The Two Witnesses.

[Marilyn C]

i can see these two witnesses in the very first verse of Genesis .....

But they could not be witnesses of Jesus speaking of His death, and then witness His empty tomb and ascension.

 

[honey badger]

But they could not be witnesses of Jesus speaking of His death, and then witness His empty tomb and ascension.

For from the creation of the world His invisible qualities, both His eternal power and divinity, are clearly seen, being understood by the things made, for them to be without excuse.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Yes all about the Lord, I agree. However I do believe the Head of His Body is quite capable and is doing a wonderful work that we do not see it all. People tend to look to man`s religious system as an indicator of how well the Lord is doing. Nonsense.

The Lord has been building His Body over the centuries and across the world. Who are we to think we can see every person all over the world and what God is doing in their lives. We have been tricked to expect `revival` of man`s religious meetings. Not going to happen. The Lord is doing a wonderful work in people`s lives and I believe Him when he said He would build and mature His church, His Body.

Have you experienced an outpouring of God's Spirit and seen the amazing works of grace that manifest?

 

[garee]

The Scripture says we have the nature of Elijah but it is my view that the church is currently severely disempowered so the Glory of God in works of power is generally not seen.

As He again breathes upon the church - I would not be at all surprised if two humble unknowns step into the breach like David's. After all it is all about Him - not us.

Sorry in advance for the length. Yes, it is about our unseen God who dwells in temples not made with human hands . . .the believers.

Christians as new creatures have the power of the Holy Spirit that worked in Elijah in these earthen bodies of death in respect to the unseen "law of faith". By it as it is written we can believe our God not seen. But that power is not of the prophets , those who declare prophecy the word of God.

Elisa represented that power of faith that works in those who do bring the gospel seed and plant it or water it with the water of the word .The doctrines of God that fall like rain from heaven.

Matthew 11:13-15 King James Version (KJV)For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John. And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come. He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.

That power gives us ears to hear his understanding. Believers who bring it are not part of that quickening work. If Christ does not apply it to our new born again hearts then we have not received his rest .

1 Corinthians 3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.

2 Corinthians 4:7But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.

In that way we neither have the power to condemn or create anew. The tongue of God alone has the power of life and death.

For all the prophets as men who declare the gospel signified by Elijah .The power of new spirit life. And or with the law which is signified by Moses the law giver as to the letter death. Together making the perfect or complete law of God .The just (letter) and justifier (faith) as one law of those who do believe a God not seen.

It I believe can be seen in a parable found in Luke 16 using a series of parables to establish what I would call "No man can serve two teaching masters" . In that parable necromancy, seeking the work of disembodied workers with familiar spirits is compared to the witness of God(law and prophets) using mammon to represent another teaching authority(necromancy) other that the witness of God . Moses to represent the letter of the law death and the prophets the law of faith life.

Luke 16:13 No servant can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

Emphasizing it in verse 16 His witness will not change. both the law and the prophets working as one witness till the last day.

Luke 16:16-17 The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.
And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.

The spirit (necromancy)that apposes the gospel continues to the end of the chapter . Three time it is emphasized we can only serve one teaching master the law and or with the prophets (sola scriptura)

Luke 16:29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. (Gods witness the gospel)

Again showing there were no ears that heard the gospel.(verse 30)
The the Holy Spirt reveled to the faithless no gospel .even if one would rise from the dead they would have no faith to believe . Christians I beleive understand by that faith that works in us. Not by what the eyes sees (the temporal) but what our new eyes of hearts reveal (the eternal rest)

Luke 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

 

[Marilyn C]

For from the creation of the world His invisible qualities, both His eternal power and divinity, are clearly seen, being understood by the things made, for them to be without excuse.

Hi honey,

Yes isn`t that wonderful for all to see. Then we need to remember that God made a whole new nation and promised them that they would teach the nations of Him and rule the world. God will thus raise up His 2 witnesses, Moses and Elijah to do just that.

God told us that Moses and Elijah spoke with the Lord about His departure (death). God called them `2 men.`

Mount transfiguration.

`Then behold, two men talked with Him, who were Moses and Elijah, who appeared in glory and spoke of His decease which He was about to accomplish at Jerusalem.` (Luke 9: 30 & 31)


The Tomb - `behold, 2 men stood by them in shining garments.` (Luke 24: 4)



The Ascension - `while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as He went up,


Behold, 2 men stood by them in white apparel,` (Acts 1: 10)


These two men, Moses and Elijah are thus well qualified to WITNESS of the Lord, His death, resurrection and ascension.

 

[Marilyn C]

Have you experienced an outpouring of God's Spirit and seen the amazing works of grace that manifest?

I surely have Carl. Such wonderful works of God in people`s heart`s and healings also.

 

[Carl Emerson]

So it is more than possible that two 'unknowns' who have had a face to face encounter with Him could be called to this role. Any way time will tell.

 

[Marilyn C]

So it is more than possible that two 'unknowns' who have had a face to face encounter with Him could be called to this role. Any way time will tell.

Not really Carl, as God`s word clearly says who these 2 men are, Moses and Elijah, the 2 witnesses who can witness of the Lord, His death, resurrection and ascension.

 

[Carl Emerson]

You could be right - end-times is not my gift.

Time will tell.

 

[honey badger]

Hi honey,

Yes isn`t that wonderful for all to see. Then we need to remember that God made a whole new nation and promised them that they would teach the nations of Him and rule the world. God will thus raise up His 2 witnesses, Moses and Elijah to do just that.

God told us that Moses and Elijah spoke with the Lord about His departure (death). God called them `2 men.`

Mount transfiguration.

`Then behold, two men talked with Him, who were Moses and Elijah, who appeared in glory and spoke of His decease which He was about to accomplish at Jerusalem.` (Luke 9: 30 & 31)


The Tomb - `behold, 2 men stood by them in shining garments.` (Luke 24: 4)



The Ascension - `while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as He went up,


Behold, 2 men stood by them in white apparel,` (Acts 1: 10)


These two men, Moses and Elijah are thus well qualified to WITNESS of the Lord, His death, resurrection and ascension.

the two witnesses are always summed up in one ... as in both speak to the same truth ..... my favorite picture of them is the two cherubim who hold one sword ....

 

[garee]

The two witnesses as one represent the word of God. The good news the Bible. Moses and Elijah will not be reincarnated . For a short period the gospel will be silenced or killed, a famine for hearing the word of God.

 

[Marilyn C]

The two witnesses as one represent the word of God. The good news the Bible. Moses and Elijah will not be reincarnated . For a short period the gospel will be silenced or killed, a famine for hearing the word of God.

They are not reincarnated. Remember at Mount transfiguration, plus Satan was trying to get Moses` body. (Jude 9)

 

[Thomas White]

the two witnesses are always summed up in one ... as in both speak to the same truth ..... my favorite picture of them is the two cherubim who hold one sword ....

Picture?

 

[garee]

They are not reincarnated. Remember at Mount transfiguration, plus Satan was trying to get Moses` body. (Jude 9)

I would agree .It was a vision or revelation that the Holy Spirit brought to their minds..

Some say they did not die. But its appointed for all to die the physical death. Believers are given a new spirit and on the last day when all of the sons of God as believers will receive the promise of a new incorruptible body. Moses like any of the sons of God will not have the same corrupted flesh and blood they dwelt in. It will not male or female Jew nor gentile as born of mankind.

I think the body of Moses that was is dispute was when the Israelites entered the promised land which looked ahead to the new heavens and earth. Then the accuser of the brethren accused God .

A different purpose using Moses for hiding the body. We are not what we will be.

1 John 3:1_3 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

 

[honey badger]

Picture?

words that paint a picture in your mind ...

 

[garee]

words that paint a picture in your mind ...

Exactly the purpose of parables, revealing the unseen understanding. They teach us how to walk by faith the unseen eternal understanding. Hid from natural mankind.

 

[honey badger]

Exactly the purpose of parables, revealing the unseen understanding. They teach us how to walk by faith the unseen eternal understanding. Hid from natural mankind.

the natural/carnal mind limits the word/son of God because it measures the immeasurable ...

in picture it nails it down ...

 

[garee]

the natural/carnal mind limits the word/son of God because it measures the immeasurable ...

in picture it nails it down ...

I think that is what is meant in the term golden red or measure, the signified golden rule of faith. And not the measure of man the literal used in the description of the bride of Christ. (born again souls not inches or meters)

Revelation21:14 YLT and the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. And he who is speaking with me had a golden reed, that he may measure the city, and its gates, and its wall; and the city lieth square, and the length of it is as great as the breadth; and he did measure the city with the reed -- furlongs twelve thousand; the length, and the breadth, and the height, of it are equal; and he measured its wall, an hundred forty-four cubits, the measure of a man, that is, of the messenger
.

 

[garee]

So it is more than possible that two 'unknowns' who have had a face to face encounter with Him could be called to this role. Any way time will tell.

Yes face to face or faith the unseen eternal to faith the unseen . Seeing God does not a a literal face we cans see his face in the knowledge he gives us through his two witness .The word of God in all entirety. The law and the prophets typified by Moses and Elijah. Not literal flesh and blood Moses and Elijah as if we did walk by sight.

The gospel (sola scriptura) will be silenced or killed for a short period. This is when God sends a famine for hearing the word and empowering some to believe.

2 Corinthians 4:6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

 

[Victor in Christ]

I think that is what is meant in the term golden red or measure, the signified golden rule of faith. And not the measure of man the literal used in the description of the bride of Christ. (born again souls not inches or meters)

Revelation21:14 YLT and the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. And he who is speaking with me had a golden reed, that he may measure the city, and its gates, and its wall; and the city lieth square, and the length of it is as great as the breadth; and he did measure the city with the reed -- furlongs twelve thousand; the length, and the breadth, and the height, of it are equal; and he measured its wall, an hundred forty-four cubits, the measure of a man, that is, of the messenger
.

the highlighted part is important. Ezekiel's Temple is the measure of a man also. Our body is the Temple of the living God through the 3rd person of the Trinity. 1 Corinthians 6:19-20

It can be difficult to distinquish between the literal/practical and the spiritual. Maybe all 3, not sure.