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^^^ Well for starters;
-Post #1 was soooo long and convoluted with jibberish, that anyone of us here could have faked it and convinced others that the secret ingredients to Domino’s pizza sauce was also found hidden within your hodge-podge of misquoted and misinterpreted text. That’s called “scripTORTURE.”
-In post #7, you reference not only “timelines of Daniel,” but “festivals of the Torah.” The “Torah” is used in Judaism which EXCLUDES the rest of the Bible in its “completeness” and it’s entirety.
-In post #60 you said the following:
Your own words here indicate “sources” (plural)! What “reliable sources” do you have that specifically point to your date(s), specifically 2027 as you repeatedly keep reposting? If you want to coin the phrase “foolish notions” in your speak and as cited above, well then you won’t get any argument from me. I’ll agree with you on that.
Then you continue and go on to say....
(Emphasis mine to point out your spectacular claim)
Where’s your evidence of this spectacular and ground breaking claim? Again, your words from earlier are fitting here: “foolish notions.” You also contradict yourself throughout all of your posts on this subject of dating His return, whether you like it or not. Continuing (because you asked...)
-In Post #70, you said the following:
Your continuous citing of things like “jubilee cycles,” “timelines,” the Torah, the year 2027, all pertaining to Christ’s second coming etc.... is all “white noise” and jibberish.
You keep referring to the Torah as a reputable singular source in defending a second coming date or date range (2027 to be exact). Whereas the torah is merely just a small portion of the OT Bible. It’s NOT the complete bible of 66 books that Christians use in its totality. This practice and insistence on your part is highly in error of the core values and traditions of the historic Christian faith.
Why do you place so much trust in the “Torah,” when the orthodox and practicing Jews deny that Christ has even risen to begin with? They nor their beloved “Torah” believes that The Messiah has even arrived the first time, let alone that a second coming will take place next in the future.
You know, I don’t know you, but I do believe in your heart that you are a Christian who loves Jesus. I could be wrong, but I think this is a correct assessment. But Christ said people could actually worship HIM in a meaningless way. Saying in Matt 15:9 “In vain they worship ME – teaching for commandments the doctrines of men.” I think you’re very confused on the subject of Jesus’ second coming and you may mean well by what you’re trying to convey.
Just remember what James tells us as well:
James 3:1 (ESV)
Not many of you should become teachers, my brothers, for you know that we who teach will be judged with greater strictness.
As Christians, we all should follow the words of John on these matters:
1 John 5:9 (NIV)
We accept man's testimony, but God's testimony is greater because it is the testimony of God, which He has given about His Son.
God’s FULL testimony is the Bible, not the Torah. Jesus said nobody knows the date of His triumphant return and we should leave it at that. Trust him, not yourself with foolish timelines and dates. It’s all irrelevant anyway because God is ultimately in control of when He’s ready to appear to us again.
Son, You’re not to sharp, are you? The Torah is merely a partiality to the full and complete 66 books of the Christian Bible. I said previously that you seem to rely heavily on the Torah itself with your date setting puzzle. The Torah is what Judaism solely relies upon and evidentially, so do you.The Torah is in the bible genius, its the first five books of the bible. The book of Daniel is also in the bible. These sources ARE IN THE BIBLE, genius. -rolling my eyes-
Son, You’re not to sharp, are you? The Torah is merely a partiality to the full and complete 66 books of the Christian Bible. I said previously that you seem to rely heavily on the Torah itself with your date setting puzzle. The Torah is what Judaism solely relies upon and evidentially, so do you.
Its called knowledge. Knowledge is how we grow in Christ,
that is the spiritual milk we all need to drink.
But, its hard to grow in knowledge when you yourself reject knowledge
by saying, "how does it help me in my faith".
Imagine if everyone who thought the world was flat, and were given the knowledge that the earth was round would've said the said the same thing, "how is knowing the world is round going to help me".
You people are unaware of the appointed times of this heaven and earth because you walk in lawlessness, discarding the very Law that not only gives us knowledge of all sin, but of the appointed times for this heaven and earth.
So if we're not passionate about eschatology and don't agree with you, or want to debate the subject, we're walking in lawlessness and sin?
No. Not even close.
We grow in Christ by spending time with him, praying, listening to him, reading his word and doing what he tells us - even if that means stepping out in faith into difficult situations.
We can also learn, and receive encouragement in our faith, by hearing testimonies from other people.
Like I said, fellowship and prayer are just as important, if not more so.
Knowing what we believe and how to talk to non Christians about our faith is important. Working out calculations, or solving codes, to try to pinpoint the date of the Lord's return, when he has already said we can't know - is not.
I don't reject knowledge.
I'm studying and learning all the time. Some of it is academic knowledge - like the Certificate in Christian Studies that I hope to be awarded soon, after studying a number of subjects. Some of my knowledge comes from experience, fellowship, worship, prayer and spending time with God.
I don't doubt that there are people who are fascinated by eschatology, and spend hours analysing Daniel and Revelation, working out what "days" mean (always assuming that you take that literally), and relating world events to various prophesies.
Good for them; it's important to them, may mean something and they may be edified by it all. I do not and am not. But then, I've no doubt that some of the things I study and am passionate about, mean nothing to someone else.
It's a valid question.
You have quite rightly said that we need to be prepared and live each day as if the Lord may come tomorrow - in that, we agree.
What I don't see is how studying what Daniel said, or what Nebuchanezzar's actions meant have any relation to how I live my Christian life in my community, how I carry out the Great Commission and show God's love to others. If this is vitally important for you - go for it. But don't imply that I have to do the same.
But people who are fascinated by science, geology, physics etc would no doubt not say such a thing.
They'd hear, or be told, a hypothesis and they'd probably want to research, experiment and prove, or disprove, it.
If such a dedicated, intelligent, learned scientist was presented with a discussion on the best material to use for making church banners/robes/flags for worship, for example, I've no doubt their response would be the same as mine.
If you're not passionate about eschatology then what are you doing here?
This is the Controversial Theology section of the forum, not the Eschatological section.
But even if it was, I still have the right to post my view that no one knows the hour and, for me, it's not important.
You people are unaware of the appointed times of this heaven and earth because you walk in lawlessness
Because its the Law of God,
For I delight in the law of God, in my inner being, (Romans 7:22 [ESV])
if you know his will and approve of what is superior because you are instructed by the law; if you are convinced that you are a guide for the blind, a light for those who are in the dark, an instructor of the foolish, a teacher of little children, because you have in the law the embodiment of knowledge and truth— (Romans 2:18-20 [NIV])
You people are unaware of the appointed times of this heaven and earth because you walk in lawlessness, discarding the very Law that not only gives us knowledge of all sin, but of the appointed times for this heaven and earth. Sighhhhhhhhh.
1) you have yet to provide evidence of you theories. You’ve yet to defend your claims. But you hurl personal insults because you’re losing your argument from the get-go. (Remember your “year 2027” claim). All you’ve done is dump massive cut and paste passages of the Bible that are nothing more than a maze of sophistry and obfuscation.
2) What parts of Jesus’ explicit words in Matthew 24:36 and Mark 13:32 do you not understand?
Nice dodge and deflection. You can’t even answer a reasonable question, can you?You are welcome to not believe. Bye.
Nice dodge and deflection. You can’t even answer a reasonable question, can you?
Again, what parts of Jesus’ explicit words in Matthew 24:36 and Mark 13:32 do you not understand?
I do believe that God will use a known starting point - either a feast of Israel or something in the life of Christ, i.e., His birthday, the start of His ministry, the start of His Church on the Day of Pentecost, or even the destruction of the temple, then count 2000 years (2 days) for the beginning of the 1000 year Millennium (1 day). Knowing this trait about God is why so many seem to try to predict, but it is only because we all want Him to come so badly.
God has always been exactly on time. The second coming will not be random.
Hosea 6:1-3
"Come, and let us return unto the Lord: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.
2 After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.
3 Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the Lord: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth.
Oh boy, you really don’t get it do you? You really need to learn the art and science of biblical interpretation to fill that void that’s currently occupied by ignorance. So now you think you may know the “year” of His return, eh??? Well, check this out:Day or hour I do not know, the year, maybe.
Oh boy, you really don’t get it do you? You really need to learn the art and science of biblical interpretation to fill that void that’s currently occupied by ignorance. So now you think you may know the “year” of His return, eh??? Well, check this out:
Have you ever read Acts 1:7???
Let me help you with this again... and all caps are in Jesus’ own words:
Acts 1:7 (NIV)
“He said to them: “IT IS NOT FOR YOU TO KNOW THE TIMES OR DATES THE FATHER HAS SET BY HIS OWN AUTHORITY.”
Key word here is “DATES.” That would include a year, because a “year” is ALWAYS PART OF THE DATE!
Passage #2:
1 Thessalonians 5:1 (NIV)
“Now, brothers, about times and DATES we do not need to write to you, 2-for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night.”
Well dog gone it, there’s that pesky little word again, “dates” and it’s spoken by Paul this time. Again, a “date” is inclusive for the word “year,” just as “millisecond” and “nanosecond” would be inclusive with the word “time.”
Going back to Acts 1, Luke tells us how the disciples asked Jesus if he was going to restore the kingdom to Israel, just before His ascension. At that time, Jesus told them it was not for them to know the times or “seasons.” Jesus may come back tomorrow, next month, next year or 1000 years from now. We just don’t know and it’s futile to think you can calculate a date. If the Angels in heaven don’t know, don’t think that you’re smarter than them or The Son, because they would have figured it out a long time ago and the Bible probably would have indicated this fact to us.
Coming full circle here, your prediction of the “year” is again, sophistry and scripTORTURE at best.
You’d best just realize the error of your ways here and stop trying to predict something JESUS Himself said YOU CAN’T DO. Why are you contradicting Jesus Christ on this cut and dry issue? Do you think that you’re better than Him? Hang it up son before you sink to rock bottom on this argument. Jesus isn’t lying to you and neither you nor I know better.
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