The RCC born in 313 AD?

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Albion

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yes, he accomplished the dividing of Christ's Church

That would be the Pope's doing. Luther was more than willing to work within the church for reform. He wasn't even given a hearing.

now we have 50,000 +
different denominations all teaching their own version of truth

quite an accomplishment

Religious liberty, freedom of conscience, Bible study, being able to worship in the language we understand, allowing the laity to take communion in both forms, reasserting the right and ability of men and women to go to their God without permission from middlemen, etc. Yes, Luther did accomplish much that even the knee-jerk critics of today have benefitted mightily from (considering that the Roman Church has adopted most of what Luther advocated, but it just took the Pope four centuries to get around to it!)
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Originally Posted by truthHurts77 yes, he accomplished the dividing of Christ's Church
Originally Posted by Albion That would be the Pope's doing. Luther was more than willing to work within the church for reform. He wasn't even given a hearing.
Quite true. Luther didn't excommunicate the Pope.
:)
Which leads me to ask, how are Popes excommunicated?

http://www.christianforums.com/t6790703/
Great Schism and effect on Christianity and Theology

Following the rule of Charlemagne, Christianity spread throughout Europe which served as a unifying force for the continent. This was in part due to the Great Schism of 1054 where two competing religious authorities, Pope Leo IX of the Roman Catholic Church, and Patriarch Michael I of the Eastern Orthodox faith, excommunicated each other in a dispute over authority..............
 
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SolomonVII

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jataylo

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Constatine was a roman emporer who was Christian and not only stopped persecutions against the early church but allowed it to flourish for little while. However, he did have quite a pesky way of trying to get involved with Church affairs. However, the Church was around before then as the writings we have from the early Church show:

We see the Church present in name:

"Let no one do anything of concern to the Church without the bishop. Let that be considered a valid Eucharist which is celebrated by the bishop or by one whom he ordains. Whereever the bishop appears, let the people be there; just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church" Letter to the Smyrneans 8:2 Ignatius of Antioch (110 AD)

And of the elect, he was one indeed, the wonderful martyr Polycarp, who in our days was an apostolic and prophetic teacher, bishop of the Catholic Church in Smyrna. For every word which came forth from his mouth was fulfilled and will be fulfilled" Martyrdom of Polycarp 16:2 (155 AD)

And in teachings:

"the blessed Peter, the chosen, the preeminent, the first among the disciples, for whom alone with himself the Savior paid the tribute, quickly grasped and understood their meaning. And what does he say? 'Behold, we have left all and have to followed you"" Who is the Rich Man That is Saved? 21:3-5 Clement of Alexandria (200 AD)

"Be it known to you, my lord, that Simon, who, for the sake of the true faith, and the most sure foundation of his doctrine, was set apart to be the foundation of the Church, and for this end was by Jesus himself, with his truthful mouth, named Peter, the first fruits of our Lord, the first of the apostles; to whom first the Fathers revealed the Son; whom the Christ, with good reason, blessed; the called, and elect" Letter of Clement to James 2 (221 AD)

"He then speaks of those Gentiles, namely us who in every place offer sacrifices to hm, that is, the bread of the Eucharist and also the cup of the Eucharist" Dialogue with Trypho the Jew 41 (155 AD)

"Baptize first the children, and if they can speak for themselves let them do so. Otherwise, let their parents or other relatives speak for them" The Apostolic Tradition 21:16 Hippolytus (215 AD)

"Are you unwilling to be anointed with the oil of God? It is on this account that we are called Christians: because we are anointed with the oil of God" Theophilus of Antioch 1:12 (181 AD)--this is confirmation in the Catholic Church.

"We call this food Eucharist, and no one else is permitted to partake of it, except those who believes our teaching to be true and who has been washed in the washing which is for the remission of sins and for pregeneration and is thereby living as Christ enjoined. For not as common bread nor common drink do we receive these; but since Jesus Christ our Savior was made incarnate by the word of God and had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so too, as we have been taught, the food which has been made into the Eucharist by the Eucharistic prayer set down by him, and by the change of which our blood and flesh is nurtured, is both the flesh and blood of that incarnate Jesus" First Apology 66 Justin Martyr (151 AD).

"Confess your sins in church, and do not go up to your prayer with an evil conscience. This is the way of life....On the Lord's Day gather together, break bread, and give thanks, after confessing your transgressions so that your sacrifice may be pure" Didache 4:14, 14:1 (70 AD)

So whoever is making these claims needs to explain why Catholic name and doctrine appear all over early Christian writings, and where the Church that he claims to be the be the True Church was in the early writtings.
 
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Standing Up

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-snip-
So whoever is making these claims needs to explain why Catholic name and doctrine appear all over early Christian writings, and where the Church that he claims to be the be the True Church was in the early writtings.

The easiest way for you to prove that what is called the Roman Catholic Church is the same as the very early Church is to dig out the explicit four Marian dogmas, the latest one was 1950, from c100-300. Can you do that? If not, then obviously RC is not the same as the early Church.

Good luck ...
 
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Athanasias

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I feel the urge to add the sabbath to this discussion. We all know the Catholic Church and her Popes were created on the year 1497 A.D. which just happens to be the same year the sabbath was ruined and changed to sunday!!!!!!!...........talk amongst yourselves!
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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I feel the urge to add the sabbath to this discussion. We all know the Catholic Church and her Popes were created on the year 1497 A.D. which just happens to be the same year the sabbath was ruined and changed to sunday!!!!!!!...........talk amongst yourselves!
Well, I for one think the RCC finally did something right by doing that.
My hat goes off to it for that :)

images
images
 
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Athanasias

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Well, I for one think the RCC finally did something right by doing that.
My hat goes off to it for that :)

images
images

excellent! Have you seen the picture of JP II that says You ready to Rock! Its pretty funny!
 
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JacktheCatholic

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Quite true. Luther didn't excommunicate the Pope.

Martin Luther was only a priest/monk/presbyter and did not receive the Charisms of a bishop/bishopric so he did not have the same authority and powers that the Apostles received, only some so as to be a servant to a bishop. Thus, Martin Luther had no power to excommunicate or ordain others.
 
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JacktheCatholic

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excellent! Have you seen the picture of JP II that says You ready to Rock! Its pretty funny!

Our "German Shepherd" is awesome. Luv to see his image.
 
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JacktheCatholic

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[FONT=arial, helvetica, geneva, sans-serif]Irenaeus[/FONT]
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"Matthew also issued among the Hebrews a written Gospel in their own language, while Peter and Paul were evangelizing in Rome and laying the foundation of the Church" (Against Heresies, 3, 1:1 [A.D. 189]).



[FONT=arial, helvetica, geneva, sans-serif]Gaius[/FONT]
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"It is recorded that Paul was beheaded in Rome itself, and Peter, likewise, was crucified, during the reign [of the Emperor Nero]. The account is confirmed by the names of Peter and Paul over the cemeteries there, which remain to the present time. And it is confirmed also by a stalwart man of the Church, Gaius by name, who lived in the time of Zephyrinus, bishop of Rome. This Gaius, in a written disputation with Proclus, the leader of the sect of Cataphrygians, says this of the places in which the remains of the aforementioned apostles were deposited: ‘I can point out the trophies of the apostles. For if you are willing to go to the Vatican or to the Ostian Way, you will find the trophies of those who founded this Church’" (Disputation with Proclus [A.D. 198] in Eusebius, Church History 2:25:5).


[FONT=arial, helvetica, geneva, sans-serif]Pope Damasus I[/FONT]
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"Likewise it is decreed: . . . [W]e have considered that it ought to be announced that although all the Catholic churches spread abroad through the world comprise one bridal chamber of Christ, nevertheless, the holy Roman Church has been placed at the forefront not by the conciliar decisions of other churches, but has received the primacy by the evangelic voice of our Lord and Savior, who says: ‘You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of hell will not prevail against it; and I will give to you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you shall have bound on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you shall have loosed on earth shall be loosed in heaven’ [Matt. 16:18–19]. The first see, therefore, is that of Peter the apostle, that of the Roman Church, which has neither stain nor blemish nor anything like it.


Peter's Roman Residency | Catholic Answers
 
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Athanasias

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Christianity became the official state religion of the Roman empire in 380 ad..

No your wrong! It became official in 1497 when the Roman Catholics invented themselves with there founder Cathel who lived in Rome! Hail Cathel!
 
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SolomonVII

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Christianity became the official state religion of the Roman empire in 380 ad..

Yup.
What Emperor declared Christianity the official religion of the Roman Empire

Best Answer
Constantine was the first emperor to *accept* Christianity but he did *not* make it the official religion of the Roman Empire. Constantine did put a stop to Christian persecution, returned Christian property from pagans and reduced support for pagan religion.

On February 27 380 Theodosius I "... declared "Catholic Christianity" the only legitimate imperial religion, ending state support for the traditional Roman religion."​
This was over 40 years after Constantine had died.
 
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Athanasias

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SolomonVII

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Solomon your wrong Cathel founded it in 1497 in Rome. You need to worship Cathel you know! Worship HIM! NOW!:cool:

There are people on CF that have posted similar things, for sure. If it references to anything at all, it references to fantasy games that are no doubt popular, but I am completely unfamiliar with and uninterested in.

So, perhaps your ideas are better suited to that level of discussion rather than anything that is the norm for me in this one?
 
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Athanasias

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There are people on CF that have posted similar things, for sure. If it references to anything at all, it references to fantasy games that are no doubt popular, but I am completely unfamiliar with and uninterested in.

So, perhaps your ideas are better suited to that level of discussion rather than anything that is the norm for me in this one?


No you need to worship Cathel like the rest of us Catholics do. You need to worship him now! Cathel was a roman but a God! Worship him now! You must!:)
 
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SolomonVII

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No you need to worship Cathel like the rest of us Catholics do. You need to worship him now! Cathel was a roman but a God! Worship him now! You must!:)

Do you teach this at catechism to the children that look up to you?
Do they know how you are spending your time here now?
 
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Athanasias

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Do you teach this at catechism to the children that look up to you?
Do they know how you are spending your time here now?


Of course I do. Don't be silly! We all worship Cathel and now you must too!
 
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