The Thing Most Sabbath Keepers Do not Talk About.

[Mercy Shown]

This is not what this verse says, you are making it sound like God's Spirit is against God's Law. There is no "instead" in these verses as if its either or. Paul is contrasting what it means to be spiritually minded verses carnally minded. And his conclusion is the opposite of instead of according to God's laws.


Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who[a] do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.

What is the law of sin and death? Rom6:23 the wages of sin is death, so breaking God's law which is sin deserves death

3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,

The flesh is what is weak, not the law. Paul said in the previous chapter the law is holy, just and good Rom7:12

Paul says

Rom7: 22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man. 23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members

Paul is contrasting the war of sin with the flesh (that breaks God's law) with serving the law of God (Rom7:7) according to the inward man Heb8:10 2Cor3:3

Rom7:25 So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin.

Paul in Chapter 8 talks about victory over the law of sin and it's not breaking God's laws, it's the opposite

Rom8: 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit

Serving the Spirit fulfills the righteous requirement of the law of God from the inside out (the inward man i.e. the New Covenant God's law in our hearts and minds) keeping them based on what God does in us if are cooperating. Those who are walking in the Spirit are not breaking God's laws, they are keeping them through the Spirit.

John 14:15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another [e]Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.


5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be [b]carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life (Mat 19:17-19) and peace (Isa48:18 Psa119:165).

This is what Paul says plainly as the lost, so if we are saying we can walk in His Spirit instead of obeying God's laws Paul flat out says thats serving the law of sin and being carnally minded which makes one an enemy to God.

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.


No one can keep the law without the Spirit, but the Spirit is leading us to keep God's laws, not break them. That's the spirit we don't want Isa8:20

The Holy Spirit is the One who wrote the Ten Commandments. Exo 31:18 Luke 11:20 Mat 12:28 The Holy Spirit is the One who convicts us of sin when we break them. 1John3:4 John16:8 if we hear His voice Heb3:7-19 The Holy Spirit is the One who helps us keep these commandments if we love Jesus and cooperate with Him. John14:15-18 The Holy Spirit only resides with those who obey Acts 5:32. No one is sealed by the Holy Spirit if being in rebellion to the law of God.

Isa 8:16 Bind up the testimony, Seal the law among my disciples.

God placed the Law that was written on tablets of stone to being written in the heart 2Cor3:3 its the same Law, but placed in a new location, the heart and this NC is established on the better promises of what God does in us, (fulfilling the righteous requirement of the law or keeping them) if we are not rebelling Rom8:7-8 but cooperating John14:15-18


Worshipping another god is not going to lead anyone to a greater deeper righteousness than obeying what God asked us to do if we love Him? Or breaking the least of these commandments doing the opposite of what Jesus said Mat5:19-30 is going to lead us to Christ when we are told those who say they know Him and do not keep His commandments is a liar and there is no truth in them 1John2:4 and Jesus will say at His Second Coming, I do not know you, depart from Me, ye who practices lawlessness,Mat7:23 this is not going to lead anyone to Christ. This has never worked out for anyone in all of Scriptures, it only separates us Isa59:2 Rev22:15 Mat7:21-23 obedience through love and faith reconciles 1John2:3 Rev14:12 Rev 22:14 but we are free to test any theory we want, even if our Heavenly Father warns against it.

Amen, we should pray for everything as I hope you will as well to these plain Scriptures.

I am sorry that you missed the entirity of what was presented to focus on thiniest part of what was said.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I am sorry that you missed the entirity of what was presented to focus on thiniest part of what was said.

I personally do believe teaching the Spirit leading one away from God's law is a thin part. I do not believe Paul thought so either if reading the whole passage in its proper context. I think it's actually harmful to the spiritual life in Christ, who says If you love Me, keep My commandments. John 14:15, the Spirit is Who helps us obey these very commandments. John 15:18 so its not if we have one the other goes, the Spirit and God's Laws are in harmony, not against.

we now walk according to the Spirit instead of according to the Law (Romans 8:1–4).

 

[Hentenza]

I personally do believe the Spirit leading one away from God's law is a thin part. I do not believe Paul thought so either if reading the whole passage in its proper context. I think its actually harmful to the spiritual life in Christ, who says If you love Me, keep My commandments. John 14:15, the Spirit is what helps us obey these very commandments.

Because if you believed what Paul actually said, in actual context not in your biased interpretation, you could not support your beliefs and your church teachings.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Because if you believed what Paul actually said, in actual context not in your biased interpretation, you could not support your beliefs and your church teachings.

When we are using Paul to teach against what Jesus said Mat4:4 I would prayerfully consider 2Peter3:16

At the end, we all have to stand before Jesus, so He will be the One to sort everything out.

I know He promised the Sabbath would continue in the New Heaven and New Earth and promised He would not alter the words of His covenant Psa89:34,

Isa 56:1 Thus says the Lord:

6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant—

7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain,
And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices
Will be accepted on My altar;
For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations.”

What did Jesus say His people would be doing in His house of prayer?

Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant

Isa 66L22 “For as the new heavens and the new earth
Which I will make shall remain before Me,” says the Lord,
“So shall your descendants and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass
That from one New Moon to another,
And from one Sabbath to another,
All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says the Lord.

Its a lot of thus saith the Lords to try to erase God's Sabbath, Jesus never taught to do this, He taught the opposite to live by every Word that proceeds out of the mouth of God quoting OT. Mat4:4 Paul came along after Jesus ratified His covenant, It Is Finished, nothing could be changed or altered without Jesus having to die all over again, but His Sacrifice was once and for all Heb10:10

Its why trying to change what Jesus clearly said He would not by taking Pauk out of context comes with a serious warning.

The Lord does not change and has been consistent with His holy day Isa58:13 from the beginning to the end. Exo20:11 Isa66:23 Guess it will get sorted out soon enough.

 

[Hentenza]

When we are using Paul to teach against what Jesus said Mat4:4

When you use this to start you have already started against scripture.

“But He answered and said, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes out of the mouth of God.’ ””
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭4‬:‭4‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Matthew 4:4 But He answered and said, “It is written: ‘MAN SHALL NOT LIVE ON BREAD ALONE, BUT ON EVERY WORD THAT COMES OUT OF THE MOUTH OF GOD.’ ” | New American Standard Bible - NASB (NASB2020) | Download The Bible App Now

But He answered and said, “It is written: ‘MAN SHALL NOT LIVE ON BREAD ALONE, BUT ON EVERY WORD THAT COMES OUT OF THE MOUTH OF GOD.’ ”

bible.com

Paul never teaches against Christ but he teaches forcibly against your interpretation. This comparison is an attempt to deflect and accuse others of teaching against God. Is a typical strategy used by legalists.

And you are yet to post a post crucifixion verse that requires the Christian to keep the 4th commandment.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

When you use this to start you have already started against scripture.

“But He answered and said, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes out of the mouth of God.’ ””
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭4‬:‭4‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Matthew 4:4 But He answered and said, “It is written: ‘MAN SHALL NOT LIVE ON BREAD ALONE, BUT ON EVERY WORD THAT COMES OUT OF THE MOUTH OF GOD.’ ” | New American Standard Bible - NASB (NASB2020) | Download The Bible App Now

But He answered and said, “It is written: ‘MAN SHALL NOT LIVE ON BREAD ALONE, BUT ON EVERY WORD THAT COMES OUT OF THE MOUTH OF GOD.’ ”

bible.com

Only if we do not believe what Jesus tells us to live by. I do not believe we can believe in Jesus but not what He taught or how He lived for our example. But I guess we will all find out soon enough.

 

[Hentenza]

Only if we do not believe what Jesus tells us to live by. I do not believe we can believe in Jesus but not what He taught or how He lived for our example. But I guess we will all find out soon enough.

I firmly believe in what Jesus teaches but I firmly reject your interpretation. And you have still not posted a post crucifixion verse that requires the Christian to keep the 4th commandment.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I firmly believe in what Jesus teaches but I firmly reject your interpretation. And you have still not posted a post crucifixion verse that requires the Christian to keep the 4th commandment.

I do not need to interpret Jesus, just believe what He says plainly. He speaks plainly. He even spelled out literally the Sabbath commandment, written by His own finger, so we will have no excuses when we stand before Him. That's the issue is trying to insert something it doesn't say.

Paul on the other hand is hard to understand why we have this salvation warning 2Peter3:16

 

[Hentenza]

I do not need to interpret Jesus, just believe what He says. He speaks plainly. That's the issue is trying to insert something it doesn't say.

Then tell me when after resurrection did Jesus say to the apostles and believers to keep the 4th commandment. If it is that important then I’m sure He would have been all over it and offered plenty of teaching about it.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Then tell me when after resurrection did Jesus say to the apostles and believers to keep the 4th commandment. If it is that important then I’m sure He would have been all over it and offered plenty of teaching about it.

You're looking at it from the wrong angle. Jesus who is God made flesh, where did He ever teach not to keep the Sabbath, just once?

He didn't have to tell His apostles because they were keeping every Sabbath before and after His death according to the commandment Luke23:56 Acts 13:42 Acts 13:44 Acts 15:21 Acts 18:4.

Jesus linked keeping the Sabbath to the prophecy of His Second Coming. Never did He say it ended at the Cross, He clearly stated His faithful would be keeping it decades after as we see with all His apostles.


Mat 24:20 And pray that your flight may not be in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the [c]elect’s sake those days will be shortened.

23 “Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.

26 “Therefore if they say to you, ‘Look, He is in the desert!’ do not go out; or ‘Look, He is in the inner rooms!’ do not believe it. 27 For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. 28 For wherever the carcass is, there the eagles will be gathered together.
29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His [d]elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.


And the Sabbath continues on after He makes a new heaven and new earth for worship, thus saith the Lord.

Isa 66L22 “For as the new heavens and the new earth
Which I will make shall remain before Me,” says the Lord,
“So shall your descendants and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass
That from one New Moon to another,
And from one Sabbath to another,
All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says the Lord.

Do you really think God is going to make a separate part of heaven for all those who opposed God's Sabbath and holy day for worship. I think one is kidding themselves. God will never force one to obey Him or keep His commandments. We have to have love in our heart for Jesus to follow His example and follow what He taught and lived. He certainly never taught not to keep the Sabbath, He said plainly we can do evil on the Sabbath but said to do good Luke6:9 I Profaning the Sabbath He relates as doing evil Neh13:17 Isa 56:2 something in the past He punished as it showed a lack of faith. I do not believe it will be a different result. We are told it won't be. Eze20:13 Heb4:11

 

[Hentenza]

You're looking at it from the wrong angle. Jesus who is God made flesh, where did He ever teach not to keep the Sabbath, just once?

When He fulfilled the law including the Ten Commandments. In the NT Jesus mentions the particular commandments that were summarized in His two love commandments. Never did He mentioned the 4th commandment. This is because Jesus ushered in the new covenant which does not include the law.

He didn't have to tell His apostles because they were keeping every Sabbath before and after His death according to the commandment Luke23:56 Acts 13:42 Acts 13:44 Acts 15:21 Acts 18:4.

Yep. They went to the temple to win Jews to Jesus. Even Paul explains why he became one with the law to win those of the law. The numbers added to Christianity consisted of both Jews and gentiles.

Jesus linked keeping the Sabbath to the prophecy of His Second Coming. Never did He say it ended at the Cross, He clearly stated His faithful would be keeping it decades after as we see with all His apostles.


Mat 24:20 And pray that your flight may not be in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the [c]elect’s sake those days will be shortened.

23 “Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.

26 “Therefore if they say to you, ‘Look, He is in the desert!’ do not go out; or ‘Look, He is in the inner rooms!’ do not believe it. 27 For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. 28 For wherever the carcass is, there the eagles will be gathered together.
29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His [d]elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

And you claim to quote in context? How come you didn’t quote verse 16? Who resides in Judea? Well the Jews of course. And what do the Jews keep? The sabbath of course. Context is indeed important.

“then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains. Whoever is on the housetop must not go down to get things out of his house. And whoever is in the field must not turn back to get his cloak. But woe to those women who are pregnant, and to those who are nursing babies in those days!”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭24‬:‭16‬-‭19‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Matthew 24:16-18 then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains. Whoever is on the housetop must not go down to get things out of his house. And whoever is in the field must not turn back to get his cloak. | New American Standard Bible - NASB

then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains. Whoever is on the housetop must not go down to get things out of his house. And whoever is in the field must not turn back to get his cloak.

bible.com

And the Sabbath continues on after He makes a new heaven and new earth for worship, thus saith the Lord.

Isa 66L22 “For as the new heavens and the new earth
Which I will make shall remain before Me,” says the Lord,
“So shall your descendants and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass
That from one New Moon to another,
And from one Sabbath to another,
All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says the Lord.

And who is the audience of Isaiah? The Jews of course. Why wouldn't Isaiah use Jewish imagery.

Do you really think God is going to make a separate part of heaven for all those who opposed God's Sabbath and holy day for worship. I think one is kidding themselves. God will never force one to obey Him or keep His commandments. We have to have love in our heart for Jesus to follow His example and follow what He taught and lived. He certainly never taught not to keep the Sabbath, He said plainly we can do evil on the Sabbath but said to do good Luke6:9 I Profaning the Sabbath He relates as doing evil Neh13:17 Isa 56:2 something in the past He punished as it showed a lack of faith. I do not believe it will be a different result. We are told it won't be. Eze20:13 Heb4:11

You proof is just one verse away. Provide a post crucifixion verse that requires the Christian to keep the Jewish sabbath.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

When He fulfilled the law including the Ten Commandments. In the NT Jesus mentions the particular commandments that were summarized in His two love commandments. Never did He mentioned the 4th commandment.

It included all of them, not just the ones we agree with, because we are not God. Jesus didn't repeat to only worship Him when He said the greatest commandment. Does that mean that commandment is deleted too? I am not familiar with the verse that says if each commandment is not repeated every time, it gets automatically deleted. In Scripture when it quotes one of the greatest commandment it means both, when quoting one of the Ten Commandments it means them all James2:11 The summary does not delete the details either.

This is because Jesus ushered in the new covenant which does not include the law.

Jesus fulfilled the law by magnifying it as prophesized Isa 42:21 which means making greater not smaller. Why He goes on saying

Mat 5: 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Least in heaven means not there according to the next verse. Jesus then quoted from the Ten Commandments to say which commandments we are not to break the least of or teach others I would consider taking this warning more serious, but we have free will. The commandment that identifies who the God is Exo20:11 of the other 9 commandments that God blessed and made holy and said to Remember I do not believe is a least commandment, but even if we think it is, Jesus said clearly not to break or teach others to break, with some serious consequences.

Yep. They went to the temple to win Jews to Jesus. Even Paul explains why he became one with the law to win those of the law. The numbers added to Christianity consisted of both Jews and gentiles.

It doesn't say that's why they went to the temple but instead it clearly says to hear the word of God Acts 13:44 that the gentiles begged more Sabbath preaching not the next day, but the next Sabbath Acts 13:42 because the Sabbath never changed and never will for the people of God Heb4:9NIV why both Jews and Gentiles and the entire town came together to hear God's Word on the Sabbath. Just as Jesus said it would as His house is a house of prayer for all nations Isa 56:7 for those who keep the Sabbath and love His name and want to join themselves to Him and serve Him and hold on to His covenant. Isa56:6-7. The sign He is our Santifier Eze20:12 and He is our God Eze20:20 Wow and people fight against this. I'll never understand

And you claim to quote in context? How come you didn’t quote verse 16? Who resides in Judea? Well the Jews of course. And what do the Jews keep? The sabbath of course. Context is indeed important.

“then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains. Whoever is on the housetop must not go down to get things out of his house. And whoever is in the field must not turn back to get his cloak. But woe to those women who are pregnant, and to those who are nursing babies in those days!”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭24‬:‭16‬-‭19‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Matthew 24:16-18 then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains. Whoever is on the housetop must not go down to get things out of his house. And whoever is in the field must not turn back to get his cloak. | New American Standard Bible - NASB

then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains. Whoever is on the housetop must not go down to get things out of his house. And whoever is in the field must not turn back to get his cloak.

bible.com

This is a prediction that was fufilled in 70AD 40 years after the Cross, which is not an example of Jesus saying His Sabbath ended at His Cross, if anyone would know it would be Jesus. The Sabbath verse is sandwiched between the destruction of Jerusalem and the prediction of His Second Coming, I do not think Jesus does anything random especially if we understand why the previous temples were destroyed by God.

And who is the audience of Isaiah? The Jews of course. Why wouldn't Isaiah use Jewish imagery.

This is a prediction of the New Heaven and New Earth something that God Himself revealed. You just don't seem to understand prophecy and don't seem that interested in what it teaches so I am going to let you be on your way and we will see how it all works out.

I am not going to respond further because there is no point. God will settle this when He returns. And it will be decided at that point which side of the battle we are on Rev22:11

Take care.

 

[Hentenza]

Jesus He fulfilled the law by magnifying it Isa 42:21 which means making greater not smaller.

No. Jesus fulfilled all of the law by completing it.

“And He said to him, “ ‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ This is the great and foremost commandment. The second is like it, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ Upon these two commandments hang the whole Law and the Prophets.””
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭22‬:‭37‬-‭40‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Matthew 22:37-40 And He said to him, “ ‘YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.’ This is the great and foremost commandment. The second is like it, ‘YOU SH | New American Standard Bible -

And He said to him, “ ‘YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.’ This is the great and foremost commandment. The second is like it, ‘YOU SH

bible.com

The WHOLE law hangs in these two commandments. He didn’t have to expand it because He streamlined it and made it much better.

Why He goes on saying

Mat 5: 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Least in heaven means not there according to the next verse. And then quoted from the Ten Commandments to say which commandments we are not to break the least of or teach others I would consider taking this warning more serious, but we have free will. The commandment that identifies who the God is of the other 9 commandments that God blessed and made holy and said to Remember I do not believe is a least commandment, but even if we think it is, Jesus said clearly not to break or teach others to break with some serious consequences.

Move to chapter 22. Jesus does not contradict Himself.

It doesn't say that's why they went to the temple but instead it clearly says to hear the word of God, both Jews and Gentiles the entire town. Just as Jesus said His house is a house for all nations for those who keep the Sabbath and hold on to His covenant.

This is 40 years after the Cross, which is not an example of Jesus saying His Sabbath ended after the Cross, The Sabbath verse is sandwiched between the destruction of Jerusalem and His Second Coming, I do not think Jesus does anything random.

This is not 40 years after the cross. The gospel of Matthew was written prior to the destruction of the temple. The estimated date of writing is between 55 to 65 ad. The Jews still inhabited Judea.

This is a prediction of the New Heaven and New Earth, You just don't seem to understand prophecy and don't seem that interested in what it teaches so I am going to let you be on your way and we will see how it all works out.

I understand prophesy just fine but you are trying to use prophesy to justify your belief. The book of Isaiah was written with the Jews as the audience even if this part of the book contains future prophesy. Since Isaiah was written to the Jews then the imagery and examples would be something that the Jews would understand. The book of Isaiah, written between 739 and 685 BCE, was written to prophesy to the kingdom of Judea. The book was primarily, probably exclusively, read by the Jews and was not read by others until Christ. Again, context is important.

 

[Mercy Shown]

I personally do believe teaching the Spirit leading one away from God's law is a thin part. I do not believe Paul thought so either if reading the whole passage in its proper context. I think it's actually harmful to the spiritual life in Christ, who says If you love Me, keep My commandments. John 14:15, the Spirit is Who helps us obey these very commandments. John 15:18 so its not if we have one the other goes, the Spirit and God's Laws are in harmony, not against.

I think there may have been a misunderstanding of what the post was actually saying. If you read it as written, you’ll see that the point wasn’t to dismiss the Ten Commandments, but to show that the Spirit leads us beyond them—into something deeper and more complete.

Scripture teaches that those who depend on the Law for righteousness are under a curse, but those who live by the Spirit through faith will live forever. Many sincere Sabbath keepers focus so much on the written code—especially the fourth commandment—that they sometimes miss the greater gift of righteousness offered to us through the blood of Jesus Christ.

The Bible reminds us that “there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.” True righteousness and spiritual growth don’t come from keeping the Law; they come from knowing Christ and being transformed by His Spirit.

So the real question isn’t whether we can fulfill the Law ourselves, but whether Christ has fulfilled it in us. And when we speak of being ambassadors for Him, it’s not about promoting the Ten Commandments—it’s about representing the message of reconciliation that God has offered to the world through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I think there may have been a misunderstanding of what the post was actually saying. If you read it as written, you’ll see that the point wasn’t to dismiss the Ten Commandments, but to show that the Spirit leads us beyond them—into something deeper and more complete.

Do you mean lead one to something deeper that they would no longer be kept the way God said to? Or the way Jesus said, dealing with the heart issue that would automatically fix the actions so the commandments of God would automatically be kept just the way God commanded.

Scripture teaches that those who depend on the Law for righteousness are under a curse,

Can you please post the verse you are indicating so we can examine.

We are made righteous through faith. Does faith void the law and the voice of God? Not according to Scripture. The faith part is what saves, the action part proves our faith is genuine, instead of being just hearers James1:22

Heb 11:8 By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going.

Gen 26:5 5 because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.”

but those who live by the Spirit through faith will live forever. Many sincere Sabbath keepers focus so much on the written code—especially the fourth commandment—that they sometimes miss the greater gift of righteousness offered to us through the blood of Jesus Christ.

Perhaps, but teaching we do not need to keep the Sabbath commandment is in rebellion to what God commanded. Exo20:8-11 Exo20:6 John14:15 Mat5:19

The Sabbath is about both spiritual rest in Christ and physical rest from work on the seventh day Exo20:10 Heb4:4,10 Exo20:11. Heb4:4,9,10 You need both to be keeping God's Sabbath.

The Bible reminds us that “there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.” True righteousness and spiritual growth don’t come from keeping the Law; they come from knowing Christ and being transformed by His Spirit.

Yes and I went through this in detail what Paul contrasted as walking in the Spirit compared to those who are walking in the flesh Rom8:4,7-8

So the real question isn’t whether we can fulfill the Law ourselves, but whether Christ has fulfilled it in us.

Yes I discussed here The Thing Most Sabbath Keepers Do not Talk About. If Christ is fulfilling the law is us, we would be keeping it just as He did as he is our example to follow John15:10 1John2:6

And when we speak of being ambassadors for Him, it’s not about promoting the Ten Commandments—it’s about representing the message of reconciliation that God has offered to the world through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Sadly, this shows me you do not understand the role of the Ten Commandments. It reveals our sin Rom3:20 Rom7:7 and shows us our condition and our need for Jesus. We get rid of the law, all it does is covers our sins and we think we are in Christ, when we are in darkness Pro28:13 John3:19-21 I guess that's why Jesus commissioned us to teach the commandments of God quoting right from the Ten Mat5:19-30, we are to repent of sin and turn from it, meaning go the other direction and start keeping the commandments of God because breaking them is sin. 1John3:4 James2:11 Mat5:19-30 Rom7:7

The wisest man in the Bible put it this way

Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter:

Fear God and keep His commandments,
For this is man’s all.
14 For God will bring every work into judgment,
Including every secret thing,
Whether good or evil.

And one of the last verses in the Bible before the Second Coming of Jesus Christ

Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

 

[Bob S]

The Ten Commandments are the Law of Love.

I have no idea how you have arrived at the conclusion that the Ten Commandments were the Law of Love. There is not one word in any of them about loving. The only real conclusion anyone can derive is that they were about duty. Remember, Thou shalt not. The law of Love was expressed first in Deuteronomy and Leviticus. Jesus then gave us a new Law of Love in Jn15. We are to love others as He loves us. No greater love than to give our lives for our fellow man. Jesus did it on the Cross.

How to love God, how to love man. God IS love so it would be impossible for Him to personally write a law by His own finger that wouldn't be about love. His own Testimony which is Love.

Oh! What makes you think that?

The law is not the issue, the heart is, when its not right with God sadly, we rebel against His Law Rom8:7-8

I pray you will see this before its too late. If I am not mistaken, its what your family believes.

You are mistaken. We all know we are not subject to the ritual laws of the Old Covenant.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I have no idea how you have arrived at the conclusion that the Ten Commandments were the Law of Love. There is not one word in any of them about loving. The only real conclusion anyone can derive is that they were about duty. Remember, Thou shalt not. The law of Love was expressed first in Deuteronomy and Leviticus. Jesus then gave us a new Law of Love in Jn15. We are to love others as He loves us. No greater love than to give our lives for our fellow man. Jesus did it on the Cross.

Oh! What makes you think that?

You are mistaken. We all know we are not subject to the ritual laws of the Old Covenant.

I guess we will find out soon enough if the God of Love could personally write and unloving law that is His Testimony that He keeps in the Most Holy of His Temple, who He tells us who He shows mercy to Exo20:6 even when the death penalty is deserved.

To me, it shows a misunderstanding of the character of God which His law is a reflection of. Psa19:7 Rom7:12

 

[Mercy Shown]

Do you mean lead one to something deeper that they would no longer be kept the way God said to? Or the way Jesus said, dealing with the heart issue that would automatically fix the actions so the commandments of God would automatically be kept just the way God commanded.

Into being a child of the Almighty God. The Holy God. Not just saved but made joint heirs with Jesus Christ. Counted a perfect forever by Christs one great sacrifice. Are you better than the sunday keepers? Are you more righteous than they are, more accpted by God? Does sabbath keeping in some way earn you something? Or maybe help you avoid something. What keeps you from soley focuing on the sabbath rather than the Gosple of Jesus?

Can you please post the verse you are indicating so we can examine.

Gal 3:11

We are made righteous through faith. Does faith void the law and the voice of God? Not according to Scripture. The faith part is what saves, the action part proves our faith is genuine, instead of being just hearers James1:22

You can't make faith genuine by action. The pharasees tried that and it did not work. Those who come to Christ in the last day and have a list of things they have done in his name still will not have genuine faith. Right action is a natural outgrowth of faith in the right thing. What is God's word to you? Is it only the law?

Heb 11:8 By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going.

He obeyed because of his faith not to establish it. It was already established. But even then it was not his obedience that saved him. It was because he believed God.

Gen 26:5 5 because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.”

This verse has nothing to do with Abraham's salvation. It was about making him a great nation.

Perhaps, but teaching we do not need to keep the Sabbath commandment is in rebellion to what God commanded. Exo20:8-11 Exo20:6 John14:15 Mat5:19

So, are you now suggesting that keeping the Sabbath is necessary for salvation? I thought your position was that the law itself does not save. If the Sabbath is truly the keystone to salvation, then it seems we would need to take it very seriously.


How can one claim to keep it if any of its precepts are being violated? I hope you’re not cooking or doing meal prep on that day, and that your furnace isn’t kindling a fire. The command also forbids buying or selling, which today might even include using electricity.


Does all of this sound extreme? Or do we instead reinterpret the Sabbath laws to fit modern lifestyles, saying something like, “Sure, the Bible says that, but it’s impractical in our day and age”?

The Sabbath is about both spiritual rest in Christ and physical rest from work on the seventh day Exo20:10 Heb4:4,10 Exo20:11. Heb4:4,9,10 You need both to be keeping God's Sabbath.

It is true that the Sabbath teaches both spiritual rest in Christ and physical rest from labor (Exo 20:10,11; Heb 4:4,9-10). However, this rest is a symbol and a gift, not a means of salvation. Observing the day perfectly does not make anyone righteous before God. Salvation comes by trusting in Christ, who is the ultimate source of rest for our souls (Matt 11:28-30). The Sabbath points us to Him, but keeping the day itself cannot secure eternal life.

Yes and I went through this in detail what Paul contrasted as walking in the Spirit compared to those who are walking in the flesh Rom8:4,7-8

Paul’s teaching in Romans 8 shows that the Spirit produces true obedience, including the fruit of rest and godly living. Yet this obedience flows from faith and grace, not from legalistic law-keeping. One could observe the Sabbath flawlessly outwardly but still lack the Spirit, and therefore lack salvation. The Spirit leads us into righteousness, whereas mere rule-keeping cannot change the heart (Rom 8:4; Gal 5:16-18).

Yes I discussed here The Thing Most Sabbath Keepers Do not Talk About. If Christ is fulfilling the law is us, we would be keeping it just as He did as he is our example to follow John15:10 1John2:6

It is correct that Christ fulfills the law and that our obedience should reflect His example (John 15:10; 1 John 2:6). But this shows that salvation comes through Him, not through our attempts to imitate Him perfectly. Even perfect Sabbath observance is still our human effort and cannot accomplish what Christ’s obedience alone has achieved. Following Christ is about relationship and faith, not legalistic perfection.

Sadly, this shows me you do not understand the role of the Ten Commandments. It reveals our sin Rom3:20 Rom7:7 and shows us our condition and our need for Jesus. We get rid of the law, all it does is covers our sins and we think we are in Christ, when we are in darkness Pro28:13 John3:19-21 I guess that's why Jesus commissioned us to teach the commandments of God quoting right from the Ten Mat5:19-30, we are to repent of sin and turn from it, meaning go the other direction and start keeping the commandments of God because breaking them is sin. 1John3:4 James2:11 Mat5:19-30 Rom7:7

The law, including the Sabbath command, indeed exposes sin and highlights our dependence on Jesus (Rom 3:20; Rom 7:7). This reinforces that obedience cannot save, because we all fall short. The law’s purpose is to show the need for a Savior and to guide believers in faithful living—not to act as a ticket to heaven. Our standing before God is based on faith in Christ, who fulfilled the law for us.

The wisest man in the Bible put it this way

Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter:

Fear God and keep His commandments,
For this is man’s all.
14 For God will bring every work into judgment,
Including every secret thing,
Whether good or evil.

And one of the last verses in the Bible before the Second Coming of Jesus Christ

Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

Obedience to God’s commandments, including the Sabbath, is a natural fruit of a redeemed life and a response to His love (Eccl 12:13-14; Rev 22:14). It is never the basis of salvation. One can faithfully keep the Sabbath and still miss the gospel if they trust in rules rather than Christ. True blessing and eternal life are received through faith in Him, and obedience flows from that relationship—not the other way around.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Into being a child of the Almighty God. The Holy God. Not just saved but made joint heirs with Jesus Christ. Counted a perfect forever by Christs one great sacrifice. Are you better than the sunday keepers? Are you more righteous than they are, more accpted by God? Does sabbath keeping in some way earn you something? Or maybe help you avoid something. What keeps you from soley focuing on the sabbath rather than the Gosple of Jesus?

I think you have the wrong idea about God’s Sabbath. The Sabbath is about spending time with God on the day God set aside as holy time for us to do so. It’s not about earning anything, it’s about wanting to spend time with God because we love Him, instead of using that holy and sanctified time doing secular things when God asked us not to Isa58:13 Exo20:8-11. The Sabbath is part of the gospel message and has always been. Heb4:1-10, Rev 14:6-12. Worship the Creator who made the heavens and earth and everything in them Rev14:7 Exo20:11 Resting in Him from sin, obeying Him through faith and love.

It’s no different than spending quality time with our spouse. Would it mean the same if we spent their birthday doing something we wanted to do and would catch up with them on another day that works better for us? I do not think so. God wants to spend time with us, not to punish but to bless Isa56:2 and sanctify us Eze 20:12 because we can’t do this ourselves Isa66:17, we need God

You can't make faith genuine by action.

Luke 6:46 “But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say?

Anyone can say Lord Lord, but those with faith actually do what the Lord asks.

James 1:22 But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves.

Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? Certainly not! On the contrary, we establish the law.

Faith most certainly is active, not passive. Read Hebrews 11

The pharasees tried that and it did not work.

They did not do what God asked, I am not sure if we are reading the same Bible. They followed what they thought was right and wrong made up their own rules and laws and laid aside the commandments of God which Jesus condemned. Mat 15:1-14 Mark 7:7-13. Rom 2:21-23 Lets not follow their same path of disobedience. He said those who teach and follow this teaching end up in a ditch.

whereas mere rule-keeping cannot change the heart

Psa 19:7 The law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul;
The testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple;

No one is going to have a changed heart by worshipping another god. The very first commandment and no one is going to have a changed heart without the sanctification of God, which the 4th commandment is a sign of Eze20:12 and tells us which God to only worship Exo20:11

It is correct that Christ fulfills the law and that our obedience should reflect His example (John 15:10; 1 John 2:6). But this shows that salvation comes through Him, not through our attempts to imitate Him perfectly. Even perfect Sabbath observance is still our human effort and cannot accomplish what Christ’s obedience alone has achieved. Following Christ is about relationship and faith, not legalistic perfection.

The law, including the Sabbath command, indeed exposes sin and highlights our dependence on Jesus (Rom 3:20; Rom 7:7). This reinforces that obedience cannot save, because we all fall short. The law’s purpose is to show the need for a Savior and to guide believers in faithful living—not to act as a ticket to heaven. Our standing before God is based on faith in Christ, who fulfilled the law for us.


Obedience to God’s commandments, including the Sabbath, is a natural fruit of a redeemed life and a response to His love (Eccl 12:13-14; Rev 22:14). It is never the basis of salvation. One can faithfully keep the Sabbath and still miss the gospel if they trust in rules rather than Christ. True blessing and eternal life are received through faith in Him, and obedience flows from that relationship—not the other way around.

Do you believe someone is saved if they are in rebellion to God and willfully sinning?

Did Jesus fufill the law so we can worship other gods? I do not believe that is what He had in mind or breaking the least of these commandments as He plainly stated Mat5:19

You again are not making sense when you say, ‘trusting rules rather than Christ’ Didn’t Christ give the rules? We keep His rules because we trust Him and said to If we love Him. John14:15 And if we do not keep His rules, it means we do not trust Him or love Him nor do we know Him 1John2:4 because Jesus said keeping them was a condition of our love why He said IF. So basically you are pitting Jesus against what He asks of us if we love Him. It’s nonsensical.

Sadly not everyone does love Him enough to subit to what He asks and thats the issue. People love their sins more than they love Jesus to come to Him and forsake their sins or turn from sin Pro28:13 John3:19–21.

 

[Mercy Shown]

I think you have the wrong idea about God’s Sabbath. The Sabbath is about spending time with God on the day God set aside as holy time for us to do so. It’s not about earning anything, it’s about wanting to spend time with God because we love Him, instead of using that holy and sanctified time doing secular things when God asked us not to Isa58:13 Exo20:8-11. The Sabbath is part of the gospel message and has always been. Heb4:1-10, Rev 14:6-12. Worship the Creator who made the heavens and earth and everything in them Rev14:7 Exo20:11 Resting in Him from sin, obeying Him through faith and love.

One day in 7? Why not everyday all day long?