Trinity logic...

[edpobre]

Originally posted by LouisBooth
"can we go back to the past? can we go into the future while still in the present?"

*sigh* if you had read that IN CONTEXT it was to debunk the idea that tribune things are not logical and do not appear at all in exsistance. Please do not take the things out of context, that's just nutty.

Standard Trinitarian defense. Whenever Trinitarians are caught in a LIE, they say you are "out of context." But when their interpretation of a verse FAVORS their FALSE belief, they throw "context" out of the window. Take John 10:30 for example. They conveniently disregard the "context" in which this was said.

I did...I let a 8 yr old and a 7 yr old read John chapter 1 ( I read it to them) and I asked who is the logos..they said Jesus..and I said does that make Jesus God..they said yes). So again, what can't you see. I've gone to great lenghts to show you 1. it appears in nature 2. it is a logical concept and 3 its biblical supported. I have done my job as a christian to share Truth with you.

I believe you Louis. Children of Trinitarians are taught as early as 4 years old that Jesus is God. And as they grow older, they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine - no matter what - at the expense of TRUTH.

Ed

 

[LouisBooth]

Ed you have no idea what you're talking about. Its a standard "defense" because its what you usually do. It seems franklin has a problem with it too.

Ed, actually that 4 yr old was from an unchurched family.

 

[franklin]

Originally posted by LouisBooth
Ed you have no idea what you're talking about. Its a standard "defense" because its what you usually do. It seems franklin has a problem with it too.
I did...I let a 8 yr old and a 7 yr old read John chapter 1 ( I read it to them) and I asked who is the logos..they said Jesus..and I said does that make Jesus God..they said yes

booth, you did just what I thought you would do with that child by asking him if that makes Jesus God! You put the words you were looking for right in his mouth!
And Ed is correct, little children are raised very early to believe in the false trinitarian doctrine.... your the one with the problem because you are not allowing the scripture to be it's own interpreter!

 

[LouisBooth]

"You put the words you were looking for right in his mouth! "

*sigh* no I didn't. I like him make the choice. I'm letting scripture stand on its own. You two are taking scripture out of context to prove your point and making scripture contradict itself by saying Christ is not God. If you wanna cut verses out of your bible, go ahead, just don't claim to be biblical about this topic.

 

[OldShepherd]

Posted by El Pobre
I believe you Louis. Children of Trinitarians are taught as early as 4 years old that Jesus is God. And as they grow older, they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine - no matter what - at the expense of TRUTH.

_____False accusations which neither you nor Franklin can back up. If you have proof, not just wild eyed accusations, post it here. I posted a link to a Messianic Jewish website about two pages back, 11th June 2002 07:13 AM. Nobody, but nobody responded. A Jewish rabbi told his story how he came to find the Triune God in His Hebrew scriptures. You want to argue that he was taught that as early as the age of four? Link here.

http://www.christianforums.com/foru...readid=13874&perpage=10&display=&pagenumber=4

_____Now, unless Jesus was lying, there should be a history of Franklin and El Pobres belief in the writings of the early church, the first few generations after the apostles. Jesus said He would build His church upon the rock and that the gates of hell would not prevail against it. Here is a link to an educational website which has all 38 volumes of the early church fathers, dating from about 50 AD. Please show us where the early church at any time ever believed and practiced what you believe.
_____And if you like I can post a 23 page article from the International Standard Bible Encyclopedia. An important feature of this article is it doesn’t just present one or two “proof texts”, as in the typical Unitarian argument but references most, if not all, of the scriptures relating to this topic. And this article refutes and rebuts all of the Unitarian arguments.

http://www.ccel.org/fathers2/

 

[OldShepherd]

Post by El Pobre.
Children of Trinitarians are (1) taught as early as 4 years old that Jesus is God. And as they grow older, (2) they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine – (3) no matter what – (4) at the expense of TRUTH.

_____In my previous post I said that the above post was “false accusations”. Here is what specifically is false.

1. "

1. taught as early as 4 years old that Jesus is God.” Since you have made this accusation please produce any proof or evidence, from any medium, of any mainline denomination, i.e. Presbyterian, Baptist, Methodist, Assembly of God, etc., which is directed at four year olds, which teaches specifically that Jesus is God. In the absence of any proof, which I am absolutely confident you cannot produce, we can only assume this is a deliberate falsehood.
   
   [*]”they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine. . ." Please produce any proof or evidence that any mainline denomination, who knowingly believe the Trinity doctrine to be false, teach children that the doctrine is false and to defend it knowing that it is false. In the absence of any evidence, which again I am absolutely confident you cannot produce, we can without fear of contradiction assume that this is another deliberate falsehood.
   
   [*]”no matter what –" This is similar to no. 2. This alleges that Trinitarian children are taught that the Trinity is false and that those children are to use any means, murder, fraud, deception, lying, anything to defend it. I will categorically state that you cannot produce any proof or evidence, of any type whatsoever, to back up this deliberate falsehood.
   
   [*]”at the expense of TRUTH." This states that Trinitarian children, at the age of four, are taught to deliberately lie to defend the Trinity doctrine. Go to any denominational school or university library, or visit any denominational website, search as long as you wish, and produce any evidence or proof of this accusation. You cannot do it!

_____Any person who would post a list of hate mongering, malicious, character assassinating, vicious, deliberate falsehoods like this cannot possibly be a disciple of Jesus of Nazareth.

 

[edpobre]

Originally posted by OldShepherd

Post by El Pobre.
Children of Trinitarians are (1) taught as early as 4 years old that Jesus is God. And as they grow older, (2) they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine – (3) no matter what – (4) at the expense of TRUTH.

_____In my previous post I said that the above post was “false accusations”. Here is what specifically is false.

"taught as early as 4 years old that Jesus is God.” Since you have made this accusation please produce any proof or evidence, from any medium, of any mainline denomination, i.e. Presbyterian, Baptist, Methodist, Assembly of God, etc., which is directed at four year olds, which teaches specifically that Jesus is God. In the absence of any proof, which I am absolutely confident you cannot produce, we can only assume this is a deliberate falsehood.

Are you saying that because there is no documented proof, 4-year old children of Trinitarian parents are not taught that Jesus is God? Can you honestly say that children of Trinitarian parents are not taught that Jesus is God?

”they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine. . ." Please produce any proof or evidence that any mainline denomination, who knowingly believe the Trinity doctrine to be false, teach children that the doctrine is false and to defend it knowing that it is false. In the absence of any evidence, which again I am absolutely confident you cannot produce, we can without fear of contradiction assume that this is another deliberate falsehood.

Your statement gives the impression that I was referring to 4-year old children. This is a a deliberate attempt to TWIST what my post says.

Anyway, are you saying that because there is no documented proof, children of Trinitarian parents are not taught to defend the false Trinity doctrine AS THEY GROW OLDER? Can you honestly say that children of Trinitarian parents are not taught to defend the FALSE Trinity doctrine?

”no matter what –" This is similar to no. 2. This alleges that Trinitarian children are taught that the Trinity is false and that those children are to use any means, murder, fraud, deception, lying, anything to defend it. I will categorically state that you cannot produce any proof or evidence, of any type whatsoever, to back up this deliberate falsehood.

Again, you TWIST the maninmg of my post. I did NOT say that"Trinitarian children are TAUGHT that the Trinity is FALSE..." Your TWISTING what I say is an example of the EXTENT Trinitarians will go to defend the FALSE Trinity docctrine.

”at the expense of TRUTH." This states that Trinitarian children, at the age of four, are taught to deliberately lie to defend the Trinity doctrine. Go to any denominational school or university library, or visit any denominational website, search as long as you wish, and produce any evidence or proof of this accusation. You cannot do it!

Did I say, "Trinitarian children, at the age of four, are taught to deliberately lie to defend the Trinity doctrine" (highlight mine)? This was what I wrote:

I believe you Louis. Children of Trinitarians are taught as early as 4 years old that Jesus is God. And as they grow older, they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine - no matter what - at the expense of TRUTH.

Doesn't this show how a Trinitarian mind works? Devilish, isn't it? This is what I mean when I say that Trinitarians try to defend their position at the expense of truth.

_____Any person who would post a list of hate mongering, malicious, character assassinating, vicious, deliberate falsehoods like this cannot possibly be a disciple of Jesus of Nazareth.

OldShepherd

Aren't you referring to yourself Oldshepherd

Ed

 

[PrinceJeff]

No just you Ed.

 

[LouisBooth]

":Are you saying that because there is no documented proof, 4-year old children of Trinitarian parents are not taught that Jesus is God? Can you honestly say that children of Trinitarian parents are not taught that Jesus is God? "

Ed, in the laws of logic you make the claim so you have to provide the evidence. I'd like a statement of a 4 yr old and her or his parents noterized, scanned and posted here. Until then your claim is false. Thanks. I'd also like there personal info so I can verify the documentation.

 

[OldShepherd]

Posted by El Pobre
Children of Trinitarians are taught as early as 4 years old that Jesus is God. And as they grow older, they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine - no matter what - at the expense of TRUTH.

Are you saying that because there is no documented proof, 4-year old children of Trinitarian parents are not taught that Jesus is God? Can you honestly say that children of Trinitarian parents are not taught that Jesus is God?

I said if you can prove this accusation then produce your proof. You are the one attacking, don’t try to put your poison off on me. If you can’t back up your accusations then they must not be true. And all you have done so far is make accusation which you haven’t backed up.

Previously posted by OS,
“they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine. . ." Please produce any proof or evidence that any mainline denomination, who knowingly believe the Trinity doctrine to be false, teach children that the doctrine is false and to defend it knowing that it is false. In the absence of any evidence, which again I am absolutely confident you cannot produce, we can without fear of contradiction assume that this is another deliberate falsehood.

Your statement gives the impression that I was referring to 4-year old children. This is a a deliberate attempt to TWIST what my post says.

This point says absolutely nothing about 4-year old children, no age is given. It says “teach children” and that is exactly what your previous post said and you say again in this response.

Anyway, are you saying that because there is no documented proof, children of Trinitarian parents are not taught to defend the false Trinity doctrine AS THEY GROW OLDER? Can you honestly say that children of Trinitarian parents are not taught to defend the FALSE Trinity doctrine?

I’m fairly sure I wrote my response in English, did you not understand it? You made several accusations about the children of Trinitarians. Back it up with proof. If you can’t then it must be false. When I make a statement I will back it up, right now the subject is your hate filled, malicious, anti-Christian attack on Trinitarians and their children.

Again, you TWIST the maninmg of my post. I did NOT say that"Trinitarian children are TAUGHT that the Trinity is FALSE..." Your TWISTING what I say is an example of the EXTENT Trinitarians will go to defend the FALSE Trinity docctrine.

they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine - no matter what - at the expense of TRUTH.

Let’s substitute the words “Biblical” or “Scriptural”, for FALSE, in this statement and see who is lying and who is telling the truth.

If I said, ”they are taught how to DEFEND the BIBLICAL Salvation doctrine.’ about you and your children. Would the parents/teachers teaching this doctrine and the children learning know that it was Biblical or would they think it was bananas, or something else?

Or if I said, “they are taught how to DEFEND the SCRIPTURAL Baptism doctrine” would the teachers/parents teaching and the children learning know that it was Scriptural or would they think it was soap, or something else?

So when you say “they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine” it is the same thing. It means the parents/teachers teaching and the children learning know it is FALSE. If you mean something else, write it a different way. But I gave you a chance to do that and you refused, instead you want just keep repeating your filth and try to twist it around make out that I’m lying.

Here is the only point I used “age four” But take out the four it still is a vicious attack on Trinitarians and their children. So let me change it by six months, that is older than four.

”at the expense of TRUTH." This states that Trinitarian children, at the age of four and a half, are taught to deliberately lie to defend the Trinity doctrine. Go to any denominational school or university library, or visit any denominational website, search as long as you wish, and produce any evidence or proof of this accusation. You cannot do it!

Did I say, "Trinitarian children, at the age of four, are taught to deliberately lie to defend the Trinity doctrine" (highlight mine)? This was what I wrote:

Children of Trinitarians are taught as early as 4 years old that Jesus is God. And as they grow older, they are taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine - no matter what - at the expense of TRUTH.

That’s right you did not say that Trinitarian children “at the age of four” are taught to deliberately lie to defend the Trinity doctrine. You said that Trinitarian children, older than 4 years, are taught that the Trinity doctrine is false, and to defend that doctrine, knowing it is false, “no matter what”, i.e. murder, deceit, deception, lying, what ever it takes, and to deliberately lie to defend what they know to be false. What does “at the expense of the TRUTH.”, mean except to lie?

Doesn't this show how a Trinitarian mind works? Devilish, isn't it? This is what I mean when I say that Trinitarians try to defend their position at the expense of truth.

Look at the lying, twisting and squirming, I only had “age four” out of place in one point, out of four, the other three were all correct and Pobre is still spewing out his lying filth. I will repeat what I said again. The statement posted by Pobre states, Trinitarian children above the age of four are taught;

1. That the Trinity doctrine is False and “taught how to DEFEND the FALSE Trinity doctrine”.
2. To defend this false doctrine, “No matter what”, which can mean lie, steal, deceive, murder, whatever it takes.
3. to defend this false doctrine. . .”At the expense of the TRUTH which means to deliberately lie in defense of the Trinity doctrine which they allegedly know is false.

Pobre you have been asked twice to produce evidence, proof, of any of these accusations, if you cannot post any evidence, then these accusations are false and you know them to be false.

So I will repeat what I said. Any person who, without any evidence whatsoever, would post a list of hate mongering, malicious, character assassinating, deliberate falsehoods like this, vicious attacks against Christian children, over and over again, as Pobre has done, cannot possibly be a disciple of Jesus of Nazareth.

 

[drmmjr]

Children are liks sponges. They absorb information from their surroundings. Good or bad, they take the information in. They get it from parents, relatives, neighbors, television, movies, etc. They don't have the experience to be able to tell "truth" from "untruth".

Children may not be "taught" about the trinity, but they learn about it from their environment. A child growing up in a Jewish, Islam, Hindu, Baptist, Catholic, Mormon, etc. environment will learn those beliefs. That will be their knowledge base that everything else is compared to. If something does not conform to that belief, then it is wrong. If they are confronted about their belief, they will defend it.

We are all like this. We have our knowledge base that everything else is compared to. When someone confronts us, we defend our beliefs. We try to make others belive the same that we do. We try to "convert" them from their beliefs to ours. In the same manner, they are trying to "convert" us to their beliefs.

Arguing and pointing fingers does nothing to help. In fact, it only fans the fire. And then we forget what Jesus taught us about turning the other cheek. We forget who we are and how we should act. To sum it up, we become children again. "Did not" "Did so" "Did not" "Did so"

We will now return to our regularly scheduled progam.

 

[OldShepherd]

El Pobre,

There is a question for you on another thread. Since you haven’t responded I will ask the question here. You claim to belong to the Iglesia ni Christo. This group began in 1914 by a self proclaimed prophet Felix Manalo. Jesus said that the gates of hell would not prevail against the church He built on the rock and that His words would never pass away. So how could Manalo restore something that was not lost or missing? According to the Word of God His Word and His church could never be gone from this earth for even one minute, so any false teacher that says different, like Manalo, and his followers are contradicting God. There is a link below for more information on this false cult. All the information at this site is written by ex-INC members. 

Who or what is the Iglesia ni Cristo (INC)?

Iglesia ni Cristo (Philippine language for "Church of Christ") is a quasi-religious sect founded by the late Felix Y. Manalo in the Philippines in 1914. It claims to be the extension or "re-emergence" of the one and only apostasied "true church" that was established by Christ himself during the first century (Pasugo, July-Aug. 1979, p. 8). Iglesia's unique basic doctrines which it uses to differentiate itself (or court others into joining the organization) are alleged 'prophecies' on its point of origin, its time of emergence, its 'prophesied messenger' and its rejection of the Trinity (mainly Christ's deity). One very common characteristic among these 'unique' basic doctrines is they are all founded on deception

Today, it's governed by the "Central Administration" composed of several elite members led by Erano Manalo--son and successor of Felix Manalo--and "right hand man" Eduardo Manalo.

http://members.tripod.com/~janchung/table_of_contents.html

Mateo 16:18 At sinasabi ko rin sa iyo: Ikaw ay Pedro. Sa ibabaw ng batong ito ay itatayo ko ang aking iglesiya. Hindi makakapanaig sa kaniya ang tarangkahan ng Hades.

Mateo 24:35 Ang langit at ang lupa ay lilipas ngunit kailanman ay hindi lilipas ang aking mga salita.

 

[King David]

Here are a few reasons and verses from the Bible that have lead me to the belief in the Trinity: [Part 1]

Genesis 16:
6 But Abram said to Sarai, "Behold, your maid is in your power; do to her what is good in your sight." So Sarai treated her harshly, and she fled from her presence.
7 Now the angel of the LORD found her by a spring of water in the wilderness, by the spring on the way to Shur.
8 He said, "Hagar, Sarai's maid, where have you come from and where are you going?" And she said, "I am fleeing from the presence of my mistress Sarai."
9 Then the angel of the LORD said to her, "Return to your mistress, and submit yourself to her authority."
10 Moreover, the angel of the LORD said to her, “ I will greatly multiply your descendants so that they will be too many to count."
11 The angel of the LORD said to her further, "Behold, you are with child, And you will bear a son; And you shall call his name Ishmael, Because the LORD has given heed to your affliction.
12 "He will be a wild donkey of a man, His hand will be against everyone, And everyone's hand will be against him; And he will live to the east of all his brothers."
13 Then she called the name of the LORD who spoke to her, "You are a God who sees"; for she said, "Have I even remained alive here after seeing Him?"

Exodus 3:
1 Now Moses was pasturing the flock of Jethro his father-in-law, the priest of Midian; and he led the flock to the west side of the wilderness and came to Horeb, the mountain of God.
2 The angel of the LORD appeared to him in a blazing fire from the midst of a bush; and he looked, and behold, the bush was burning with fire, yet the bush was not consumed.
3 So Moses said, "I must turn aside now and see this marvelous sight, why the bush is not burned up."
4 When the LORD saw that he turned aside to look, God called to him from the midst of the bush and said, "Moses, Moses!" And he said, "Here I am."
5 Then He said, "Do not come near here; remove your sandals from your feet, for the place on which you are standing is holy ground."
6 He said also, "I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob."Then Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look at God.
7 The LORD said, "I have surely seen the affliction of My people who are in Egypt, and have given heed to their cry because of their taskmasters, for I am aware of their sufferings.

The “angel of the LORD” is referred to as God in Genesis and Exodus.


Zechariah 1:
12 Then the angel of the LORD said, "O LORD of hosts, how long will You have no compassion for Jerusalem and the cities of Judah, with which You have been indignant these seventy years?"
13 The LORD answered the angel who was speaking with me [Zechariah] with gracious words, comforting words.
14 So the angel who was speaking with me said to me, "Proclaim, saying, 'Thus says the LORD of hosts, "I am exceedingly jealous for Jerusalem and Zion.

Here we see the “angel of the LORD” conversing with the “LORD of hosts”. They are not the same “person”, yet the angel of the LORD is referred to as God in Genesis and Exodus.

1 Chronicles 21:
15 And God sent an angel to Jerusalem to destroy it; but as he was about to destroy it, the LORD saw and was sorry over the calamity, and said to the destroying angel, "It is enough; now relax your hand." And the angel of the LORD was standing by the threshing floor of Ornan the Jebusite.
16 Then David lifted up his eyes and saw the angel of the LORD standing between earth and heaven, with his drawn sword in his hand stretched out over Jerusalem. Then David and the elders, covered with sackcloth, fell on their faces.
30 But David could not go before it to inquire of God, for he was terrified by the sword of the angel of the LORD.

Note how the angel of the LORD carries out the judgement of God as we see Jesus claim that He has been given authority to execute judgement and ‘He does not his will but the will of his Father’. Also note the reference to the sword of the angel of the LORD in Revelation 19:15

Revelation 19:
13 He is clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.
14 And the armies which are in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, were following Him on white horses.
15 From His mouth comes a sharp sword, so that with it He may strike down the nations, and He will rule them with a rod of iron; and He treads the wine press of the fierce wrath of God, the Almighty.
16 And on His robe and on His thigh He has a name written, "KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS."

John 1:
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 He was in the beginning with God.
3 All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.
4 In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men.

Genesis 1:
26 Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness...

Note how Revelation 19:13 and John 1:1 both refer to Jesus as the “Word”. This shows how Jesus [the Word] and God constitute the plural “Our image” from Genesis 1:26.

 

[King David]

[Part 2]

Matthew 28:
16 But the eleven disciples proceeded to Galilee, to the mountain which Jesus had designated.
17 When they saw Him, they worshiped Him; but some were doubtful.
18 And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.
19 "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,
20 teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."

Here is a clear revelation of the Trinity “Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit” spoken by Jesus.

John 5:
18 For this reason therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God.
19 Therefore Jesus answered and was saying to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, unless it is something He sees the Father doing; for whatever the Father does, these things the Son also does in like manner.
20 "For the Father loves the Son, and shows Him all things that He Himself is doing; and the Father will show Him greater works than these, so that you will marvel.
21 "For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son also gives life to whom He wishes.
22 "For not even the Father judges anyone, but He has given all judgment to the Son,
23 so that all will honor the Son even as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.
24 "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.
25 "Truly, truly, I say to you, an hour is coming and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live.
26 "For just as the Father has life in Himself, even so He gave to the Son also to have life in Himself;
27 and He gave Him authority to execute judgment, because He is the Son of Man.

John 8:
12 Then Jesus again spoke to them, saying, "I am the Light of the world; he who follows Me will not walk in the darkness, but will have the Light of life."
13 So the Pharisees said to Him, "You are testifying about Yourself; Your testimony is not true."
14 Jesus answered and said to them, "Even if I testify about Myself, My testimony is true, for I know where I came from and where I am going; but you do not know where I come from or where I am going.
15 "You judge according to the flesh; I am not judging anyone.
16 "But even if I do judge, My judgment is true; for I am not alone in it, but I and the Father who sent Me.

Isaiah 44 & 48:
6 Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: I am the first and I am the last, And there is no God besides Me.
12 Listen to Me, O Jacob, even Israel whom I called; I am He, I am the first, I am also the last.
Revelation 22:
13 "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end."

John 10:
37 "If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me;
38 but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father."

In Isaiah we see the prophecy that Jesus will clearly be called God and Matthew backs it up.

Isaiah 9:
6 For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.
7 There will be no end to the increase of His government or of peace, On the throne of David and over his kingdom, To establish it and to uphold it with justice and righteousness from then on and forevermore. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will accomplish this.

Matthew 1:
19 BEHOLD, THE VIRGIN SHALL BE WITH
20 CHILD AND SHALL BEAR A SON, AND THEY SHALL CALL HIS NAME IMMANUEL," which translated means,
21 “GOD WITH US.”

For those that think Jesus was not God because he was human:

Philippians 2:
6 who, although He [Christ Jesus] existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,
7 but emptied Himself [laid aside his privileges], taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.
8 Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.
9 For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name,
10 so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father

 

[Allen2]

The Trinity Doctrine is not false, but poorly stated and poorly understood. When I get together with my Jehovah Witness Friends they always want to trash the Trinity, but I insist that first and foremost is Christ. Christ is the final, complete revelation and expression of God.
The title God is rarely used of the Son for good reason that we might not confuse both Father and Son. The Father is Jesus' God and the Son comes for our salvation at the behest of the Father. The Father is and always will be the God of our Lord Jesus Christ.
However, the Son shares in the full being and identity of His Father:"For God was pleased to have ALL HIS FULLNESS dwell in [the Son]"Col.1:19. Since this is the case to see the Son is to experience fully the Father: our God determined to express Himself fully in His Son. To put it even more strongly, "For in Christ all the fullness of Deity lives in bodily form", Col.2:9 There is nothing that can be added to fullness; as I said earlier, while the title God is rarely used of the Son, but it would not be inappropriate.
Any attempt at developing the Biblical doctrine of the Trinity must begin here, answering the question, "Who is Christ". God bless, Al