THE FULFILLMENT OF BABYLON THE GREAT

[Douggg]

For example, there is no publication 'Barclay, Chapter XXVII, p. 218, “Cities Petrus Bertanous”' which contains the supposed but fabricated quotation by Pope Pius V. The fancy/foreign sounding title and chapter and page number were meant to deceive you. Notice there is no date given for this publication or first name of "Barclay," that is a warning sign that should make one proceed with caution. If you thought it through at least one anti-Catholic who actually found powerful documentation that the pope said he was the same as God or something similarly would be expected to post an image of such a page or a link to the page. For a second example of a bogus source for a fabricated quotation supposedly from a pope, there was no publication in 1895 called the Catholic National. You said you checked references, what kind of checking did you do?

"There are not over a hundred people in the United States who hate the Catholic Church. There are millions, however, who hate what they wrongly believe to be the Catholic Church — which is, of course, quite a different thing. These millions can hardly be blamed for hating Catholics because Catholics “adore statues”; because they “put the Blessed Mother on the same level with God”; because they say “indulgence is a permission to commit sin”; because the Pope “is a Fascist”; because the “Church is the defender of Capitalism.” If the Church taught or believed any one of these things it should be hated, but the fact is that the Church does not believe nor teach any one of them. It follows then that the hatred of the millions is directed against error and not against truth. As a matter of fact, if we Catholics believed all of the untruths and lies which were said against the Church, we probably would hate the Church a thousand times more than they do."
Bishop Fulton Sheen

Hi Valietta,

I am curious. Do Catholics say that the Pope is "the" Vicar of Christ, and not "a: Vicar of Christ ? "the" Vicar of Christ seems to indicate exclusivity.

 

[Marilyn C]

It's not over yet ..... (papal rulership) will indeed come .... that is why the "common good" (humanism) is being promoted through the papacy (because it includes everyone)

It will be a repeat of the dark ages.

The Pope won`t rule for he is a religious leader. The A/C is a Political leader and the False Prophet is a religious economist.

 

[eclipsenow]

It's not over yet ..... (papal rulership) will indeed come .... that is why the "common good" (humanism) is being promoted through the papacy (because it includes everyone)

It will be a repeat of the dark ages.

But the problem is any Christian futurist can just insert any person or regime or thing they don't like into Revelation 13's 'beast' or the Babylon metaphor. What I want is evidence, and most of the theologians I respect say Babylon was ancient Rome. Instead, John was writing to his generation about his generation suffering under Rome. The Judgement Day imagery is the general reminder and promise that one day God's enemies will be judged, NOT some kind of timetable of the future that generations of "futurists" are to argue over as they compete to insert their most hated enemy or pet theory into the bible! Instead the "Apocalyptic genre" was John saying specific things to his generation so that all future Christians could understand how to deal with the beast-governments in their day.

The Apocalypse

Ep 97: There aren’t many parts of the Bible that excite the imagination more than its thrilling climax in the book of Revelation. Amidst the imagery, violence and controversy, how do we sort truth from fiction?

undeceptions.com

For a more Biblical perspective try these.

World's End - Undeceptions

Undeceptions Episode 34: Christianity has plenty to say the world's end. However, our cultural narrative has become increasingly apocalyptic.

undeceptions.com

 

[eclipsenow]

The Pope won`t rule for he is a religious leader. The A/C is a Political leader and the False Prophet is a religious economist.

Was. These things happened already.

 

[Douggg]

Was. These things happened already.

What has not happened in the past is a failed Jewish messiah who was anointed the King of Israel.

The Antichrist will be a future failed Jewish messiah, who gets anointed the King of Israel, before he reveals himself as the man of sin.

 

[eclipsenow]

What has not happened in the past is a failed Jewish messiah who was anointed the King of Israel.

The Antichrist will be a future failed Jewish messiah, who gets anointed the King of Israel, before he reveals himself as the man of sin.

My friend Doctor Greg Clark on the antichrists​

John writes that “many antichrists have come”, reminding us that there has been great opposition to Christ ever since he was born (remember how Herod killed all the babies in Bethlehem trying to get to Jesus?). Throughout the whole Bible, we find characters who are ‘anti’ God’s plans—wicked men, foreign kings, false prophets and ‘the beast’ who features in Revelation 13. Even in Deuteronomy, there are warnings about the rise of prophets who lie and preach rebellion against the true God.

But is there going to be one mega-evil ruler who will deceive the world and lead millions astray and do things like brand ‘666’ on their foreheads?

Probably not. There are passages in the Bible which talk about a particular being who is Christ’s foe (e.g., “the man of lawlessness” in 2 Thessalonians 2 or the dragon of Revelation 12-13 who is identified as the Devil). But this kind of symbolic language is used to describe an attitude or spirit of evil rather than a single evil person. The fact that some parts of Scripture bring ultimate evil to a head by using an individual character to identify it probably says more about how dramatic literature operates than it does about predicting history.

The worst thing about antichrists is that they have come from within the church! The apostle John wrote that they “went out from us, but they did not really belong to us”. This is what antichrists do. They get among believers and try to deceive them, persuading them to believe lies and getting people to follow them and their deceptions rather than Jesus and his truth. They teach that Christ did not come in the flesh (1 Jn 4:1-3); they say it doesn’t matter whether you sin or not (1 Jn 1:5-10); and they neglect their Christian brothers and sisters (1 Jn 4:19-21).

According to God’s word, the antichrist might have sat next to you in the church pew. This isn’t a scene from a horror movie; quite the opposite-it is an everyday event. In this final age before Jesus returns, plenty of opponents of Jesus will arise. And they may even be in church, trying to deceive us and lead us into error. But Christians can be confident and at peace, because there will be a day when all ‘antichristness’ will be done away with.

It’s a bit of a waste of time trying to work out whether the antichrist is Boris Yeltsin, the Dalai Lama, Bill Gates or the Pope. It’s just as likely to be your granny or your next door neighbour, if they are promoting lies about our Lord.

Just make sure it isn’t you …

"See that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. If it does, you also will remain in the Son and in the Father. And this is what he promised us—even eternal life." (1 John 2:24-25)

The devil you know

 

[Marilyn C]

What has not happened in the past is a failed Jewish messiah who was anointed the King of Israel.

The Antichrist will be a future failed Jewish messiah, who gets anointed the King of Israel, before he reveals himself as the man of sin.

So, a Jew is the leader of the final Gentile Global Government? Don`t think so.

 

[Douggg]

My friend Doctor Greg Clark on the antichrists​

John writes that “many antichrists have come”, reminding us that there has been great opposition to Christ ever since he was born (remember how Herod killed all the babies in Bethlehem trying to get to Jesus?). Throughout the whole Bible, we find characters who are ‘anti’ God’s plans—wicked men, foreign kings, false prophets and ‘the beast’ who features in Revelation 13. Even in Deuteronomy, there are warnings about the rise of prophets who lie and preach rebellion against the true God.

But is there going to be one mega-evil ruler who will deceive the world and lead millions astray and do things like brand ‘666’ on their foreheads?

Probably not. There are passages in the Bible which talk about a particular being who is Christ’s foe (e.g., “the man of lawlessness” in 2 Thessalonians 2 or the dragon of Revelation 12-13 who is identified as the Devil). But this kind of symbolic language is used to describe an attitude or spirit of evil rather than a single evil person. The fact that some parts of Scripture bring ultimate evil to a head by using an individual character to identify it probably says more about how dramatic literature operates than it does about predicting history.

The worst thing about antichrists is that they have come from within the church! The apostle John wrote that they “went out from us, but they did not really belong to us”. This is what antichrists do. They get among believers and try to deceive them, persuading them to believe lies and getting people to follow them and their deceptions rather than Jesus and his truth. They teach that Christ did not come in the flesh (1 Jn 4:1-3); they say it doesn’t matter whether you sin or not (1 Jn 1:5-10); and they neglect their Christian brothers and sisters (1 Jn 4:19-21).

According to God’s word, the antichrist might have sat next to you in the church pew. This isn’t a scene from a horror movie; quite the opposite-it is an everyday event. In this final age before Jesus returns, plenty of opponents of Jesus will arise. And they may even be in church, trying to deceive us and lead us into error. But Christians can be confident and at peace, because there will be a day when all ‘antichristness’ will be done away with.

It’s a bit of a waste of time trying to work out whether the antichrist is Boris Yeltsin, the Dalai Lama, Bill Gates or the Pope. It’s just as likely to be your granny or your next door neighbour, if they are promoting lies about our Lord.

Just make sure it isn’t you …

"See that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. If it does, you also will remain in the Son and in the Father. And this is what he promised us—even eternal life." (1 John 2:24-25)

The devil you know

Greg Clark does not know what he is talking about concerning "the" Antichrist.

Being "the" Antichrist is just one of several stages, i.e. evolving functional roles of the person. Similar to being governor, then senator, then president that a single person might go through.

The single person who becomes "the" Antichrist, a future failed King of Israel messiah, is .....


first as the little horn, leader of ten EU kings;

then, following God's destruction of Gog's army, as the prince who shall come, geographically north and west of Israel;

then is anointed the King of Israel (coming not in the name of the Lord), becoming "the" Antichrist ;

then is revealed as "the man of sin", end of his time as the King of Israel, Antichrist ;

then is is killed, brought back life, becoming the beast of Revelation;

then the ten kings hand over their EU kingdom to him to become the dictator of the EU


-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here are the evolving functional roles of that person during the 7 year timeline of Daniel 9:27....


.

 

[Douggg]

So, a Jew is the leader of the final Gentile Global Government? Don`t think so.

There is no final Gentile "Global" Government.

There will be a final Gentile "Dominant" Government. Which will be the EU. And as the power of the West, the EU having allies of the U.S. and Canada.

The beast (no longer the Antichrist) will be the dictator of that globally dominant government - over the other three regions of the global, i.e. north, south, east.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The person will be a Jew, as well as, descended from the Julio-Claudian line of Caesars.


1. Julius Caesar
2. Augustus Caesar
3. Tiberius
4. Caligula
5. Claudius
6. Nero

7. end times little horn
8. same person after being killed and brought back to life as "the beast"

 

[trophy33]

Futurists have been so bad in predicting the future events for so many decades that its a strange thing some of you still try to make new and new specific predictions.

"If something does not work, try it again and again till it will work" is not a good strategy.

Putting so much time and effort to create fantazies that will not happen... pointless. Nobody's life is made easier, simpler or better because of it.

 

[Marilyn C]

There is no final Gentile "Global" Government.

`And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.` (Luke 21: 24)

 

[Valletta]

It's not over yet ..... (papal rulership) will indeed come .... that is why the "common good" (humanism) is being promoted through the papacy (because it includes everyone)

It will be a repeat of the dark ages.

Likewise the quote about Pope Nicholas I is fabrication, and there is no "Labb IX Dist.: 96 Can. 7, Satis evidentur, Decret Gratian Primer Para." Now why would someone fabricate such a story, and why would such stories be spread around the Internet to trick people year after year after year?

 

[eclipsenow]

So, a Jew is the leader of the final Gentile Global Government? Don`t think so.

But - remember those Russians in the Golan heights? Don't think so about that either.

 

[eclipsenow]

Here are the evolving functional roles of that person during the 7 year timeline of Daniel 9:27....

Nope.
Here is a good explanation of Daniel.

 

[eclipsenow]

Futurists have been so bad in predicting the future events for so many decades that its a strange thing some of you still try to make new and new specific predictions.

"If something does not work, try it again and again till it will work" is not a good strategy.

Putting so much time and effort to create fantazies that will not happen... pointless. Nobody's life is made easier, simpler or better because of it.

Exactly! But here's the irony. Because Futurism feeds into our narcissistic tendency to want to make Revelation all about us and our times, it gets people frenzied. It's just more exciting and popular than the standard Reformation Amillennial "idealist" view of Revelation being symbolic writing about maintaining gospel hope under Roman persecution - and really - any persecution God's people experience through history. Blah! Who wants that? As a teenager I wanted to dive into the book to see what I could find out about MY ideas, MY dreams, MY fears about MY "baddies" in MY world. As such, futurism easily becomes a mirror into our own hopes and fears. It's addictive. And therefore just more popular.
My conclusion? Because of mathematical probability, some futurists will guess the year the Lord returns. Not because their theology was correct or Revelation is even about the future - but due to probability and the sheer popularity of Christians wasting their time arguing over their end-times-tables.

 

[Valletta]

Hi Valietta,

I am curious. Do Catholics say that the Pope is "the" Vicar of Christ, and not "a: Vicar of Christ ? "the" Vicar of Christ seems to indicate exclusivity.

We usually just say pope or Pope Francis or Francis. I would guess "the" is more common. It is an exclusive role, Peter was the only one of the Apostles given the keys to the kingdom.

 

[Marilyn C]

But - remember those Russians in the Golan heights? Don't think so about that either.

Still to come.

 

[eclipsenow]

We usually just say pope or Pope Francis or Francis. I would guess "the" is more common. It is an exclusive role, Peter was the only one of the Apostles given the keys to the kingdom.

For a little while - then others took over.

 

[eclipsenow]

Still to come.

Nope. Revelation isn't about Russia.

 

[Valletta]

For a little while - then others took over.

It was actually decades until Linus became pope.