The No-Straw-Man Calvinism challenge.

[jimmyjimmy]

Very Funny! OK then, your turn!

Still haven't read the OP?

 

[Haipule]

Thanks for the tip. I'll get busy tearing every page from my Bile that mentions faith or justification. I'll leave the ones that mention, "life", though.

Bile?[funny] "Faith" is a noun and it is a noun of action with a principle, motivation and function. It is not a verb. pistos noun means: that which, or whom, you truize/place confidence in/trust and, as a Christian, should be based on your inventory of ideas built through the study of God's Word as well as, what we learn through life/death. Experience is the best teacher giving us understanding of the words written and God wanted it that way. It is not blind. "Believe/believing is the verb pisteuO and should be understood as to trust/trusting in that which is your trust(noun).

"Justification" is the forensic(legal) side of the Greek word dikE. One word in Greek: two words in English--just(law)/right(society). We are not Greeks in Greece on trail. The societal side of the word is "right". We are not "justified". Rather, by a death, we are declared right or, rightified living in rightification and it had nothing to do with us. In fact, that death was so private between God and the humanity of Jesus, that it was shrouded in darkness. And so separate from us, that we cannot add, nor take away from it. It is a matter of history and a done deal.

Don't rip it up. It is a useful tool. But, grab an interlinear bible, some lexicons and a beginner book on Greek grammatical inflection(that's all you will ever need: I read some of the more advanced books and was horrified by the erroneous manipulative tools) and you will see the beauty of God's gorgeous Word with out the rocket science and guilt trips of theology. The Scriptures are simple books written to simple minds. They are not puzzles, cryptic nor anal.

 

[Hammster]

Very Funny! OK then, your turn!

Well, I started the OP with a specific guideline. So it doesn't really apply to me.

 

[Hammster]

I'm certain that people also understood what choosing means

You think so? I wonder if they also understood agriculture and shepherding.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Okay. When you make an actual argument, let me know.

If it weren't for straw men, there wouldn't be a forum.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I'm certain that people also understood what choosing means

If so, why does most all the world
never choose
to serve God ?
They willingly go to destruction/ resurrection to shame and judgment, instead ..

 

[Hammster]

If so, why does most all the world
never choose
to serve God ?
They willingly go to destruction/ resurrection to shame and judgment, instead ..

You need to respond to the context of his post.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

You need to respond to the context of his post.

Maybe after he clarifies it.

 

[Hammster]

Maybe after he clarifies it.

There was a context to it. It was part of a longer conversation. You just jumped into the last page and made assumptions about what he said that have absolutely nothing to do with your comment.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

There was a context to it. It was part of a longer conversation. You just jumped into the last page and made assumptions about what he said that have absolutely nothing to do with your comment.

Don't assume that at all - it starts with a false premise, so cannot have good results.

 

[Hammster]

Don't assume that at all - it starts with a false premise, so cannot have good results.

Okay, I thought were unintentionally posting off topic. Now I see you were doing it intentionally.

Anyway, back to the discussion.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Okay, I thought were unintentionally posting off topic. Now I see you were doing it intentionally.

Anyway, back to the discussion.

Not at all- you seem to make that same assumption / mistake / frequently.

That's what questions or statements/ posts/ to achieve clarity are for.

 

[Hammster]

Not at all- you seem to make that same assumption / mistake / frequently.

That's what questions or statements/ posts/ to achieve clarity are for.

Okay.

 

[Truthfrees]

This section might be helpful to at least start your questioning.

one foundational question from what i have read so far

is predestination the main tenet of calvinism?

is that what non-c's mainly oppose?

is this link basically the foundation for predestination?

 

[ToBeLoved]

Bile?[funny] "Faith" is a noun and it is a noun of action with a principle, motivation and function. It is not a verb. pistos noun means: that which, or whom, you truize/place confidence in/trust and, as a Christian, should be based on your inventory of ideas built through the study of God's Word as well as, what we learn through life/death. Experience is the best teacher giving us understanding of the words written and God wanted it that way. It is not blind. "Believe/believing is the verb pisteuO and should be understood as to trust/trusting in that which is your trust(noun).

"Justification" is the forensic(legal) side of the Greek word dikE. One word in Greek: two words in English--just(law)/right(society). We are not Greeks in Greece on trail. The societal side of the word is "right". We are not "justified". Rather, by a death, we are declared right or, rightified living in rightification and it had nothing to do with us. In fact, that death was so private between God and the humanity of Jesus, that it was shrouded in darkness. And so separate from us, that we cannot add, nor take away from it. It is a matter of history and a done deal.

Don't rip it up. It is a useful tool. But, grab an interlinear bible, some lexicons and a beginner book on Greek grammatical inflection(that's all you will ever need: I read some of the more advanced books and was horrified by the erroneous manipulative tools) and you will see the beauty of God's gorgeous Word with out the rocket science and guilt trips of theology. The Scriptures are simple books written to simple minds. They are not puzzles, cryptic nor anal.

Why not list all your Greek sources and give us a lesson in Greek here. Not that I don't think you know who your talking about, but sources in Greek would allow me to double check your logic.

No one can follow what you are saying from the Greek or verify it. Bible hub has a good Greek reference area.

Otherwise. Lay off the Greek if we can't verify it, because without verification you have not proven the words you posted are the ones in the Bible at all or even that you can understand or know Greek at all.

 

[Hammster]

one foundational question from what i have read so far

is predestination the main tenet of calvinism?

is that what non-c's mainly oppose?

is this link basically the foundation for predestination?

God's sovereignty is the main tenet of Reformed Theology. The other issues would be concerned with how He gets the results He wants.

 

[Truthfrees]

God's sovereignty is the main tenet of Reformed Theology. The other issues would be concerned with how He gets the results He wants.

can you give me that link?

what are the other issues that follow sovereignty?

can you give me those links in order of importance?

 

[Hammster]

can you give me that link?

what are the other issues that follow sovereignty?

can you give me those links in order of importance?

The other issues would be spelled out in the links in the OP. Election, predestination, atonement, etc. are the issues in question.

I think the London Baptist one is the best out of the ones I linked to.

 

[Truthfrees]

The other issues would be spelled out in the links in the OP. Election, predestination, atonement, etc. are the issues in question.

I think the London Baptist one is the best out of the ones I linked to.

can you link it here again so that i can follow you step by step as you answer my questions

i don't want to hunt and search and discover later that i found the wrong link

i'd like to walk step by step through each answer you give to eliminate misunderstanding

 

[Truthfrees]

that is not the problem we have

we have a problem with calvin saying God forces anyone to do/think/decide something

it's that part of calvin's predestination theology that is opposed/incomprehensible

Which is why I created the straw man thread, since this here is an example of one.

why do you say this is a strawman?

can you clarify?