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The Quran's "problem" with Christianity

DamianWarS

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The Qur'an seems to present a perspective of Christianity where Christians worship 3 gods and these gods are Allah, Mariah and Issa (or God, Mary and Jesus). This is something Muslims have commented directly to me like it's assumed knowledge and I have course taken those times to reject such beliefs. This is clearly from passages that reject Mary and Jesus as "gods" or calling God 3 (inserting Allah, Mariah and Issa as the three). The issue is this also is rejected by Orthodox Christianity today and in the 7th century and I'm curious to know where this came from?

During the 7th century dominate Christianity in the AP (Arab Peninsula) was probably Nestorian. What is Nestorian Christianity? It was started by a guy name Nestorius (early 5th century) who was labeled a heretic by rejecting the title of Mary "theotokos" (mother of God) to what he thought was more theologically correct "christotokos" (mother of Christ). He also believed that Jesus had two natures (divine and human). At the time the natures of Christ was not fully articulated by the Church and was still developing but Orthodox Christianity rejected Nestorius thinking in favour of a single nature Christ (later revised to accept something closer to nestorius thinking with 2 natures). He then was exiled where for a time he ended up in the AP and this is where Nestorian Christianity started in the AP (by Nestorius himself)

It's unclear how Nestorianism evolved being unchecked by orthodox Christianity but Nestorius himself was a Nicene Christian and believed in the trinity. He also was against the title of Mary "theotokos" and fought to remove it (which got him exiled and labeled a heretic). Theotokos is actually more about Christ than about Mary and Nestorius didn't disagree with it's teaching but rather its terminology and the potential misleading implications it put on Mary which is why he preferred christotokos. Suffice to say Nestorius rejected worship of Mary or deifying her in any way.

But clearly the prophet of Islam encountered such heretica belief systems and took note to reject them. Some say his wife and uncle may have been Nestorian Christians themselves or at least his exposure to Christianity that he accepted was Nestorian. The Ka'ba itself historical is said to have a painting of Mary and the child Jesus inside (or classic "Madonna and Child" painting) and when all the idols were removed this picture remained (it has since been removed). So The Prophet didn't object to a type of reverence toward Mary and Jesus but he did reject this Allah-Mariah-Issa god partnership. It would seem the objection of this heresy was practiced probably by some fringe Christian group that actually worshiped Allah, Mariah and Issa as separate gods which Christianity, even those with particular affinity to Mary, categorically reject.

The Qu'ran is vehemently anti-tritheistic, and aggressively Unitarian, but intentionally seems to avoids anti-trinitarian language which would be impossible not to come into contact with the word; despite interpretations "ثَلَاثَةٌ" is not "trinity" it is "three". It seems the prophet was contextualizing the monotheistic abrahamic regions of the area recognizing they worship the true God in a polytheistic context; in doing so aggressively rejected any hint of "more than one" affirming only "there is no god by God" which in itself does not reject the trinity.... it perhaps misunderstands it but does not reject it as I too as a Christian can say "there is no god by God" Jesus himself affirms the teaching of the Torah saying "Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one."
 

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Epiphanius of Salamis writes of an heretical group in Arabia in the third century called Collyridianism.

It apparently taught that Mary herself was a goddess and offered her cakes in tribute. It is certainly possible that Mohammed confused Collyridianist doctrines with those of the rest of Christianity when reciting the Koran.
 
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DamianWarS

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I have heard of this but from what I can find it was short lived and was more 5th-6th century and didn't overlap into the 7th when Islam started. It seems to have not really penetrated the AP too and was dominantly women-centric; seems unlikely Muhammad had any exposure to this particular heretical belief.
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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How did Collyridianism not penetrate the Arabian Peninsula? It was then a fourth century Arabian heresy according to Epiphanius. It certainly penetrated it as much as Nestorianism did, especially with the clear Koranic parallelism to their belief presented as Christian doctrine.
I think Gibbon said they survived into the 7th century as well, although I am unsure what his source was.

The very fact that it was perhaps 'women-centric' points to why it may be what is so vehemently rejected by Muhammad in these texts. Anyway, Mohammad was certainly nicer to womenfolk than his Arabian peers, even if still not by modern standards.

I am not aware of a better explanation for the Koran's weird claims of Mary as part of the trinity, then Collyridianist influence. It fits your hypothesis as well, as Collyridianism is a known fringe heretic group worshipping Mary and in the right place, just slightly earlier; this does not mean they were extinct completely by Mohammed's day therefore. I think you are too quick to dismiss the possibility, although of course it is far from certain. It certainly fits better than deriving it from the Nestorianism of Mohammed's near relations.
 
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DamianWarS

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you might be right and there certainly is no better claims for this. Nestorius himself only found himself essentially on the borders of the AP but nestorianism seems to have went much deeper. Collyridianism on the other hand seems to have fizzled out before Islam and I suspect never made it really deep in the AP. The problem however is there is no proof because any christian community that existed in the AP was out of the watch of the church and certainly wouldn't have been valued by Muslims, eventually being removed, so no one really kept track what was going on.

to me Collyridianism doesn't fit but perhaps it does reflect a broader audience that raised Mary up in heretical ways or depicted Christ as a separate god with Allah. The Quran ironically may be the best source of heretical christian communities operating in the AP but that's the issue because it is according to the lense of an outside heretical movement itself and one that both had a particular sensitivity to the oneness of God and lacked a maturity itself to understand different monotheistic values sytems. Islam grew so rapidly they didn't have time to understand their opposers and a Muslim walking into an abandoned cathedral with images of Father, Son, and Mary perhaps was interpreted simply in the wrong way and I suspect the "dove" image of the HS wasn't even noticed.
 
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Gxg (G²)

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If I may say....

You would perhaps appreciate others who have noted how Islam itself is really radical Monotheism at its core when seeing what Mohammad was trying to address (as best as possible) with what he knew:


As Orthodox theologian/scholar David Hart noted best:


Thanks to the holidays, the internet debate about whether Christians and Muslims worship the “same” God and refer to the “same” divine reality by their use of “God” and “Allah,” respectively, has died down a bit; but the question is not likely to go away anytime soon. So far we have mainly heard from Protestant analytic philosophers and evangelical theologians. But what about Roman Catholics and the Orthodox? So far I have not found anything particularly interesting on the subject by contemporary Eastern Orthodox theologians, yet I have learned that in the first millennium Arabic-speaking Christians assumed that both Christianity and Islam believed in the one God/Allah. They commonly spoke of Allah and his Kalimah (Word) and his Ruh (Spirit). Tom Belt has shared with me his recent correspondence with Dr Najib G. Awad, author of Orthodoxy in Arabic Terms. With Awad’s permission I quote this passage from his email to Tom:

But, to my knowledge of the Christian-Muslim Kalam in the early Muslim Era, which I touch upon in my book Orthodoxy in Arabic Terms, the Arab-Speaking, Oriental Christians always believed that they and Islam believe in the same God. So, it was not a problem for them calling the God of the Scripture and of Jesus Christ, “Allah”. They even talked about the Trinity in terms that are reminiscent of the Qur’anic attestation: the Trinity is Allah, his Kalimah (Word) and Ruh (Spirit). They also talked about Jesus as God’s Word ‘kalimat Allah’ intensively in their kalam texts due to this belief in the commonality of their and the Muslim’s belief in God. John of Damascus in the 7th century would treat Islam as just a Christian-Jewish Heresy, not as a totally contrast faith. Timothy I in the 8th century and Theodore abu Qurrah, Abu Ra’itah at-takriti and Ammar al-Basri in the 9th centuries would also speak about the Christian God not just in Arabic terms, but also in Qur’anic ones because they believed that the common components between the Christian and Muslim doctrines of God are far more evident to be ignored or undermined. So, what western scholars like Volf try to reveal to the western world today as a revolutionary and new discovery has been considered a given fact for these Oriental Christians of the 7th-9th centuries.

Once Oriental Christians realized they could not ignore Islam but had to engage it theologically and apologetically, they found they could not simply dismiss it as a form of pagan idolatry.
 
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Gxg (G²)

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On the issue of worshipping Mary, a lot of people do not remember how there were MANY cults devoted to the worship of Mary and that is something Nestorius (despite other areas where flaws were present) HAD to deal with - and many of those groups influenced others to do as Nestorius when they fled down into Arabia. It is no surprise to see others unfamiliar with the background of things and then assuming the Trinity itself meant Allah, Mary and Jesus based on what others were fighting against.

I have noted this elsewhere, but I do think that there are multiple ways that Christian Trinitarianism is actually reflected well within the system of Islam and yet not understood due to the issue of language. And when understanding what's actually said in the Quran rather than going with what most Imams do with giving cultural Islamic teaching instead of what's in the text (just as it is with Christian teaching based on culture rather than scripture), it's very clear that Jesus is presented as He is....

Geoffrey Parrinder noted it well in his book entitled "Jesus in the Quran"

And it's really best to see the Trinity as Radical Monotheism....and The Trinity as radical monotheism has always been a present factor for many Muslims just as it has been for Jews in Judaism when it comes to believing in Christ and yet noting their not being against the concept of the Holy Spirit or Yeshua being the same and yet separate from the Father. And again, there's context - as it concerns how Muslim culture believe/accept the concept of a Trinity .

Something to consider is that Muhammad's mentor and distant blood relative Waraka ibn Nawfal was a Nestorian Christian and that is the key reason behind the denouncement of the specific idea of the Trinity that Muhammad denied in 4:171 as this was a common belief among Nestorians. Of course, others say that Muhammad's uncle also had Ebionite influence and this was present in the references of Christ as a prophet (more shared here and here/here and here).

As another noted best on the matter when it comes to historical background:


In an article well worth reading about the religious practices of the Ebionites found here, author Stephen Tomkins notes, "... it sounds not unlike Islam in all those respects."

There is a reason for that. The Ebionites followed a text known as the Gospel of Matthew to the Hebrews. Although most scholars would say it was lost to history, it is possible that its precepts can be found today in the early suras of a text far more famous known as the Quran.

If true, this could be a fascinating study. Two of the major controversies in the early Christian church were the nature of the divinity of Jesus (how could he be both a man and God?), and the extent to which Christians were to follow Jewish practices and traditions. Although the Apostle Paul's conviction that Jesus was both fully God and fully man and that being Christian meant leaving everything Jewish behind eventually won the day, many groups disagreed. As they and their gospels were declared heretical by early Church councils, they were forced away from the Christian geographical centers of power and some of them ended up in Arabia and Yemen. Two of these were the Nestorians and the Ebionites. Although they are sometimes lumped together, they are distinct in that the Nestorians believed in the divinity of Jesus whereas the Ebionites saw him merely as a Prophet.

One difference between those declared heretics and the orthodox church was that the former often followed only one text, or gospel, rather than all the books that became the New Testament. The Ebionites followed The Gospel of Matthew to the Hebrews (called by some scholars simply the Gospel of the Ebionites). It is probably a second-century compilation including passages from Matthew, Mark, and Luke that emphasizes the compassion and humanity of Jesus while denying his divinity. The Ebionites believed that Jesus was a man, not God, and that a presence called the Holy Spirit descended upon him at his baptism and remained with him until just before his crucifixion. They followed the dietary and health practices of the Jews and placed much emphasis on rituals such as ablution, fasting, and circumcision.

Available online studies of the Ebionites found here and here seem unaware of their continued history after persecution possibly forced them from the Levant into Arabia in the early centuries of the Christian era. There are several reasons for this historical lack of knowledge. One is the fact that the Ebionites were less significant and less known than the Nestorians, the larger Christian sect in Arabia at the time that did accept the divinity of Jesus. Another is that Christian historians typically had little access to ancient Islamic history, until recently only available in Arabic, that made scattered references to theNusraniyah (taken from the town of Nazareth, this is the Quranic word used to describe the non-orthodox Christians in Mecca at the time of Muhammad).

There is another and more significant reason. After Muhammad, Muslims paid little or no attention to the beliefs of Christians and Jews in the Arabian Peninsula other than to compare them critically to Islam. Muslims believe the Quran was revealed directly to Muhammad from Allah via the angel Gabriel. They historically had little interest in the beliefs of others, and even less interest in the possibility that their religious texts and practices influenced Muhammad and the formation of the Quran.

Muslims have placed much emphasis in creating an imaginary genealogy for Muhammad that passes through Abraham all the way back to Adam. Of more historical relevance is that Muslim scholars emphasize his lineage from his ancestor Qusay to Muhammad's grandfather Abdel Mutallib, but ignore that same lineage from Qusay to grandson Assad who was the grandfather of Khadijah, Muhammad's first wife, and Waraqa bin Naufal, the Prophet's distant uncle. The reason Muslims have deliberately ignored that side of the family is that it included relatives including Waraqa and possibly Khadijah herself who were members of the Nusraniyah.

Ancient historian Abu Faraj Al Isfahani noted in his Kitab Al Aghani that Waraqa bin Naufal converted to Nusraniyah, and biographer Ibn Ishaq describes him as a Hanif, one who believed in only one God.

Hadith compilers Bukhari and Sahih Muslim both state that Waraqa bin Naufal translated the Book of the Hebrews and the Gospel into Arabic. It is possible the book they meant was the Gospel of Matthew to the Hebrews.....Among the characteristics of the Ebionites was compassion for the poor and the orphaned. Waraqa bin Naufal, who was both a scholar and the leader of the Ebionites in Mecca, took a special interest in his young relative the orphaned Muhammad. He saw in him qualities of leadership, spent much time with him, and over the years taught Muhammad the Gospel of the Ebionites as well as the contents of the Torah. Waraqa bin Naufal performed Muhammad's marriage to Khadijah, and groomed Muhammad to replace him as the Ebionite spiritual leader in Mecca....The influence of Waraqi bin Naufal upon Muhammad and his revelations continued until Waraqa died. It is not accidental that the Hadith writers note that "revelations ceased for some time" following the death of Waraqa. The reason, of course, is that Muhammad was no longer learning from his Ebionite uncle.

The presence of the Gospel of the Ebionites in the short, poetic Meccan suras with their vivid descriptions of hell and Muhammad's repeated claim that he is a Prophet just like Abraham, Moses, and Jesus is something most Muslims are not allowed to even think about, at least publicly. It's much easier, and safer, to just toe the party line. I would encourage Muslims to be a little more open in their thinking and scholarship.



Some may be surprised by the impact of Nestorian Christians on Islam, although as they traveled far, it's not surprising. They (Nestorian Christians) were very influential in Islam in the Far East with the Mongols as well as other religions, this has been shared before here:

And on the rest of what you have noted, some of this I have tried to bring up before elsewhere, as seen here:

 
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People should remember that the idea of Islam as a separate religion is a fairly modern one.

Dante for instance, has Mohammed in the Eighth circle of Hell, amongst the Heretics - "those who tear the body of Christ asunder"
Piers Ploughman called the Saracens heretics, not infidels. Peter the Venerable called Mohammed the successor of Arius. John of Damascus wrote of Islam in his book on Heresies. The Journey of John de Mandeville speaks of the ease of converting muslims from their heresy to the true worship of Christ.

Islam was seen as an heresy for much of the mediaeval period and beyond. It was only with the growing Orientalist studies after the 16th that it began to be classified as a separate religion, but even this took some time to be established. This was the same time when Protestantism and Catholicism were occasionally classed as separate religions - luckily this idiocy has mostly died down.

Whether Islam is really a separate religion or not, it is certainly derived from Judaeo-Christian roots and we share a lot of ideas. Islam rejects Christ's crucifixion, so based on that, I would class it as separate as well. The discussion between a Muslim and a Christian is however, far different than it would be between a Buddhist, Hindu or Atheist.
 
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Gxg (G²)

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Honestly, growing up with a grandmother who grew up in a sect of Islam AND seeing this discussion often within Black culture (since we have had Muslims and Christians experiencing slavery in America since its founding), a lot of things can feel like it takes awhile for others to become aware of where many never saw any issue. I've seen and met many growing up in Islam who clarified what they meant when it came to things like Jesus being God and the Spirit of God working with him (in raising him from the dead/doing miracles) - and they were very direct noting the Qur'an itself never condemned the Crucifixion. Of course, for many saying Islam does so, there are also Christians saying Jesus never condemned same sex unions in the Bible ...but that is an argument from silence. It's the same in the Qur'an when it comes to the Death/Rise of Christ. I am thankful for this awesome video lecture series investigating the evidence for the crucifixion of the prophet Jesus, looking at what the Qur'an says, the Injil's account and other historical reports.



Where many get confused is when others see people say that they did not kill Christ - and from the perspective that Jesus IS life and LIFE ITSELF could not be defeated, they're right. Jesus did not die spiritually and his physical body was sacrificed when he laid down his life (John 10) and rose again. This is something that even Nestorians debated extensively among themselves when talking on how the nature of Christ could experience death and yet be above it.


 
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DamianWarS

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the quran taken at face value does not need to reject the trinity or the crucifixion as the language is simply not specific enough but doctrines of Islam aggressively reject both. I actually see Muhammad like a Moses character in that Moses had to deal with a people who had pagan/polytheistic tendencies and a gross miseducation about God with no leader, no priestly order, no temple. They needed to be united under a strict monotheistic regime and essentially de-paganized. Muhammad had the same task and his approach was rejecting any hint of plural gods and the trinity did not fit that strict model within a polytheistic culture just as it wouldn't fit a post-egyptian israelite culture. I don't consider him a prophet and that's not what this conversation is about however under the right guidance his message could have had greater impact. I don't know if the church at the time was too blind, prideful or just ill equipped to recognize the positive role it could have played with Islam but the quran is redeemable under the context it was written in and perhaps had things played differently arab christians would be carrying a third canon of their bible and Muhammad considered a saint.
 
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cloudyday2

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One possible clue is the Gospel of Barnabas. This gospel is pseudepigrapha, but it probably predates the times claimed for Muhammad's life. The theology of the gospel matches Islam's beliefs, so maybe the Christian community who wrote the Gospel of Barnabas were an influence on Islam. Apparently historians recently discovered a very early manuscript from near the time when Islam was forming. Until this discovery, the manuscripts available were from much more recent centuries and might have been edited by Muslims. I don't know how closely this early manuscript matches the later manuscripts.
Gospel of Barnabas - Wikipedia
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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Where did you hear of this early 7th century manuscript? I couldn't find anything of this sort when I tried to google it. It can't be the same though if they did find one, as the known gospel of Barnabas has many mediaeval anachronisms, so it may just be a text upon which it was partially based? Much appreciated.
 
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cloudyday2

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I googled "gospel of Barnabas Turkey" to find some links. Some of the journalists who authored the articles seem to be pretty ignorant. If you find any information that is less sensationalized let me know. It would be very interesting to compare a pre-Islamic manuscript with the later manuscripts, because it might explain where the Islamic beliefs originated. Here is one news article FWIW:
Secret £14million Bible in which 'Jesus predicts coming of Prophet Muhammad' unearthed in Turkey | Daily Mail Online
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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Seems to be a forgery. It apparently claims to be a true copy of an early Gospel of Barnabas in Aramaic, supposedly transcribed by monks in the 1500s.
It is however written in modern Neo-Aramaic, has significant grammatical errors and even uses the wrong terms for holy books.
It looks like this is 16th or 17th century at the earliest. Seems this story was picked up by news agencies, had a few days in the sun and then quietly died.


The Gospel of Barnabas ‘hoax’
 
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cloudyday2

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Well that's disappointing. It's a shame Turkey won't let anybody study the manuscript. A forgery can still be informative.
 
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Islamic textual content(The Qur'an) primarily consist of Gnostic Gospels from the Syrian orders as is evident since Syrian Arabic and its dialect occurs in many places in the Qur'an. There were things present IN the Syrian orders since there were various forms of Christian thought which tended to get included as well (Based on forms of Christian ideas Mohommad was exposed to).

Moreover, Most, if not ALL of Islam is based on non-canonical Jewish sources that existed amongst the illiterate Jews of western Arabia and which were told by storytellers in the public market places of mainly Mecca. And the same goes for stories told by many of the Christians who were exiled from the Eastern empire due to their views being herectical/not accepted by the Orthodoxy of the day.


From an historical perspective, some of the stories in the Quran must have been circulating around Arabian caravan routes where Muhammad may have heard them when he was in the employ of his wife Khadija. If interested, the following 7-minute video explains a few of them.



With Eastern Christianity (in some circles), similar things have often come up...as there's one account somewhere I remember learning of where the 18yrs of the life was Christ (between when he was 12 and when he went into ministry) involved Him traveling to India, making playful miracles and learning. In the Quran itself, those specific folklore stories are from the second century and older. Some of the material in the hadith is actually taken verbatim from the Gospel of Thomas.

The story of Jesus talking to Mary in the Cradle, as it appears in the Qur'an in Surah 3:38-48, has always interested me. For the story was most likely being told in the times of Muhammad when considering the pseudepigrapha accounts of the same. --and for more, one can go here or here, in light of how many other scholars have been noting the same for sometime now. Apparently Muhammad heard them told verbally and thought they were true, when in fact, they are folklore. He couldn't tell the difference, as one who wasn't educated. They include Jesus talking as an infant and making clay birds that could fly, plus others.


To give a different perspective on why so much within the Qur'an is similar to what is found in Christianity and why Mohommad knew that, it was once noted that what was noted in the Qur'an on Christ was indeed the same Yeshua but with a newly decorated biography, essentially looking to the right person but with an incomplete understanding that could lead to bad consequences.

Seeing how Muhammad himself was not really a scholar on all points and was heavily influenced by the accounts of Christ he may have heard from other believers in Christ, it is not surprising to me to see the many ways in which some of the things he notes are not fully accurate..or as well expounded upon as in the very Bible which the Qur'an encourages all to actually study. It's always interesting to see the many accounts of believers in Christ who noted that they grew up studying the Qur'an--and yet, grew from that into reading the scriptures when they noticed how the Qur'an instructed them to do so...and thus, they ended up reading the scriptures/gaining a fuller view of what the Qur'an only saw to a limited degree...

Some of it's akin to the dynamic of folk or tale tales and real biographies, as the former deal with unbelievable elements, related as if it were true and factual, even though there are many true aspects it was built around while other things are exaggerations. Some stories are exaggerations of actual historical/biographical eventS (i.e. Davey Crocket and the Alamo, John Henry, etc), for example fish stories ('the fish that got away') such as, "that fish was so big, why I tell ya', it nearly sank the boat when I pulled it in!"---but compared to an actual biography, one will get fuller details that describe an event in its fullness and give clarity on one aspect that wasn't understood as fully.

For a practical example of this within the Qur'an, one can consider the aforementioned example of where it was noted that the Lord made clay pigeons come to life. In the Qur'an, it notes that "Jesus could make birds out of clay and create life for the amusement of his playmates with "Allah's" permission. He would make clay birds into which he breathed and they were transformed, by the Lord's permission into real birds that could fly. i.e. duplication of the process of CREATION, by God's permission. Seeing that, one must ask 'what purpose was there in allowing 'Jesus' to make birds out of clay what could fly (with Allah's permission) further God's purpose? For God doesn't do things without a purpose.

That fact that 'Jesus' could do this tells us that as a child 'Jesus' could create life. And who creates life, but God Himself? In the final analysis, perhaps the Qur'an is demonstrating that 'Jesus' is the Creator. For notice according to the Qur'an "Allah" creates through His Word---and Jesus/Isa is considered the Word and Spirit of God. Perhaps the author of the Qur'an didn't realize what this all meant...as he repeated Christian folklore and made a huge mistake in repeating it without understanding the full implications.
 
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cloudyday2

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Thanks, I just finished watching that video you linked - very interesting.
 
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Concerning Al-Nisa: 155-158: ‘And so for breaking their pledge, for rejecting Allāh’s revelations, for unjustly killing their prophets, for saying: “Our minds are closed” - No! Allāh has sealed them in their disbelief, so they believe only a little - and because they disbelieved and uttered a terrible slander against Mary, and said: “We have killed the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, the Messenger of Allāh.” They did not kill him, nor did they crucify him, though it was made to appear like that to them; those that disagreed about him are full of doubt, with no knowledge to follow, only supposition: they certainly did not kill him - Allāh raised him up to Himself. Allāh is almighty and wise.’

I’ve spent a while learning (and in some cases re-learning) what the Qur’an and others have to say about the crucifixion. I’ve read extracts of the tafâsîr (interpretations of the Qur’an) of Wahb Ibn Munabbih; Ṭabarî; Makkî Ibn Abi Ṭâlib; Qurṭubî; Ibn Kathîr; Suyûṭî; Ṭabâṭabâ’î ; and Jazâ’irî. All of them (apart from Ṭabâṭabâ’î) are saying that Yeshua (ʿalayhi as-salām) was not crucified, but that another was made to resemble him - and to take his place. It is not possible to justify, from Al-Nisa: 155-158, any notion of a substitute.

There are those who say that the Qur’an is denying only that the Jews crucified Yeshua. Not so. The Qur’an is saying that Yeshua was not crucified (killed) at all - not by the Jews, and not by anyone else.

Some agree with this; but only to argue that it was Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla) Himself who did the killing. In support of their argument they quote: ‘Those who say: “Allāh is the Messiah, the son of Mary,” are defying the truth. Say: “If it had been Allāh’s will, could anyone have prevented Him from destroying the Messiah, son of Mary, together with his mother and everyone else on earth? Control of the heavens and earth and all that is between them belongs to Allāh: He creates whatever He will. God has power over everything.’ (Al-Ma’ida: 17); and this: ‘No soul may die except with Allāh’s permission at a predestined time.’ (Al‘Imran 145); and this: ‘The Father loves me, because I lay down my life in order to take it up again. No one takes it from me; I lay it down of my own free will.’ (John 10: 17-18); and even this: ‘. . . it was the Lord's will to crush him . . .’ (From Isaiah 53: 1-12).

Comment:

The Qur’an uses two different terms when referring to death: ‘mawt’ and ‘tawaffâ’. The former is the Qur’an’s usual term for death.

Mawt:

A major point of distinction between ‘mawt’ and ‘tawaffâ’ is that only the former is associated with murder or manslaughter (‘qatala’). We see examples of the use of ‘qatala’ (and its derivatives) in the following: ‘And Pharaoh said: “Leave me to kill Moses (aqtulu Musa) - let him call upon his Lord! - for I fear he may cause you to change your religion, or spread disorder in the land.”’ (Ghafi: 26); and again: ‘They were struck with humiliation and wretchedness, and they incurred the wrath of Allāh because they persistently rejected His messages and killed (yaqtuloona) prophets contrary to all that is right. All this was because they disobeyed and were lawbreakers.’ (Al-Baqara: 61); and again: ‘Allāh has certainly heard the words of those who sneer, “So Allāh is poor, while we are rich”. We shall record everything they say – as well as their killing (wa qatlahum) of prophets in defiance of all that is right – and We shall say to them: “Taste the torment of the scorching fire.”’ (Al‘Imran: 181). There are several others verses where derivatives of ‘qatala’ are used when describing the death of prophets.

With ‘mawt’ comes the natural decomposition of the body; its return to dust. There is no return from ‘mawt’, save on the Day of Resurrection.

As far as I can tell, derivatives of ‘mawt’ and ‘qatala’- used as expressions of normal death when referring to the demise of all other prophets - are never used for Yeshua. The term used to describe his departure is a derivative of ‘tawaffâ’. This appears to make the manner of his leaving something special.

Tawaffâ:

‘Tawaffâ’ invokes the notion of completion and fulfilment. The Qur’anic image of death through ‘tawaffâ’ is quite different from that of ‘mawt’. For a start, ‘tawaffâ’ is never associated with ‘qatala’; instead, it is juxtaposed with ‘nawm’ (sleep). On two occasions sleep is described as a repeated nightly death (‘tawaffâ bil layl’): ‘It is He who calls your souls back by night, knowing what you have done by day, then raises you up again in the daytime until your fixed term is fulfilled. It is to Him that you will return in the end, and He will tell you what you have done.’ (Al-An‘am: 60); and again: ‘Allāh takes the souls of the dead and the souls of the living while they sleep – He keeps hold of those whose death He has ordained and sends the others back until their appointed time – there truly are signs in this for those who reflect.’ (Al-Zumar: 42).

In the Qur’an the term ‘an appointed time’ is used in a general sense for the cycles of the sun and moon: ‘He makes the night merge into the day and the day into the night; He has subjected the sun and the moon - each runs for an appointed term.’ (Fatir: 13); for the waiting period associated with divorce: ‘If you are in doubt, the period of waiting will be three months for those women who have ceased menstruating and for those who have not (yet) menstruated; for the waiting period of those who are pregnant will be until they deliver their burden: ‘Allāh makes things easy for those who are mindful of Him.’ (Al-Talaq: 4); for the time that a widow has to wait before she can remarry: ‘If any of you die and leave widows, the widows should wait for four months and ten nights before remarrying.’ (Al-Baqara: 234); and when contracting the period of a loan: ‘You who believe, when you contract a debt for a stated term, put it down in writing: have a scribe write it down justly between you.’ (Al-Baqara: 282).

The term is also applied, of course, in a particular sense to one’s predestined time for living.

It is worth noting that whenever a verse includes a reference to a person’s predestined death the term used is always ‘mawt’. There are no exceptions. This suggests that when we reach our ‘appointed time’ we experience, not ‘tawaffâ’, but ‘mawt’; with no chance to return to life, save at the Day of Resurrection: ‘No soul may die except with Allāh’s permission at a predestined time. If anyone strives for the rewards of this world, We will give him some of them. If anyone strives for the rewards of the Hereafter, We will give him some of them: We will reward the grateful.’ (Al‘Imran: 145).

There is no notion of physical damage or decomposition in ‘tawaffâ’. Likewise, there is no notion of a ‘non-return’ (as there is in ‘mawt’). It might be better, therefore, to avoid understanding and translating ‘tawaffâ’ as ‘death’; or ‘to die’; or ‘to cause to die’. People return from ‘tawaffâ’ every night of their lives. What makes the last experience of ‘tawaffâ’ non-returnable - as when someone dies in their sleep - lies not in tawaffâ own nature, but in its combination with ‘mawt’.

There is nothing in the Qur’an to support the claim that Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla) killed Yeshua; and nothing to justify the notion that he killed himself. But what are we to make of the words: ‘Allāh said: “Jesus, I will take you back and raise you up to Me.”’ (Al‘Imran: 55).

The word ‘take’ in ‘I will take you back’ translates ‘mutawaffi’. Its root, of course, is w-f-y; the root of tawaffâ (and not that of mawt). Some mufassirûn interpret ‘mutawaffi’ to mean that Yesuha died, and was taken in death. Other mufassirûn say that this interpretation is problematic, since – as we have seen - ‘tawaffâ’ is not the same as ‘mawt’.

It is for this reason, perhaps, that these same mufassirûn interpret ‘mutawaffi’ as a kind of sleep; since the Qur’an uses the same root (w-f-y) for sleeping, and - as we have seen - presents sleep as a kind of death.

The word ‘raise’ in ‘and raise you up to me’ translates ‘rafa‘a’ (‘to raise’) rather than ‘ba‘atha’, which is used elsewhere to mean ‘to resurrect’ after death. Commenting on this, Abu Musa al-Ash'ari writes: ‘There is a consensus among the community of the faithful that the Prophet Jesus (as) was raised alive to the heavens.’ (‘al-Ibana 'an Usul al-Diyana); and Hasan Basri Cantay writes: ‘Allah raised and lifted up the Prophet Jesus (as) in both body and soul.’ (Tafsir of the Qur'an); and Imam ibn Taymiyya writes: ‘The verse "He raised him to His Presence" … explains that the Prophet Jesus (as) was raised in both body and soul.’ (Majmu' Fatawa).

Citing both Al‘Imran 55 and Al-Nisa' 157-158, Zahid al-Kawthari claims that the ascension of Yeshua is beyond doubt: ‘That is because the basic meaning of the word rafa'a in the verses is transportation from below to above. There is no element here that could be used to interpret the verses metaphorically. Therefore, there is no evidence for seeking to produce a meaning in the sense of ascension in honour and station.’ (Nazra 'Abira fi Maza'im; page 93).

The argument that Yeshua was raised alive - both body and soul - is strengthen by the use of the word ‘bal’ that appears in Al-Nisa 157-158. By way of explanation, Sheikh al-Islam Mustafa Sabri writes:

‘If the term ‘bal’, which appears in Surat Al-Nisa' 158 and which I have translated as "on the contrary," comes after a sentence expressing a negativity, then, according to the rules of Arabic linguistics, the sentence following it must mean the exact opposite of the one preceding it. The opposite of death is life. This is a requirement of the rules of linguistics. If we say that "the ascension here is a spiritual one" and "the Prophet Jesus (as) died in the normal sense," then we are violating that rule. In that case, the ascension following the expression "on the contrary" would not represent the opposite to the verbs of "killing" and "crucifying" in the negative sentence preceding it. That is because it may be possible for a person to be killed and for his or her soul to rise to the skies. Otherwise, this term would be meaningless, and there are no meaningless terms in the Qur'an … According to those who support the thesis that the ascension is only one of the soul, the meaning of the verse is this: "They did not kill him and did not crucify him … on the contrary (‘bal’), Allah raised his station." There is no particular oratory here, let alone succinctness … No rational person could take the words "The elevator in my building raises me to the fourth floor every day," to mean that I am only raised to the fourth floor in spirit. Therefore, neither was the Prophet Jesus (as) raised only in spirit. (‘Position of Reason’; page 233).

Said Ramadan al-Buti interpreted the subject in the same way: ‘The mutual compatibility between the verses’ previous and later sections necessarily reveals a fact. For example, if an Arab says: "I am not hungry; on the contrary, I am lying on my side," this is not a correct sentence. In the same way, there is a discrepancy between the components in the sentence: "Khalid did not die; on the contrary, he is a good man." What would be correct is to say: "Khalid did not die; on the contrary, he is alive." To say: "The chairman was not killed; he is a man with a superior station in Allah's Presence" also leads to a break in meaning in the sentence, for his having a high station in Allah's Sight is no obstacle to his being killed. The term bal expresses a contradiction between the preceding and the following words. In other words, bal cancels out a previous statement. (Islamic Catechism: page 338).

The conclusion (justified in my view) is that Yeshua (ʿalayhi as-salām) did not die, but was merely removed from this dimension by the Will of Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla); and He knows best.
 
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Niblo

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According to the Quran to be truly wise you must believe whatever the foolish believe (moslems). surah al baqrah verse 13
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You really do need to set the verse in its context:

‘Some people say: “We believe in Allāh and the Last Day,” when really they do not believe. They seek to deceive Allāh and the believers but they only deceive themselves, though they do not realize it. There is a disease in their hearts, to which Allāh has added more: agonizing torment awaits them for their persistent lying. When it is said to them: “Do not cause corruption in the land,” they say: “We are only putting things right,” but really they are causing corruption, though they do not realize it. When it is said to them: “Believe, as the others believe,” they say: “Should we believe as the fools do?” but they are the fools, though they do not know it.’ (Al-Baqara 8-13).

Comment:

The ‘some people’ referred to in verse 1 are the hypocrites (munāfiqūn); originally, those who lived around Madinah, and who pretended to be Muslims (believers), but were not. The verse can also be applied to hypocrites in general, no matter wherever and whenever they happen to live.

The ‘fools’ spoken of by the hypocrites (in verse 13) are the Companions of the Prophet (sallallahu 'alayhi wa sallam). The Companions are ‘fools’ because they believe in Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla)
and His revelations.

The behaviour of the hypocrites is seen as a general attitude of rejection of faith. Consider also: ‘For the leader. On machalat. A maskil of David: A brutish fool tells himself, "There isn't any God." Such people are depraved, all their deeds are vile, not one of them does what is good.’ (Psalm 53:1 - Complete Jewish Bible).
 
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