They shall mingle themselves with the seed of men

[DrBubbaLove]

Ok, guys. My apologies. It has been explained to me that as long as your icon does not say Mormon or a few other explicitly banned faiths, then you are free to post whatever you want as "truth" in this section. I will stop complaining and join in this discussion. Again please accept my apologies for thinking the rules meant more than they do. Need to catch up.

In discussing this very topic in another section, another brother says Satan knew Eve and Cain is the product of that union. Is that consistent with your understanding of these verses as well?
If I have understood you so far, you are saying Chap6 is also speaking of "other people" that are the offspring of similar unions between women and demons?

If I have your view wrong please correct me. If not then a couple of more questions.

Someone mentioned one of the wives of Noah's sons. So the idea would be this "demon seed" survives the flood via her. Since obviously not all of Noah's sons married these women carrying "demon seed" or at least only one has been singled out, can we identify anyone today having this demon genetic material? Or do they look the same as everyone else today?

If you believe God created everything visible and invisible, how is it possible that a fallen invisible part of creation has the ability to create something?

 

[nephilimiyr]

Ok, guys. My apologies. It has been explained to me that as long as your icon does not say Mormon or a few other explicitly banned faiths, then you are free to post whatever you want as "truth" in this section. I will stop complaining and join in this discussion. Again please accept my apologies for thinking the rules meant more than they do. Need to catch up.

I'll have to file that away because I didn't know about that, thanks for relaying the message you got!
Your apology is accepted

In discussing this very topic in another section, another brother says Satan knew Eve and Cain is the product of that union. Is that consistent with your understanding of these verses as well?

No, at least not with the main stream theology that I agree with. There is a guy, I don't remember his name or website, who teaches this but this just shows how imagination can get the best of some people...either that or demon influence.

This theology, I admitt, does have a problem and that is some people take liberties with the word. They don't know the Hebrew and the proper way to use it's grammar. They don't want to keep with sound doctrine or what is clearly written. The above story is a perfect example of this. The base of this theology is what I keep with and hold to be true and that means to take the original Hebrew at it's literal word, to a point.

If I have understood you so far, you are saying Chap6 is also speaking of "other people" that are the offspring of similar unions between women and demons?

I'm not sure what you mean here. My answer to you is no. The only offspring were the Nephilim and the only people involved were the daughters of Adam...human women.

But if you are talking about the tribes of the Nephilim then there is this. After the flood it is shown that once again angels sinned. Another eruption of Nephilim began. After this second eruption the Bible refers to the Nephilim by their tribes only, accept with their specific reference in Numbers 13:33, otherwise the tribes are only mentioned.

If you're really interested, read Chapter 14 in Genesis and then do a search on the Zamzummins, Rephaims, Horims, Emims, Avvims, and the Anakims. These are all tribes of the Nephilim and it can be known that they are because the Bible ties all these groups into one quite nicely but only if you look for it.

If I have your view wrong please correct me.

So far you show me you don't have it right.

Someone mentioned one of the wives of Noah's sons. So the idea would be this "demon seed" survives the flood via her. Since obviously not all of Noah's sons married these women carrying "demon seed" or at least only one has been singled out, can we identify anyone today having this demon genetic material? Or do they look the same as everyone else today?

See know your getting into prophecy concerning these beings and like I told the guys here about this, I am done speculating on this. I have spent alot of time looking for answer about this and have found none. That includes searching the word and praying.
I can't answer this because I believe the answer is unknown. My belief is that Noah and all his family were free of any Nephilim blood. To say one or more of them were contaminated is pure speculation.

If you believe God created everything visible and invisible, how is it possible that a fallen invisible part of creation has the ability to create something?

I don't have enough time or space to answer that question in full. This theology is based on the literal word of the Hebrew text and the Greek text of the New Testament.

Jude 1:6-7, And the angels which kept not their first esate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
I love it when the word is preached!
The angels that sinned did so by leaveing their own habitation, their first estate. This is both referring to their spiritual bodies and the place in which they lived in, their domain. They left it! Genesis 6 says that angels married women and had children with them. The angels left to go where? The answer is and can only be, they left their spiritual bodies that were in the heavenly places and came down to earth in phisical bodies. Not forms, but real physical bodies.

Once they left their first estate, there was no turning back.
2 Peter 2:4, For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment.

DrBubbaLove, I believe you are a victom of false information. You got the lefts story and explanation and you got the rights story and explanation...I'm here to meet you in the middle where the real truth lies! Throw away all the garbage you have heard. No, Satan did not rape Eve but also, no, sons of God does not mean sons of Seth. Niether version can be found in the texts.

 

[DrBubbaLove]

Thanks for the correction Nephilimiyr.



An alternative and commonly accepted explanation for Chp6, and “sons of God” vs “sons of men” is the idea of good vs wicked people. The Hebrew writer wishing to show his ancestors leading up to Abraham came from “good” people. What about the “Hebrew words” here suggests to you that this alternative explanation is not possible?



Also how does God allow the created to “create”?


If we believe God created everything, then it seems contradictory to say fallen angels can “create” these demon-human beings you say the Nephilim represent. There were no Nephilim according to your understanding before the demons did this, so Nephilim in your view were not something God created. Did I miss something?

 

[nephilimiyr]

Also how does God allow the created to “create”?

The same way I, as a male, can put my seed in my wife and create a child. God didn't create the flesh of my sons...My wife and I did. We created offspring because that is what God wanted us to do and is what pleases him, this is the law of nature God designed. I have 4 sons by the way, thanks be to God!
However, God never intended for angels to procreate. That wasn't part of his plan. Yet we see that angels can become fully physical by reading the Bible. For them to procreate is a violation of the laws He established.

You see, God made it posible for us to create. The angels who becoming physical I have to believe was made posible by God's laws, through some kind of law I know nothing about.

 

[nephilimiyr]

An alternative and commonly accepted explanation for Chp6, and “sons of God” vs “sons of men” is the idea of good vs wicked people. The Hebrew writer wishing to show his ancestors leading up to Abraham came from “good” people. What about the “Hebrew words” here suggests to you that this alternative explanation is not possible?

When dealing with the Hebrew text or any other ancient language a universal law has to be applied. The text has to define itself in the original language that it was written in. You can't use the German language to define what the Hebrew says just as much as you can't use the English language to define what the Hebrew says.


In the ancient Hebrew writtings, when a phrase is used over and over again and is shown to mean the same thing, we are then sure in what that phrase means. When the phrase "sons of God" is used in the Hebrew text it always shows to mean angelic beings. You will not ever find the phrase "Bene Elohim" written in Hebrew meaning any other thing but that of angelic beings. It can only be read in the context of the rest of the Bible, as referring to angels.

The only places where the Hebrew phrase is written are: Genesis 6:4, Job 1:6, Job 2:1, Job 38:7, and Daniel 3:25.
Now yes, there are similar phrases used in the English but in the Hebrew, "Bene Elohim" is only used in those passages and they all refer to angelic beings.

This is why most conservative scholars and theologians agree with the basic theology. You can't have 4 instances of a Hebrew phrase meaning one thing and another meaning something else. They all have to mean the same. This is a law of interpretation all throughout the Hebrew Bible. If you chose to violate this law to fit your theology you open up a can of worms and all other theologies become into question. There would be mass chaos! Agreed?

So the question really is, can Bene Elohim mean sons of men? The answer to that question is certainly, unequivocaly, and without question, not! It simply can't happen!

Those people who chose to believe that the passage in Genesis means good people vs wicked people do so without any understanding of the Hebrew language and the context in which the passage was set in. My opinion is that they just chose to believe what their church tells them but 90% of the churches don't even really care about it or have the knowledge to say much about it. The fact of the matter is, probably 90% of christians don't even really care to find out.

 

[DrBubbaLove]

Ok well there is something to be said for consistency.


Agree with the references you state as being to angelic beings, even Gen 6. However, not being a theologian myself, my sense is that we could not categorically say "most" agree with this understanding, even if we limit that statement to "modern" theologians. We could no doubt find some from all walks that agree with you, but I think saying 'most' is a stretch. Again could be mistaken, but I do not think so.

These references, especially in Gen 6, could also be explained as just part of the myth and current popular understanding of that day in regards to how wicked vs good people came to be. As in how fortunate for the Hebrew that they came from the "good" seed.


I do think it is clear that some stories in the Bible contain nods to the world as understood by the writer, not necessarily as the way things really were or are. How could their world and their understanding of it not influence them? Living among pagans as they did and sometimes being enslaved by them, it should not surprise anyone that ancient Hebrew tradition would contain references to/be influenced by cultures that had extensive and elaborate practices/beliefs about demons. Such a person might insert their own view/understanding of the way they think things are slanted by what was all around them. That would be my understanding of Gen 6.

So no, still do not think it follows that the revealed message from God to us from these verses is that demons can produce children with humans. In fact I do not think spirits reproduce at all. I do absolutely understand how you can see and feel this way given what the Hebrew and even English text literally says.

To me this view does not fit with what else we claim to know from the Bible. As far as I can tell, aside from possibly superhuman abilities and some of them perhaps being very tall, these people do not appear all that different from us. In fact when pressed and if I understood correctly, the posters here seem to consider these individuals still a part of the human race.


The dignity of all men is demanded because each of us is made in His Image. It is difficult for me to accept that truth and then at the same time say some men might be made in some other image or even partially in another image. Especially when that "other" image is demonic.

We all agree God created everything, spirits and the spirit world first, then the visible world and finally man. How could I except that while also believing that Satan and his demons come along later after God was done and start creating something else? What other parts of creation should we attribute to Satan and his demons?


If fallen angels came to earth and procreated with humans, that could in no way be seen as part of God's creation or as being from the hand of God. In sequence of events these things come after God was done. There were no such beings when He was done. So who or what created them? It can only mean the created, then became the creators (a central tenant of Mormonism BTW). Your saying two created beings, with two entirely different natures, join in an holy union that was never intended to be and thereby create something else.


Would such a being have a soul, a spirit and if so where did it get that soul? How could that soul come from God? So to me these beliefs do not fit and even seem contrary to everything else we know about God and creation.

Am sorry but to me these ideas also parallel closely with Mormon thoughts on the subject. They take if further in that for them angels and men represent basically beings of the same 'nature' just in different stages of development. My understanding though is that they would say the same things you do about Gen 6 and the ability of demons to produce offspring in humans.

 

[Brain Damage]

DrBubbaLove.

Do these seem like normal humans to you .

2Sa 21:20 - Show Context Yet again there was war at Gath, where there was a man of great stature, who had six fingers on each hand and six toes on each foot, twenty-four in number; and he also was born to the giant.

De 3:11 - Show Context For only Og king of Bashan remained of the remnant of the giants. Indeed his bedstead was an iron bedstead. (Is it not in Rabbah of the people of Ammon?) Nine cubits is its length and four cubits its width, according to the standard cubit.

Commentators reckon 9 cubits to be some where between 15 and 18 feet.

Not to mention Goliath who stood at 10 1/2 feet. ( 6 cubits and a span )

Before you mouth off , i suggest you bible search the words "GIANT" and "GIANTS" , and read the stories.

 

[nephilimiyr]

Before you mouth off , i suggest you bible search the words "GIANT" and "GIANTS" , and read the stories.

Calm down Brain Damage. I have invited the Doc to a thread I will create in the general theology forums tomorrow morning. To his credit he has relinquished some of his prejudices towards our belief and is willing to discuss it. He still disagrees with it but at least he is willing to now hear us out. Don't ruin it by not showing a heart of fellowship. And please show up yourself. I know I could use the help!

LOL, "Before you mouth off", that was funning but please, please, none of that tomorrow ok?
You know if I was the Doc I'd really give you a what for for saying that...

 

[Brain Damage]

Calm down Brain Damage. I have invited the Doc to a thread I will create in the general theology forums tomorrow morning. To his credit he has relinquished some of his prejudices towards our belief and is willing to discuss it. He still disagrees with it but at least he is willing to now hear us out. Don't ruin it by not showing a heart of fellowship. And please show up yourself. I know I could use the help!

LOL, "Before you mouth off", that was funning but please, please, none of that tomorrow ok?
You know if I was the Doc I'd really give you a what for for saying that...

I am calm , and yes i will be a good little boy and not disrupt your thread...lol

Should be interesting!

 

[Ebed-Yahweh]

So thanks for your input!
That goes for everybody here
Ebed

Happy to contribute.

No, at least not with the main stream theology that I agree with. There is a guy, I don't remember his name or website, who teaches this but this just shows how imagination can get the best of some people...either that or demon influence.

This theology, I admitt, does have a problem and that is some people take liberties with the word. They don't know the Hebrew and the proper way to use it's grammar. They don't want to keep with sound doctrine or what is clearly written. The above story is a perfect example of this. The base of this theology is what I keep with and hold to be true and that means to take the original Hebrew at it's literal word, to a point.

I've done a lot of research on the Two-Seedline theology. Please read my posts on the following thread. I'd like to know what you think.

Exposition & Bible Study: Cain and Abel
http://www.christianforums.com/t154409-cain-and-abel.html&page=2

I can't answer this because I believe the answer is unknown. My belief is that Noah and all his family were free of any Nephilim blood. To say one or more of them were contaminated is pure speculation.

I don't want to argue with you Nephilimyr, but Genesis says nothing about Noah's wife. As it only tells us that Noah himself was "perfect in his generations", I don't think that considering his wife may not have been is pure speculation. Also, the Bible says nothing of fallen angels procreating with human women again after the Flood (although it is not impossible), Another explanation for the continued presence of giants on the earth afterwards is that the Great Deluge was not global but regional, directed only against the descendants of Seth who had transgressed Yahweh's laws.

However, if Noah's wife was indeed free of demonic contamination, it is then possible (taking for granted a regional flood) that the wives of some of Noah's descendants carried the Nephilim genes.

 

[Brain Damage]

Ebed-Yahweh.

I guess i could be wrong but when i look at this scripture : "The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore {children} to them".

It seems to me that it is saying that the sons of God were at it again after the flood , can you see where i'm coming from ?

 

[Ebed-Yahweh]

Ebed-Yahweh.

I guess i could be wrong but when i look at this scripture : "The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore {children} to them".

It seems to me that it is saying that the sons of God were at it again after the flood , can you see where i'm coming from ?

I hadn' thought about it that way before. You may be indeed be correct. After all, Nephilim is basically Hebrew for fallen angels. While I was writing my last post, I was thinking about how Greek mythology, for example, speaks of the gods having children sevearl centuries after the Flood. Good job, Brain Damage. I think I agree with you.

 

[Ebed-Yahweh]

Also how does God allow the created to “create”?

If we believe God created everything, then it seems contradictory to say fallen angels can “create” these demon-human beings you say the Nephilim represent. There were no Nephilim according to your understanding before the demons did this, so Nephilim in your view were not something God created. Did I miss something?

If I create a machine and program it with the ability to create other machines, am I not ultimately responsible for the creation of the machines later created by the first. In the same way, Yahweh created celestial and terrestrial beings with the ability to create and procreate. He is then responsible for everything that is created and occurs within His creation, and He indeed takes responsibility for it.

KJV Isaiah 45:5-7
5 I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:
6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.
7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Though He did not create any beings with the intention that they do evil, He granted them free will, knowing that they might then choose darkness instead of light, evil instead of good. This in no way makes Yahweh evil. It makes Him a fair and just creator who desires to be loved and worshipped only by those beings who choose to do so freely.

 

[DrBubbaLove]

[/size]
The same way I, as a male, can put my seed in my wife and create a child. God didn't create the flesh of my sons...My wife and I did. We created offspring because that is what God wanted us to do and is what pleases him, this is the law of nature God designed. I have 4 sons by the way, thanks be to God!
However, God never intended for angels to procreate. That wasn't part of his plan. Yet we see that angels can become fully physical by reading the Bible. For them to procreate is a violation of the laws He established.

You see, God made it posible for us to create. The angels who becoming physical I have to believe was made posible by God's laws, through some kind of law I know nothing about.

Missed this earlier. Do not agree. Agree that God gave us the ability to procreate, but that is not the same as create as in make something out of nothing. God creates all life and that is why all men are made in His image, which means we must all respect each other because God saw fit, that it was Good, to make each us in His Image. God gives each of us a soul. Can concieve of no way the same could be said of demon-human child even if I believed that possible.

While I do not disagree that spirits can take physical form, that does not mean they can "become" the nature of that form. Becoming "man" or a "women" not just looking like one would be required in order for them to be able then "plant thier seed" in your words. A created thing cannot make itself into something it is not, at best it can only appear to. That ability would only be a characteristic of a creator, and we have only One. Mormons on the other hand would say we all can eventually develope that ability, so to them it makes perfect sense that Jesus "brother" Satan and the demons would be able to become man also, not just look like a man.

Besides being able to take whatever form they wish, Spirits can also possess humans too, and could conceivable thereby rape another human, but the seed being passed there is still human.

 

[DrBubbaLove]

If I create a machine and program it with the ability to create other machines, am I not ultimately responsible for the creation of the machines later created by the first. .

Actually you would be responsible, ask any lawyer. And technically a machine is not life. You assembled what was given to us by God using your intellect (also from God) and you made it such that it could take materials also created by God and duplicate itself. That is assembling something which already exists, giving order and function to it.

In the same way, Yahweh created celestial and terrestrial beings with the ability to create and procreate. He is then responsible for everything that is created and occurs within His creation, and He indeed takes responsibility for it.

It is a nice theory that spirits can procreate and it would be popular in Mormon circles too though they put a few more twists on it than you guys do.


Other than these verses some claim support your view of demon-on-human procreation, am unaware of any verse supporting the idea of spirits reproducing with other spirits? If not why do you believe they can?

Do you believe like the Mormons that spirits are just another stage of human development? I doubt you do, but it would make sense if you did because you obviously think the two natures (demon spirit and man) are close enough to be able to procreate together.

 

[nephilimiyr]

Hello,

the thread is started.

You can get there from here...http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?p=14283359#post14283359

 

[Just The Facts]

Hi Brain


No What happened is the Flood did not destroy the corruption. We read this in Genesis

8:21: And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done.


But Enoch says it much clearer.

Enoch 54 1Afterwards the Ancient of days repented, and said, In vain have I destroyed all the inhabitants of the earth. 2And he sware by his great name, saying, Hence forwards I will not act thus towards all those who dwell upon earth. 3But I will place a sign in the heavens; and it shall be a faithful witness between me and them for ever, as long as the days of heaven and earth last upon the earth.


Why does God say he destroyed the Earth in vain???????????????????????

Because the infection is with Noah......................Ham the Son of Noah is infected. Ham is a Nephilim. His Son Caanan is the Father of the Canaanites the Canaanites are The Nephilim that are in the Earth after the Flood.

Deut:3:11: For only Og king of Bashan remained of the remnant of giants; behold, his bedstead was a bedstead of iron; is it not in Rabbath of the children of Ammon? nine cubits was the length thereof, and four cubits the breadth of it, after the cubit of a man.

This Og King of Bashan was 18 feet Tall he was a Canaanite that is why God ALLOWS the Hebrew to destroy men woman and Children in the conquest of the Land………THEY ARE NOT HUMAN they are part of the infection they are the remnant of the nephilim and when they die their spirits find no rest …………they wander the Earth as demons and posses man and beast in a desperate attempt to exist in the carnal world.

Mt:4:24: And his fame went throughout all Syria: and they brought unto him all sick people that were taken with divers diseases and torments, and those which were possessed with devils, and those which were lunatick, and those that had the palsy; and he healed them.

Their Parents the Fallen Angels are locked in the Pit and will be released at the Fifth Trumpet when the pit is Open.

2Pt:2:4: For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

Jude:1:6: And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

Many of these Demons have been banished to the Pit by Jesus and the Saints and by the rest of those sealed in the Early Rain.

Mt:8:16: When the evening was come, they brought unto him many that were possessed with demons: and he cast out the spirits with his word, and healed all that were sick:

Acts:5:16: There came also a multitude out of the cities round about unto Jerusalem, bringing sick folks, and them which were vexed with unclean spirits: and they were healed every one.

We even have the Demons begging Jesus not to be cast into the pit/ abyss where their Parents the Fallen Angels are held until the fifth trumpet.

Luke 8:[30] Jesus then asked him, "What is your name?" And he said, "Legion"; for many demons had entered him. [31] And they begged him not to command them to depart into the abyss.

So the beast that comes out of the pit here

Rev 17:8: The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition:

Rev 9:1: And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.2: And he opened the bottomless pit;

Is the king of the Fallen Angels ….

Rev 9:11: And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

He is Baal /Azazel the Destroyer he is the God of War and Forces.

Daniel 11:38: But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces:

He taught mankind War

Enoch 8:1 And Azazel taught men to make swords, and knives, and shields, and breastplates, and made known to them the metals of the earth and the art of working them, and bracelets, and ornaments, and the use of antimony,


He once was on Earth……………..Now he is Not…………….and When he returns the World will marvel and his great power and will follow him and Believe He is Jesus Returned.

Rev 17:8: The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

He will imitate what scripture says about Jesus’ Arrival So he will Destroy who the World believes is the AC………………………It is simple since we all know this

2Thes:2:8: And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

First the AC will deceive the world into thinking some man is the AC most likely an Arab, as most of the Christian world is already deceived by his demon introduced Doctrines and Believe that the AC will be an Arab.

Then when he gets released out of the Pit he will appear as an Angel of Light and destroy this “evil arab AC” from the Earth with a great Wonder………………….at his arrival

2Thes:2:9: Even him, WHOSE COMING is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

The Great Wonder that the AC does at his arrival is

Rev 13:13: And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, 14: And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast;

We know that with this great wonder he will destroy the Man who most of Christianity sees as the AC . It is this great deception that convinces the Christian world that Azazel the Beast from the Pit the King of the Fallen Angels is Jesus returned and so the whole world will follow after him.

This is the truth of this matter

 

[Ebed-Yahweh]

Quote:
Originally Posted by: Ebed-Yahweh
If I create a machine and program it with the ability to create other machines, am I not ultimately responsible for the creation of the machines later created by the first.


Actually you would be responsible, ask any lawyer.

Sorry, I forgot the question mark.

That should have read: "If I create a machine and program it with the ability to create other machines, am I not ultimately responsible for the creation of the machines later created by the first?" I was saying that, yes, I would be responsible for the machines the first machine created.

And technically a machine is not life. You assembled what was given to us by God using your intellect (also from God) and you made it such that it could take materials also created by God and duplicate itself. That is assembling something which already exists, giving order and function to it

How exactyly do you define life? If you mean, biological life, then, yes, I did not mean to imply that a machine is life. But what is a human body compared to a spirit? It is a biological machine, designed to be the vehichle with which we interact with the material, natural world. One day some of us will have new bodies and become supernatural (above natural), but we will still be able to interact with the natural world, even as Yahshua did after his resurrection. Why do we assume that angels are so different? After all, didn't Yahshua himself say we would be "as the angels of God in heaven" upon our resurrection (see KJV Matthew 22:30).

 

[Ebed-Yahweh]

JTF, I agree with you. The wording of Genesis 6:4 might in English (KJV) imply that the same things occured after the Flood, but I'll need to check the Hebrew to make certain. Anyway, I looked at it again, and it seemed to me (as it seemed to me in the past) that the Nephilim were the offspring of the unions of the sons of God and the daughters of men, and that it is they who were on the earth both before and after the Flood, not necessarily the sons of God (angels who left their first estate/fallen angels).

 

[DrBubbaLove]

How exactyly do you define life? If you mean, biological life, then, yes, I did not mean to imply that a machine is life. But what is a human body compared to a spirit? It is a biological machine, designed to be the vehichle with which we interact with the material, natural world. One day some of us will have new bodies and become supernatural (above natural), but we will still be able to interact with the natural world, even as Yahshua did after his resurrection. Why do we assume that angels are so different? After all, didn't Yahshua himself say we would be "as the angels of God in heaven" upon our resurrection (see KJV Matthew 22:30).

I think that if man were anything like angels the story of our creation and the very idea that we are made "in His Image" would be altered. The Bible says the angels were made higher than us. It does not say they can become us or we can become them. They are higher. "Higher than" or us being lower than must mean angels are something different than what is implied in by our being made "in His Image". So I think it makes more since to see these as seperate species rather than anything similar.

Since our Lord is speaking of human marriage in the Matt 22:30, I would not conclude that His response meant anything more than we would not technically be married in Heaven like we are here. He was answering that question rather than implying something about our resurrected bodies or making any statement regarding the nature of angel other than they do not marry.

Unlike Mormons, we believe angels canot reproduce, so they would not have mates and not be married. Some people take this a step further to suggest that it means in Heaven, since we can no longer sin but still have human bodies (though different for sure) it would not be a sin for us to have sex whenever and with whomever we like. Sounds nice to me, but such thoughts probably trouble some.