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The persecution of the Church during our time

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by BABerean2, Apr 16, 2021.

  1. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    Within the last few months Pastor James Coates of Grace Life Church in Canada was placed in jail, due to COVID restrictions.

    He was released a few weeks ago.

    Canadian police attempted to disrupt the service of the church on resurrection Sunday, but were politely denied access by the elders of the church.

    Last week the building of the church was placed in prison, when police officials erected a fence around the building.

    However, this congregation still found a place to meet last Sunday.

    In my state of North Carolina the governor shut down many churches last year due to COVID restrictions, but a Federal judge later determined that Governor Roy Cooper had violated the law.
    This same governor also ordered pharmacies not to fill prescriptions for Hydroxychloroquine, which had been prescribed by physicians. We may never know how many people died as a result of this interference in the doctor-patient relationship.

    We need to pray for those in persecuted churches, as well as all of our churches.
    The persecution has now come to Canada.


    Pastor James Coates on Psalm 2 (April 11, 2021 sermon)


    Thank God for this man.

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  2. pescador

    pescador Newbie Supporter

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    Protecting the lives of the churchgoers in the interest of public health is exactly what should have been done. I pray that it will continue.

    If people think it's Christian to infect others with a deadly virus I sincerely question their faith. We are commanded in both Testaments to love your neighbor as yourself.
     
  3. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    Heb_10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.


    Are you ignoring the verse found above. Do you ever assemble with other Christians for worship?

    The survival rate for COVID-19 is 99.7%.
    Tuberculosis is much more deadly.

    The 1918 Spanish Flu killed about 10% of those infected, but it fizzled out after the population gained "herd immunity". This happened without any vaccines to stop that virus.

    How long do you want churches to be shut down?

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  4. pescador

    pescador Newbie Supporter

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    I want churches to be shut down until the safety of the attendees can be satisfactorily addressed.

    The rest of your post shows that your attitude is hostile, so I won't discuss this with you any further. Go ahead and continue in your "righteous anger". But not with me.
     
  5. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    Are those who want to meet with other believers "hostile", if they disagree with you?

    What would have to happen for your concerns about safety to be satisfactorily addressed?

    Will all communicable diseases have to be cured before churches can be reopened?

    Were there any communicable diseases that effected members of the first century Church?


    Pastor John MacArthur looks at COVID numbers:



    Why should Christians not be afraid of death?


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    Last edited: Apr 16, 2021
  6. Abraxos

    Abraxos ...

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    The tradition of going to church every Sunday doesn't make you any more of a Christian.

    If believers in the 'free world' want to congregate they can simply do so via Zoom.
     
  7. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    My church met remotely for a time last year, and it was not the same.
    Some churches in my area never closed last year.

    Going and meeting with a body of believers is not a "tradition", based on what is written in the New Testament.

    If you want to meet remotely, go ahead.

    However, do not try to force it on others.

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  8. pescador

    pescador Newbie Supporter

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    No, those who want to meet with other believers are not "hostile" if they disagree with me. I said that your attitude in your post was hostile. There is a significant difference between reasonably disagreeing with someone and being hostile to them.

    What would have to happen for my concerns about safety to be satisfactorily addressed? Most of the population would have to be fully vaccinated and "herd immunity" would be achieved.

    Will all communicable diseases have to be cured before churches can be reopened? That question doesn't even deserve a response.

    Were there any communicable diseases that effected members of the first century Church? I give up, were there?

    566,000 people have died from COVID-19 in the US. Since 65% of the US population is Christian, that means that approximately 368,000 Christians have died from the virus. Gathering together in churches will continue to increase that number. Going to a regular church service without proper safeguards -- masks, distance separation, safe ventilation systems -- is a recipe for more sickness and deaths.

    Personally, I don't want anyone, Christian or otherwise, to die unnecessarily. Do you agree or not?
     
  9. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    How many people that you know personally died of COVID-19, who were under 60 years old and had no co-morbidities?

    I only know of one, and I was a teacher for 29 years who knows thousands of people and many of their family members.

    One of my former Sunday School teachers died of a heart attack last year, and the hospital wanted his wife to agree that it be recorded he died of COVID-19. She refused, because it was not the truth.
    Why did the hospital make this request of her? Because the hospital receives a payment for each COVID-19 death.
    How many times has this same request happened in our nation during the last year?

    If you believe the numbers you gave, our nation has had more COVID-19 deaths per thousand people, than any other nation on earth, and we are supposed to have one of the best health care systems in the world. Check the numbers for yourself.


    Many of the people who died could have been saved by Hydroxychloroquine, or Ivermectin, if politics had not entered the medical field.


    We do temperature checks at my church, and people can wear masks if they want.
    We have extra masks if people need one.
    We also have an extra space where people can spread out more and watch the service on a big screen.
    Several people at our church had COVID, and all survived, most with minor flu-like symptoms.


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  10. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    Do we stop churches because of all communicable diseases of all time? In some ways the apostate churches needed to cease and desist the spread of false doctrine. The sword of God cuts both ways.
     
  11. pescador

    pescador Newbie Supporter

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    I don't understand your reply to my post. I wrote, "Protecting the lives of the churchgoers in the interest of public health is exactly what should have been done. I pray that it will continue.

    If people think it's Christian to infect others with a deadly virus I sincerely question their faith. We are commanded in both Testaments to love your neighbor as yourself."

    Would you give another explanation for asking "do we stop churches because of all communicable diseases of all time?"

    Also, "In some ways the apostate churches needed to cease and desist the spread of false doctrine. The sword of God cuts both ways."

    It's obvious that we don't "stop churches" -- whatever that means -- because of all communicable diseases. Churches continue throughout the annual flu season, as well as the ubiquitous common cold. Neither of these (or any others) are killing over a half-million people in a single year. COVID-19 is a pandemic, the worst in over 100 years. It's not like other common communicable diseases for which we have vaccines.

    What "false doctrine" are your referring to? And which churches are apostate in your opinion?
     
  12. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    Should all churches have been shut down during the year 2015 due to Tuberculosis?
    Should all churches be shut down until TB is cured?



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  13. Abraxos

    Abraxos ...

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    Due to the pandemic, it has limited accessibility from the perspective that a mass grouping of people increases the likelihood of infecting a mass group of people, church gatherings are no exception. Does this mean that Christianity is persecuted? No. Churchianity perhaps, but not Christian faith. Protesting the freedom of worship in the West seems odd to me - it's just propagating a false narrative. Christianity itself can still continue to thrive if you have internet access. Some ministries have taken this initiative to bring the Word to the flock through alternative means, it's not that hard.

    Personally, those protesting about it look entitled and don't realise how easy they got it in the West compared to Christians in other countries.
     
  14. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    Have you ever worshipped with a group of believers in your nation?

    Based on the New Testament, groups of Christians have met together on a regular basis since the first century.

    Mass groups of people can go to Walmart in my country.

    In the verse below Christians are commanded to assemble together.
    If you want to do otherwise, that is your business.

    A Federal judge in my state made it clear to the governor that he had no legal right to limit the ability of believers to meet.
    Other nations do not enjoy the same freedoms.

    Heb_10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

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  15. Abraxos

    Abraxos ...

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    I'm sure Christians regularly met for a round of golf in the first century, but there is a difference between forsaking and alternating church gatherings.
     
  16. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    Are you trying to say meeting with other Christians is a joke?


    Act_14:27 And when they were come, and had gathered the church together, they rehearsed all that God had done with them, and how he had opened the door of faith unto the Gentiles.

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  17. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    Church restrictions removed in California:



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  18. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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