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You might read my post 357Correct.
A being that is all-good cannot create anything evil.
The bible says that God has no evil in Him.
Psalm 5:4
Psalm 92:15
1 John 1:5
This is the message we have heard from Him and announce to you, that God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness at all.
And more...
(1 John 1:5 might interest the O.P. since it equates darkness with evil.
@The Righterzpen )
Time is a linear concept that only goes in one direction. Because of entropy we can't "go backward" in time.
My understanding in the past was that the word could be used to mean"nothing". Might be wrong. But, in conjunction with other words and concepts used in Gen regarding the state of the earth at the beginning: "formless", "void", it all sounds very much like the viewpoint of someone, with the knowledge they had, trying to describe how God formed the world out of nothing.Except "darkness" does't mean "nothing". That Scriptures explain that to us. You are using your own thought as to what it means and not a Scriptural definition.
I just don't think you can have it both ways. How does evil exist outside of a created entity? What would its nature be and where would it originate from other than God anyway in that case?God would not be God if He was not omnipotent. Of course He has power over evil. Evil is a separate reality of its own. Scripture tells us that. Evil is not simply the "absence of good". Evil is a reality that exists in this world. And because it is a reality that exited before there was any created entity that had consciousness. Evil's influence is upon the will of the creature, not the other way around.
Yes, Scripture can interpret Scripture, precept building upon precept, but not every attempt is necessarily proper. For example, to extrapolate from 2 Pet 3:8 ("a day is as a thousand years"), that Gen 1 is telling us that the world is 6-10,000 years old (rather than 2 Pet 3:8 meaning to make the general statement that God exists outside of time) is simply poor hermeneutics.I am not looking at my own "speculations" as superior. I am taking other passages in the Bible to determine what this passage means. That is "interpreting Scripture with Scripture". This is what we are told by God to do.
Yes, Scripture can interpret Scripture, precept building upon precept, but not every attempt is necessarily proper. For example, to extrapolate from 2 Pet 3:8 ("a day is as a thousand years"), that Gen 1 is telling us that the world is 6-10,000 years old (rather than 2 Pet 3:8 meaning to make the general statement that God exists outside of time) is simply poor hermeneutics.
My mind is sort of uni-dimensional I think..Haven't got much past 1D with Rev so far LOL.When we engage with Scripture, we certainly are time-traveling...in a sense.I heard the other day that the book of Revelation is like a 3D hologram image.
*Correction...maybe 4D...as it works in conjunction with our minds.
**The Bible as a time travel "machine"...
Yeah, we are all, currently, time traveling, in one direction--forward, but maybe it wasn't always so...or maybe it was, but the enemy saw a way that it can be manipulated to allow for backward timing and began pushing for its authorization/legalization,but was told "No"...and you know the rest. Or, maybe this was always a granted law, but it was the enemy who had issue with it for whatever reason...maybe having something to do with being in disharmony with the other "Pulsars", if you will...an unwillingness to cooperate within the range of frequencies, which may be the key to omnidirectional time navigation.
*The Time Wars and the Flickering...
**This may also explain the conflicting age readings in the scientific time scales..."geologic time scales"?
**Maybe when the earth is described as being "without form and void" (some describe it as chaos), it speaks about this time (these times) when the struggle over time itself was raging...in the dark.
My understanding in the past was that the word could be used to mean"nothing". Might be wrong. But, in conjunction with other words and concepts used in Gen regarding the state of the earth at the beginning: "formless", "void", it all sounds very much like the viewpoint of someone, with the knowledge they had, trying to describe how God formed the world out of nothing.
I just don't think you can have it both ways. How does evil exist outside of a created entity? What would its nature be and where would it originate from other than God anyway in that case?
Yes, Scripture can interpret Scripture, precept building upon precept, but not every attempt is necessarily proper. For example, to extrapolate from 2 Pet 3:8 ("a day is as a thousand years"), that Gen 1 is telling us that the world is 6-10,000 years old (rather than 2 Pet 3:8 meaning to make the general statement that God exists outside of time) is simply poor hermeneutics.
I think nothing, besides God, would necessarily predate creation. I may not understand you on this.In the context of Genesis yes, the word "darkness" can not mean "nothing" because in order for it to mean "nothing"; would mean that it had to predate creation and we know that is not true.
Sorry, I can be a bit dull but evil as a necessary inevitable reaction to God's creative action just doesn't follow logically in my mind. Creation as potentially evil due to the fact that its necessarily inferior to God, with an inferiority that can express itself in evil moral choices if and when free will is given to that creation (in the form of men or angels) makes sense to me.You really don't understand this theory do you? The theory answers those questions.
I think nothing, besides God, would necessarily predate creation. I may not understand you on this.
Sorry, I can be a bit dull but evil as a necessary inevitable reaction to God's creative action just doesn't follow logically in my mind. Creation as potentially evil due to the fact that its necessarily inferior to God, with an inferiority that can express itself in evil moral choices if and when free will is given to that creation (in the form of men or angels) makes sense to me.
And still, what form would this evil take that you speak of? What would contain it-and/or control it, or spread it, etc? How does it exist or manifest itself? Is it contained in a mind? With God or satan we have goodness and evil personified.
Man is a sufficient sinner. He does not need a Satan to blame. But as to the origins of evil, I would ask why does that matter? To be intellectually saved? To help others avoid sin? To speak at a one on one level with God? I used to ask those kinds of questions until one day I realized that it was sufficient to read the word and follow the Lord to eternal salvation. It does not need to be difficult, but we make it so. Don't we.
I don't see any criticism in my answer. Maybe you took it that way because you are accustomed to it in various forms. But my offering to the original posters question is just as valid and intellectually sound. The Bible isn't about evil. It is about the saving grace of God through His son, Jesus Christ. Evil exists as the outcome of disobedience to God in every case. Every case. Disobedience by Lucifer. Disobedience to His word. Disobedience to the 10 Commandments. You name it, evil is the disobedience of God.Why does the question of origin of evil matter to those who ask it? Probably because they seek a better understanding of God. God is not an entity that deals only with the emotions. We have an intellect because God is an intelligent entity and He created intelligent life.
Just because you don't feel the need to ask the question, does not justify you're criticizing those who do. If it doesn't interest you; move on to a different thread. It doesn't need to be difficult - does it?
Isnt it just so cool how powerful our God is? Imagine speaking things into existence!Yes, you are correct. How this works out in "real time" is a mystery to us because choices we make are still independent of "programed response". You've still independently picked out what clothing you put on this morning, what college you attended, who you married, whether or not you went to the grocery store today etc.
God does interact in "real time" to accomplish His purposes and He can do that because He's omniscient. How He does it, we're probably never going to figure out.
The ability to have independent volition to make choices in this life is a different issue than the concept of "free will" as it applies to "choosing" God. Our will isn't "free" because it's encumbered by both our own sin as well as the fall. We are corruptible / corrupted creatures living in a corrupted universe.
So, in the realm of belief, we don't "believe" unless God enacts upon us first. Belief / faith requires a supernatural opening of the understanding, changing of the heart, changing of the will, which leads to repentance and believing and walking in faith, etc.
And who becomes believers was preordained before creation ever began. How God chose who would be redeemed - none of us got the foggiest clue. All we know is that was not determined by anything we did or did not do.
People are thrown into Hell not because God wants to roast them. Going to hell was entirely the choice of the poor souls who chose to reject God. God loves you too much to force you to spend eternity with Him. Let me turn this question around. If God created evil, that would then mean that evil can be in the presence of God. So why then is hell necessary? Why is a savior necessary? Why wont God allow us to be with Him in heaven, sin and all? Considering you think He "created" it?So, God wouldn't create evil (as he says) but he'll roast people for not believing in him?
People are thrown into Hell not because God wants to roast them. Going to hell was entirely the choice of the poor souls who chose to reject God. God loves you too much to force you to spend eternity with Him. Let me turn this question around. If God created evil, that would then mean that evil can be in the presence of God. So why then is hell necessary? Why is a savior necessary? Why wont God allow us to be with Him in heaven, sin and all? Considering you think He "created" it?
You didn't answer my question. If God created evil, why is a savior necessary?So, he wouldn’t create evil, but he’ll create a place where people suffer indefinitely? Sounds totally legit.
You didn't answer my question. If God created evil, why is a savior necessary?
Why? What death are we being saved from and why does sin matter?To save us from sin and death.
I don't see any criticism in my answer. Maybe you took it that way because you are accustomed to it in various forms. But my offering to the original posters question is just as valid and intellectually sound. The Bible isn't about evil. It is about the saving grace of God through His son, Jesus Christ. Evil exists as the outcome of disobedience to God in every case. Every case. Disobedience by Lucifer. Disobedience to His word. Disobedience to the 10 Commandments. You name it, evil is the disobedience of God.
But as to the origins of evil, I would ask why does that matter?
I used to ask those kinds of questions until one day I realized that it was sufficient to read the word and follow the Lord to eternal salvation.
It does not need to be difficult, but we make it so. Don't we.
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