The truth revealed by God CANNOT change!

tz620q

Regular Member
Supporter
Apr 19, 2007
2,658
1,038
Carmel, IN
✟567,157.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
I don't believe that I've ever heard a Protestant say that. Of course, we both know that it was meant as a sarcastic joke.

On the other hand, "Development of Doctrine" is an official policy of the Roman Catholic Church and has been referred to many times in posts by Catholic members here when justifying a change of doctrine by their church.
Yeah, that motto was my attempt at a sarcastic joke. The problem with sarcastic jokes on the internet is that they are almost always taken at face value and not as a joke. So what I said is not even a good generalization and does not promote any unity or Christian love. It is merely a divisive attempt at humor. Sorry for stooping to that level.
 
Upvote 0

Albion

Facilitator
Dec 8, 2004
111,138
33,258
✟583,842.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
Yeah, that motto was my attempt at a sarcastic joke.

...and I don't mind that too much. But that's what it was, as contrasted with the Development of Doctrine idea which is serious.

So what I said is not even a good generalization and does not promote any unity or Christian love. It is merely a divisive attempt at humor. Sorry for stooping to that level.
 
Upvote 0

Major1

Well-Known Member
Sep 17, 2016
10,551
2,837
Deland, Florida
✟203,785.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
I don't believe that I've ever heard a Protestant say that. Of course, we both know that it was meant as a sarcastic joke.

On the other hand, "Development of Doctrine" is an official policy of the Roman Catholic Church and has been referred to many times in posts by Catholic members here when justifying a change of doctrine by their church.

I KNOW that I have never heard that said!
 
Upvote 0

Athanasius377

Out of the deep I called unto thee O Lord
Supporter
Apr 22, 2017
1,370
1,515
Cincinnati
✟702,387.00
Country
United States
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
false.
Of course you can feel free to prove me wrong.
I’m not sure I would say official policy but would it be better to say Rome increases her understanding of doctrine?
 
Upvote 0

Athanasius377

Out of the deep I called unto thee O Lord
Supporter
Apr 22, 2017
1,370
1,515
Cincinnati
✟702,387.00
Country
United States
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
thank you for confirming his claim was false.
I wasn’t trying to throw shade at anyone. I was was asking a question. Is that how Rome understands her belief in things like the IC? I know we disagree but I do try to accurately represent RC belief. I’m not try to start another debate. We’ve been over this ground before.
 
Upvote 0

Thomas White

Well-Known Member
Feb 9, 2020
1,193
705
37
Stockbridge
✟78,796.00
Country
United States
Faith
Methodist
Marital Status
Married
The truth revealed by God CANNOT change!

Jn 14:16 I am the way, the truth, and the life:

Heb 13:8 - Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

The truth is not something but somebody! Jesus Christ!

It cannot change. Our understanding of it can change. God is infinite as is His truth.
 
Upvote 0

garee

Newbie
Feb 18, 2013
552
112
✟22,818.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
No it cant. Jude 1:3 the deposit of faith was deliverd to the church (the apostles) fullness of the faith revealed by God thru Christ!

We might understand it better but there is no new doctrine!

it was delivered by those who are sent out two by two with the gospel .How beautiful are their feet shod with the gospel of Christ.

Not in respect to the sent ones (apostle) Some have added new meaning to the word "sent one" as venerable ones.

I would think we venerate or hallow our unseen Holy Father who sends apostles with his living Word in a hope Christ will apply it to there hearts . Those who plant the seed and water it with the doctrines of God are considered nothing .Christ must provide the power or increase.


1 Corinthians 3:5-7 King James Version (KJV) Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man? I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase

The faith is the faith of Christ's labor of love . Not the faith of or coming from the church, corrupted mankind. But rather the faith that works in the church, the daily will of the unseen Holy Father..

Philipians2:13;14 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. Do all things without murmurings and disputings:
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

bbbbbbb

Well-Known Member
Jun 9, 2015
27,803
13,115
72
✟362,269.00
Faith
Non-Denom
It cannot change. Our understanding of it can change. God is infinite as is His truth.

Our understanding and application of God's truth does change. Hence we have two covenants which God made - the old covenant with Israel and the new covenant with the church. Israel is not obligated to keep the new covenant nor is the church obligated to keep all 613 commandments of the old covenant.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

SabbathBlessings

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jun 12, 2020
10,019
4,232
USA
✟470,430.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Our understanding and application of God's truth does change. Hence we have two covenants which God made - the old covenant with Israel and the new covenant with the church. Israel is not obligated to keep the new covenant nor is the church obligated to keep all 613 commandments of the old covenant.

Just like the old covenant God made the second covenant with Israel too

Hebrew 8

A New Covenant
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second. 8 Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah

Just like the law of the first covenant was meant for everyone, so is the second covenant because we are grafted into Israel Romans 11 19-24

Hebrews 10
16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them,”

What laws? The only law of God, His 10 commandments under the new covenant should be written in both our heart (love) and actions (mind)

Jesus never came to destroy the laws of God:

Mathew 5:
17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Jesus gave us an example of the spirit of the law and He came to magnify the law in our hearts
Murder begins in the heart Mathew 5:17-26 and so forth Mathew 5:27-30

God Bless
 
Upvote 0

garee

Newbie
Feb 18, 2013
552
112
✟22,818.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Our understanding and application of God's truth does change. Hence we have two covenants which God made - the old covenant with Israel and the new covenant with the church. Israel is not obligated to keep the new covenant nor is the church obligated to keep all 613 commandments of the old covenant.

God has not made covenants of temporal flesh. His covenant is spiritual eternal, not seen . the flesh profits for nothing . (John6) many disciples that were hoping in the flesh walked away in unbelief.(no faith)

2 Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

I would offer as a reminder the tool above for what I would call rightly dividing between the things seen, the temporal, and the unseen eternal .
It helps myself to focus on faith that works in those who believe needed to mix with the things seen and heard . Then I would think we could rest. (Hebrews 4)

Hebrews 4:1-2 King James Version (KJV) Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit "them", not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
 
Upvote 0

bbbbbbb

Well-Known Member
Jun 9, 2015
27,803
13,115
72
✟362,269.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Just like the old covenant God made the second covenant with Israel too

Hebrew 8

A New Covenant
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second. 8 Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah

Just like the law of the first covenant was meant for everyone, so is the second covenant because we are grafted into Israel Romans 11 19-24

Hebrews 10
16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them,”

What laws? The only law of God, His 10 commandments under the new covenant should be written in both our heart (love) and actions (mind)

Jesus never came to destroy the laws of God:

Mathew 5:
17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Jesus gave us an example of the spirit of the law and He came to magnify the law in our hearts
Murder begins in the heart Mathew 5:17-26 and so forth Mathew 5:27-30

God Bless

Do you believe in replacement theology?
 
Upvote 0

garee

Newbie
Feb 18, 2013
552
112
✟22,818.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Do you believe in replacement theology?

I would offer. No such thing as replacement theology. Our heavenly father promised in the Old testament and renamed the bride as born again members that make her up from all the nations her new name "Christian" meaning; "residents of the heavenly city of Christ named after her founder and husband Christ.

No longer Israel the former temporal name. A Jew is not one outwardly according to the flesh but inward according to the born again Spirit of Christ. In that way any man that has not the eternal Spirit of Christ does not belong a a member of His bride the church. Also remember as sons of God which we are, we do not known what we will be when we receive the new bodies .As new creatures we are lovingly commanded to know no man or woman after the temporal what the eyes see .It would seem our new incorruptible bodies will be nether Jew nor gentile, male nor female.

Romans 8:9-11 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
 
Upvote 0

bbbbbbb

Well-Known Member
Jun 9, 2015
27,803
13,115
72
✟362,269.00
Faith
Non-Denom
I would offer. No such thing as replacement theology. Our heavenly father promised in the Old testament and renamed the bride as born again members that make her up from all the nations her new name "Christian" meaning; "residents of the heavenly city of Christ named after her founder and husband Christ.

No longer Israel the former temporal name. A Jew is not one outwardly according to the flesh but inward according to the born again Spirit of Christ. In that way any man that has not the eternal Spirit of Christ does not belong a a member of His bride the church. Also remember as sons of God which we are, we do not known what we will be when we receive the new bodies .As new creatures we are lovingly commanded to know no man or woman after the temporal what the eyes see .It would seem our new incorruptible bodies will be nether Jew nor gentile, male nor female.

Romans 8:9-11 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

I agree!
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Daniel Marsh

Well-Known Member
Jun 28, 2015
9,748
2,615
Livingston County, MI, US
✟199,349.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
No it cant. Jude 1:3 the deposit of faith was deliverd to the church (the apostles) fullness of the faith revealed by God thru Christ!

We might understand it better but there is no new doctrine!

Revelation in the Bible is progressive as is the growing knowledge of the Church.
 
Upvote 0

Daniel Marsh

Well-Known Member
Jun 28, 2015
9,748
2,615
Livingston County, MI, US
✟199,349.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Two things.
The truth was delivered to the apostles yes, not to any church organisation
2nd the teachings of the RCC are new doctrines coming after the Bible was written.

It was educated Catholics and Church Fathers who made copies of the Bible Manuscripts.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Daniel Marsh

Well-Known Member
Jun 28, 2015
9,748
2,615
Livingston County, MI, US
✟199,349.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Correct.

John 17:17 says........
"Sanctify them by the truth; your word is truth."

It is the nature of God that does not change. How he chooses to relate to mankind that changes.
 
Upvote 0