“Then the glory of the Lord went out from the threshold of the house, and stood over the cherubim. And the cherubim lifted up their wings and mounted up from the earth before my eyes as they went out, with the wheels beside them” (vv. 18–19a).
- Ezekiel 10
Travel the world, and you will find Christians meeting for worship in unusual locales. New church plants often hold services in school cafeterias or movie theaters. Even old railroad cars have been used as church buildings in other countries. Moreover, unusual congregational meeting places are nothing new. After all, the earliest believers often met for worship in the Roman catacombs during periods of persecution.
Jesus’ dialogue with the Samaritan woman in John 4 has inspired Christians’ willingness to meet wherever we can find space. Our Savior’s statement that His followers will not worship exclusively in Samaria or Jerusalem but “in spirit and truth” indicate that God’s presence is not limited to any place or time (vv. 21–24). That is not to say that sacred space has no place in the new covenant. Our sanctuaries’ design and architecture always influence our worship for good or for ill. However, the Lord is not limited to one place, nor does He require a specific kind of church building for us to worship Him rightly.
Right before the exile into Babylon, the old covenant community lost sight of the fact that the Lord does not limit Himself to one place. True, He chose to make His presence felt in a special way in the Jerusalem temple during the old covenant period. Yet He was by no means imprisoned there. A belief that God could never leave His temple, however, was commonly held during the ministries of Jeremiah and Ezekiel. Thus, the people paid little heed to the warnings of these prophets to repent lest Jerusalem be destroyed. If the Lord could not leave Jerusalem, how could it be destroyed? “This is the temple of the Lord, the temple of the Lord, the temple of the Lord” they would cry in order to shout down the threats of divine judgment (Jer. 7:4).
In this context, the vision God granted to Ezekiel in today’s passage was for the purpose of telling the covenant community that the Lord could not be limited to Jerusalem and that He could easily abandon the physical temple in order to bring about its destruction. Ezekiel saw the same chariot-throne that he wrote about in chapter 1 of his book, only this time the chariot was parked outside the temple (10:1–3). The glory of God left His place above the cherubim of the ark in the Holy of Holies and exited the temple, carried off by the chariot (vv. 4–22). By this vision, Ezekiel saw that Yahweh was leaving the place where His people normally met with Him, opening up Jerusalem to the invasion of its enemies. ~ Ligonier Ministries
Yes; God's Shekinah glory left Solomons Temple and Ezekiel saw it...thoughts?
Please visit my Reve 15:8 thread and the Shekinah glory in the Sanctuary located up in heaven:Yes; God's Shekinah glory left Solomons Temple and Ezekiel saw it.
The Second Temple never had the Shekinah glory.
Now, it is we Christians who represent the Temple on earth. 1 Corinthians 3:16
But a new Temple will be built by the Lord's people, Zechariah 6:15, and the Glory of God will come again into it. Ezekiel 43:1-9. Verse 10 onwards, describes the details of its construction and use.
Do NOT think that the Israelites of verse 10 refers to Jews only. We Christians ARE the Israelites of God, the Overcomers for Him and the Victorious ones.
Great info and post mk.......I just read this on Ligonier's Ministries page:
Jesus’ dialogue with the Samaritan woman in John 4 has inspired Christians’ willingness to meet wherever we can find space. Our Savior’s statement that His followers will not worship exclusively in Samaria or Jerusalem but “in spirit and truth” indicate that God’s presence is not limited to any place or time (vv. 21–24). That is not to say that sacred space has no place in the new covenant. Our sanctuaries’ design and architecture always influence our worship for good or for ill. However, the Lord is not limited to one p
In this context, the vision God granted to Ezekiel in today’s passage was for the purpose of telling the covenant community that the Lord could not be limited to Jerusalem and that He could easily abandon the physical temple in order to bring about its destruction.
.....thoughts?
Ark of the Covenant Found Before The End of Days?Do you believe the Ark of the Covenant will ever be found?
The finding of the Ark of the Covenant could be one of the catalysts for the start of the coming tribulation of Revelation chapters 6-18. For the finding of the Ark could be one of the catalysts for the ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel deciding that they're going to immediately begin to build a Third Temple on the Temple Mount in Jerusalem. This will require that they destroy the Muslim Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque. This destruction could then bring about the great war which will begin the coming tribulation of Revelation chapters 6-18.
The current, secular government of Israel has been very careful to protect the Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque ever since Israel took military control of the Temple Mount back in 1967. For the Israeli government knows that if the ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel were to destroy the Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque (the third holiest sites in Islam) in order to clear the Temple Mount for the building of a Third Temple, this could mean the end of the state of Israel, because Muslim armies and militias worldwide could in their total rage descend on Israel en masse in an all-out jihad, attacking Israel simultaneously from every side, overwhelming its defenses and quickly overrunning its tiny territory, defeating it completely.
While the ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel are no doubt aware of this danger to Israel should the Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque ever be destroyed, they believe that the Third Temple must nonetheless be built exactly where the First and Second Temples stood: right over the Rock of Sacrifice (the Rock of the Dome of the Rock) on which Abraham almost sacrificed Isaac. And the ultra-Orthodox Jews could eventually be brought to the point where they will even desire to see the end of the current, secular state of Israel, believing that only in its demise will God make it possible for them to establish a perfectly ultra-Orthodox, city-state of Israel within the walled Old City of Jerusalem (which contains the Temple Mount), and build in it a Third Temple before which they can restart the daily Mosaic sacrifices and perfectly keep every jot and tittle of the Mosaic law.
The ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel are currently very well-armed, as they are allowed by Israel to even have machine guns for self-defense against the Palestinians. If the ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel start to get squeezed out of their settlements in Samaria and Judaea (also called the West Bank), especially around Hebron and East Jerusalem, because of some "peace deal" handing the whole kit and caboodle over to a Palestinian "state", the ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel, in their rage and desperation, could ultimately resort to violence. They could mass in their tens of thousands, all armed with machine guns, and led by three huge bulldozers they could march as a great army to the Old City of Jerusalem and go up onto the Temple Mount and completely destroy the Muslim Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque. They could then begin to build the Third Temple and declare the walled Old City of Jerusalem to be a purely ultra-Orthodox "city-state of the True Israel", where the Mosaic law will be the law, and where no non-kosher person or thing will be allowed within Old Jerusalem's "Holy walls".
Besides getting squeezed out of their settlements, something else that could help tip the scales so that the ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel will become violent, is the rising up of a false, miracle-working ultra-Orthodox Jewish "Messiah" in Israel. He could rise up and declare that "God says that now is the time for us to take religious control of the Holy Temple Mount and rid it of all the vile abominations which the heathen have placed upon it. We must now sanctify it in the name of our God so that we might rebuild His Holy Temple there. Listen, my brethren, fear not the reaction of the heathen when we retake religious control of the Holy Temple Mount. For God Himself is with us. He will protect us perfectly. Have I not shown you His mighty Power working through Me? Fear not any men, but fear only our Mighty God, who now commands us to rebuild His Holy Temple at the place He determined from the time of our father Abraham. Our God gave us back the Temple Mount way back in 1967 C.E. But what have we done with it over the past 40-odd years? Nothing! How can this be? How can we have allowed some merely-secular, so-called 'Israeli' government invented by sinful men to keep us, God's holy servants, from even setting foot back on the Temple Mount? Let us rise up, my brethren! Let us all rise up, in the name of our God, and let us do mighty exploits to the Glory of His Holy Name!" With such rhetoric, accompanied by his working of amazing miracles (cf. Matthew 24:24), a false ultra-Orthodox Jewish "Messiah" in Israel could whip up the ultra-Orthodox Jews there into a religious frenzy, so that they will all with great zeal, and without any fear, march in their tens of thousands upon the Temple Mount, and take total control of it, and then rejoice there and dance and sing holy hymns to God "for His great and mighty Victory".
Something else that could help tip the scales with regard to the ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel becoming violent is the discovery of the Ark of the Covenant. (It could be found buried under an ancient ruined fort in the desert east of Jerusalem.) The ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel could see the discovery of the Ark of the Covenant as "an unmistakable sign from God that now is the time for us to rebuild His Holy Temple".
A Third Temple could be built on the Temple Mount in Jerusalem during the coming tribulation (Revelation 11:1), and the daily Mosaic animal sacrifices could be restarted in front of it, by the ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel. But then the Antichrist could attack and defeat them and a false Messiah leading them (Daniel 11:22). Then the Antichrist could "cut" a peace treaty with them and their false "Messiah" (Daniel 9:26, Daniel 11:23) permitting them to keep the Temple and continue to perform the sacrifices for at least seven more years (Daniel 9:27), so long as they give up the outer court of the Temple (Revelation 11:2) to the Muslims so that the Muslims can rebuild the Al Aqsa Mosque on the southern end of the Temple Mount and resume worship there. But then, only two or three years after making the seven-year treaty, the Antichrist could break the treaty, attack the Temple, stop the daily Mosaic animal sacrifices, and place the abomination of desolation in the holy place of the Temple (Daniel 9:27, Daniel 11:31, Matthew 24:15), and then sit himself in the Temple and proclaim himself God (2 Thessalonians 2:4, Daniel 11:36).
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If the ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel succeed in building a Third Temple on the Temple Mount in Jerusalem, it could be seen by God as a valid temple, just as the Second Temple building in Jerusalem was seen by God as a valid temple, even at the time of Jesus' first coming (Matthew 23:21) and even at the time of the early church (Luke 24:53), a temple building co-existing as the temple of God alongside the temple of Jesus' individual human body (John 2:21), and alongside the temple of every Christian's individual human body (1 Corinthians 6:19), and alongside the temple of the church as a whole (Ephesians 2:21), and alongside the temple building in heaven (Revelation 11:19).
For the ultra-Orthodox Jews would build a Third Temple, and would perform animal sacrifices before it, under the auspices of the Old Covenant Mosaic law, which in itself remains holy before God (Romans 7:12); that's why he still keeps an ark of the Old Covenant in his temple building in heaven (Revelation 11:19). This isn't to say that the (Jesus Christ rejecting) motives of the ultra-Orthodox Jews would be holy before God, but that a Mosaic Third Temple in itself and Mosaic animal sacrifices in themselves would be holy before God because the Mosaic law in itself remains holy before God (Romans 7:12), even though its letter is no longer meant to be practiced by people (Romans 7:6) because the New Covenant has been inaugurated by Jesus Christ and his once-for-all-time sacrifice on the Cross for all of our sins (Hebrews 10:1-23, Matthew 26:28, 2 Corinthians 3:6-18).
(Continued)
I absolutely agree! And you bring out an important point when you posted that the Second Temple never had the Shekinah glory.Yes; God's Shekinah glory left Solomons Temple and Ezekiel saw it.
The Second Temple never had the Shekinah glory.
Now, it is we Christians who represent the Temple on earth. 1 Corinthians 3:16
A new Temple WAS built (and you just described it - Jesus was that temple, the BRANCH described in Zechariah).But a new Temple will be built by the Lord's people, Zechariah 6:15, and the Glory of God will come again into it. Ezekiel 43:1-9. Verse 10 onwards, describes the details of its construction and use.
Do NOT think that the Israelites of verse 10 refers to Jews only. We Christians ARE the Israelites of God, the Overcomers for Him and the Victorious ones.
Yes; Spiritually, as we are during this Church age.A new Temple WAS built (and you just described it - Jesus was that temple, the BRANCH described in Zechariah).
There WAS a physical second temple (Herod's) that was desecrated in several ways, but this is likely to be the fulfillment of 2 Thess 2:4:But there has to be a new physical Temple for the AC to desecrate. 2 Thess 2:4 and John measures it in Revelation 11:1.
Likewise - denying the completed fulfillment of God's prophecies is to deny His sovereignty and power (in my opinionDenying the truth of a new Temple , is to ignore the truth of many prophesies.
keras.Yes; Spiritually, as we are during this Church age.
But there has to be a new physical Temple for the AC to desecrate. 2 Thess 2:4 and John measures it in Revelation 11:1.
Denying the truth of a new Temple , is to ignore the truth of many prophesies.
And I have already rejected that historically unsustainable notion.keras.
I have already shown you it is the 1st century Sanctuary being measured..
One answer to that is from this explanation:When did the 42 months take place?
Where and who were the 2 Witnesses?
Where do you see that's necessary to consider these prophecies fulfilled?There has been no earthquake in Jerusalem that killed 7000 people yet.
Actually the Gentiles have trampled the Temple mount for nearly 2000 years.Vespasian and Titus’ military campaign lasted 42 months during which “foreign” rebels overran and seized control of Jerusalem, we can see how these “Gentiles” “trampled the Holy City” for “42 months.” ~ Source
Jesus and the Body of the Church are as ONE.From the same source mentioned above: "The Fact that the Two Witnesses are depicted as Two Lampstands and Two Olive Trees also points to Christ Who is the Sole Embodiment of the Church, the Body of Christ."
What I see as necessary, is to read and understand God's plan for His people in the last days.Where do you see that's necessary to consider these prophecies fulfilled?
You'd asked about when the 42 months took place and I gave you an answer (Vespasian and Titus’ military campaign lasted 42 months during which “foreign” rebels overran and seized control of Jerusalem, we can see how these “Gentiles” “trampled the Holy City” for “42 months.” ) - and you dismiss it with this? It's hardly "the Temple mount" with no more of Herod's Temple left (I realize that's the modern term that's used - but it's hardly appropriate in context, IMO).Actually the Gentiles have trampled the Temple mount for nearly 2000 years.
But during the final 42 months before Jesus Returns, the Anti-Christ and his cohorts will do that to the new Temple in Jerusalem.
Where and who were the 2 Witnesses?
F.W. Farrar said:These questions have never been satisfactorily answered, and perhaps never will be. We must be content to leave them in the half-light in which the uncertainty of nineteen Christian centuries has left them hitherto. There are no two writers of any importance who even approximately agree in the interpretation of the symbols... Every interpretation seems to be beset with insuperable difficulties. No one school of commentators has been more successful than its rivals...
There will be a new Temple, many prophesies prove this. Isaiah 56:1-8, 2 Thess 2:4, Rev 11:1, Ezekiel 43:1-27, +There's NO reason for a third Temple (and, certainly, Jesus won't have a thing to do with such a grievous offense to His work on the cross).
.So your belief is wrong. What else do you believe that is error?
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