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The sum of God

Discussion in 'Exploring Christianity' started by Project Panda, May 1, 2018.

  1. Tree of Life

    Tree of Life Hide The Pain Supporter

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    The creation always tells us something about the Creator. It doesn’t tell us everything. But a brilliantly designed, beautiful, provocative, and structurally sound piece of architecture will always tell us something about the mind of the architect. Yet it cannot tell us everything. In order to get a clearer vista into the mind of the architect we would need to read his personal letters.
     
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  2. St_Worm2

    St_Worm2 Senior Member Supporter

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    Hi again PP, there is, of course, the Bible, which is a proven historic record, replete with such evidence (of God's very real power as seen in the world, and in/through the lives of both the Jews (and those who came before them) and of Christians, of course.

    There is also the testimony and contemporary evidence of God's transforming work in the lives of non-Christians (like you are and like I was). This astounds me even today, because for years I was just like you are now, and then one day I wasn't anymore. And it wasn't like I had any big problems or reasons that I could point to as to why I would have suddenly wanted my life to be different, why I desired to come to Christ. In fact, I had what might be referred to (by the world's standards anyway) as a very enviable life. EVERYTHING seemed to be going my way, the way I had planned and always hoped that it would.

    I loved my life (sinful as I now realize that it was), but right in the middle of all that "good" I began to wonder if this was all there really was to life, if this was all it would ever mean, and almost before I knew what was happening, I had what can perhaps be best described as a complete and overnight paradigm shift in my way of thinking, and God was there and had the answers to all of my questions and concerns (and that complete "change" in my thinking/understanding about life that occurred on Nov 2nd, 1986, remains the way I still think about/see things today).

    I've been a Christian for a little over thirty years now, and I've seen many others (just like I was and you are now), be transformed into something impossibly different than they were. They go from, at best, denying and/or hating God (or just not caring about Him at all), and loving their sinful activities (and wanting to please themselves whenever it's possible to do so), to knowing God as their loving, caring Father, and wanting to obey and please Him instead. This is something that I see as miraculous, and it occurs regularly within Christianity, but I can hardly think of an example of something like it happening outside of Christianity. And if it can happen to me, it can happen to you as well :)

    Whoa, this is going on longer than I planned. Sorry about that. There is a lot more I could tell you about my personal experiences/why/how I became a Christian (if you'd like me to, that is ;)), so let me know if you do.

    Yours and His,
    David
    p.s. - just to be clear, we Christians aren't anything special in and of ourselves. While God has made us into something new, and in doing so changed (in a big way) what we desire most in this life, we are still the same in many ways. The biggest difference isn't that we are no longer "sinners in need of a Savior" (because we will always have a great need of Him as such), rather, we are sinners who have found Him and, as a result, have had the weight of the world lifted off our our shoulders, because we are sinners who have been forgiven :)
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2018
  3. redleghunter

    redleghunter Thank You Jesus! Supporter

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    Because most hate the Light that He may expose their deeds.

    What evidence have you examined if at all?
     
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  4. jesus316

    jesus316 All Truth is in Jesus Supporter

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    Not everyone believes the earth is a sphere, that's why.
     
  5. Project Panda

    Project Panda Member

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    Accuracy of historical events in the Bible & the gospel account's.

    Secular evidence for Biblical events & there account's.

    The psychological effects that hell has on humans, especially children.

    Scientific evidence that contradicts Biblical notions & current Biblical concepts of our universe.

    Christian behavior & their inability to replicate Jesus known abilities.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2018
  6. HypnoToad

    HypnoToad *croak* Supporter

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    How do I know you're rational? How do I know to what degree your rationality is? Is it 100% perfect? Is your judgment infallible? If you were to say it is, I'd have to conclude you were either a fool or a liar. If you were to say it isn't, then why should I not conclude that your lack of acceptance of God is not due to those rational deficiencies you admit to having?
     
  7. redleghunter

    redleghunter Thank You Jesus! Supporter

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    What leads you to believe Amy of the above are in contrast with the other?
     
  8. Trimeresurus

    Trimeresurus Advocatus diaboli

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    Best description of my religion I read in a while.
    Very accurate. It is about pride and pride won't allow you to devote.
     
  9. Project Panda

    Project Panda Member

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    I'm not sure what you're saying, sorry.
     
  10. Project Panda

    Project Panda Member

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    "There's safty in the multitude of evidence"
     
  11. redleghunter

    redleghunter Thank You Jesus! Supporter

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    What leads you to believe any of the statements you made to me are valid or even in conflict?

     
  12. Project Panda

    Project Panda Member

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    There valid because they prove these religious beliefs false from different angles, but there is more evidence than what I outlined. You only need to research & study enough material to get a clear picture.
     
  13. redleghunter

    redleghunter Thank You Jesus! Supporter

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    Can you point out any evidence you presented? I did see some philosophical presuppositions.
     
  14. Project Panda

    Project Panda Member

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    As uncomfortable as I was in Christ Jesus, I didn't just fold up my tent and walk away. Who in their right mind would walk away knowing that it would end in eternal hell fire. Simply put, you need a strong case built on evidence that hell is a mythology concept to transition over to non belief.

    Even then I didn't leave Christianity fully until I was satisfied I had enough evidence to support my view that this God was not real, and that I was gravely mistaken. It was a journey into learning that took 3-4 years of my life, so explaining it to you and other Christian's would take a very committed relationship.
     
  15. Lukaris

    Lukaris Orthodox Christian Supporter

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    I believe God is real because His Word promises us everlasting life ( Romans 10:9-13 );this world is tragic but His Word has overcome it ( John 16:33 ).His commandments tell us how we need to live ( Matthew 19:16-19, Romans 13:8-10 ), we are unable to do this though but God still loves us ( John 3:16-21 ).

    We cannot live without our conscience but it often fails due to our sin ( or faults if you may ).
    Our conscience needs a higher authority ( other than God it might be good or bad). We can at least try to love our neighbor even if we do not believe in God ( Matthew 22:36-40 ) & treat each other accordingly ( Matthew 7:1-12 ).

    Collectively we fail the virtues ( Beatitudes Matthew 5:1-12 ) only God can know who succeeds ( & some must).

    I believe God told the ancient Hebrews the way of life & death by following or failing His commandments ( Deuteronomy 30:11-20 ) & subconsciously to all people ( Acts of the Apostles 10:34-35 ). It is here where His attributes are known & how we rebel & self destruct ( Romans 1:18-32). Of course some do what is right vs wrong & the Lord will determine the righteous; even those who may not have known Him ( see Romans 2 (& also the Beatitudes again).

    I believe it is only by grace we are saved and do what is good ( Ephesians 2:8-10 ).

    All I can say to someone is examine their conscience and hope that they find that the kingdom of God is within ( Luke 17:20-21 ).
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2018
  16. Lukaris

    Lukaris Orthodox Christian Supporter

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    Last edited: May 3, 2018
  17. Project Panda

    Project Panda Member

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    Yes, I've read the Bible, I get the point of it all.
     
  18. user385

    user385 New Member

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    Unbelievers do not believe in Jesus because they love darkness. John chapter 3 I think. It is possible for christians to sin. I am not here to judge anyone. Pride can keep an unbeliever from believing in Jesus. You need to call on the real Jesus Christ to reveal Himself to you and He will. Good behavior cannot save us. A person who has received eternal life cannot lose eternal life.
     
  19. Project Panda

    Project Panda Member

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    Who exactly is the real Jesus? None of us start off in faith knowing the real Jesus, that's why it's faith, because you can't see who the real Jesus is. Isn't the idea of believing in Jesus just to believe, after that his spirit comes and makes himself known to you.
     
  20. redleghunter

    redleghunter Thank You Jesus! Supporter

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    What do you mean by you were in Christ Jesus?
     
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