The Palestinian-Jewish issue in a nutsell

[S.ilvio]

No one has noticed? Israel is not invading. Israel GAVE the land (along with the 3000 greenhouses with already established, flowering, and producing plants that the people of Gaza could use for a flourishing trade--what happened to them) back in 2005.

The 3,000 greenhouses justifies 1,880 massacred..?

 

[Zeek]

The 3,000 greenhouses justifies 1,880 massacred..?

There you go again 2+2=5, bad maths exemplified.

 

[eastcoast_bsc]

Crazed Liberal woman asking for God to bless Hamas. She was confronted by the man in the video. He is correct, she clearly looks medicated.


LiveLeak.com - I Confront Woman Calling For God To Bless Hamas

 

[Fantine]

The key to peace--teaching our children well.

Children's songwriter and performer Raffi has written two songs for children about peace, and is offering the MP3's, sheet music, and lyrics for free on his website.

They can be used to teach our children--our future--well.

RaffiNews.com | Store | Songs for Peace

 

[S.ilvio]

I love your signature, Fantine...

 

[Zeek]

Crazed Liberal woman asking for God to bless Hamas. She was confronted by the man in the video. He is correct, she clearly looks medicated.


LiveLeak.com - I Confront Woman Calling For God To Bless Hamas

The world gone bonkers...no point in arguing with people like her she does not have room in her heart for reason because it is already full with hate.

 

[classicalhero]

So Israel is not killing hundreds of innocent women and children?

For real..?

The 4th Geneva convention clearly states that Hamas as the current power in Gaza are the one ultimately responsible for the way civilians are treated. If you put civilians in harms way like Hamas are, then it is on Hamas whom the blood lies and not Israel.
The Avalon Project : Convention (IV) Relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War, August 12, 1949

Art. 28. The presence of a protected person may not be used to render certain points or areas immune from military operations.
Art. 29. The Party to the conflict in whose hands protected persons may be, is responsible for the treatment accorded to them by its agents, irrespective of any individual responsibility which may be incurred.

How long are you going to ignore international law while continuing to blame Israel for Hamas' crimes?

 

[S.ilvio]

The 4th Geneva convention clearly states that Hamas as the current power in Gaza are the one ultimately responsible for the way civilians are treated. If you put civilians in harms way like Hamas are, then it is on Hamas whom the blood lies and not Israel.
The Avalon Project : Convention (IV) Relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War, August 12, 1949
How long are you going to ignore international law while continuing to blame Israel for Hamas' crimes?

An advocate for the Zionist terror machine citing internaitonal law. You couldn't make it up...

 

[AMDG]

But what about the international law? That still funny?

 

[pdudgeon]

But what about the international law? That still funny?

agreed. and did anyone notice that the law was written after WWII?

that long ago the problem of unnecessary civilian casualties as a by-product of war was recognized, and yet we still have that problem today.

my guess is that the root cause is:
1. a lack of respect for the value of a human life,
2. the idea that might = right,
3. dictatorship as a form of government is the way to manage a country.

When you put those three things together, there's gonna be a problem.

 

[Armoured]

But what about the international law? That still funny?

The same international law that enshrines the principal of proportionality in military responses? The one codified in treaties to which Israel is a signatory? That international law?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proportionality_(law)#International_humanitarian_law

 

[brewmama]

The same international law that enshrines the principal of proportionality in military responses? The one codified in treaties to which Israel is a signatory? That international law?

Proportionality (law) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

from your link: A crime occurs if there is an intentional attack directed against civilians (principle of distinction) (Article 8(2)(b)(i)) or an attack is launched on a military objective in the knowledge that the incidental civilian injuries would be clearly excessive in relation to the anticipated military advantage (principle of proportionality)

perhaps you should consider what proportionality actually means



Blog: Short Memories: Once Upon a Time, Killing Civilians was Kosher for the Brits

 

[classicalhero]

An advocate for the Zionist terror machine citing internaitonal law. You couldn't make it up...

That is your response? An ad hominem attack rather than discussing what I brought up. Typical of your side of the argument, because when facts are brought in, you can only use emotion to fight back.

The same international law that enshrines the principal of proportionality in military responses? The one codified in treaties to which Israel is a signatory? That international law?

Proportionality (law) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Proportionality doesn't refer to the number of victims, but to the threat. The threat posed by Hamas is more than sufficient in relation to the casualties.

 

[Armoured]

from your link: A crime occurs if there is an intentional attack directed against civilians (principle of distinction) (Article 8(2)(b)(i)) or an attack is launched on a military objective in the knowledge that the incidental civilian injuries would be clearly excessive in relation to the anticipated military advantage (principle of proportionality)

perhaps you should consider what proportionality actually means



Blog: Short Memories: Once Upon a Time, Killing Civilians was Kosher for the Brits

Um, yes, the link is exactly what proportionality is about. And Israel isn't using proportional response, given that principle, are they?

I didn't bother to click your tu quoque link. No one is suggesting that other responses in history have lacked proportionality. That doesn't excuse Israel.

 

[Armoured]

Proportionality doesn't refer to the number of victims, but to the threat. The threat posed by Hamas is more than sufficient in relation to the casualties.

The threat posed by Hamas is not sufficient to justify the civilian casualties in Gaza. That's the proportionality we're discussing.

 

[AMDG]

The difference between Hamas and Israel? "Israel answers to a higher authority." Hamas simply doesn't care.


"In the current war against Palestinian Hamas, the Jews take great pains to fight according to ethics dating back to Ancient Israel. Today’s Israeli Defense Forces call the cell phones and land lines of everyone in a target area; they drop warning fliers written in Arabic; and they drop a dummy-bomb immediately before any attack. Why do Jews try so hard to honor the commandment to “choose life,” even in wartime?

This all goes back to David. Circa 1005 BC, King David captured Jerusalem from the Jebusites, targeting only those who opposed him. There was no wanton slaughter, nor were surviving Jebusites expelled: “And the children of Benjamin did not drive out the Jebusites . . . but the Jebusites dwell with the children of Benjamin in Jerusalem unto this day” (Judges 1:21)."

Read more at The "Real" Truth About Israelis & Palestinians » Eagle Rising

 

[Armoured]

The difference between Hamas and Israel? "Israel answers to a higher authority." Hamas simply doesn't care.


"In the current war against Palestinian Hamas, the Jews take great pains to fight according to ethics dating back to Ancient Israel. Today’s Israeli Defense Forces call the cell phones and land lines of everyone in a target area; they drop warning fliers written in Arabic; and they drop a dummy-bomb immediately before any attack. Why do Jews try so hard to honor the commandment to “choose life,” even in wartime?

This all goes back to David. Circa 1005 BC, King David captured Jerusalem from the Jebusites, targeting only those who opposed him. There was no wanton slaughter, nor were surviving Jebusites expelled: “And the children of Benjamin did not drive out the Jebusites . . . but the Jebusites dwell with the children of Benjamin in Jerusalem unto this day” (Judges 1:21)."

Read more at The "Real" Truth About Israelis & Palestinians » Eagle Rising

Yeah. All those anti-semite Palestinians, getting all maimed and killed just to make Israel look bad

 

[classicalhero]

The threat posed by Hamas is not sufficient to justify the civilian casualties in Gaza. That's the proportionality we're discussing.

And you know this how?

 

[Armoured]

And you know this how?

Uh, because I can read casualty figures? Because I have enough military experience to compare the effectiveness of a Merkava 3 main battle tank with vintage Qassam rockets?

It's all public record stuff, it's not exactly like calculating quantum particle fluctuations.

 

[classicalhero]

Uh, because I can read casualty figures? Because I have enough military experience to compare the effectiveness of a Merkava 3 main battle tank with vintage Qassam rockets?

It's all public record stuff, it's not exactly like calculating quantum particle fluctuations.

Obviously you have no idea what proportionality is about, because it i most definitely not just simple numbers, because no war is ever like that. Did you know that with the NATO operations in the former Yugoslaviua, that they killed about 5,000 civilians and they investigated the whole thing and found that none of the deaths warranted any further look to see if they are a war crime, that does include the bombing a TV station and the accidental bombing of the Chinese Embassy. Just simply killing civilians isn't a war crime, but the intentional targeting of them. In an urban environment there will always be civilian casualties no matter how precise your are due to the density of the population.