filo
[/font]

 

[DaRev]

At my last church, I convinced them to include a line item in the budget each year for the Youth Gathering, which would accumulate (unlike other budget items). This would cover half of the cost. This also set the tone that the congregation was committed to supporting the youth for the Gathering (not sight-seeing) every year. This also demonstratives a positive stewardship emphasis within the congregation and teaches the youth to plan ahead as well.

I tell ya, I am envious of congregations that actually support some sort of ministry, especially youth. This one that I am at is so tight fisted, I'm not sure how long they are going to continue to pay me.