The Generations

[JohnR7]

In the genologys of Jesus we read:

Matthew 1:17 So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David until the carrying away into Babylon are fourteen generations; and from the carrying away into Babylon unto Christ are fourteen generations.

In the Book of Luke, we read that there were about 10 generations from Adam to Noah, and around another 10 generation from Noah to Abraham. So if you take 14 + 14 + 14 + 20 that comes out to 62 generations from Adam to Jesus over about a 4000 year span of time. The Hebrew calander is based on Adam being 5762 years ago.

Now, lets look at a scripture that has stuck in my head for years, ever since I first read it.

Deut. 7:9 Know therefore that the Lord thy God, he is God, the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations;

One thousand generations? If it took about 4000 years to cover 64 generations from Adam to Jesus. Then 1,000 generations would be about 64,000 years.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Originally posted by JohnR7
In the genologys of Jesus we read:

Matthew 1:17 So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David until the carrying away into Babylon are fourteen generations; and from the carrying away into Babylon unto Christ are fourteen generations.

In the Book of Luke, we read that there were about 10 generations from Adam to Noah, and around another 10 generation from Noah to Abraham. So if you take 14 + 14 + 14 + 20 that comes out to 62 generations from Adam to Jesus over about a 4000 year span of time. The Hebrew calander is based on Adam being 5762 years ago.

Wait a minute...

Matthew 1:2-16 lists 41 generations, including Arbraham and Christ himself, if you count them up. But in the very next verse, Mt 1:17 "Thus, there were fourteen generations from Abraham to David, fourteen from David to the exile to Babylon, and fourteen from the exile to the Christ."

14+14+14 = 42. Who's missing?

Luke 3:23-31 names 43 generations from Christ just to get back to David. It takes a total of 56 generations to go back to Abraham,  and 76 generations to get back to Adam.

Somebody's math is off. Either mine, yours, or the Bible's

 

[JohnR7]

Originally posted by Nathan Poe
76 generations to get back to Adam.

Somebody's math is off. Either mine, yours, or the Bible's

I did not spend that much time on it. Even if we are talking 72 generatons, How does that relate to the three differnet places in the Bible that talks about 1000 generations?

Of course my answer is that Adam may have been the first food producer. But there was a group of good gathers that had been around for a while. It could be that Adam's son Seth married a female from this other group of people. It is either that or he married his sister. But from what we know about brother - sister marriages, even among wolves. It will keep the species alive, but they will not grow or develop. They go sort of dorment, tell someone from outside of the family comes along.  Then the population will explode. In fact when it comes to having children, the further you can get away from your own familys genes, the better off you will be.

 

 

[Freodin]

Could you accept that this talking of "1000 generations" was just a metaphor for "a very long time"?

 

[JohnR7]

Originally posted by Freodin
Could you accept that this talking of "1000 generations" was just a metaphor for "a very long time"?

No, everything in the Bible has a literal meaning also. Even though there are shadows and types.

Moses hit the rock twice instead of just once and got in big trouble for not hitting it just once. (num 20:11)

 

[Matthew]

I did not spend that much time on it. Even if we are talking 72 generatons, How does that relate to the three differnet places in the Bible that talks about 1000 generations?

When the Bible lists 72/42 or some other number of generations, it was intending to go from the present into the past. References to "1000 generations" could even mean "a very great number of generations", or it could be literal. Either way, these numbers are meant to go from the present (when it was written) into the future. They were a guarantee of God's covenant faithfulness.

Of course my answer is that Adam may have been the first food producer. But there was a group of good gathers that had been around for a while. It could be that Adam's son Seth married a female from this other group of people.

The Bible does not allow for other groups of people. All it allows for is Adam, Eve and their descendants.

It is either that or he married his sister. But from what we know about brother - sister marriages, even among wolves. It will keep the species alive, but they will not grow or develop. They go sort of dorment, tell someone from outside of the family comes along.  Then the population will explode. In fact when it comes to having children, the further you can get away from your own familys genes, the better off you will be.

Leaving genetics aside, the marriage of brothers and sisters is what the Bible does imply for that time period.

 

[JohnR7]

Originally posted by Matthew
Leaving genetics aside, the marriage of brothers and sisters is what the Bible does imply for that time period.

The Bible prohibits marriages between brothers and sisters. deut 27:22, eze 22:11, lev 18:9

Malachi 3:6a "For I am the Lord, I do not change;

Hebrews 13:8  Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.



 

 

[kaotic]

Originally posted by JohnR7
No, everything in the Bible has a literal meaning also. Even though there are shadows and types.

Moses hit the rock twice instead of just once and got in big trouble for not hitting it just once. (num 20:11)

Does the bible say anywhere that you are suppose to take this compelely literal?

 

[Matthew]

The Bible prohibits marriages between brothers and sisters. deut 27:22, eze 22:11, lev 18:9

Malachi 3:6a "For I am the Lord, I do not change;

Hebrews 13:8  Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.

Those were laws enacted during Moses. They were not applicable previously. The Bible also prohibited eating unclean animals: Lev 7:19, 11:4, 11:8, 11:29. Yet this law was abolished under the new covenant: Acts 10, 15.

The verse that says, "The LORD does not change", means that God's essential properties cannot change. It does not mean that his laws cannot.

Does the bible say anywhere that you are suppose to take this compelely literal?

This is an absurd requirement. And I will demonstrate:

1) God made the earth in six days, and he made birds before reptiles.

2) (1) is meant literally.

But what about (2)? Is it also meant literally? To be sure, God should have included this:

3) (2) is meant literally.

But (3) is the same as (2). So if there is no way to know that (2) is literal on its own, then no statement will be able to convince you. But if a statement can be known as literal on its own, why do we even need (2)?

 

[JohnR7]

Originally posted by Matthew
The verse that says, "The LORD does not change", means that God's essential properties cannot change. It does not mean that his laws cannot.

Matthew 5:18  For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

I believe the law still applys to us today. We are to keep the righteous requirements of the law. We live under grace. The Holy Spirit is IN us, and seldom did the Holy Spirit dwell IN people under the Old Covenant. Clearly our righteousness is to go beyond their righteousness. There are sins that God overlooked under the old covenant, that He will not overlook now.

They had sins that were covered over by the Blood. We do not have that available to us today. Our only option is to be cleansed in the Blood from all sin.

Matthew 5:20 For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.

Those to who more is given, more is required from them.



 

 

[Nathan Poe]

Originally posted by JohnR7
Matthew 5:18  For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

I believe the law still applys to us today. We are to keep the righteous requirements of the law. We live under grace. The Holy Spirit is IN us, and seldom did the Holy Spirit dwell IN people under the Old Covenant. Clearly our righteousness is to go beyond their righteousness. There are sins that God overlooked under the old covenant, that He will not overlook now. 

So does this mean you keep all the Biblical laws? Including the infamous Leviticus laws?

 

[Matthew]

I believe the law still applys to us today. We are to keep the righteous requirements of the law. We live under grace. The Holy Spirit is IN us, and seldom did the Holy Spirit dwell IN people under the Old Covenant. Clearly our righteousness is to go beyond their righteousness. There are sins that God overlooked under the old covenant, that He will not overlook now.

So, are you saying that:

1) You must not eat rabbits (Lev 11:6)

2) Whoever touches a carcass must wash his clothes (Lev 11:28)

3) Mediums (those who contact the dead) must be stoned to death (Lev 20:27)

4) Those who blaspheme must be stoned by the entire community (Lev 24:16)

5) If a leader sins unintentionally he must bring a male goat for sacrifice (Lev 4:22-23)

Really. I doubt the Christian community agrees with you.

 

[judge]

Originally posted by Nathan Poe
Wait a minute...

Matthew 1:2-16 lists 41 generations, including Arbraham and Christ himself, if you count them up. But in the very next verse, Mt 1:17 "Thus, there were fourteen generations from Abraham to David, fourteen from David to the exile to Babylon, and fourteen from the exile to the Christ."

14+14+14 = 42. Who's missing?

Luke 3:23-31 names 43 generations from Christ just to get back to David. It takes a total of 56 generations to go back to Abraham,  and 76 generations to get back to Adam.

Somebody's math is off. Either mine, yours, or the Bible's

 

Yes Nathan you are correct. There is only 41 generations (that is if we read the english or greek translations).

However if we read the Aramaic we see that the Joseph mentioned in Matthew 1:16 is the FATHER of Mary rather than the husband, and thus we have 42 generations.

I have addressed it further here.

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/26623.html

 

[JohnR7]

Originally posted by Nathan Poe
So does this mean you keep all the Biblical laws? Including the infamous Leviticus laws?

If your a Levi and have a temple to worship in, but the temple was taken down and burned by the Romans in 70 ad.

I think it is very interesting that they have a clear marker in the Genetic Code that they can tell you exactly who is and who is not qualified to call themselves a Levi. Even though only about 1% of the people who call themselves Jewish, really are.

Our job as Christians is to be able to explain the meaning of the temple rituals. It was never about being justifed by performing rituals, it was all about the symbolism, the shadows and types, and understanding what the rituals are trying to teach us.

Also, I try to follow a few of the general guide lines of the Levi priest, the ones that apply to all priests. We are all called to be priests before God.

 

[JohnR7]

Originally posted by Matthew
4) Those who blaspheme must be stoned by the entire community (Lev 24:16) 

Jesus never said that they should not be stoned. He just showed them that everyone was worthy of death, and no one was willing to step forward and throw the first stone. We would all have to stone each other to death and no one would be left.

As it is, we decide that murder is a worse crime then adultry, so we zap people for murder, or give them a lethal injection, but we do nothing to people who commit adultry. I think we should either kill the people who commit adultry, or quit killing the murders.

Still, we live under grace. God is long suffering, not wanting any to perish, but for all to come to a saving knowledge of the truth. So He gives people time and a chance to repent and turn away from their sin. If they do not repent, and turn to God whole heartedly, then they well end up dying, because that is the wages of sin.