tired of going to church

[Musician4Jesus]

I realize that the church is more than a building, I know it's the body of Christ; as a result it doesn't where the body of Christ meets.

However I basically feel forgotten. I have a cell phone, but I honestly don't know why I have it: the only phone calls I get are spam calls (about paying off student loans) and my cell phone provider reminding me that my bill is due. Other than those calls, nobody ever calls me.

I am tired of receiving the typical suggestions. These typical suggestions are:

*Go to a small group/lifegroup (a.k.a. a Bible study)
*Try doing volunteer work
*Get involved with a local church

I AM going to a local church AND I AM going to weekly Bible study. Unfortunately, fellowship at my church is centered around church stuff (the aforementioned Bible study and church on Sundays) but the fellowship doesn't carry over into real life. If I didn't go to church on Sundays and didn't go to Bible study during the week, I wouldn't see anybody from my church in real life, because as I said, fellowship at my church is relegated to the aforementioned church stuff.


I have chronic depression and have suffered with it since I was 17 (34 now). It's true that volunteering would somewhat alleviate my depression and I do volunteer weekly at the humane society (I pet and cuddle cats; the socializing helps get them used to humans for when they're adopted). However the reality is that most people my age are married, living on their own and providing for their families via working at a job. I'm an older single and spend most of my time alone. Any volunteer work I do, I'd be doing by myself. I don't mind doing volunteer work alone in and of itself. However when you do everything by yourself it becomes very lonely and very depressing, and I pretty much do everything by myself.
I am also struggling in regards to making friends with Christians. Pretty much every Christian friend I've ever befriended, I do all the work from a communication standpoint; if I don't initiate I don't hear from them. I don't have an issue initiating in and of itself; the problem I have is when I am doing all the work with communicating, and they never take the initiative to reciprocate with communicating.

I also don't expect the friendship to monopolize all their time nor do I expect it to monopolize their lives as I understand they have their own lives. I'd be content if they would just initiate once a week with a call, text, or sending me a message via facebook, but I don't even get THAT much.

To me with a friendship, it's a two-way street with communication; both people in the friendship should be initiating with communication and it's not fair to stick one person with the work with communicating in a friendship. I expect a friend to initiate with communication cause that's what I think should happen in a real friendship, and I get accused of 'you're having an entitlement mentality'.

I

I am tired of reaching out and trying to make friendships/social connections when when I do I get stuck doing all the work in regards to communicating. I am tired of doing everything by myself and I am very frustrated with fellowship at my church being relegated to the aforementioned church stuff. Unfortunately the problem with fellowship being centered around church stuff (Bible study, church on Sundays) and not carrying over into real life isn't just exclusive to my church, it's a problem in mainstream Christian culture as a whole, at least in the United States.

I don't trust that when I make new friends that anything is going to change. Why should I believe and trust that a new friend I make is going to actually initiate with contact, when literally every friend I've ever made I do all the work with communicating. Different people feel loved in different ways and for me it's quality time; if you cannot take 5 minutes to initiate with communicating with the friendship you have with me, then no I don't think you care about me as a person, nor do I think you care about my life.

People ask 'what am I going to do about it'? The reality is that I don't know what the solution is. However I know two things to be true:

1.I cannot even begin to make improvements with this fellowship issue without God's help.

2.Sadly most Christians in America don't see fellowship only being centered around church stuff and not carrying over into real life as an issue; they're content with the fellowship setup the way it currently is. The truth is that since they don't see it as a problem to begin with they're not going to try and make changes towards a solution. However I look at the new church and how fellowship was intertwined into daily life, and I look at fellowship in mainstream Christianity here in the United States, and realize there IS an issue with the way fellowship is in the United States.

3. This is such a major issue that it's going to take more than one person to make changes with this. I am only one person, and yes I can 'be the change I wish to see in the world' however the reality is I AM ONLY ONE PERSON, and sometimes an issue is so big that it takes more than one person to fix it and such is the case with this problem.

I have become really 'hung up' with this because I could deal with it from people from the secular world, it's the type of treatment I'd expect to receive. However I thought when I became saved I would find my niche in church, and find a place where I feel I truly belong. However I've always felt like I'm on the outside looking in for as long as I can remember, and I don't even feel like there's a place for me even in the body of Christ. The reality is that most of my congregation is made up of married people raising young families and the others are retirees. Most people my age are raising families and working jobs to provide for those families. I am not, so while I feel accepted, I don't feel included. Most Christians at my church also don't struggle with depression, at least not chronically; depression varies in severity and somebody who has never had depression or who has only had a mild form of it IS NOT going to be able to relate to somebody who struggles with it chronically because chronic depression is completely different than mild depression and effects you more badly than mild depression does.

 

[W2L]

I realize that the church is more than a building, I know it's the body of Christ; as a result it doesn't where the body of Christ meets.

However I basically feel forgotten. I have a cell phone, but I honestly don't know why I have it: the only phone calls I get are spam calls (about paying off student loans) and my cell phone provider reminding me that my bill is due. Other than those calls, nobody ever calls me.

I am tired of receiving the typical suggestions. These typical suggestions are:

*Go to a small group/lifegroup (a.k.a. a Bible study)
*Try doing volunteer work
*Get involved with a local church

I AM going to a local church AND I AM going to weekly Bible study. Unfortunately, fellowship at my church is centered around church stuff (the aforementioned Bible study and church on Sundays) but the fellowship doesn't carry over into real life. If I didn't go to church on Sundays and didn't go to Bible study during the week, I wouldn't see anybody from my church in real life, because as I said, fellowship at my church is relegated to the aforementioned church stuff.


I have chronic depression and have suffered with it since I was 17 (34 now). It's true that volunteering would somewhat alleviate my depression and I do volunteer weekly at the humane society (I pet and cuddle cats; the socializing helps get them used to humans for when they're adopted). However the reality is that most people my age are married, living on their own and providing for their families via working at a job. I'm an older single and spend most of my time alone. Any volunteer work I do, I'd be doing by myself. I don't mind doing volunteer work alone in and of itself. However when you do everything by yourself it becomes very lonely and very depressing, and I pretty much do everything by myself.
I am also struggling in regards to making friends with Christians. Pretty much every Christian friend I've ever befriended, I do all the work from a communication standpoint; if I don't initiate I don't hear from them. I don't have an issue initiating in and of itself; the problem I have is when I am doing all the work with communicating, and they never take the initiative to reciprocate with communicating.

I also don't expect the friendship to monopolize all their time nor do I expect it to monopolize their lives as I understand they have their own lives. I'd be content if they would just initiate once a week with a call, text, or sending me a message via facebook, but I don't even get THAT much.

To me with a friendship, it's a two-way street with communication; both people in the friendship should be initiating with communication and it's not fair to stick one person with the work with communicating in a friendship. I expect a friend to initiate with communication cause that's what I think should happen in a real friendship, and I get accused of 'you're having an entitlement mentality'.

I

I am tired of reaching out and trying to make friendships/social connections when when I do I get stuck doing all the work in regards to communicating. I am tired of doing everything by myself and I am very frustrated with fellowship at my church being relegated to the aforementioned church stuff. Unfortunately the problem with fellowship being centered around church stuff (Bible study, church on Sundays) and not carrying over into real life isn't just exclusive to my church, it's a problem in mainstream Christian culture as a whole, at least in the United States.

I don't trust that when I make new friends that anything is going to change. Why should I believe and trust that a new friend I make is going to actually initiate with contact, when literally every friend I've ever made I do all the work with communicating. Different people feel loved in different ways and for me it's quality time; if you cannot take 5 minutes to initiate with communicating with the friendship you have with me, then no I don't think you care about me as a person, nor do I think you care about my life.

People ask 'what am I going to do about it'? The reality is that I don't know what the solution is. However I know two things to be true:

1.I cannot even begin to make improvements with this fellowship issue without God's help.

2.Sadly most Christians in America don't see fellowship only being centered around church stuff and not carrying over into real life as an issue; they're content with the fellowship setup the way it currently is. The truth is that since they don't see it as a problem to begin with they're not going to try and make changes towards a solution. However I look at the new church and how fellowship was intertwined into daily life, and I look at fellowship in mainstream Christianity here in the United States, and realize there IS an issue with the way fellowship is in the United States.

3. This is such a major issue that it's going to take more than one person to make changes with this. I am only one person, and yes I can 'be the change I wish to see in the world' however the reality is I AM ONLY ONE PERSON, and sometimes an issue is so big that it takes more than one person to fix it and such is the case with this problem.

I have become really 'hung up' with this because I could deal with it from people from the secular world, it's the type of treatment I'd expect to receive. However I thought when I became saved I would find my niche in church, and find a place where I feel I truly belong. However I've always felt like I'm on the outside looking in for as long as I can remember, and I don't even feel like there's a place for me even in the body of Christ. The reality is that most of my congregation is made up of married people raising young families and the others are retirees. Most people my age are raising families and working jobs to provide for those families. I am not, so while I feel accepted, I don't feel included. Most Christians at my church also don't struggle with depression, at least not chronically; depression varies in severity and somebody who has never had depression or who has only had a mild form of it IS NOT going to be able to relate to somebody who struggles with it chronically because chronic depression is completely different than mild depression and effects you more badly than mild depression does.

When im depressed i cry out to God. I have found strength in the Lord and love too. But it was not always so. I struggled for many years. I still struggle occasionally but Gods grace sustains me. Dont give up but instead seek God at a deeper level . Thats the only advice i have, i hope its helpful.

 

[Danielwright2311]

I realize that the church is more than a building, I know it's the body of Christ; as a result it doesn't where the body of Christ meets.

However I basically feel forgotten. I have a cell phone, but I honestly don't know why I have it: the only phone calls I get are spam calls (about paying off student loans) and my cell phone provider reminding me that my bill is due. Other than those calls, nobody ever calls me.

I am tired of receiving the typical suggestions. These typical suggestions are:

*Go to a small group/lifegroup (a.k.a. a Bible study)
*Try doing volunteer work
*Get involved with a local church

I AM going to a local church AND I AM going to weekly Bible study. Unfortunately, fellowship at my church is centered around church stuff (the aforementioned Bible study and church on Sundays) but the fellowship doesn't carry over into real life. If I didn't go to church on Sundays and didn't go to Bible study during the week, I wouldn't see anybody from my church in real life, because as I said, fellowship at my church is relegated to the aforementioned church stuff.


I have chronic depression and have suffered with it since I was 17 (34 now). It's true that volunteering would somewhat alleviate my depression and I do volunteer weekly at the humane society (I pet and cuddle cats; the socializing helps get them used to humans for when they're adopted). However the reality is that most people my age are married, living on their own and providing for their families via working at a job. I'm an older single and spend most of my time alone. Any volunteer work I do, I'd be doing by myself. I don't mind doing volunteer work alone in and of itself. However when you do everything by yourself it becomes very lonely and very depressing, and I pretty much do everything by myself.
I am also struggling in regards to making friends with Christians. Pretty much every Christian friend I've ever befriended, I do all the work from a communication standpoint; if I don't initiate I don't hear from them. I don't have an issue initiating in and of itself; the problem I have is when I am doing all the work with communicating, and they never take the initiative to reciprocate with communicating.

I also don't expect the friendship to monopolize all their time nor do I expect it to monopolize their lives as I understand they have their own lives. I'd be content if they would just initiate once a week with a call, text, or sending me a message via facebook, but I don't even get THAT much.

To me with a friendship, it's a two-way street with communication; both people in the friendship should be initiating with communication and it's not fair to stick one person with the work with communicating in a friendship. I expect a friend to initiate with communication cause that's what I think should happen in a real friendship, and I get accused of 'you're having an entitlement mentality'.

I

I am tired of reaching out and trying to make friendships/social connections when when I do I get stuck doing all the work in regards to communicating. I am tired of doing everything by myself and I am very frustrated with fellowship at my church being relegated to the aforementioned church stuff. Unfortunately the problem with fellowship being centered around church stuff (Bible study, church on Sundays) and not carrying over into real life isn't just exclusive to my church, it's a problem in mainstream Christian culture as a whole, at least in the United States.

I don't trust that when I make new friends that anything is going to change. Why should I believe and trust that a new friend I make is going to actually initiate with contact, when literally every friend I've ever made I do all the work with communicating. Different people feel loved in different ways and for me it's quality time; if you cannot take 5 minutes to initiate with communicating with the friendship you have with me, then no I don't think you care about me as a person, nor do I think you care about my life.

People ask 'what am I going to do about it'? The reality is that I don't know what the solution is. However I know two things to be true:

1.I cannot even begin to make improvements with this fellowship issue without God's help.

2.Sadly most Christians in America don't see fellowship only being centered around church stuff and not carrying over into real life as an issue; they're content with the fellowship setup the way it currently is. The truth is that since they don't see it as a problem to begin with they're not going to try and make changes towards a solution. However I look at the new church and how fellowship was intertwined into daily life, and I look at fellowship in mainstream Christianity here in the United States, and realize there IS an issue with the way fellowship is in the United States.

3. This is such a major issue that it's going to take more than one person to make changes with this. I am only one person, and yes I can 'be the change I wish to see in the world' however the reality is I AM ONLY ONE PERSON, and sometimes an issue is so big that it takes more than one person to fix it and such is the case with this problem.

I have become really 'hung up' with this because I could deal with it from people from the secular world, it's the type of treatment I'd expect to receive. However I thought when I became saved I would find my niche in church, and find a place where I feel I truly belong. However I've always felt like I'm on the outside looking in for as long as I can remember, and I don't even feel like there's a place for me even in the body of Christ. The reality is that most of my congregation is made up of married people raising young families and the others are retirees. Most people my age are raising families and working jobs to provide for those families. I am not, so while I feel accepted, I don't feel included. Most Christians at my church also don't struggle with depression, at least not chronically; depression varies in severity and somebody who has never had depression or who has only had a mild form of it IS NOT going to be able to relate to somebody who struggles with it chronically because chronic depression is completely different than mild depression and effects you more badly than mild depression does.

Then you are reaching out to the wrong people, like me, I will talk to you all the time. See, there are others in God who want to communicate. We are out there, you just have to have faith to find us..

 

[Maria Billingsley]

I realize that the church is more than a building, I know it's the body of Christ; as a result it doesn't where the body of Christ meets.

However I basically feel forgotten. I have a cell phone, but I honestly don't know why I have it: the only phone calls I get are spam calls (about paying off student loans) and my cell phone provider reminding me that my bill is due. Other than those calls, nobody ever calls me.

I am tired of receiving the typical suggestions. These typical suggestions are:

*Go to a small group/lifegroup (a.k.a. a Bible study)
*Try doing volunteer work
*Get involved with a local church

I AM going to a local church AND I AM going to weekly Bible study. Unfortunately, fellowship at my church is centered around church stuff (the aforementioned Bible study and church on Sundays) but the fellowship doesn't carry over into real life. If I didn't go to church on Sundays and didn't go to Bible study during the week, I wouldn't see anybody from my church in real life, because as I said, fellowship at my church is relegated to the aforementioned church stuff.


I have chronic depression and have suffered with it since I was 17 (34 now). It's true that volunteering would somewhat alleviate my depression and I do volunteer weekly at the humane society (I pet and cuddle cats; the socializing helps get them used to humans for when they're adopted). However the reality is that most people my age are married, living on their own and providing for their families via working at a job. I'm an older single and spend most of my time alone. Any volunteer work I do, I'd be doing by myself. I don't mind doing volunteer work alone in and of itself. However when you do everything by yourself it becomes very lonely and very depressing, and I pretty much do everything by myself.
I am also struggling in regards to making friends with Christians. Pretty much every Christian friend I've ever befriended, I do all the work from a communication standpoint; if I don't initiate I don't hear from them. I don't have an issue initiating in and of itself; the problem I have is when I am doing all the work with communicating, and they never take the initiative to reciprocate with communicating.

I also don't expect the friendship to monopolize all their time nor do I expect it to monopolize their lives as I understand they have their own lives. I'd be content if they would just initiate once a week with a call, text, or sending me a message via facebook, but I don't even get THAT much.

To me with a friendship, it's a two-way street with communication; both people in the friendship should be initiating with communication and it's not fair to stick one person with the work with communicating in a friendship. I expect a friend to initiate with communication cause that's what I think should happen in a real friendship, and I get accused of 'you're having an entitlement mentality'.

I

I am tired of reaching out and trying to make friendships/social connections when when I do I get stuck doing all the work in regards to communicating. I am tired of doing everything by myself and I am very frustrated with fellowship at my church being relegated to the aforementioned church stuff. Unfortunately the problem with fellowship being centered around church stuff (Bible study, church on Sundays) and not carrying over into real life isn't just exclusive to my church, it's a problem in mainstream Christian culture as a whole, at least in the United States.

I don't trust that when I make new friends that anything is going to change. Why should I believe and trust that a new friend I make is going to actually initiate with contact, when literally every friend I've ever made I do all the work with communicating. Different people feel loved in different ways and for me it's quality time; if you cannot take 5 minutes to initiate with communicating with the friendship you have with me, then no I don't think you care about me as a person, nor do I think you care about my life.

People ask 'what am I going to do about it'? The reality is that I don't know what the solution is. However I know two things to be true:

1.I cannot even begin to make improvements with this fellowship issue without God's help.

2.Sadly most Christians in America don't see fellowship only being centered around church stuff and not carrying over into real life as an issue; they're content with the fellowship setup the way it currently is. The truth is that since they don't see it as a problem to begin with they're not going to try and make changes towards a solution. However I look at the new church and how fellowship was intertwined into daily life, and I look at fellowship in mainstream Christianity here in the United States, and realize there IS an issue with the way fellowship is in the United States.

3. This is such a major issue that it's going to take more than one person to make changes with this. I am only one person, and yes I can 'be the change I wish to see in the world' however the reality is I AM ONLY ONE PERSON, and sometimes an issue is so big that it takes more than one person to fix it and such is the case with this problem.

I have become really 'hung up' with this because I could deal with it from people from the secular world, it's the type of treatment I'd expect to receive. However I thought when I became saved I would find my niche in church, and find a place where I feel I truly belong. However I've always felt like I'm on the outside looking in for as long as I can remember, and I don't even feel like there's a place for me even in the body of Christ. The reality is that most of my congregation is made up of married people raising young families and the others are retirees. Most people my age are raising families and working jobs to provide for those families. I am not, so while I feel accepted, I don't feel included. Most Christians at my church also don't struggle with depression, at least not chronically; depression varies in severity and somebody who has never had depression or who has only had a mild form of it IS NOT going to be able to relate to somebody who struggles with it chronically because chronic depression is completely different than mild depression and effects you more badly than mild depression does.

I have always believed that if you stop focusing on yourself and start focusing on others, you will see a change in your environment and in yourself. I will pray that you take this to heart.

 

[AllThingsWorkForGood]

I have found as a single woman going to church on my own, I threaten some people for some reason. As you mentioned, the vast majority of people in churches are there with others in families. What I've found is that they either completely ignore me or overcompensate for my 'singleness' (which they seem to be uncomfortable with whereas I am completely at peace about it) by being extremely nosy and asking me very personal questions for some reason they think they are entitled to ask (probably because I am female and 'single'). For example, the last time I went to a church I had been trying to go to consistently for a few weeks, a woman I hadn't met before came up and her first statement on approaching me was 'are you on your own?'. I was a bit shocked and didn't say what I should have which is 'well no because God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are with me but you probably can't see them'.

I have decided that it seems it's other people that have more of an issue with me being at a church on my own than me. For some bizarre reason it becomes an issue for them. All I honestly want to do is worship God and hear his Word but where I live anyway in Scotland, there are very few real churches around. What I have realised over the years is that most churches (here anyway) are nothing more than social clubs. Most in this country are not interested in glorifying God and putting him first. They are literally just places for 'Christians' to get together and have inane conversations about work, holidays, etc. I literally struggle to find a Christian these days who actually wants to talk about God and Jesus. It's bizarre but I put it down to them just being worldly and people who are married with children appear to be completely obsessed with thinking about their own small family units instead of the greater good of the Church. So I am not surprised at how you feel.

Although this should not be the case. You should be able to find a church where you are accepted and loved, unfortunately the reality is that most 'Christians' are not fully in accordance with God's will and are living worldly lives, 'Christian' in culture rather than in soul.

I have learned that God has kept me outside the church for a reason. Never really integrating because of these issues, I see the church through the eyes of the lost (and always have). I despair at their lack of action to reach the lost. I despair at their obsession with worldly concerns. I despair at their lack of connection to the Holy Spirit. However, God has kept me apart for a reason.

St. Paul said it is better for single people to remain single because they can focus completely on God and his Purpose. Something that St. Paul knew all about.

I'm afraid that in today's chaotic social media-obsessed world, how people relate to each other has changed. People no longer take time to communicate properly because they mostly don't engage their brains during social media and this translates to everyday life and how they interact face-to-face.

You need to realise that you are enough as you are. You don't need other people to define you. You are God's child if you are saved and have been redeemed by Christ. If not, you can be. Allow God to define you as his precious child and not people. Allow God to strengthen your confidence in yourself and being strong and independent. St. Paul achieved great things for God's kingdom here on earth and he couldn't have achieved that if he had worried about how other people perceived him. You are enough in God's eyes. Show the world that by being content in you. If you are faithful and patient and prayerful, God will make your path straight and bring people who truly value, love and respect you into your life when the time is right. Take this time to know Him more and get so close to Him that nothing can shake your relationships with your Father God.

 

[oxtailsoup]

Hello, M4J, when I read that you had depression for seventeen years, I thought to myself, that sounds like something that should be treated by a professional rather than resolved by well-meaning advice from your peers. Have you considered approaching a doctor or therapist rather than taking suggestions from laypeople?

 

[Messerve]

Wow. You basically described myself, M4J, though I'm a little younger. I'm even a musician. Hahaha

I also struggle with some depression, and some of it is caused by the very situation at church like you describe. I grew up at my current church and have been a member for a long time, but most Sundays go by with no one really saying anything to me. When I graduated from college and was still single it was like a warning message appeared over my head...

If people do talk to me, they either rush away again to find their kids or spouse or they ask the shallowest questions possible: "Where do you work?", "Are you living on your own?", "How are your parents/siblings?" And I almost never see them outside of church.

I have gotten zero personal invitations to anyone's home or to share a meal or to do anything. I'm only one person, so it's not like I'm hard to feed... And I can think of plenty of people who have common interests as myself that we would have plenty to talk about. But they're all so caught up in their busy little worlds I think they just forget people like you and me even exist.

And for the friends I do have in the world (all one and a half of them), it can definitely be a one-way street at times like you said. However, the reason these people are my friends is because at least some of the time they reach out to me instead. That has yet to happen at my church...

 

[oxtailsoup]

M4J, one thing I would add to my post yesterday is, "Don't blame yourself for things you can't change."

Specifically, I would point to two things.

First, society as a whole is becoming more and more fragmented. People are less and less willing to connect with each other.

Second, almost all institutional churches work on a performer-and-audience basis, with a few stars doing all the talking and everyone else obliged to just sit there. This doesn't put people in the mood to open up. Some churches try to fake it with hand-shaking or coffee hour, but these aren't enough for real relationships to develop. It's like, "Now the members of the audience will all pretend they all know each other."

 

[oxtailsoup]

And one other thing, M4J. Sorry this is coming out in bits and pieces, but that's the way it goes.

Derek Prince, the famous British Bible teacher, suffered from long-term, heavy depression back in the late 1940s and early 1950s. This was before depression was recognized as a treatable medical condition.

The story of "My Struggle with Depression" is chapter 4 of Derek Prince's book They Shall Expel Demons: What You Need to Know about Demons -- Your Invisible Enemies. That chapter tells you what he did.

 

[Messerve]

M4J, one thing I would add to my post yesterday is, "Don't blame yourself for things you can't change."

Specifically, I would point to two things.

First, society as a whole is becoming more and more fragmented. People are less and less willing to connect with each other.

Second, almost all institutional churches work on a performer-and-audience basis, with a few stars doing all the talking and everyone else obliged to just sit there. This doesn't put people in the mood to open up. Some churches try to fake it with hand-shaking or coffee hour, but these aren't enough for real relationships to develop. It's like, "Now the members of the audience will all pretend they all know each other."

My church had a time during the service when people could get up and greet each other for a little before the "program" continued, and actually that was one of my favorite parts of Sunday morning! Most of the time you're staring at the backs of each other's heads and have no idea what's going on in each other's life. So that was the one time when everyone could take a small break from the craziness and just say hello and shake hands and reconnect for a moment.

New church leaders took over and decided to eliminate it to encourage "more authentic relationships". So what happens? As soon as the service is over, everyone rushes out the door to go home, pick up their kids, get their Sunday school material together, practice with the choir, etc etc. There is much less personal interactions now that they've taken away the one time we weren't just operating within the confines of a program. Multiple people told me that the greeting time in the service was one thing that attracted them to the church. And now it's gone. It's a shame...

Could people invite each other to do things outside of Sunday morning? Sure. but most people are just too busy. For that one hour, we're all in the same room together. Why not use that moment to just relax and say hello?

 

[Messerve]

And one other thing, M4J. Sorry this is coming out in bits and pieces, but that's the way it goes.

Derek Prince, the famous British Bible teacher, suffered from long-term, heavy depression back in the late 1940s and early 1950s. This was before depression was recognized as a treatable medical condition.

The story of "My Struggle with Depression" is chapter 4 of Derek Prince's book They Shall Expel Demons: What You Need to Know about Demons -- Your Invisible Enemies. That chapter tells you what he did.

And I don't know about Derek Prince's book, but if he is arguing that demons can live in a Christian, I would be very careful about that teaching. Our bodies are temples into which God has put His presence in the form of the Holy Spirit. Though God allowed imperfect human beings (who had consecrated themselves) into his Holy Place, I do not believe he would have let demons live in His temple! So I do not believe He would let demons live in a true Christian, either...

 

[EzekielsWheels]

You're not alone as others have said. This culture has become in my perception increasingly fragmented. Also, many people that go to church are not Christians. Period. And yes when you're 30+ and single it makes it even harder. It's just a tough spot to be in. I have had many similar experiences and I don't know what to say to be honest. Yeah, we could probably change things about ourselves but also sometimes it is what it is. We're in a time in history here in this country where social skills are on the decline, self-absorption is on the increase and a sense of community is disappearing, or rather shifting to alternative arenas online.

Maybe here's a way to think about it positively for all of us. We're not in Jerusalem right now. We've all been scattered to the ends of the earth so we can be witnesses to them, even if that means loneliness, persecution and whatever else. But these messages are like our epistles to each other, encouraging each other in our walks that we may be firm in the faith. I would guess Paul struggled with many of the things we faced but he endured. So too we must endure. We must. We don't live these lives for ourselves but for Jesus Christ, so come what may we must continue forward and use the resources the Lord provides like this forum to continue onward.

 

[EzekielsWheels]

And I don't know about Derek Prince's book, but if he is arguing that demons can live in a Christian, I would be very careful about that teaching. Our bodies are temples into which God has put His presence in the form of the Holy Spirit. Though God allowed imperfect human beings (who had consecrated themselves) into his Holy Place, I do not believe he would have let demons live in His temple! So I do not believe He would let demons live in a true Christian, either...

From what I've read a demon can be present in the body and soul (mind, will, emotions) but not the spirit, for that is where the Holy Spirit resides.

 

[oxtailsoup]

And I don't know about Derek Prince's book, but if he is arguing that demons can live in a Christian, I would be very careful about that teaching. Our bodies are temples into which God has put His presence in the form of the Holy Spirit. Though God allowed imperfect human beings (who had consecrated themselves) into his Holy Place, I do not believe he would have let demons live in His temple! So I do not believe He would let demons live in a true Christian, either...

Messerve, if you're interested in pursuing Derek Prince's thoughts on this subject, chapter 16 addresses your very question.

 

[Heissonear]

You've got the right perspective of the current "churches" available to attend.

You are not alone in how you think.

I mention again Milton Green. There are tape series on Youtube by Milt on the falling away of the church - with hundreds of Scripture verses to read during his presentations.

Yes, the Falling Away has occurred. We do not need to wait for it.

Many other posters see the same, church as a country club or people not walking in the Word they hear.

May Milton Green multiple recordings over a 5 year period enlighten you, and lift you up in the Scriptures and Body.

Joyce lived longer than Milt, and continued generating video sermons. Milts were the original/beginning.

Be Fruitful and multiply Milton and Joyce Green - YouTube

 

[ml5363]

I understand..I attend a church of 29-40 people...everyone is friendly but apart from 3 or 4 people u really don't feel like I know them well...it has always been harder to make friends as an adult...partly I think to not having enough time bc of work, family, etc

 

[Musician4Jesus]

Yes I haven't actually replied to the responses people in this thread have posted in ages, but I didn't know what to say initially; part of this is because I'm introvert and I have to THINK about what I am going to say (or rather type in this case) BEFORE I say it.

Another reason for not responding in ages is because lots of people responded to this thread, and there are lots of different perspectives regarding what I said, so I needed to figure out how to respond.

This is my response in regards to what people have said....

Somebody said 'why can't you just enjoy the time you have to fellowship when you go to church on Sundays' well this is my response to that...

I feel like I am putting on a facade, and I'm tired of the masquerade. I have to put on this masquerade and facade at church every sunday, and it's to the point where I HATE going to church now, that I DREAD going to church. The typical thing that happens is people say hi and ask 'how are you'. I get so sick of people asking me how I am; the reason for this is they're not asking because they actually care how you are, they're only asking to be polite. It's just inferred that your response should be that you're fine, and that you're just supposed to hide your pain, sorrow, and problems; that if you do so, 'nobody wants to be around somebody who is always negative'. I get so sick of this attitude because it completely contradicts what the Bible says....the Bible says to bare one another's burdens, to love one another, and that when one person in the body of Christ mourns/grieves, the others in the body of Christ do so as well.

Add to that we're supposed to love like Jesus does, and Jesus lets you be REAL about your pain sorrow and problems; he accepts you as you are. It's agape love, and that's the type of love we're supposed to emulate. Yet does this happen with the church I go to? No, and the sad reality is it's been this way with every church I've ever gone to, and I've been saved 17 years.

You know how many people in my church I can actually confide in, actually BE REAL WITH about my problems and my depression? Who actually help me and take an interest in my life? Three, that's it. Even though I go to a small group, I don't feel comfortable at all confiding in them about my depression, or about being an older single. The reason I don't want to open up to them (the people in my small group) about this stuff is because....

1.Most of them are older (in their 50s, and 60s); I don't have a problem being friends with somebody who is older that's not the issue. However with the exception of one other person, everybody in my small group but me is married. Most of them were married when they were young (early to mid 20s); since they were married when they were young they don't know how difficult it is to be an older single, since when they were my age (I'm in my mid 30s) they were married and raising a family.

2. None of them have chronic depression, and as I far as I know of, none of them have depression (if they do it's a milder form, and they're doing a really good job of hiding it). THAT in and of itself aggravates me to no end, that you cannot be open about depression in the church. You know how many sermons have been preached about specifically focusing on depression?! NONE, and it SHOULD NOT be that way, because there are SO MANY CHRISTIANS AT CHURCH WHO STRUGGLE WITH IT. However what's the 'solution' that we're just supposed to put on this masquerade of everything is great, even though we're devastated and broken inside.

Somebody posted this on the thread, and it really aggravated me....

Hello, M4J, when I read that you had depression for seventeen years, I thought to myself, that sounds like something that should be treated by a professional rather than resolved by well-meaning advice from your peers. Have you considered approaching a doctor or therapist rather than taking suggestions from laypeople?

I don't know where the hell in the post I put that I EVER ONCE IMPLIED that I am expecting people at my church to be my therapist/counselor. THAT IS NOT what I am expecting of them. I'm obviously not a psychologist, but I have a very good idea of how depression works, because I've lived with it for so long; as a result I know what makes it better, and what makes it worse. If you have a support system, it makes it better, and I feel like I don't have that; I have people from aforementioned small group claiming to love and care about me, yet those SAME people, I'm just expected to say I'm great and put on a smile and facade. Those same people, NONE of them so much as ever initiate with a phone call or text outside of small group and church on Sundays, AND NONE OF THEM ever lift a finger to help in a practical way; all they say is "I'll pray for you". None of them ever invite me out to do something, or offer to hang out. I don't do so either, but it's because I have become so tired of doing all the work from a communication stand point with friendships, sick of putting on this facade and masquerade, and sick of being forgotten.

The reality is that that primary focus and emphasis with mainstream Christian culture and Christian churches in america is FAMILY; that's great if you're in that demographic but if you're not it SUCKS ASS, and you fall through the cracks.

How Am I possibly supposed to believe that being myself is good enough?! That it's enough?! How am I supposed to believe this, when the emphasis in American culture is on being extrovert, and if you're an introvert you are seen as inferior, as a liability. I am sick of being forced to be something I am not; I don't force extroverts to be introverts, but with american culture if you're introvert, it's immediately seen that something is wrong with you, and it drives me absolutely insane and makes my blood boil.

I am not stupid, the whole attitude with contemporary Christian churches is you're just supposed to be encouraging and edifying and uplifting. That as long as you're nice and happy and positive to be around, constantly saying how great life is, that you deserve love, help, time, and attention. However if you don't fit that mold, then you just deserve to be snubbed, and ostracized; or if you are acknowledged, you're judged in a condemning way and people play the comparison game with your life and problems....that somebody else has it worse off that makes your problems and life inferior. It's this whole gist of 'there are millions of people around the world in poverty, you could be a lot worse off' That's minimizing, and it aggravates me so much. Then people here wonder why I don't trust people, why I don't like them, they wonder why I am so resentful and angry.

This aggravates me because it's NOT WHAT JESUS DOES and again totally contradicts the Bible. Jesus himself said that ...

Matthew 5:46-48 New International Version (NIV)
46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

The bottom line is we're not just supposed to love those who love us that we're supposed to love those who are not loving. However contemporary Christian churches say 'being real about your problems is taboo, nobody wants to be around somebody who is always negative, you're real about your problems and you're whining and complaining'

 

[sea5763]

Nvm

 

[AllThingsWorkForGood]

I'm sorry you're experiencing this but I'm afraid to say I'm not surprised.

Forget 'Christians' for a moment because people, in general, are intrinsically selfish, as is human nature (as the Bible makes very very clear). Because of humanity's fallen nature, generally, humans exist for themselves and the offspring that they create through reproduction. When reproduction is attained, the primary focus of life is built around the 'family' that now exists. As a result, most people cannot literally do anything else but focus on their own little family units because their whole life's purpose becomes about their identity as part of the family that they have created, and whatever role they play, i.e. provider, protector, mother, father, disciplinarian, cook, cleaner, whatever. Most people lose their individual identity to whatever 'family' unit they are brought up in and then whatever 'family' unit they go on to create for themselves. The family then becomes their primary motivating factor in life.

It becomes what motivates people to get up to go to work everyday (provide for current family), to go to school and university (provide for their future family that they are expected to create), save for a pension in retirement (provide for their grandchildren etc etc).

It's all about family and yes it is a social assumption that we are all supposed to want to attain to this 'ideal' of being part of some kind of human creation that we ourselves are supposed to take pride in and exult in having created.

But not everyone wants that. Not everyone desires that. Not everyone is called by God to that. For some people that is just tedium. I suspect it would have been extreme tedium for St. Paul to have contemplated those things. His focus was on Christ and extending His Kingdom throughout the world. No small feat that required total dedication to the task in hand.

This is also why St. Paul dedicated so much of his teaching and preaching to rising above the things of the flesh, in order to avoid so much of this human-induced tedium. For example, I can sense Paul's frustration when he says things like 'if virgins cannot control themselves then let them marry' (1 Corinthians 7:9).

Some people recognise 'family' as a social creation that has a biological basis but is not something that is predetermined. Not everyone's main priority in life is to reproduce and create human chains of dependency and co-existence, which very often result in dysfunction, sorrow and lack of love. Families can also be tangled webs of deceit, corruption and lies - where the Enemy loves to dwell.

Sometimes, it's a blessing to be free of human chains.

Some people desire to be free of co-dependency on other human beings. Of manipulation. Of emotional blackmail. Of sexual oppression. Of social expectation.

Some people desire to be at one with God and avoid all of the above.

But here's the thing. That is the crude simplicity of the world. If you are truly born again then you are called not to be of the world. You are called by God to be different, in whatever unique way that is you have to offer that. God created you as an individual, to be consecrated to Him, in order that He may be the centre of your life and not human beings.

The Father (and the Father's will to redeem mankind) was the absolute core, centre and purpose of Jesus' life. There was no exception.

In fact, very often, human beings were a stumbling block to Jesus and he did not hesitate to tell them so. For example, when he told Peter to 'Get thee behind me Satan for you have not in mind the things of God but of men' Matthew 16:22-24.

It was in this context that he told his followers that if they really wanted to follow him they had to pick up their cross daily.

Was not it also Jesus who said that whoever looks back is not fit for the kingdom?

I am trying to explain that it sounds to me as if you are focusing on other people far too much. In this day and age, very few churches replicate the true Christian fellowship of Jesus Christ. They are nothing more than glorified social clubs where like-minded 'Christians' get to meet up and have nice, smiley conversations about their kids, the latest holiday or barbeque, and all the other banal things they have to discuss. In fact, most of them will happily stand and talk with their church friends about anything and everything apart from Jesus Christ because he is NOT their priority. Their personal life and family is.

If even Jesus Christ is not their priority, why do you even think that they would have the capacity to see beyond the superficial and extend true and generous Christian fellowship to you? I am telling you these people do not sound like the type of Christians who have Christ at the centre. They might talk the talk and walk the walk but they may not have the Father's heart. So why let it get to you so much? Why not recognise that you are the centre of your universe with God and you do not require other people to define you (as I said in my previous post).

It can be extremely disconcerting to be 'single' in the Church. But do not think of it in this way. I don't know if you actually want to have a family yourself and this is maybe why you find it such a struggle? If this is the case then you should be seeking God as this is clearly having a serious impact on you and you should ask the Father to provide you with a spouse. But if this is not the case, and you are only affected by the lack of compassion that you seem to express and the hypocrisy that I sense you are frustrated by, then this is something different and you are not alone in feeling and experiencing that hypocrisy.

But either way, you have to focus on Jesus Christ. They may only be there on Sunday because it's the 'done' thing and to show face but you are going for the right reasons. Seek first God's Kingdom and He will give you the desires of your heart (Matthew 6:33).

Human nature is selfish and self-absorbed, and yes, unfortunately this extends to the Church because most of them are not really spirit-filled believers. They are just living life like the vast majority of the world.

But you are free and have a wonderful opportunity now to grow in God and make Him the centre of your world so that He can direct all of your paths and make them straight, if you Trust in Him (Proverbs 3:5-6).

The 'Church' is not where you go on Sunday. It's the spiritual body of true believers across the globe. You are not alone in how you feel, although it may seem like it.

(If I am way off base with this reply I apologise as I understand how frustrating it is when people reply having misrepresented what you initially said, so I know I may not have said the right things. But I really hope you will realise how important your individual relationship with Jesus and the Father is and how this should be your everything until God decides you are ready for other things. That was my main intention in writing this).

 

[sea5763]

nvm