The snare of devotion to Mary.

[Galilee63]

All I can say is that every Christian Bible with God's Old Testament and Jesus' New Testament is to be respected and revered for these are God's Holy Scriptures of which The Holy Spirit speaks to us through God's Loving Holy Wisdom, Guidance and Enlightenment.

One day in a paddock a few pages of an old bible flitted towards me (a couple of years ago on a farm that a relative had purchased. The place had been vacant for a few years and a very old place with an old homestead vacant) tucked away in a remote region.

I read the Holy passages that Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit had flitted towards me in the breeze.

Within weeks an electrical storm built up from no-where and the place was struck by lightning of which caused a fire in the back hills on the property. I prayed to Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary for rain and the cessation of winds fanning the fires of which Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit answered me within hours (as Jesus and the Blessed Virgin Mary have answered every prayer for the cessation of winds with fires) over past years - within hours - rain not forecast - and rain not received on any other land or in the region at the time.

The Holy Spirit 'breathes' His Loving Holy Wisdom through each and every one of God's Holy Word within His Holy Bibles always there waiting for His Children to read about Jesus/God.

Trust in Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit through Jesus Christ our Saviour, is the golden key to unlocking our hearts to receive Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit more fully.

Love and kindest wishes your Sister in Jesus Christ our Saviour

 

[Galilee63]

This appearance by The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God to Bruno and his three Children may be of interest to some people struggling with The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God in Her Holy Role as Daughter of God The Most High (His favoured one), Mother of God (Mother of Son) and Spouse of The Holy Spirit, Queen of Heaven and Queen of Mercy, Queen of the Universe and Earth.

The Assumption:

"And a great sign appeared in Heaven, a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon was under Her feet and upon Her Head a crown of twelve stars".

The Coronation:

"Thou art the Glory of Jerusalem the honour of our people...The Hand of The Lord hath strengthened Thee, and therefore Thou shalt be Blessed forever".

In 1997 the Holy Father, Pope John Paul II, approved the renaming of the place as "Holy Mary of Third Millennium at Three Fountains".

The Virgin of the Revelation, Rome

April 12, 1947

ROME, on the above date, was a sunny Saturday after Easter. Bruno Cornacchiola, a railway worker, decided to take advantage of the beautiful spring day by taking his three children----- Isola, aged ten, Carlo, aged seven, and Gianfranco, aged four----- on a picnic. It was a day he will never forget as it changed the whole course of his life. Early that afternoon he providentially missed a train going to Ostia and so decided to go to Tre Fontane instead. It is a location just outside of Rome noted for the shrine where St. Paul suffered Martyrdom and a parklike area with eucalyptus trees. It was also, alas, notorious as a place of sin in which even the bodies of dead preborn babies were found. There, in the shade of the eucalyptus, while his children played, Bruno pored over his Bible. He was preparing a speech which he intended to deliver in a public square the following day. It was a vicious attack on the Church's teaching on the Immaculate Conception of Mary.

Although Bruno had been Baptized a Catholic and received his First Holy Communion, he wasn't a practicing Catholic. His parents weren't very religious and his early environment in an ill-famed district of Rome certainly didn't foster his Faith. A few months after he was married, he deserted his wife and volunteered to fight in the Spanish Civil War. It was there that he left the practice of the Catholic faith and embraced Protestantism, eventually becoming a militant Seventh Day Adventist. He returned to Rome and his wife, who remained a practicing Catholic, in 1939. In his uncontrollable anger, he often beat her up. He wouldn't allow her to bring the older children to church and refused to have the youngest son Baptized.

Besides being a wife-beater, Bruno Cornacchiola was not a very good Christian. His language was punctuated frequently with obscenities, blasphemy and he had affairs with other women. The very morning of the picnic he passed a statue of Our Lady which had on the base of the statue, "Virgin Mother." Bruno wrote in pencil, "You are neither virgin nor mother." In his great hatred of the Church, he had even devised a plot to assassinate Pope Pius XII on September 8, 1947, the feast of the birthday of the Blessed Virgin Mary. In the late afternoon of the 12th, in the middle of his preparation for his attack on Mary's great prerogative, one of his children interrupted him. Would he help them find their ball? Bruno put aside his Scripture text and the notes he had taken and joined in the search. While searching for the ball, Bruno found his youngest son, Gianfranco, kneeling at the entrance to a dark cave. The boy's hands were folded in the attitude of one engrossed in prayer, as though in ecstasy. With a happy countenance and his eyes fixed on a certain point of the cave, the child repeated, "Beautiful lady! Beautiful lady!" as though he were addressing a living person.

Bruno was surprised, then uneasy, and finally terror seized him. He could see nothing in the interior of the cave. What was he to make of his son's strange behavior? Excitedly he turned to Isola and Carlo for an explanation. But the children's curiosity and fear for their younger brother were brief. Within seconds they also-----first Isola and then Carlo-----fell to their knees and joined their hands in prayer, enraptured with the same vision. Bruno was dumbfounded. Then he heard all three of his children cry out together: "Beautiful lady!" He tried to move each child, but they were as if glued to the ground. He was terrified.
Suddenly, Bruno was also overcome by the strange mystical experience. His eyes were filled with intense light for a moment, then everything in front of him disappeared his children and the cave. He felt himself becoming weightless, ethereal, as if his spirit had been freed of his body. When he regained his sight, after momentary blindness, Bruno saw in the most illuminated part of the cave a woman of indescribable celestial beauty. Her head was adorned by a halo of brilliant golden light. The lady had black hair, and was clothed in a radiant white dress, gathered together by a rose-colored sash whose edges fell gracefully at her side; over her shoulders she wore a striking green mantle. The three colors of the dress (white), sash (rose-colored) and mantel (green) have special significance to Bruno. He explains that they signify Mary's relationship to the Three Divine Persons and the three apparitions of Lourdes, Fatima and Rome. In fact, Our Lady identified herself as, "Daughter of the Father, the Mother of the Son, and Spouse and Temple of the Holy Spirit." At her bare feet lay a black cloth which had a smashed crucifix on it.

Her face had an expression of motherly kindness, although clouded by sadness at times. In her right hand she held, resting on her breast, a small gray book. Her hands were crossed at her breast, but she unfolded them once to point to the broken pieces of the crucifix. She then joined them together again. In a noteworthy departure from other modern apparitions, Mary appeared not only to a non-practicing Catholic but to a zealous enemy of the Church and of herself personally. What message did she have for the wayward Bruno Cornacchiola and our times? We know only part of it; the remainder was to be delivered to Pope Pius XII, who later was to bless the statue of the Virgin that stands in the grotto where she appeared.

When the Blessed Virgin identified herself to Bruno Cornacchiola, she did so with two profound truths. The first was of a general nature:

"I am the one that is of the Divine Trinity."

"I am the one that is of the Divine Trinity: Daughter of the Father, the Mother of the Son, and Spouse and Temple of the Holy Spirit"

Because of her relationship to each person in the Blessed Trinity-----daughter of the Eternal Father, spouse of the Holy Spirit and mother of the Divine Son-----she is altogether unique among all of God's creation. In the second identification she chose to reveal herself in relation to Bruno's activity of Bible reading:

"I am the Virgin of the Revelation."


By this second title she corrects the error of those who would deny her privileges as unfounded, unnecessary inventions of the Catholic Church, not found in Divine Revelation in the Bible. She was admonishing a return to God and a more literal living of the holy Gospel:

"Return to the pure source of the Gospel."

Then the Virgin of the Revelation addressed herself directly to Bruno,

"You persecute me-----enough of it now! Enter into the true fold, God's Kingdom on earth. The Nine First Fridays of the Sacred Heart have saved you. You must be like the flowers which Isola picked, they make no protest, they are silent and do not rebel. . . . With this dirt of sin, I shall perform powerful miracles for the conversion of unbelievers."

She revealed to Bruno the sad condition of his soul, at the once all his pat arguments and prejudices against the Church fell apart and he saw before him the way to salvation-----the Roman Catholic Church.
At that point, the Virgin of the Revelation taught him the sure means of salvation, for him and for and all mankind, which is prayer, and in particular the daily recitation of the Holy Rosary.

"Pray much and recite the Rosary for the conversion of sinners, of unbelievers and of all Christians." As a reward to those souls who would listen to her message of prayer for the salvation of mankind, the Virgin promised great favors from Heaven. "In this place of sin I shall perform wonderful miracles for the conversion of unbelievers."

In Bruno Cornacchiola, the Blessed Virgin recognized that we all have our moments of doubt and discouragement, and should turn to her for help.

The Virgin of the Revelation also favored her prodigal son with foreknowledge of a portion of the future dogma of the Assumption, proclaimed by Pope Pius XII in 1950. She revealed: "My body could not be allowed to decay. My Son came for me with His Angels . . ."

True to Mary's promise, the dirt from the Grotto of Tre Fontane, which formally saw great immorality, has proven to be miraculous. Like the miraculous waters at Lourdes, it continues to work wonders for the welfare of both bodies and souls. There have been so many bodily cures and conversions that no one disputes that these graces have been received through the intercession of the Virgin of the Revelation.
In order to test him and to assure him of the Divine reality of all he experienced, she gave him a sign.

"Every time you meet a priest in church or in the street, you are to approach him and address him with these words, 'Father I must talk to you.' If he answers, 'Ave Maria! My son, what do you want?' beg him to stop because he is the chosen one. He will direct you to another priest by saying, 'He is the one for you.' "

It was quite a test that Our Lady put him through. He had to ask the question, countless times it seemed, to every priest he met and not get the proper response and walk away sadly aware of being thought of as rude or even out of his mind. It upset him so much that he was on the point of despair and even thought of committing suicide.

Then he prayed as he had never prayed before. Didn't Our Lady ask him to pray and suffer for the conversion of sinners, of unbelievers and for unity of all Christians? He persevered and it eventually happened exactly as Our Lady predicted. However, as the word of the apparition got around he had much to suffer from former friends and associates who accused him of being a fanatic, crazy, etc. Others saw him as an exploiter of a situation that brought much attention to him. He was examined by the police and given, along with his children, psychiatric examinations. If he at times became depressed, he now turned to his spiritual guide, Our Lady of Good Counsel.

As if to refocus attention on the shrine and her message to Bruno, on April 12, 1980, the 33rd anniversary of the Virgin's visit, a most astounding public miracle occurred at Tre Fontane in the presence of 3,000 people (including some 25 priests), who had gathered to hear Bruno Cornacchiola recall the first apparition and to attend a commemorative Mass. During the Holy Sacrifice strange images appeared in the sky above the Grotto. The sun seemed to turn backwards in the heavens and began to draw near the earth. It could be seen with without straining the eyes. It appeared bigger than normal, and showed within its corona brilliant and diverse colors, in much the same way as the sun "danced" in the sky over Fatima, Portugal in 1917.

In rapid movements, as an incandescent magma, forming diverse figurations, the sun appeared as: a cross; an "M"; a heart surrounded with stars, or dripping with blood; the monogram of Christ "IHS"; hands joined in prayer; the Holy Family; etc. Some also claim to have seen the solar crown separate in three circles, then come back together again. In spite of the numerous trees, which should have impeded vision, the sun stood out clearly and brightened the chapel, faces, and the clothing of the people.

The phenomenon lasted about a half an hour.

http://www.indefenseofthecross.com/V...Revelation.htm


Love and kindest wishes your Sister in Jesus Christ our Saviour

 

[Albion]

The "bottom line" in this thread should be seen to be this:

For some people, Mariolatry IS a snare, while for others there is only a healthy regard for the woman who gave birth to Our Lord. The problem only arises when some of us want to deny that such respect and regard can possibly be taken to extreme levels. Ever.

The people who argue that way seem to have no trouble saying that all manner of other religious actions can be distorted and misdirected, but they won't admit that anyone ever does it in this case.

 

[MKJ]

Thank you for the well-considered reply. Concerning the Bible, we have a great number of passages which probably worry you, such as Psalm 119 where the psalmist devotes all 176 verses to extolling the word of God.

Then, also there are passages such as in John 1 where the writer intentionally conflates Jesus Christ with the Word of God, carrying multiple levels of meaning. In a similar manner the Greek word pneuma is frequently used to convey multiple meanings (wind, breath, spirit, Holy Spirit) so that interpretations of various passages can be difficult, at best.

On the other hand, scripture does not contain these sorts of passages in respect to honoring deceased saints. They are neither extolled nor ascribed divine attributes as is frequently done in the Catholic Church. This level of attribution and adoration is a development which apparently came well after the writing of the New Testament.

I can't say that anything found in the Bible approaches the sort of problem I think exists among some kinds of Protestants.

Christianity has a long tradition of apophatic theology, which has always been there to balance out the more positive kinds of statements we make about God in the Bible or in the Church. You can see it too in the East in the way they carefully differentiate between God's essence and attributes, or in the way mystics talk about God in both the eastern and western tradition. And in the ancient world, it was just very much taken for granted that language and especially religious language could, as you say, have many layers of meaning.

Among the groups that tend to have problems with their attitude to Scripture, much of that doesn't exist. They tend to be very flat in the ways they understand Scripture, and they have often totally lost that apophatic tradition, almost seeming to come at it from a sort of materialism.

So my view is that they have for various reasons lost some of the aspects of thinking that tend to protect from those errors. Right at this moment in history, in some parts of the world, I think this is a significant problem among Christians.

As far as saints - well, I would somewhat disagree with you about the Scriptures, and I think the communion of saints is in there quite explicitly. Ultimatly though I think the practices around them are for the most part very much the logical extention in belief in the Communion of Saints - which is really an aspect of belief in the Church as a body and the connectedness of all nature. If human actions in the Fall reverberated through the animal, natural, and physical world, and the New Creation will mean the reanimation of all these things, does it not make sense that even now, in por prayer life and relationships to each other, we are all connected? It also has very important relation to the idea of theosis - when we have a saint, someone who has allowed God to really lodge in him or herself in a concrete way, we should recognize God there. And such practices help us to remember some other important truths that it is easy for Christins to forget - like we are meant to allow ourselves to be open in that way, or that we must honour God in all people we meet.

Sure, people can become superstitious, or even idolatrous, but at this point in history, I think that is not actually a very serious problem.

 

[bbbbbbb]

I can't say that anything found in the Bible approaches the sort of problem I think exists among some kinds of Protestants.

Christianity has a long tradition of apophatic theology, which has always been there to balance out the more positive kinds of statements we make about God in the Bible or in the Church. You can see it too in the East in the way they carefully differentiate between God's essence and attributes, or in the way mystics talk about God in both the eastern and western tradition. And in the ancient world, it was just very much taken for granted that language and especially religious language could, as you say, have many layers of meaning.

Among the groups that tend to have problems with their attitude to Scripture, much of that doesn't exist. They tend to be very flat in the ways they understand Scripture, and they have often totally lost that apophatic tradition, almost seeming to come at it from a sort of materialism.

So my view is that they have for various reasons lost some of the aspects of thinking that tend to protect from those errors. Right at this moment in history, in some parts of the world, I think this is a significant problem among Christians.

As far as saints - well, I would somewhat disagree with you about the Scriptures, and I think the communion of saints is in there quite explicitly. Ultimatly though I think the practices around them are for the most part very much the logical extention in belief in the Communion of Saints - which is really an aspect of belief in the Church as a body and the connectedness of all nature. If human actions in the Fall reverberated through the animal, natural, and physical world, and the New Creation will mean the reanimation of all these things, does it not make sense that even now, in por prayer life and relationships to each other, we are all connected? It also has very important relation to the idea of theosis - when we have a saint, someone who has allowed God to really lodge in him or herself in a concrete way, we should recognize God there. And such practices help us to remember some other important truths that it is easy for Christins to forget - like we are meant to allow ourselves to be open in that way, or that we must honour God in all people we meet.

Sure, people can become superstitious, or even idolatrous, but at this point in history, I think that is not actually a very serious problem.

O how I love Your law!
It is my meditation all the day.

 

[Galilee63]

The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God within most if not all of Her Loving Holy messages always says to focus on Jesus Christ our Saviour Her Son, opening up hearts to Him, in genuine remorse for sins, praying to Jesus Christ our Saviour, focussing on His bitter Passion and His Sorrowful Stations of His Cross in Her Holy Rosary, in The Our Father's, The Hail Mary's, and all of the other prayers that Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God have given to mankind in Jesus' appearances to Saints for mankind to pray from our hearts to Him.

Jesus has requested that His Divine Mercy Chaplet be prayed to God The Most High through Him - addressed within this Chaplet as "Eternal Father" "I offer You the Body and Blood Soul and Divinity of Your Dearly Beloved Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, in atonement for our sins, and those of the whole world", then "For the sake of His Sorrowful Passion, have Mercy on us and on the whole world", with the Creed, The Our Father and The Hail Mary prior to this, then in conclusion: Holy God, Holy Mighty One, Holy Immortal One, have Mercy on us and on the whole world.

Jesus in fact requested both Saint Dominic 1214 and the Blessed Alan De la Roche 1260 (both priests) while delivering the Holy Rosary of The Blessed Virgin Mary, to pray The Holy Rosary to "the Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God" - with The Blessed Virgin Mary encouraging every person to focus on Jesus Himself, His bitter Passion and His Sorrowful Stations of His Cross.

The Blessed Virgin Mary has stated the following:

"And in this way My Children, hearts come closer to My Son Jesus your Saviour by focussing on My Son's bitter Passion and Sorrowful Stations of His Cross".

"That is all".

 

[Albion]

The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God within most if not all of Her Loving Holy messages always says to focus on Jesus Christ our Saviour Her Son, opening up hearts to Him, in genuine remorse for sins, praying to Jesus Christ our Saviour, focussing on His bitter Passion and His Sorrowful Stations of His Cross in Her Holy Rosary, in The Our Father's, The Hail Mary's, and all of the other prayers that Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God have given to mankind in Jesus' appearances to Saints for mankind to pray from our hearts to Him.

Jesus has requested that His Divine Mercy Chaplet be prayed to God The Most High through Him

That's a valid point to make, but it doesn't erase the other issues that have been part of this discussion:

1. MANY "Marian devotions" involve the unscriptural glorification of Mary, her alleged apparitions and the rosary aside.

and

2. The Rosary itself is a myth. Its origins lie in monks from the early Middle Ages making a suggestion to the unlearned laypeople of the time who admired the monastic routine of prayer about how even the ordinary people could count their prayers (the 'Our Father,' that is) using string and stones. The legend of Mary appearing to St. Dominic and giving him the rosary in more or less its current form, along with all the mysticism, benefits, and etc. that Catholics associate with it, is just that--a Marian legend.

 

[Galilee63]

Correction Albion and I really am praying that all Christians and people comprehend what has been happening for centuries around the world Albion - because Albion we are definitely in the last days before Jesus appears here on His Earth for all time - we only all have these last days to pray, repent all sins from our hearts and it is through Jesus Divine Mercy Chaplet and The Holy Rosary being the most powerful weapons against satan and its evil. I don't apologise for this fervent nature at all - because it is for the good of all our souls eternally Albion.

First, question logically the reasons why most of the Saints throughout the Centuries have reported similar Holy messages from Jesus Himself in His Holy Presence and Holy apparitions and from the Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God's Holy apparitions and Holy Words - with Prayers delivered to be prayed to "God The Most High" our "Eternal Father" and "Heavenly Father" Albion. Have you read all of the Holy Prayers that God The Most High in His Holiness has delivered through Jesus Christ our Saviour and The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God. Try reading Jesus' Divine Mercy Chaplet just once Albion and then wonder why someone would have have conjured this up that in fact includes: The Sign of The Cross, The Our Father (that God The Most High gave His Apostles BC and Jesus gave His Disciples) then The Hail Mary (the first part of The Hail Mary given in Holy Scriptures by God The Most High through Saint Elizabeth) and the latter part of the Hail Mary Prayer through Saint Dominic by Jesus Christ our Saviour Himself. Other priests prior to Saint Dominic (the earlier Church Fathers (prior to 1214) may have been given the latter part of The Hail Mary before Jesus appeared to Saint Dominic) however that is of no concern. This is God's Holy Will Albion, not yours, not mine nor any human being here on earth. God our Heavenly Father has decreed in His Holy Will all things through Jesus Christ our Saviour and The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God. It is our choice free will if we choose to trust in our Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour and The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God opening our hearts and praying the Holy Prayers that Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit and our Blessed Virgin Mary have given us.

Jesus Christ our Saviour Himself appeared to Saint Dominic during 1214 and later Jesus appeared to Blessed Alan De la Roche during 1260 with the admonishment to this latter priest that he and other priests had not spread The Holy Rosary that God The Most High had Gifted and bestowed upon The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God for mankind to pray daily - all of mankind Albion - this was not directed to people of Catholic faiths only.

The Holy Rosary waned after Saint Dominic passed away with The Holy Rosary almost dying in terms of people praying to The Blessed Virgin Mary Her Holy Rosary.

Jesus appeared to Saint Dominic and Blessed De la Roche and requested that The Holy Rosary always be prayed to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God. The Holy Roses make up a Holy Chain of Roses with every Our Father to Jesus and God The Most High and every Hail Mary Prayer going to our Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God within The Holy Rosary in "Holy Adoration and Glory to God The Most High" received by Jesus/God. This is how Special and important every Our Father and Hail Mary Prayer are to God The Most High. One of the greatest Holy Gifts to God The Most High is praying The Holy Rosary of which our souls are Blessed eternally praying for many causes and Holy causes. The other Holy prayers within The Holy Rosary are from God The Most High for the benefit of deterring satan (within these prayers) through the Archangel Michael and that Prayer God the Most High gave mankind. Therefore, certain Saints are allowed to be called - one being the Holy Archangel Michael Prayer within The Holy Rosary.

Saint Louis De Montfort of whom knew the Blessed Alan de la Roche personally put together the book "The Secret of The Rosary" of which I have been posting the link on other threads of which you have obviously missed.

The Paternoster of which comprised 150 x The Our Father's on beads and string of which the monks would pray and medieval Catholics, the Angelic Salutation (the Creed and The Ave Maria) The Hail Mary prayer of which only contained at that time the first part of The Hail Mary Prayer until Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God delivered the remaining half of The Hail Mary Prayer within The Holy Rosary to Saint Dominic and all of the other Prayers within The Holy Rosary included by Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit through Jesus Christ our Saviour. (One of Jesus' chosen priests to deliver to mankind and other priests The Holy Rosary after the Paternoster) that was given to the Children of Fatima and other Saints throughout the ages.

The history of The Holy Rosary can only be completely comprehended if one reads Jesus' Holy Words within the writings of Saint Dominic and The Blessed Alan de la Roche by Saint Louis De Montfort:

The Secret of The Rosary by Saint Louis De Montfort (here is another link for you Albion).

Saint Louis explains every Holy Prayer that God The Most High gave within The Holy Rosary, the most beautiful Holy reasons and explanations for each Holy Prayer - Holy Word by Holy Word of God The Most High Himself through Jesus Christ our Saviour appearing to these priests to deliver. The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God appeared to Saint Dominic after Jesus Christ our Saviour had appeared.

The same occurred when Jesus Christ our Saviour appeared to Saint Sister Faustina - with the 600 pages of Jesus/God's Holy Divine Mercy messages and Chaplet - then the Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God appeared to Saint Faustina thereafter. Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit are within our Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God and The Blessed Virgin Mary is extremely close to God The Most High as His favoured Holy Daughter and Holy Spouse of The Holy Spirit - and The Holy Rosary was Gifted by God The Most High to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God.

Jesus/God The Most High/The Holy spirit Gifted in His Holy Will mankind with Jesus' Divine Mercy after Jesus Christ our Saviour died and Ascended into Heaven - as indeed God The Most High stated BC to His Apostles that The Messiah was forthcoming with His Mercy.

Jesus then delivered His Divine Mercy Chaplet as the last hopes of salvation for mankind (in Jesus' Holy Words) for people to pray to Him repentant and unrepentant given that Jesus Christ our Saviour gave His Divine Mercy Chaplet to priests through Saint Faustina and it was delayed being delivered to mankind by 40 years - between the years 1930s - 1970's when finally Pope John Paul II fulfilled Jesus Christ our Saviours requests getting around the then Vatican members and creating through Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit "Divine Mercy Sunday Feast - the Feast of The Divine Mercy - Jesus is the "Unfathomable Divine Mercy Himself".

Jesus' Holy words in relation to His Holy Scriptures with Revelations that Jesus will be appearing first as King of Mercy here on earth then after being here on Earth as King of Mercy (Divine Mercy) of which Jesus appeared to Saint Faustina delivering His Divine Mercy, Jesus will then appear in His Second Coming soon after this:


"Write this down, that before My Coming as Judge, I shall come first as The King of Mercy. Before the coming of that day of justice, there will be a sign in the Heavens. All light will be extinguished in heaven and earth. There will appear in the sky the Sign of The Cross. From each of the Wounds on My Hands and Feet will shine forth a light that will for a brief time brighten the earth. This will be for a short time before the last day".

www.divinemercy.com

What then of mankind ignoring the fact that Jesus Christ our Saviour Himself appeared to Saint Dominic, other priests of His Holy choice, to Blessed Alan, to Saint Sister Faustina with all of The Holy Prayers from God The Most High for mankind to pray for our salvation Albion?

How dreadfully sad that we as mankind hold little faith in our Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour having appeared on many occasions to His priests and sisters/nuns (His religious) Saint Bernard included with another Holy Prayer from God The Most High for all Catholics and Christians to pray for sins to be forgiven.

In the interim period I pray for the world that Jesus/God/The Holy Spirits Loving Holy Wisdom flows through those of little faith, because, Albion, without the most powerful Holy Prayers that God The Most High has given mankind to pray in order to have hearts opened greatly to Jesus Christ our Saviour; we are all floundering in the darkness in terms of hope of soul salvation in Jesus/God's Holy Will - Jesus makes this clear within all of His Divine Mercy Holy messages and our Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God for centuries through God's Chosen Children - His Saints and Children - has made this quite clear.

Trust in our Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour
Pray from our hearts in trust to Jesus Christ our Saviour
Repent our sins from hearts in trust to Jesus Christ our Saviour
Receive His Blessed Holy Sacraments - Baptism, Repentance/Reconciliation, Receiving Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit's Holy Communion - Jesus' pre-Blessed Flesh and Blood - to receive His Holy Blessings/Gifts/Graces from Him.[/B][/B][/B]THE SECRET OF THE ROSARY

(one passage below - refer to the Third Rose of The Most Holy Rosary and the Fourth Rose of the Most Holy Rosary) Saint Dominic and Blessed Alan De la Roche).


FOURTH ROSE: BLESSED ALAN DE LA ROCHE

ALL THINGS, even the holiest, are subject to change, especially when they are dependent on man's free will. It is hardly to be wondered at, then, that the Confraternity of the Holy Rosary only retained its fervor for one century after it was instituted by Saint Dominic. After this, it was like a thing buried and forgotten.

Doubtless, too, the wicked scheming and jealousy of the devil were largely responsible for getting people to neglect the Holy Rosary, and thus block the flow of God's grace which it had drawn down upon the world.

Thus, in 1349, God punished the whole of Europe and sent the most terrible plague that had ever been known into every land. It started first in the east and spread throughout Italy, Germany, France, Poland and Hungary, bringing desolation wherever it came----for out of hundred men hardly one lived to tell the tale. Big towns, little towns, villages and monasteries were almost completely deserted during the three years that the epidemic lasted.

This scourge of God was quickly followed by two others: the heresy of the Flagellantes and a tragic schism in 1376.

[Web Master Note: The Flagellantes were members a group, who, naked to the waist, used the discipline of self-flagellation most extremely. In the beginning, they were not in actual error; but in course of time they declared, that no one could receive the forgiveness of his sins, unless he entered their confraternity; and although laymen, they confess and absolved one another. They passed from Italy to Germany, and from that to Hungary. They were condemned at Paris, 1349.]

Later on when these trials were over, thanks to the mercy of God, Our Lady told Blessed Alan to revive the ancient Confraternity of the Most Holy Rosary. Blessed Alan was one of the Dominican Fathers from the monastery at Dinan, in Brittany. He was an eminent theologian and was famous for his sermons. Our Lady chose him because, since the Confraternity had originally been started in this province, it was most fitting that a Dominican from the very same province should have the honor of re-establishing it.
Blessed Alan began this great work in 1460 after a special warning from Our Lord. This is how he received His urgent message, as he tells it himself:

One day when he was saying Mass, Our Lord, Who wished to spur him on to preach the Holy Rosary, spoke to him in the Sacred Host:

"How can you crucify Me again so soon?" Jesus said.

"What did You say, Lord?" asked Blessed Alan, horrified.

"You crucified Me once before by your sins," answered Jesus, "and I would willingly be crucified again rather than have My Father offended by the sins you used to commit. You are crucifying Me again now because you have all the learning and understanding that you need to preach My Mother's Rosary, and you are not doing so. If you only did this you could teach many souls the right path and lead them away from sin----but you are not doing it and so you yourself are guilty of the sins that they commit."

This terrible reproach made Blessed Alan solemnly resolve to preach the Rosary unceasingly.

Our Lady too spoke to him one day to inspire him to preach the Holy Rosary more and more:

"You were a great sinner in your youth," she said, "but I obtained the grace of your conversion from my Son. Had such a thing been possible I would have liked to have gone through all kinds of suffering to save you because converted sinners are a glory to me. And I would have done this also to make you worthy of preaching my Rosary far and wide."

Saint Dominic appeared to Blessed Alan as well and told him of the great results of his ministry: he had preached the Holy Rosary unceasingly, his sermons had borne great fruit and many people had been converted during his missions. He said to Blessed Alan:

"See the wonderful results I have had through preaching the Holy Rosary! You and all those who love Our Lady ought to do the same so that, by means of this holy practice of the Rosary, you may draw all people to the real science of the virtues."

Briefly, then, this is the history of how Saint Dominic established the Holy Rosary and of how Blessed Alan de la Roche restored it.



Love and kindest wishes your Sister in Jesus Christ our Saviour

 

[mark46]

I feel compelled enter this discussion. You argue with Albion with regard to theology (not allowed on CF) and you misrepresent the teachings of the Church.

THE VISIONS
The Roman Catholic Church has made extensive prayerful study of the hundreds of visions and apparitions over the centuries. Only NINE are approved by the Church. This is not one of them. The Church cautions us with regard to belief in apparitions and in an messages coming from them. The pope has recently spoken out on the subject. Catholics are not even required to believe in the nine apparitions.

ORIGIN OF THE ROSARY
You properly point out that praying the pater nosher with prayer beads is a tradition that precedes St Dominic. I would also mention that none of the pictures or documents of the time associates St Dominic with the rosary. Albion calls such stories legends; we call them traditions. In any case, the are not "fact" or doctrine. We are free to accept or reject them.

THE ROSARY AS A DEVOTION
IMHO, the rosary an important devotion and discipline. Anglicans have an Anglican rosary. Many Anglicans reject such devotions. For me, as with all disciplines and devotions, what matters is not belief in an apparition and the orders supposedly given there. What matters is how the discipline brings us close to Jesus. Over the centuries, many have testified that the rosary has done that for them.

Correction Albion.

Jesus Christ our Saviour Himself appeared to Saint Dominic during 1214 and later Jesus appeared to Blessed Alan De la Roche during 1260 with the admonishment to this latter priest that he and other priests had not spread The Holy Rosary that God The Most High had Gifted and bestowed upon The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God for mankind to pray daily - all of mankind Albion - this was not directed to people of Catholic faiths only.

The Holy Rosary waned after Saint Dominic passed away with The Holy Rosary almost dying in terms of people praying to The Blessed Virgin Mary Her Holy Rosary.

Jesus appearing to Saint Dominic and Blessed De la Roche appeared to both priests and requested that The Holy Rosary always be prayed to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God.

Saint Louis De Montfort of whom knew the Blessed Alan de la Roche personally put together the book "The Secret of The Rosary" of which I have been posting the link on other threads of which you have obviously missed.

The monks recited The Angelic Psalter which was the Paternoster of which comprised 150 x The Our Father's on beads and string of which the monks would pray prior to Jesus appearing Himself on many occasions to Saint Dominic (Jesus' chosen priest to deliver to mankind and other priests The Holy Rosary after the Paternoster Psalter) that was given to the Children of Fatima and other Saints throughout the ages prior to Saint Dominic The Holy Rosary.

The history of The Holy Rosary can only be completely comprehended if one reads Jesus' Holy Words within the writings of Saint Dominic and The Blessed Alan de la Roche by Saint Louis De Montfort:

The Secret of The Rosary by Saint Louis De Montfort (here is another link for you Albion).

Saint Louis explains every Holy Prayer that God The Most High gave within The Holy Rosary, the most beautiful Holy reasons and explanations for each Holy Prayer - Holy Word by Holy Word of God The Most High Himself through Jesus Christ our Saviour appearing to these priests to deliver. The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God appeared to Saint Dominic after Jesus Christ our Saviour had appeared.

The same occurred when Jesus Christ our Saviour appeared to Saint Sister Faustina - with the 600 pages of Jesus/God's Holy Divine Mercy messages and Chaplet - then the Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God appeared to Saint Faustina thereafter. Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit are within our Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God and The Blessed Virgin Mary is extremely close to God The Most High as His favoured Holy Daughter and Holy Spouse of The Holy Spirit - and The Holy Rosary was Gifted by God The Most High to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God.

Jesus/God The Most High/The Holy spirit Gifted in His Holy Will mankind with Jesus' Divine Mercy after Jesus Christ our Saviour died and Ascended into Heaven - as indeed God The Most High stated BC to His Apostles that The Messiah was forthcoming with His Mercy.

Jesus then delivered His Divine Mercy Chaplet as the last hopes of salvation for mankind (in Jesus' Holy Words) for people to pray to Him repentant and unrepentant given that Jesus Christ our Saviour gave His Divine Mercy Chaplet to priests through Saint Faustina and it was delayed being delivered to mankind by 40 years - between the years 1930s - 1970's when finally Pope John Paul II fulfilled Jesus Christ our Saviours requests getting around the then Vatican members and creating through Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit "Divine Mercy Sunday Feast - the Feast of The Divine Mercy - Jesus is the "Unfathomable Divine Mercy Himself".

Jesus' Holy words in relation to His Holy Scriptures with Revelations that Jesus will be appearing first as King of Mercy here on earth then after being here on Earth as King of Mercy (Divine Mercy) of which Jesus appeared to Saint Faustina delivering His Divine Mercy, Jesus will then appear in His Second Coming soon after this:

"

THE SECRET OF THE ROSARY

(one passage below - refer to the Third Rose of The Most Holy Rosary and the Fourth Rose of the Most Holy Rosary) Saint Dominic and Blessed Alan De la Roche).


FOURTH ROSE: BLESSED ALAN DE LA ROCHE

ALL THINGS, even the holiest, are subject to change, especially when they are dependent on man's free will. It is hardly to be wondered at, then, that the Confraternity of the Holy Rosary only retained its fervor for one century after it was instituted by Saint Dominic. After this, it was like a thing buried and forgotten.

Doubtless, too, the wicked scheming and jealousy of the devil were largely responsible for getting people to neglect the Holy Rosary, and thus block the flow of God's grace which it had drawn down upon the world.

Thus, in 1349, God punished the whole of Europe and sent the most terrible plague that had ever been known into every land. It started first in the east and spread throughout Italy, Germany, France, Poland and Hungary, bringing desolation wherever it came----for out of hundred men hardly one lived to tell the tale. Big towns, little towns, villages and monasteries were almost completely deserted during the three years that the epidemic lasted.

This scourge of God was quickly followed by two others: the heresy of the Flagellantes and a tragic schism in 1376.

[Web Master Note: The Flagellantes were members a group, who, naked to the waist, used the discipline of self-flagellation most extremely. In the beginning, they were not in actual error; but in course of time they declared, that no one could receive the forgiveness of his sins, unless he entered their confraternity; and although laymen, they confess and absolved one another. They passed from Italy to Germany, and from that to Hungary. They were condemned at Paris, 1349.]

Later on when these trials were over, thanks to the mercy of God, Our Lady told Blessed Alan to revive the ancient Confraternity of the Most Holy Rosary. Blessed Alan was one of the Dominican Fathers from the monastery at Dinan, in Brittany. He was an eminent theologian and was famous for his sermons. Our Lady chose him because, since the Confraternity had originally been started in this province, it was most fitting that a Dominican from the very same province should have the honor of re-establishing it.
Blessed Alan began this great work in 1460 after a special warning from Our Lord. This is how he received His urgent message, as he tells it himself:

One day when he was saying Mass, Our Lord, Who wished to spur him on to preach the Holy Rosary, spoke to him in the Sacred Host:

"How can you crucify Me again so soon?" Jesus said.

"What did You say, Lord?" asked Blessed Alan, horrified.

"You crucified Me once before by your sins," answered Jesus, "and I would willingly be crucified again rather than have My Father offended by the sins you used to commit. You are crucifying Me again now because you have all the learning and understanding that you need to preach My Mother's Rosary, and you are not doing so. If you only did this you could teach many souls the right path and lead them away from sin----but you are not doing it and so you yourself are guilty of the sins that they commit."

This terrible reproach made Blessed Alan solemnly resolve to preach the Rosary unceasingly.

Our Lady too spoke to him one day to inspire him to preach the Holy Rosary more and more:

"You were a great sinner in your youth," she said, "but I obtained the grace of your conversion from my Son. Had such a thing been possible I would have liked to have gone through all kinds of suffering to save you because converted sinners are a glory to me. And I would have done this also to make you worthy of preaching my Rosary far and wide."

Saint Dominic appeared to Blessed Alan as well and told him of the great results of his ministry: he had preached the Holy Rosary unceasingly, his sermons had borne great fruit and many people had been converted during his missions. He said to Blessed Alan:

"See the wonderful results I have had through preaching the Holy Rosary! You and all those who love Our Lady ought to do the same so that, by means of this holy practice of the Rosary, you may draw all people to the real science of the virtues."

Briefly, then, this is the history of how Saint Dominic established the Holy Rosary and of how Blessed Alan de la Roche restored it.



Love and kindest wishes your Sister in Jesus Christ our Saviour

 

[Albion]

I feel compelled enter this discussion. You argue with Albion with regard to theology (not allowed on CF) and you misrepresent the teachings of the Church.

THE VISIONS
The Roman Catholic Church has made extensive prayerful study of the hundreds of visions and apparitions over the centuries. Only NINE are approved by the Church. This is not one of them. The Church cautions us with regard to belief in apparitions and in an messages coming from them. The pope has recently spoken out on the subject. Catholics are not even required to believe in the nine apparitions.

ORIGIN OF THE ROSARY
You properly point out that praying the pater nosher with prayer beads is a tradition that precedes St Dominic. I would also mention that none of the pictures or documents of the time associates St Dominic with the rosary. Albion calls such stories legends; we call them traditions. In any case, the are not "fact" or doctrine. We are free to accept or reject them.

THE ROSARY AS A DEVOTION
IMHO, the rosary an important devotion and discipline. Anglicans have an Anglican rosary. Many Anglicans reject such devotions. For me, as with all disciplines and devotions, what matters is not belief in an apparition and the orders supposedly given there. What matters is how the discipline brings us close to Jesus. Over the centuries, many have testified that the rosary has done that for them.

I appreciate a voice of moderation and common sense like yours. I might only add, just as a footnote, that the so-called Anglican rosary is not a rosary in any sense except as a counting device. It's with regard to all the rest that is attributed to the Dominican rosary that controversy arises.

 

[mark46]

This is what Pope Francis thinks of apparitions.

According to Vatican Radio, Pope Francis was cautioning people against excessive curiosity about the future and contrasting it with the wisdom that comes from the Holy Spirit:

Curiosity, the Pope continued, impels us to want to feel that the Lord is here or rather there, or leads us to say: “But I know a visionary, who receives letters from Our Lady, messages from Our Lady”. And the Pope commented: “But, look, Our Lady is the Mother of everyone! And she loves all of us. She is not a postmaster, sending messages every day.”

Such responses to these situations, he affirmed, “distance us from the Gospel, from the Holy Spirit, from peace and wisdom, from the glory of God, from the beauty of God.”

“Jesus says that the Kingdom of God does not come in a way that attracts attention: it comes by wisdom.”


Read more: Did Pope Francis just tip his hand on Medjugorje? (10 things to know and share) |Blogs | NCRegister.com

 

[mark46]

Agreed.

IMHO, the Anglican rosary is similar in use to the Orthodox prayer rope or the prayer beads used in the Church long before St Dominic. The focus is often on the Our Father and on the Jesus Prayer. Using these prayers as part of a contemplative prayer life has a very long history.

The use of this particular set of beads seems to have started recently in TEC. IMHO, this turn toward the contemplative was one of the positives given us by TEC.

I might only add, just as a footnote, that the so-called Anglican rosary is not a rosary in any sense except as a counting device. It's with regard to all the rest that is attributed to the Dominican rosary that controversy arises.

 

[Galilee63]

I am leaving satan and its ego, pride and grandiose debating and arguing out of the posts through prayer to Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary.

That stated - it is Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary's Loving Holy wishes to cease discouragement and promote encouragement to all people Christians and non-Christians to pray to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God Her Holy Rosary including The Our Father's, The Hail Mary's, the Glory Be's, The Creed, The Hail Holy Queen Prayer, The Memorare, and all of the other Prayers that Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit have given mankind through His Blessed Saints.

The greatest weapon against satan and its evil is The Holy Rosary. Some of the reasons being are that God The Most High/Jesus/The Holy Spirit gave The Blessed Virgin Mary Her Holy Rosary with its Prayers contained therein Glorifying and Praising Jesus/God The Most High with Holy Plenary Indulgences granted in God's Holy Will - of which satan cannot abide. Satan flees when The Holy Rosary prayed to The Blessed Virgin Mary is commenced. When the Hail Mary Prayer is prayed to The Blessed Virgin Mary satan flees. Satan attempts working through any people he knows is in likelihood of preaching or degrading The Holy Rosary and/or is likely to discourage others from praying to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God - God The Most High's Holy Favoured Daughter in Heaven and The Holy Spirit's Spouse and of course The Holy Mother of God - Jesus Christ our Saviour of Whom is our Heavenly Mother, our Loving Holy Intercessory for all people here of whom turn to The Blessed Virgin Mary and for all of the Holy Souls in Purgatory.

You obviously have not read Saint Louis De Montfort's book entitled The Secret of The Rosary Mark - the priest/Saint of whom documented the writings of Saint Dominic and Blessed Alan de la Roche the priest - regardless of whether the RCC acknowledged this fact or not. Fact - yes it is a fact - confirmed by Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary to my heart - spoken to my heart Mark.

Consecrating one's own heart to Jesus' Sacred Heart daily, Consecrating one's own Heart to the Blessed Virgin Mary's Immaculate Heart while regularly fasting if healthy, while repenting sins from the heart in genuine remorse, trusting in Jesus completely, facing Jesus' Holy Sacred Heart Holy Images and the Blessed Virgin Mary's Holy Immaculate Heart Image, around one self, in front of Jesus' Holy Cross, while praying Jesus Divine Mercy Chaplet, The Holy Rosary, The Our Father's The Glory Be's, The Hail Mary's and all of the prayers that God The Most High gave mankind to pray, while focussing on Jesus Life, His bitter Passion, His Sorrowful Stations of His Cross, His Agonies, torments and sufferings, is not something to be warned about Mark - these are the ways in which Holy Scriptures - God's Holy Word - taught us to do Mark in order to receive Jesus/God The Holy Spirit into our hearts, coming closer to Him.

In relation Mark to Pope Francis the world's Father of The RCC - I pray for him daily including the requests for Holy Plenary Indulgences for Holy Causes and world causes with all of the Glory being Yours Dear God our Heavenly Father now and forever. Amen. Dear Lord.

I have a spiritual director which is in accordance with the RCC's Encyclicals and Catechism.

Thank you Mark.

All things are possible by God our Heavenly Father Mark including speaking to hearts.

Just as God The Most High and The Holy Spirit did with Jesus Christ our Saviour during His life here on Earth.

Just as God The Most High spoke with His Apostles (His priests and high priests Melchizedek included).

And all it takes is complete trust in Jesus Christ our Saviour in heartfelt prayer with repentance and fasting if healthy.

By discouraging people turning away from The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God praying to our Heavenly Mother Mary, one is discouraging the 'conversion of sinners' of which Jesus delivered His Divine Mercy Chaplet for mankind to pray after appearing to Saint Faustina countless times, and responsible (soul wise) from discouraging potential Christians and non-believers, new Christians and Catholics coming closer to Jesus Christ our Saviour/God/The Holy Spirit through The Holy Rosary prayed to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God for Her Loving Holy Intercession to Jesus/God The Most High not only here on earth - for our soul salvation eternally in Jesus/God's Holy Will. and responsible for all of the holy causes one may have been praying to Jesus/God and The Blessed Virgin Mary of which Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit answers.

Any discouragement of people turning others away from prayer to Jesus His Divine Mercy Chaplet and prayer to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God - is obviously not a good thing for our souls eternally in Jesus/God's Holy Will and I make this point as a Sister in Jesus Christ our Saviour.

Turning people away from The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God and Her Holy Rosary is a sign of satan and its evil ways tempting people to criticize, doubt, discourage others from praying The Holy Rosary to the Blessed Virgin Mary of Whom has worked with sorrow in Her Holy Immaculate Heart, trying so hard, to convert sinners leading them back to Jesus Christ our Saviour through The Holy Trinity.

The greatest weapon and armour against satan of all time - for people to pray and be assisted by Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit.

The Holy Rosary contains "The Our Father's, The Hail Mary's, "the Glory be to the Father and to The Son and to The Holy Spirit as it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be world without end, Amen" of which are contained within our Lord's Holy Scriptures - God The Most High BC and Jesus' New Testament.

In effect, Albion, Mark and all others of whom are discouraging people from praying to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God - Her Holy Rosary - one is discouraging people from praying to Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit addressing God The Most High within His "Our Father" Prayer, Loving and Glorifying Jesus/God The Most High/The Holy Spirit and adoring loving and praising The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother - it is rejection of Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit within His Holy Prayers given to mankind through His Holy Scriptures.

Both Jesus' Divine Mercy Chaplet and The Holy Rosary if prayed more greatly and widely to Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit and to The Blessed Virgin Mary could have saved billions of souls throughout the ages, could have saved many priests from committing atrocities, could have saved many Families worldwide from divorce, could have averted wars and destruction and the destruction of God's earth and universe, most greatly taken countries out of poverty - we were all gifted tremendously (words cannot convey) by God The Most High The Holy Rosary given to our Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God.

Love and kindest wishes your Sister in Jesus Christ our Saviour

 

[Galilee63]

The future in God's Holy Will with the Second Coming of our Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour is contained within Jesus' Divine Mercy and Divine Mercy Holy messages already delivered to the world to mankind through Saint Sister Faustina during the 1930's of which were delayed by 40 years - with most importantly Jesus Divine Mercy Chaplet - of which could have saved millions of souls around the world had Jesus' Divine Mercy Chaplet been prayed to Jesus and in particular during the Feast of The Divine Mercy Sunday with the 9 Day Holy Novena (now approved by the Catholic Church and Vatican members praised be to Thee Dear God my Heavenly Father) prayed as Jesus Christ our Saviour states:

"the soul that goes to Confession and receives Holy Communion turning to My Divine Mercy will receive My Daughter, forgiveness of sins at the hour of death."


"I will stand between My Father and the dying person at the hour of death".

Jesus/God has spoken to my heart with His Holy message:

"Know this My Daughter I will return in just judgement for those whom doubt My Mother".

"That is all".

 

[mark46]

Both Jesus' Divine Mercy Chaplet and The Holy Rosary if prayed more greatly and widely to Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit and to The Blessed Virgin Mary could have saved billions of souls throughout the ages, could have saved many priests from committing atrocities, could have saved many Families worldwide from divorce, could have averted wars and destruction and the destruction of God's earth and universe, most greatly taken countries out of poverty - we were all gifted tremendously (words cannot convey) by God The Most High The Holy Rosary given to our Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God.

I think that we should all look at this position prayerfully. The rosary and the chaplet of divine mercy are wonderful prayers. However, and this is a rather big however, the idea that ANY should saved by the recitation of these prayers runs counter to the teachings of the Church and to Scripture.

One can speak of participating in the Divine Liturgy as being part of our salvation. That certainly makes sense.

To suggest that the recitation of private prayers will save billions is simply not what the Church teaches.

 

[mark46]

The future in God's Holy Will with the Second Coming of our Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour is contained within Jesus' Divine Mercy and Divine Mercy Holy messages already delivered to the world to mankind through Saint Sister Faustina during the 1930's of which were delayed by 40 years - with most importantly Jesus Divine Mercy Chaplet - of which could have saved millions of souls around the world had Jesus' Divine Mercy Chaplet been prayed to Jesus and in particular during the Feast of The Divine Mercy Sunday with the 9 Day Holy Novena (now approved by the Catholic Church and Vatican members praised be to Thee Dear God my Heavenly Father) prayed as Jesus Christ our Saviour states:

"the soul that goes to Confession and receives Holy Communion turning to My Divine Mercy will receive My Daughter, forgiveness of sins at the hour of death."


"I will stand between My Father and the dying person at the hour of death".

Jesus/God has spoken to my heart with His Holy message:

"Know this My Daughter I will return in just judgement for those whom doubt My Mother".

"That is all".

Please show us from the Catechism where the Church states that ANYONE is saved by the recitation of the Chaplet of Divine Mercy would save millions, or anyone. To be blunt, it the Grace of Jesus that saves, not our saying of particular prayers, even those approved by the Church.

The Chaplet of Divine Mercy is a wonderful prayer. The issue is understanding the value of repeating private prayers (prayers outside of the Mass).

 

[Galilee63]

Had The Holy Rosary been prayed by billions of Catholics and Christians around the world during each Century, in all probability, many atrocities within Jesus/God/The Holy Spirits Holy Will may well have been averted - given that The Holy Rosary to The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God is answered in Jesus/God's Holy Will and we were all strongly encouraged to pray The Holy Rosary for Centuries by Jesus Christ our Saviour and The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God via Jesus appearing to Saint Dominic and Blessed Alan De La Roche including The Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God appearing to many many Saints throughout the ages, many of which, are approved by the RCC.

The Holy Rosary told by Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary is the most powerful weapon against satan for people to pray to The Blessed Virgin Mary.

Love and kindest wishes your Sister in Jesus Christ our Saviour

 

[faroukfarouk]

I guess 1 Timothy 2.5 is very relevant.

 

[justinangel]

No one argues there were denominations, and you are getting caught up with that word. What is aegued is that the Church has always existed in many locations in relationship and in communion with other Churches. The Church in Jerusalem, the Church in England, the Church in Rome. the Church in Russia....

Historically, in the first millennium, the churches in the different regions were not independent or absolutely autocephalous corporate entities free to espouse whatever doctrines they chose at odds with the Apostolic Tradition of the one visible universal Church. The sentence reached by the Council of Ephesus against Nestorius, the Bishop of Constantinople, clearly illustrates that the Church at that time did not perceive herself to be that which you think the Church essentially is: a pneumatic invisible body. It was Celestine, Bishop of Rome, who commissioned Cyril, Bishop of Alexandria, to investigate the unorthodox teachings of Nestorius, Bishop of Constantinople, and report back to him. After Cyril had sent a full account of Nestorius' teachings to Celestine, the latter held a synod at Rome which condemned Nestorius' teachings heretical. He then instructed Cyril to proceed in his name against Nestorius, who was to be excommunicated and deposed unless he retracted in ten days. Celestine also restored all the clergy who had been excommunicated and deposed by Nestorius.


The judgment against Nestorius

The holy synod said: As, in addition to all else, the excellent Nestorius has declined to obey our summons and has not received the holy and God-fearing bishops we sent to him, we have of necessity started upon an investigation of his impieties. We have found him out thinking and speaking in an impious fashion, from his letters, from his writings that have been read out, and from the things that he has recently said in this metropolis which have been witnessed to by others; and as a result we have been compelled of necessity both by

•the canons and by
•the letter of our most holy father and fellow servant Celestine, bishop of the church of the Romans, to issue this sad condemnation against him, though we do so with many tears.
Our lord Jesus Christ, who has been blasphemed by him, has determined through this most holy synod that the same Nestorius should be stripped of his episcopal dignity and removed from the college of priests.

Council of Ephesus [A.D. 431]

Sometimes, these groups have existed in impaired communion, or in actual schism, and sometimes that sort of thing happens for a while and later goes back to normal.

Nestorius did not only lose his episcopal seat, but was also excommunicated for refusing to recant. The Assyrian church of the East rejected the pronouncements against Nestorius made by the Council of Ephesus and confirmed by Celestine, since none of its bishops had attended the council, having been Nestorian themselves. This group is still separated from the Church as a result of the Nestorian schism. Both the Catholic and Assyrian Church are not jointly holding one umbrella despite their doctrinal differences.

This is very much the sort of situations Anglicans understand was the case with the CofE - a schism based on the same kind of problem that led to the Great Schism, the inappropriate understanding and practice of papal power. Just as it had previously led every other patriarch to sever communion with the papacy, it eventually led to even other western Christians doing so. In the case of England, it was wholesale - bishops and all.

At the first point of severance from the Catholic Church the bishops in England had no choice but to comply with the statutes of the Royal Act of Supremacy passed by parliament with the consent of Henry Vlll which required that he be the supreme head of the Church in England instead of the Pope. The breach with the Holy See at Rome did not spring from religious motives but was initially based on Erastianism.

You are simply wrong that Anglicanism officially believes in consubstantiation -the most accurate description would be that Anglicanism affirms the Real Presence - much as the East does.

Most of you believe that Christ is both spiritually and physically present in the Holy Eucharist, but only sacramentally- not corporeally. This is just another shade of consubstantiation.

Much of what you are saying here seems to be arguing in a circle. " The Catholic Church is the true CHurch and the CofE is outside that.

The Eastern Fathers at the Council of Ephesus may have been accused of begging the question when they anathematized and excommunicated Nestorius and his followers in union with the Bishop of Rome because they refused to accept Mary as the Mother of God. Anyway, since the Church of England is not the Church in England, Anglican Marian theology is diverse between the more traditional 'High-Church' and more Protestantised evangelical 'low church' components. Anglicans have not really been of one mind and persuasion and disagree with each other on what to believe and practice ever since they separated themselves from communion with the Holy See at Rome. But at least most of you, if not all, agree that Mary is the Mother of God.

“But since it would be too long to enumerate in such a volume as this the succession of all the churches, we shall confound all those who, in whatever manner, whether through self-satisfaction or vainglory, or through blindness and wicked opinion, assemble other than where it is proper, by pointing out here the successions of the bishops of the greatest and most ancient church known to all, founded and organized at Rome by the two most glorious apostles, Peter and Paul, that church which has the tradition and the faith which comes down to us after having been announced to men by the apostles. With that church, because of its superior origin, all the churches must agree, that is, all the faithful in the whole world, and it is in her that the faithful everywhere have maintained the apostolic tradition.”
Against Irenaeus, Heresies, 3:3.2 [A.D. 189]



PAX

 

[Galilee63]

Dear Mark,

My Brother in Jesus Christ our Saviour,

To be loving polite and caring and abide in CF's rules and regulations Mark, I will respond to your comments here.

Most of all, because Jesus Christ our Saviour states within His Divine Mercy that He is able to flow - through His Fount of Mercy "Divine Mercy" Jesus' flows His Graces opening up an ocean of Mercy for people whom recite His Chaplet of Divine Mercy at 3pm and during the Good Friday week praying His 9 Day Chaplet and Novena going to Confession and Holy Communion and at other times praying Jesus' Divine Mercy Chaplet, however, preferably at 3pm which was Jesus request.

I have been referencing God The Most High within His Old Testament/Holy Word and making reference to Jesus and His Disciples Teachings within His New Testament in direct relation to God The Most High's Holy Words on The Messiah's "Mercy" and Jesus Christ our Saviour's Mercy and Divine Mercy on other threads previously Mark.

Jesus' Mercy is His Divine Mercy of which Pope John Paul II has approved including Jesus Christ our Saviour's Divine Mercy Chaplet, The Feast of Divine Mercy Sunday, with the Chaplet of Divine Mercy to be prayed at any time (3pm preferably Jesus has requested of mankind) in Church, at home, anywhere to be prayed, turning to Jesus and His Divine Mercy, our Unfathomable Divine Mercy Himself

Jesus requested of mankind to pray Jesus' Divine Mercy Chaplet with the 9 Day Novena Jesus has provided within His Divine Mercy Holy messages to mankind through Saint Faustina, commencing Good Friday, with Confession and Holy Communion received - those people/souls of whom pray to Jesus His Divine Mercy Chaplet and the Prayers within His 9 Day Novena, with Confession to Jesus and Holy Communion received within the Holy Good Friday week (Confession must be done within three days of the 9 Day Novena recited) then Jesus is able to forgive people/souls all of their sins for eternity and during the last hour of death. This is one of the primary reasons that so many Catholics are indeed spreading Jesus' Divine Mercy Chaplet and Divine Mercy Holy messages.

What a most Loving beautiful Holy Gift that Jesus Christ our Saviour has given in His Holy Will to mankind in order to receive Jesus' Divine Mercy further and the opportunity to receive Jesus' Divine Mercy at the hour of death - praying to Jesus Christ our Saviour His Divine Mercy Chaplet just once during our lives - Jesus has stated this fact within His Divine Mercy Holy messages to Saint Faustina for mankind Mark.


"Say unceasingly the chaplet that I have taught you. Whoever will recite it will receive great mercy at the hour of death. Priests will recommend it to sinners as their last hope of salvation. Even if there were a sinner most hardened, if he were to recite this chaplet only once, he would receive grace from My infinite mercy. I desire that the whole world know My infinite mercy. I desire to grant unimaginable graces to those souls who trust in My mercy". (687)

"Mankind will have no peace until it turns to the Fount of My Mercy"

- * Jesus' Divine Mercy, turning to Jesus in repentance, praying to Jesus His Divine Mercy Chaplet, asking for Jesus' Mercy, His Divine Mercy, focussing on Jesus Himself, His Life, His Bitter Passion, His Sorrows, His Agonies, His Sorrowful Stations of His Cross, opening our Hearts to Jesus, praying to Jesus His Divine Mercy Chaplet and Jesus' 9 Day Novena commencing Good Friday with Confession and Holy Communion during that week:

"Jesus Christ our Saviour has stated that He is able to give His Divine Mercy Graces to that person/soul praying His Divine Mercy Chaplet and stand between the dying person and His Father during the last hours of death with the 9 Day Novena prayed commencing Good Friday".

"Write that when they say this chaplet in the presence of the dying, I will stand between My Father and the dying person, not as the just Judge but as the merciful Savior". (1540-1541)

"Say unceasingly the chaplet that I have taught you. Whoever will recite it will receive great mercy at the hour of death. Priests will recommend it to sinners as their last hope of salvation. Even if there were a sinner most hardened, if he were to recite this chaplet only once, he would receive grace from My infinite mercy. I desire that the whole world know My infinite mercy. I desire to grant unimaginable graces to those souls who trust in My mercy. (687)


The souls that say this chaplet will be embraced by My mercy during their lifetime and especially at the hour of their death. (754)

At the hour of their death, I defend as My own glory every soul that will say this chaplet; or when others say it for a dying person, the indulgence is the same. (811)

Oh, what great graces I will grant to souls who say this chaplet; the very depths of My tender mercy are stirred for the sake of those who say the chaplet"
(848)"There are souls who despise My graces as well as all the proofs of My love. They do not wish to hear My call, but proceed into the abyss of hell. The loss of these souls plunges Me into deadly sorrow. God though I am, I cannot help such a soul because it scorns Me; having a free will, it can spurn Me or love Me. You, who are the dispenser of My mercy, tell all the world about My goodness, and thus you will comfort My Heart:. (580)

"My sanctity and perfection consist in the close union of my will with the will of God. God never violates our free will. It is up to us whether we want to receive God's grace or not. It is up to us whether we will cooperate with it or waste it. (1107)

... Let no soul fear to draw near to Me, even though its sins be as scarlet". (699)

He who refuses to pass through the door of My mercy must pass through the door of My justice... (1146)

At three o'clock, implore My mercy, especially for sinners; and, if only for a brief moment, immerse yourself in My Passion, particularly in My abandonment at the moment of agony. This is the hour of great mercy for the whole world. I will allow you to enter into My mortal sorrow. In this hour, I will refuse nothing to the soul that makes a request of Me in virtue of My Passion.... (Diary, 1320)

I remind you, My daughter, that as often as you hear the clock strike the third hour, immerse yourself completely in My mercy, adoring and glorifying it; invoke its omnipotence for the whole world, and particularly for poor sinners; for at that moment mercy was opened wide for every soul. In this hour you can obtain everything for yourself and for others for the asking; it was the hour of grace for the whole world-mercy triumphed over justice.
My daughter, try your best to make the Stations of the Cross in this hour, provided that your duties permit it; and if you are not able to make the Stations of the Cross, then at least step into the chapel for a moment and adore, in the Blessed Sacrament, My Heart, which is full of mercy; and should you be unable to step into the chapel, immerse yourself in prayer there where you happen to be, if only for a very brief instant. (1572)

I desire that you know more profoundly the love that burns in My Heart for souls, and you will understand this when you meditate upon My Passion. Call upon My mercy on behalf of sinners; I desire their salvation. When you say this prayer, with a contrite heart and with faith on behalf of some sinner, I will give him the grace of conversion. This is the prayer:

"O Blood and Water, which gushed forth from the Heart of Jesus as a fount of Mercy for us, I trust in You." (186-187)


"The Lord said to me, My daughter, do not tire of proclaiming My mercy. In this way you will refresh this Heart of Mine, which burns with a flame of pity for sinners. Tell My priests that hardened sinners will repent on hearing their words when they speak about My unfathomable mercy, about the compassion I have for them in My Heart. To priests who proclaim and extol My mercy, I will give wondrous power; I will anoint their words and touch the hearts of those to whom they will speak". (1521)

"My mercy is greater than your sins and those of the entire world. Who can measure the extent of my goodness? For you I descended from heaven to earth; for you I allowed myself to be nailed to the cross; for you I let my Sacred Heart be pierced with a lance, thus opening wide the source of mercy for you. Come, then, with trust to draw graces from this fountain. I never reject a contrite heart. Your misery has disappeared in the depths of My mercy. Do not argue with Me about your wretchedness. You will give me pleasure if you hand over to me all your troubles and griefs. I shall heap upon you the treasures of My grace. (1485)

My daughter, tell souls that I am giving them My mercy as a defense. I Myself am fighting for them and am bearing the just anger of My Father". (1516)"The greater the sinner, the greater the right he has to My mercy. My mercy is confirmed in every work of My hands. He who trusts in My mercy will not perish, for all his affairs are Mine, and his enemies will be shattered at the base of My footstool". (723)

"My daughter, know that My Heart is mercy itself. From this sea of mercy, graces flow out upon the whole world. No soul that has approached Me has ever gone away unconsoled. All misery gets buried in the depths of My mercy, and every saving and sanctifying grace flows from this fountain". (1777)

"Write: I am Thrice Holy, and I detest the smallest sin. I cannot love a soul which is stained with sin; but when it repents, there is no limit to My generosity toward it. My mercy embraces and justifies it. With My mercy, I pursue sinners along all their paths, and My Heart rejoices when they return to Me. I forget the bitterness with which they fed My Heart and rejoice at their return".

"Tell sinners that no one shall escape My Hand; if they run away from My Merciful Heart, they will fall into My Just Hands. Tell sinners that I am always waiting for them, that I listen intently to the beating of their heart... when will it beat for Me? Write, that I am speaking to them through their remorse of conscience, through their failures and sufferings, through thunderstorms, through the voice of the Church. And if they bring all My graces to naught, I begin to be angry with them, leaving them alone and giving them what they want" (1728)

Our Blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God:

"Further My Children, with this in mind, turn to My Son Jesus, your Saviour, from your hearts in repentance to My Son, to receive Jesus further into your hearts, coming closer to Him".

"Pray to Me The Rosary".

"That is all".