The question cessationists must answer.

LoveofTruth · Nov 15, 2018

Dave L said:
If you can provide one example from scripture where the gifts came in any other way than in the two outpourings or through an apostle's hands, you would have a valid point. But you move beyond what scripture says, adding your ideas to it, and promote a false doctrine, which BTW is very popular today, unfortunately.

1 Corinthians 14 - 1. Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy.”

1 Corinthians 12 - 31. But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.”

Acts 13 - 1. Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul. 2. As they ministered to the Lord, and fasted, the Holy Ghost said, Separate me Barnabas and Saul for the work whereunto I have called them. 3. And when they had fasted and prayed, and laid their hands on them, they sent them away.”(this then made Barnabas an apostle gift.

Romans 1 - 11. For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end ye may be established;”

Acts 10 - 44. While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. 45. And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. 46. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,”

YeshuaFan · Nov 15, 2018

Deborah D said:
More mocking!

Rev Ike here in Detroit, and Fred price also, have stated that they had that kind of faith, while most of their followers had the Pinto one!

Deborah D · Nov 15, 2018

YeshuaFan said:
Rev Ike here in Detroit, and Fred price also, have stated that they had that kind of faith, while most of their followers had the Pinto one!

Did you read my replies to you?

YeshuaFan · Nov 15, 2018

Deborah D said:
Have you read AOG doctrine lately? They are the only traditional Protestant denomination I know of that claims healing as part of atonement.

From its inception the General Council of the Assemblies of God has recognized divine healing for the whole person as an important part of the gospel, the good news, which Jesus commissioned His disciples to proclaim. The Assemblies of God constitution in its Statement of Fundamental Truths, section 12, states, “Divine healing is an integral part of the gospel. Deliverance from sickness is provided for in the Atonement, and is the privilege of all believers (Isaiah 53:4,5; Matthew 8:16,17; James 5:14–16).”

Assemblies of God (USA) Official Web Site | Divine Healing (Official A/G Position Paper)

I know well their doctrines, as went to their school, and would say that they do believe that God can still heal today, but not that we all have a right to always get physicalled healed"If we just had enough faith"

YeshuaFan · Nov 15, 2018

Deborah D said:
Did you read my replies to you?

Everyone!

Deborah D · Nov 15, 2018

YeshuaFan said:
I know well their doctrines, as went to their school, and would say that they do believe that God can still heal today, but not that we all have a right to always get physicalled healed"If we just had enough faith"

Why are you understating AOG's doctrine??? They don't just believe that God still heals. They believe that healing is "an integral part of the gospel..." and "provided for in the Atonement." And I agree with them!

Edit: I'm offering quotes directly from the source to support what I'm saying, which is something I haven't seen you do.

Dave L · Nov 15, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
1 Corinthians 14 - 1. Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy.”

1 Corinthians 12 - 31. But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.”

Acts 13 - 1. Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul. 2. As they ministered to the Lord, and fasted, the Holy Ghost said, Separate me Barnabas and Saul for the work whereunto I have called them. 3. And when they had fasted and prayed, and laid their hands on them, they sent them away.”(this then made Barnabas an apostle gift.

Romans 1 - 11. For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end ye may be established;”

Acts 10 - 44. While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. 45. And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. 46. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,”

Barnabas was an apostle. As was Ananias and others.

YeshuaFan · Nov 15, 2018

Deborah D said:
Why are you understating AOG's doctrine??? They don't just believe that God still heals. They believe that healing is "an integral part of the gospel..." and "provided for in the Atonement." And I agree with them!

Edit: I'm offering quotes directly from the source to support what I'm saying, which is something I haven't seen you do.

Yes, but they do not see it as being that everyone always gets healed physically, as all can request that of God, but God still decided whom to heal !
WoF teaches that if one has enough faith, God must heal today!

YeshuaFan · Nov 15, 2018

Dave L said:
Barnabas was an apostle. As was Ananias and others.

Just the original ones and paul though were gifted to heal and do miracles, and to write inspired scriptures!

Dave L · Nov 15, 2018

YeshuaFan said:
Just the original ones and paul though were gifted to heal and do miracles, and to write inspired scriptures!

Of course. But only an apostle could distribute the gifts beyond the two outpourings, which they did.

RDKirk · Nov 15, 2018

swordsman1 said:
I was wondering when the 'blaspheming the Spirit' card would be played. It's the oft used scare tactic to try and ward off cessationists.

Defending the Holy Spirit against the counterfeiting of His gifts, and other bogus practices done in His name, is not blaspheming Him. What is dishonoring to the Holy Spirit is attributing to Him things which are clearly not of him.

The existence of a counterfeit does not imply the nonexistence of the genuine.

RDKirk · Nov 15, 2018

Dave L said:
Of course. But only an apostle could distribute the gifts beyond the two outpourings, which they did.

There is no such "only" in scripture. An argument from silence is not persuasive, particularly since scripture itself demands two or three positive witnesses in assent.

RDKirk · Nov 15, 2018

LoveofTruth said:
1 Corinthians 14 - 1. Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy.”

1 Corinthians 12 - 31. But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.”

And what would be the point of telling them to "covet earnestly the best gifts" rather than, "I'll hook you up the next time I'm in town" if the gifts were administered only by apostles?

Dave L · Nov 15, 2018

RDKirk said:
There is no such "only" in scripture. An argument from silence is not persuasive, particularly since scripture itself demands two or three positive witnesses in assent.

But you go beyond scripture to say another means of distribution exists.

W2L · Nov 15, 2018

Who are the true apostles and teachers, and who are the false? No one wants to answer that question.

Dave L · Nov 15, 2018

W2L said:
Who are the true apostles and teachers, and who are the false? No one wants to answer that question.

True = all called apostles in scripture. False = any claiming to be apostles outside of scripture.

W2L · Nov 15, 2018

Dave L said:
True = all called apostles in scripture. False = any claiming to be apostles outside of scripture.

What i dont get is how people can talk about all the wonderful teachers and healers that God sent us, but they cant explain why none of these "gifted" churches can agree with each other.

Deborah D · Nov 15, 2018

Dave L said:
But you go beyond scripture to say another means of distribution exists.

WADR, the spiritual gifts are distributed by the Holy Spirit to whomever He desires to give them.

Deborah D · Nov 15, 2018

W2L said:
What i dont get is how people can talk about all the wonderful teachers and healers that God sent us, but they cant explain why none of these "gifted" churches can agree with each other.

Uh, I think you and Dave are on the same side of this debate. You may want to read what people are posting before commenting.

W2L · Nov 15, 2018

Does anyone understand what im asking? My question is why these churches cant agree with each other if they are spirit filled?

The question cessationists must answer.

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