Things non-Calvinists should know about Calvinism

[bottomofsandal]

Nice condescending reply.

You obviously either ignored or did not fully read either of the links I posted concerning John Wesley's sermon 128 or the post by a senior pastor of Calvary Chapel Church.

But that is okay, our dear brother bottomofthesandal.....

Post something from a CALVINIST that supports your contentions. Why do you continue to post anti-Calvinist writing as evidence to disprove Calvinism ? It sure appears like you have been misrepresenting Calvinism and cannot find any Calvinist to say what you allege that they say !!!



Either you are deliberately mischaracterizing Calvinism or you do not really understand what Calvinism is. Or possibly both scenarios. Please show us the serial killer illustration that you supplied written by a Calvinist, and not by an anti-Calvinist. You might be referencing HYPER-Calvinism. There are no HCs here presently. Nonetheless, you will continue to post anti-Calvinist remarks even though and in spite of Calvinists coming forward and stating that they do not subscribe to your false accusations.

 

[AndOne]

Post something from a CALVINIST that supports your contentions. Why do you continue to post anti-Calvinist writing as evidence to disprove Calvinism ? It sure appears like you have been misrepresenting Calvinism and cannot find any Calvinist to say what you allege that they say !!!



Either you are deliberately mischaracterizing Calvinism or you do not really understand what Calvinism is. Or possibly both scenarios. Please show us the serial killer illustration that you supplied written by a Calvinist, and not by an anti-Calvinist. You might be referencing HYPER-Calvinism. There are no HCs here presently. Nonetheless, you will continue to post anti-Calvinist remarks even though and in spite of Calvinists coming forward and stating that they do not subscribe to your false accusations.

I don't think its deliberate - though admitedly there are some bad feelings on both sides of the issue.

I will just point out that from what I've seen its usually the non-Calvinists going on the offensive trying to debunk Calvinism - I'm referring to theologians and pastors in an official setting, not CF posters. Its usually the Calvinists stuck either defending their position or correcting misrepresentations.

I've seen some good armininians do a really good job in attempting to refute Calvinism and doing it with respect and love - guys like Ron Brown who understand Calvinism.

George Bryson from Calvary Chapel is on the other end of the spectrum however. He has a minute understanding of Calvinism and just will not accept correction when he gets his facts mixed up.

Having said that - I don't think Calvary Chapel as a whole should be judged on the merits of George Bryson. I went to a Calvary Chapel church for two years and it was one of the best churches I was fortunate to be a part of. No one criticized me for my Calvinistic beliefs and I had a good relationship with the Pastors there. My family and I were Calvinist - they were not - everyone knew it and life went on.

 

[bottomofsandal]

I don't think its deliberate - though admitedly there are some bad feelings on both sides of the issue.

I will just point out that from what I've seen its usually the non-Calvinists going on the offensive trying to debunk Calvinism - I'm referring to theologians and pastors in an official setting, not CF posters. Its usually the Calvinists stuck either defending their position or correcting misrepresentations.

I've seen some good armininians do a really good job in attempting to refute Calvinism and doing it with respect and love - guys like Ron Brown who understand Calvinism.

George Bryson from Calvary Chapel is on the other end of the spectrum however. He has a minute understanding of Calvinism and just will not accept correction when he gets his facts mixed up.

Having said that - I don't think Calvary Chapel as a whole should be judged on the merits of George Bryson. I went to a Calvary Chapel church for two years and it was one of the best churches I was fortunate to be a part of. No one criticized me for my Calvinistic beliefs and I had a good relationship with the Pastors there. My family and I were Calvinist - they were not - everyone knew it and life went on.

Thank you brother !


I too have enjoyed good healthy debates with Arminians (and Calvinists) that understand what Calvinism is and is not. One of the benefits of good Biblical based discussion is it forces one to be a good Berean and spend more time searching the Scriptures. OTOH, fabrication merely serves to obfuscate and misdirect while the real issues are never discussed because someone has an ax to grind or feels compelled to disseminate what they believe to be zingers, one-uppers, or shrewd comments. I am really liking the writing of Calminian, he seems to have harmonized what many seem unable to reconcile.

 

[Lee52]

I don't think its deliberate - though admitedly there are some bad feelings on both sides of the issue.

I will just point out that from what I've seen its usually the non-Calvinists going on the offensive trying to debunk Calvinism - I'm referring to theologians and pastors in an official setting, not CF posters. Its usually the Calvinists stuck either defending their position or correcting misrepresentations.

I've seen some good armininians do a really good job in attempting to refute Calvinism and doing it with respect and love - guys like Ron Brown who understand Calvinism.

George Bryson from Calvary Chapel is on the other end of the spectrum however. He has a minute understanding of Calvinism and just will not accept correction when he gets his facts mixed up.

Having said that - I don't think Calvary Chapel as a whole should be judged on the merits of George Bryson. I went to a Calvary Chapel church for two years and it was one of the best churches I was fortunate to be a part of. No one criticized me for my Calvinistic beliefs and I had a good relationship with the Pastors there. My family and I were Calvinist - they were not - everyone knew it and life went on.

Thank you brother !


I too have enjoyed good healthy debates with Arminians (and Calvinists) that understand what Calvinism is and is not. One of the benefits of good Biblical based discussion is it forces one to be a good Berean and spend more time searching the Scriptures. OTOH, fabrication merely serves to obfuscate and misdirect while the real issues are never discussed because someone has an ax to grind or feels compelled to disseminate what they believe to be zingers, one-uppers, or shrewd comments. I am really liking the writing of Calminian, he seems to have harmonized what many seem unable to reconcile.

And, since neither of you addressed the sermon #128 by Wesley, perhaps this will help, from one of the other threads where I posted this:

BTW, I started in the Reformed Church, I understand Calvin very well.

This should provide some interesting reading for those committed to Calvin and not admitting to what EXACTLY Calvin taught.

The Unaccommodated Calvin: Studies in the Foundation of a Theological Tradition
By Richard A. Muller.
New York, NY: Oxford University Press, 2000

Calvin: an Introduction to His Thought
By T.H.L. Parker
Louisville, KY: Westminster/ John Knox Press, 1995

The Writings of John Calvin — An Introductory Guide
By W. de Greef
Grand Rapids: Baker, 1994

Calvin: Origins and Development of His Religious Thought
By Francois Wendel
Grand Rapids: Baker, 1997, c1963

John Calvin — a Biography
By T.H.L. Parker
Philadelphia: Westminster Press, 1975. [out-of-print]

Have fun reading for understanding of Calvin from a non-Arminian perspective.

Be blessed,
Lee52