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The historicity of Adam

Discussion in 'The Ancient Way - Eastern Orthodox' started by Dewi Sant, Oct 5, 2013.

  1. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    well, I would say that for one, our vision, our mind, and our will are all fallen, so we don't see things as they should be, because NOTHING in creation is as it should be.

    and no one is saying that scientists are sloppy, but they base their observations (to borrow from the Prodigal son), on looking ONLY at how the pig pen works. so they only look to those eyes when looking at the universe. what if the Father's House was once where the pig pen is now, clean and warm and everything?

    well, then the problem is not how the scientists do their experimentation, nor is it that they are being illogical. their starting point, being different, has differing consequences. so if the pig pen was always there, the way that it was being the pig pen, then only looking at the pig pen makes perfect sense. if, however, that part of the Father's House became the pig pen, then they are starting with the wrong assumptions.
     
  2. jckstraw72

    jckstraw72 Doin' that whole Orthodox thing

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    investigating the past is dependent upon death - you need remains from the past which are there because of the corruption and death of the fallen world. St. John of Kronstadt points to the ridiculousness of scientists trying to know the mind of God through the lifeless layers of the earth and the dead remains therein. Science looks to death, while the Saint investigates creation through Life. St. Isaac of Syria tells us that one of the visions of the Saint is the vision of the creation of the world. As has been pointed out, in our own times this was experienced at least by Elder Joseph of Vatopaidi, and probably by others we have not heard about. This is how Moses wrote Genesis - he was granted a vision, not simply words. This is infinitely superior.
     
  3. rusmeister

    rusmeister A Russified American Orthodox Chestertonian

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    Well said, Matt.
     
  4. truthseeker32

    truthseeker32 Lost in the Cosmos

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    I am sorry for my tone, friends. This discussion is bad for my soul. I shouldn't get into discussion about these issues.
     
  5. AndrewEOC

    AndrewEOC Newbie

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    Indeed. It would make the physical universe no less than an illusion, which is not what the Church has always taught.

    But I really, really have to go now and probably won't be back in the forseeable future. I will end my participation here by saying that, for me, what science has revealed about the physical nature and history of the universe in no way demeans the Divine Truth taught by the Church and embodied in the Creed. My wonder at God's creation is only increased by learning about evolution or the transformation of the universe over billions of years that miraculously resulted in our existence. I do not view science as uncovering anything that has relevance independent of our beliefs as Christians and stand in awe at how God made us from the primordial dust, whether by evolution or by some process that will be discovered and disprove evolutionary theory in the future (extremely unlikely though that is at this point).
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2013
  6. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    ain't nuthin wrong with your tone man
     
  7. gurneyhalleck1

    gurneyhalleck1 Reader

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    Yeah! He ain't got nothin' nohow that be bad, man. He be cool....

     
  8. rusmeister

    rusmeister A Russified American Orthodox Chestertonian

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    Fair winds and following seas!
    You've got my e-mail, I think, if you are in my neck of the woods. Buying a cell phone and SIM card here is not difficult. Ask for me by name at Yahoo!
    By the prayers of St Nicholas and St Christopher, may God grant you a safe journey!
     
  9. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    Lord have mercy on you Andrew!
     
  10. HIM_In_Me_In_HIM

    HIM_In_Me_In_HIM Angel Of YHVH

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    i'm assuming someone's covered the Hebrew on Ha'adam, by now, right?
     
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