The 'Macro-Micro' thing....again..

[PsychoSarah]

Ornithorhynchus anatinus



Platypus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The platypus (Ornithorhynchus anatinus) is a semiaquatic mammal endemic to eastern Australia, including Tasmania. Together with the four species of echidna, it is one of the five extant species of monotremes, the only mammals that lay eggs instead of giving birth. It is the sole living representative of its family (Ornithorhynchidae) and genus (Ornithorhynchus), though a number of related species have been found in the fossil record.
The unusual appearance of this egg-laying, duck-billed, beaver-tailed, otter-footed mammal baffled European naturalists when they first encountered it, with some considering it an elaborate fraud. It is one of the few venomous mammals, the male platypus having a spur on the hind foot that delivers a venom capable of causing severe pain to humans. The unique features of the platypus make it an important subject in the study of evolutionary biology and a recognisable and iconic symbol of Australia;

There is a difference between something like that and a catdog or a crocoduck, or some other such creature that tries to mash creatures that aren't in the same evolutionary timeline and split from each other millions of years ago.

 

[Riberra]

deleted

 

[createdtoworship]

There is a difference between something like that and a catdog or a crocoduck, or some other such creature that tries to mash creatures that aren't in the same evolutionary timeline and split from each other millions of years ago.

It is a mix and mash creature, as you requested. But not a link. See a transition may have only minor differences but not within the same genus. the leapord and tiger are both panthera and may breed together, but the cheetah is not. So finding a cheetah and a tiger cub from separate genuses would be a transition. simply because they are separate animals who don't normally mate but under the pretense of evolution they may somehow mutate or adapt to become closer relatives.

THAT is my understanding of evolution, but it is without evidence.

No two animals from separate genus, will ever mate or produce an offspring or missing link. In this a basic tenet of evolution all fails. Selection is true. Micro evolution is true. but the above has no links, hence the title "missing." But one thing I can't understand is with all the archaology, geology and biology being done in the world why is there no transitions being brought forward?

evolution has no proof as I say,

therefore it's un observable.

and in conclusion,

evolution is not science.

and should not be federally funded (IMHO)

 

[createdtoworship]

deleted

I saw your post about it being a mix and mash, and yes it would appear so. Just not a link.

 

[PsychoSarah]

yes there is something different but not so different. See a transition may have only minor differences but not within the same genus. the leapord and tiger are both panthera and may breed together, but the cheetah is not. So finding a cheetah and a tiger cub from separate genuses would be a transition. simply because they are separate animals who don't normally mate but under the pretense of evolution they may somehow mutate or adapt to become closer relatives.

THAT is my understanding of evolution, but it is without evidence.

No two animals from separate genus, will ever mate or produce an offspring or missing link. In this a basic tenet of evolution all fails. Selection is true. Micro evolution is true. but the above has no links, hence the title "missing." But one thing I can't understand is with all the archaology, geology and biology being done in the world why is there no transitions being brought forward?

evolution has no proof as I say,

therefore it's un observable.

and in conclusion,

evolution is not science.

and should not be federally funded (IMHO)

It won't happen directly. You are treating it as single generations without realizing that evolution is extremely gradual. You could have 50 generations pass and the only difference in the population might be that those of the creature that live in the forest are speckled while those that live in the grassy plains are striped. Given another 50 generations and those populations, which due to proximity rarely interbred, might have different claw shapes. And so on and so on.

 

[createdtoworship]

It won't happen directly. You are treating it as single generations without realizing that evolution is extremely gradual. You could have 50 generations pass and the only difference in the population might be that those of the creature that live in the forest are speckled while those that live in the grassy plains are striped. Given another 50 generations and those populations, which due to proximity rarely interbred, might have different claw shapes. And so on and so on.

okay then out of the 50 generations find one, and submit it as evidence....

there have been interesting discussions about leapords being a missing link, but again they have all turned up nothing. The fact there is not one single missing link of anything should alarm us all. Talk about a blind watchmaker. Who is blind now? IF I stated that we evolved from aliens and offered no proof, then made tax payers pay for it even though they didn't believe it. And then called it a hypothesis, and a scientific theory. Would it be? No it would be a scientific model at best. But not even science because science doesn't pertain to the extraterrestrial so called world.

evolution is no better.

say I said you came from a poodle.

then did the same method above.

and taxed you for teaching it to the masses.

then showed artistic renderings of poodle to man transitions and used clay mortar to make up plastar molds of transitions and photographed them in the museum of natural history.

then made it mandatory all schools teach it.

eventually you would believe you were half poodle.

truly sad.

(it makes me sick to think about, I truly feel sorry for ya all)

no, we were made in God's image.

but if you will, in the designers image.

following the blue prints in the heavens.

this is why certain animals can not mate with others.

or why crocoducks don't exist. because all was created according to their kind or genus (generally speaking).

its not a perfect theory without problems but I have never seen any refutation to it, and I would place all my money on it right now.

and most likely nothing will change.

seeing all the time and effort invested in evolution and still not transitions in hundreds of years.

going to bed ttyl

 

[PsychoSarah]

In those 50 generations, I can show you established small changes between two populations of the same species.

I can do even better than that by giving you living examples, if you get over your plant issue. I could literally send you living beings that have experienced these changes along with the typical, original variety. No gene splicing, no cut and paste plant parts, just good old fashioned random mutation.

 

[Kylie]

for one, because that is the definition of macro evolution, secondly because evolution must have crossed a genus barrier since apes and humans are different genra. Unless you are suggesting that it has not occurred, then we would be in agreement.

Well, actually, I've never really heard anyone but creationists harping on about the difference between macro and micro, so I don't by it as a valid scientific definition from that. And anyway, any two consecutive generations are going to be the same genus anyway, and it's the change over many generations that results in a different genus, so the claim that the two different species should still be alive is preposterous.

 

[bhsmte]

plant evolution I am sure would bypass a genus barrier, because plants are plants and you can graft whatever to whatever. But I feel you are at a lack for evidence and so you must try to scramble to whatever you know.


Just so you know I have never in five years seen an evolutionist answer this one challenge to evolution. Find one transition of an animal in the fossil record or any record that is linked to two separate genus'. An ape man is one transition, but there have been none discovered. A dog whale, or a cat dog or whatever you want. Just pic one.

but like I said no one has answered this challenge so you are not the first.

And regardless, the evidence to support evolution just keeps getting stronger and stronger, especially with DNA evidence of late.

 

[biggles53]

It is a mix and mash creature, as you requested. But not a link. See a transition may have only minor differences but not within the same genus. the leapord and tiger are both panthera and may breed together, but the cheetah is not. So finding a cheetah and a tiger cub from separate genuses would be a transition. simply because they are separate animals who don't normally mate but under the pretense of evolution they may somehow mutate or adapt to become closer relatives.

THAT is my understanding of evolution, but it is without evidence.

No two animals from separate genus, will ever mate or produce an offspring or missing link. In this a basic tenet of evolution all fails. Selection is true. Micro evolution is true. but the above has no links, hence the title "missing." But one thing I can't understand is with all the archaology, geology and biology being done in the world why is there no transitions being brought forward?

evolution has no proof as I say,

therefore it's un observable.

and in conclusion,

evolution is not science.

and should not be federally funded (IMHO)

Your understanding of evolution is absolutely woeful and the teachers who instructed you should give back their salaries....!

 

[PsychoSarah]

Your understanding of evolution is absolutely woeful and the teachers who instructed you should give back their salaries....!

I know, I didn't know what to say to it, I mean, evolution doesn't say any of those things.

 

[Riberra]

I know, I didn't know what to say to it, I mean, evolution doesn't say any of those things.

What came first, the egg or the chicken?

 

[pgp_protector]

What came first, the egg or the chicken?

A non chicken egg

 

[Subduction Zone]

What came first, the egg or the chicken?

Since chickens are a species the correct answer is neither.

 

[poikilotherm]

What came first, the egg or the chicken?

The egg. Chickens derived from dinosaurs which lay eggs.

 

[loveofourlord]

here you say that events can be repeated, but then go on to illustrate DNA, which is not an event but an experiment. I am not sure what you are saying is logical.

Experimental events, I can take all the DNA from all living species if I want too, compare the DNA and create a nested heirchy, and then so can you, we can do the same with ERV and so on, if we can get the same results within a margin or error then we can show that something is likly true.

Take dendocrhonology, if I can take the same tree core samples, carbondate the rings, and line them up to specific dates, and then you take the same ones an get same results, if dozens of people can then we have science. The only thing that is important, isn't that we can watch the trees grow for 8000 years or what ever, but the experiment that determines the tree rings go over 8000 years can be repeated. It's not one line of evidence, but multiple lines working together.

 

[Riberra]

Why don't we find a single non-avian dinosaur fossil above the 65 million year old K/T boundary?

The author is not saying that the animal described to Job by God which have the characteristic of((Apatosaurus)existed in the time of Job.
Source:
When was The beginning

(Apatosaurus) has a tail like the mighty Cedar tree, the Brontosaurus' tail grew to some thirty feet long, weighing over five tons. You've all seen the assembled skeletal remains in the museums. The Behemoth, with the description from God in the Scripture:

Job 40:15-2415 Behold now behemoth, which I made with thee; he eateth grass as an ox.
16 Lo now, his strength is in his loins, and his force is in the navel of his belly.
17 He moveth his tail like a cedar: the sinews of his stones are wrapped together.

18 His bones are as strong pieces of brass; his bones are like bars of iron.
19 He is the chief of the ways of God: he that made him can make his sword to approach unto him.
20 Surely the mountains bring him forth food, where all the beasts of the field play.
21 He lieth under the shady trees, in the covert of the reed, and fens.
22 The shady trees cover him with their shadow; the willows of the brook compass him about.
23 Behold, he drinketh up a river, and hasteth not: he trusteth that he can draw up Jordan into his mouth.
24 He taketh it with his eyes: his nose pierceth through snares. (KJV)
​

Explanation and description of Job 40:15-24. Below, in verse number:

• 15, he was created in the first earth age, when God made the souls of man.
• 16, it describes a large muscular body.
• 17, it describes a tail like a Cedar tree; long and mighty.
• 17, the "sinues of his stones" are stout strong legs.
  
• 18, his bones are very strong and solid, large bone is strong.
• 19, he is chief of all of God's kingdom, he is the mightiest of all animals (has no natural predator).
• 20, they climb into the mountains.
• 23, he doesn't have to be in fear of predators at the watering hole.
• 23, when he drinks, he drinks allot, as though he could drink up the river Jordan.
• 24, nothing can snare (trap) him, he is the chief of all creatures (see verse 19), and even his very nose is larger and more powerful than any trap that could be laid for him.

 

[loveofourlord]

for one, because that is the definition of macro evolution, secondly because evolution must have crossed a genus barrier since apes and humans are different genra. Unless you are suggesting that it has not occurred, then we would be in agreement.

Problem is Genus level doesn't allow for enough room for animals to fit on the ark. Take cat kind. These are all the genus's for cats.

Panthera
Lion,tiger,leopard,jaguar

Uncia
Snow leopard.

Neofelis
Clouded leopards

pardofelis
marbled cat

catopuma
bay cat,asian golden cat


And so on. THis isn't even half the genusus, or KIND or cats.


You've just created a massive problem, because many of the animals that creationists would want to stick into cat kind wouldn't work, and if you allow for less groupings, you then accept evolution at a higher rate then even scientists believe is possible.

 

[Riberra]

There is a difference between something like that and a catdog or a crocoduck, or some other such creature that tries to mash creatures that aren't in the same evolutionary timeline and split from each other millions of years ago.

The point i tried to make is that it matched the
mix and mash creature that by your own standard may disprove evolution.

Originally Posted by PsychoSarah

You're kidding. Do you honestly think some Frankenstein mix and mash creature would exist? That would DISPROVE evolution, because it doesn't allow for those kinds of half done changes. If you ever legitimately find a creature like that, evolution is in trouble, not validated.
​

​

Ornithorhynchus anatinus



Platypus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The platypus (Ornithorhynchus anatinus) is a semiaquatic mammal endemic to eastern Australia, including Tasmania. Together with the four species of echidna, it is one of the five extant species of monotremes, the only mammals that lay eggs instead of giving birth. It is the sole living representative of its family (Ornithorhynchidae) and genus (Ornithorhynchus), though a number of related species have been found in the fossil record.
The unusual appearance of this egg-laying, duck-billed, beaver-tailed, otter-footed mammal baffled European naturalists when they first encountered it, with some considering it an elaborate fraud. It is one of the few venomous mammals, the male platypus having a spur on the hind foot that delivers a venom capable of causing severe pain to humans. The unique features of the platypus make it an important subject in the study of evolutionary biology and a recognisable and iconic symbol of Australia;

 

[loveofourlord]

Ornithorhynchus anatinus



Platypus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The platypus (Ornithorhynchus anatinus) is a semiaquatic mammal endemic to eastern Australia, including Tasmania. Together with the four species of echidna, it is one of the five extant species of monotremes, the only mammals that lay eggs instead of giving birth. It is the sole living representative of its family (Ornithorhynchidae) and genus (Ornithorhynchus), though a number of related species have been found in the fossil record.
The unusual appearance of this egg-laying, duck-billed, beaver-tailed, otter-footed mammal baffled European naturalists when they first encountered it, with some considering it an elaborate fraud. It is one of the few venomous mammals, the male platypus having a spur on the hind foot that delivers a venom capable of causing severe pain to humans. The unique features of the platypus make it an important subject in the study of evolutionary biology and a recognisable and iconic symbol of Australia;

Funnny how this works well within evolution.

Lets see, leathery legs closer to that of reptiles as evolution would predict. Check

Bill looks like a duck, but again completly different in actuality no anatomic simularities.

Tail again is different from beavers, only superficially simular.

The venom proves evolution, as it's a gene duplication and subsequent evolution from part of the imune system.

What about it does anything to disprove evolution?