The Fall

[Oye11]

Anyone can spam up irrelevant 'prooftext' scripture as you do. Children do that sort of thing. That's never an answer, just another dodge tactic hoped by you to get your opposition chasing rabbits. I think you are child.

It is interesting that he so prides himself in quoting scripture. Ever let a Jehovah Witness in the house? They quote scripture from all around the bible like there is no tomorrow.

 

[Ormly]

It is interesting that he so prides himself in quoting scripture. Ever let a Jehovah Witness in the house? They quote scripture from all around the bible like there is no tomorrow.

Exactly! That's how I learned about 'chasing rabbits'. One will never get finished chasing them once they get sucked in by a cult mentality. No thanks.

 

[Jipsah]

My pearls are for those who can understand the elementary teachings of scripture.

What Scripture would that be, pray tell? You haven't cited any.

 

[Ormly]

What Scripture would that be, pray tell? You haven't cited any.

As it is declared Luther once said: "Oh, its you" and went back to sleep.

 

[DerSchweik]

...

 

[Van]

Hi Beloved57, the sheep, referring to mankind, are hardened by sin. You say that is false teaching. But scripture is on my side yet again. Try Romans 1:18-21. Now as far as your assertion, you have no scripture that says people do not harden themselves by the practice of sin. None, zip, nada.

Once of the failures of Calvinism is they take a metaphor in one passage and apply it to another passage. I used the sheep as the lost, and yet they post like I was referring to the sheep and the goats metaphor. This is how Calvinism is defended. Unsound hermunetics.

They seem to have never heard of the Parable of the Measure. Incredible.

 

[beloved57]

Anyone can spam up irrelevant 'prooftext' scripture as you do. Children do that sort of thing. That's never an answer, just another dodge tactic hoped by you to get your opposition chasing rabbits. I think you are child.

ormly are you a sinless being ?

 

[beloved57]

Hi Beloved57, the sheep, referring to mankind, are hardened by sin. You say that is false teaching. But scripture is on my side yet again. Try Romans 1:18-21. Now as far as your assertion, you have no scripture that says people do not harden themselves by the practice of sin. None, zip, nada.

Once of the failures of Calvinism is they take a metaphor in one passage and apply it to another passage. I used the sheep as the lost, and yet they post like I was referring to the sheep and the goats metaphor. This is how Calvinism is defended. Unsound hermunetics.

They seem to have never heard of the Parable of the Measure. Incredible.

You have hardened sheep and hardened goats = hardened mankind however God only loves and saves the hardened sheep..The goats wiil go were it has been prepared for them to go with their Father..

Matt 25:

33And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty

Now Jn 10:

11I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep. Why Jesus ? because they were sinful..

The goats are sinful to..but christ died for the sinful sheep and he rose for the sheep according to the everlasting covenant..

heb 13:

20Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

van you are totally in the dark as to the things of God but I will teach you if you desire to be taught sir..

 

[Ormly]

I am a saint who is the process of learning not to sin.

 

[beloved57]

I am a saint who is the process of learning not to sin.

so you have not learnt yet , then who is your teacher..

 

[Rightglory]

Beloved57,

Now Jn 10:
11I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep. Why Jesus ? because they were sinful..

20Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

these texts, nor the context in which they are taken give any limitation as to who the sheep are, other than all sinners, all mankind.
As Van also stated, you mix metaphors. One has nothing to do with the other. You make distinctions where there are none.

 

[heymikey80]

I will leave with what Princeton has explained that makes perfect sense to those with "ears":


"The answer to this question could not possibly be less relevant; for whether or not this individual sins has no bearing whatsoever on the words of the Bible. In other words, the Bible says what it says whether this individual sins or not. The truth of the Bible rests upon the Bible itself, and not upon the experience of one individual reader of it.

Instead of using the Bible to find excuses for sin and arguing that we can’t help it, I suggest that it would please God much more if we all used the Bible to find promises of victory over sin. Here is a good one, just for starters (there are many more):

1 Cor. 10:13. No temptation has overtaken you but such as is common to man; and God is faithful, who will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you are able, but with the temptation will provide the way of escape also, so that you will be able to endure it."

I would think it would please God if we concentrated on hearing everything God said, not just looking for victory speeches, especially in circumstances where we seek out sin, or overemphasize a hollow victory over sin.

If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. 1 Jn 1:8-10
​

An understanding of sin that conforms with God's understanding, I think that would please God the most.

 

[Ormly]

I would think it would please God if we concentrated on hearing everything God said, not just looking for victory speeches, especially in circumstances where we seek out sin, or overemphasize a hollow victory over sin.

If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. 1 Jn 1:8-10​

An understanding of sin that conforms with God's understanding, I think that would please God the most.

Victory speech?? Hollow victory speech??

 

[heymikey80]

Victory speech?? Hollow victory speech??

Your quote from Princeton ...

it would please God much more if we all used the Bible to find promises of victory over sin.
​

If that's not prooftexting and cherrypicking the Bible I don't know what is. Every mentor has warned me not to simply, narrowly overemphasize one teaching of the Bible against another. We shouldn't pit God against Himself.

But not this advice.

 

[Ormly]

Your quote from Princeton ...

it would please God much more if we all used the Bible to find promises of victory over sin.​

If that's not prooftexting and cherrypicking the Bible I don't know what is. Every mentor has warned me not to simply, narrowly overemphasize one teaching of the Bible against another. We shouldn't pit God against Himself.

But not this advice.

Sorry, I don't see the "heaviness of implication", you place upon it.

 

[heymikey80]

Sorry, I don't see the "heaviness of implication", you place upon it.

Any time we go looking for something in the Bible that we want, trying to emphasize it more than it's emphasized in Scripture, we get a myopic view of God's purposes -- a very nearsighted view.

If we want to understand the nature of our victory over sin we really need an accounting of our present struggle with sin.

No soldier ever preserved his life on the battlefield by ignoring a skirmish that he needed to suppress. The war's victory may be certain. There are still battles to be fought.

 

[Ormly]

Any time we go looking for something in the Bible that we want, trying to emphasize it more than it's emphasized in Scripture, we get a myopic view of God's purposes -- a very nearsighted view.

If we want to understand the nature of our victory over sin we really need an accounting of our present struggle with sin.

No soldier ever preserved his life on the battlefield by ignoring a skirmish that he needed to suppress. The war's victory may be certain. There are still battles to be fought.

And??

 

[heymikey80]

And??

I think I've answered your question. So to my conclusion:

An understanding of sin that conforms with God's understanding, I think that would please God the most.

 

[Ormly]

I think I've answered your question. So to my conclusion:

OK. We will have to leave it at me not understanding what you are talking about. [Your writing I find difficult to follow. Some find mine the same]

 

[beloved57]

Sorry, I don't see the "heaviness of implication", you place upon it.

ormly do you sin ?