The EASY part of the Sabbath topic - where BOTH Sides find agreement

[BobRyan]

I have no problem with scholars rehearsing the history of the Sabbath. The question is how is the Sabbath to be observed today? Is it a day of rest, or not?

The answer to that is determined by what the Word of God -- so let's take a look.

1. Do the TEN Commandments still exist as part of the moral law of God written on the heart under the New Covenant? This is where Bible scholars on BOTH sides agree that the answer is "yes".
2. Does God's Word dictate that the Sabbath as given in scripture was a day of "holy convocation" Lev 23:3 Bible scholars on BOTH sides agree that the answer is "yes".
3. Does the Word of God predict that for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth - the Sabbath continues to be a day of worship "for all mankind"? - Is 66:23 says the answer is "yes"

Where everyone differs is when it comes to the question "can the Word of God be edited by tradition"?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

The answer to that is determined by what the Word of God -- so let's take a look.

1. Do the TEN Commandments still exist as part of the moral law of God written on the heart under the New Covenant? This is where Bible scholars on BOTH sides agree that the answer is "yes".
2. Does God's Word dictate that the Sabbath as given in in scripture was a day of "holy convocation" Lev 23:3 Bible scholars on BOTH sides agree that the answer is "yes".
3. Does the Word of God predict that for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth - the Sabbath continues to be a day of worship "for all mankind"? - Is 66:23 says the answer is "yes"

Where everyone differs is when it comes to the question "can the Word of God be edited by tradition"?

But there is nothing in the commandment that suggests a commanded assembly on that day for the new covenant church. The purpose, and actual meaning of Sabbath, is rest. Wasn't the assembly command added to the commandment, as part of the law of Moses?

 

[U.S. Grant]

Which we all agree with. The New Covenant that we see in Jer 31:31-34 and unchanged in Heb 8:6-12 is NOT the Old Covenant - but the NEW Covenant DOES "write God's LAW" on the heart -

• the Law of God known to Jeremiah and his readers
• the one that has "do not take God's name in vain" as a command in it even though that command is never repeated in the NT
• the one that includes the TEN having "'honor your father and mother' as the first commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2

This is the part that Bible scholars agree with in almost ALL Christian denominations ... the "easy part".



There is no "tables of stone done away" text in the Bible.

But there is - "'honor your father and mother' as the first commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2 which is a direct reference to that same unit of TEN.

This is the part that Bible scholars agree with in almost ALL Christian denominations ... the "easy part".



Everyone agrees that the "Law regarding the priesthood" in Hebrews 7 is ended such that Christ is now the High Priest as that chapter points out. But that does not mean "it is ok to take God's name in vain for Christians".. Here again the Bible scholars on both sides agree.



The statement by Christ in Matt 19 "KEEP the Commandments" is met with a question in that chapter "Which ones?" - and HIS answer to that question in Matt 19 comes only from the "Law of Moses".

This is irrefutable.



Technically that is correct - only the command "Do not take God's name in vain" is never quoted in the NT. But that technicality does not mean it is ok for Christians to take God's name in vain.


God's Word says "the seventh day IS the Sabbath" Ex 20:10
God's Word says "tomorrow IS the Sabbath" Ex 16
God's Word says that for 40 years no manna fell on that exact day of the week - the 7th day in Ex 16.
God's Word says that the "seventh day was sanctified" Gen 2:1-3 at creation week Ex 20:11.

This is not even disputed among Bible scholars on BOTH sides of the Sabbath topic in almost all denominations.

Bible Sabbath keeping Christians argue that the Bible is correct.



Stating that "the Bible is correct" - is not forbidden in the Bible. All Bible scholars agree with that point as well. (I may have to add that to my list for clarity)

Good explanations.

When I spoke of not judging days, I did not mean the 7th day, which is in all Scripture, but that the 7th day being a 'Saturday' or 'Sunday'. Or 'Friday' for that matter.

I would also argue not taking God's name in vain is written about by the apostles:

Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

The all too modern familiar use of Jesus' name in cursing manner would qualify as taking God's name in vain. Whether done so in comedy, jest, fear, anger, or hatred.

 

[U.S. Grant]

Jesus is openly supporting the death penalty in this case. How do we deal with that in the new covenant church?

If the church has secular power, then have the death penalty.

And the church has had secular power at many times, and has abused the death penalty as well.

Neither the law nor the death penalty of the law are the problem, but how they are used:

But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully.

 

[BobRyan]

But there is nothing in the commandment that suggests a commanded assembly on that day for the new covenant church.

Lev 23:3 and Exodus 20:8-11 are given to the SAME readers by the same author at approximately the same time. And Lev 23:3 commands them to have "holy convocation" on the 7th day Sabbath. What is more that is the Law written on the heart under the Jer 31:31-34 "NEW Covenant" according to Jeremiah.

That is one more example of a Bible detail where Bible scholars on both sides of the Sabbath debate agree.

=================================

And just in case there is a shred of doubt Is 66:23 seals it, saying that even in the case of all eternity after the cross in the New Earth - "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL mankind come before Me to worship"

The purpose, and actual meaning of Sabbath, is rest. Wasn't the assembly command added to the commandment, as part of the law of Moses?

All of it is in the Law of Moses and the Lev 23:3 statement was not "chiseled in stone" next to Ex 20:11 -- but it is included in what Christ called "the Word of God" regarding the Sabbath "made for mankind". And having this aspect of Sabbath observance stated in scripture to be continued for all mankind for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth - clarifies the point that it is not "just for the OT"

 

[BobRyan]

I would also argue not taking God's name in vain is written about by the apostles:

Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

.

I agree that all Ten are referenced in some way (often indirect) so my argument is not that one of of them no longer matters. I am just pointing out that when looking for "direct quote" of the actual text of the commandment - we see the Sabbath quoted from a number of times in the NT but never do we see Exodus 20:7 quoted. (Which is not an argument against that commandment - just an interesting side detail about it.)

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Lev 23:3 and Exodus 20:8-11 are given to the SAME readers by the same author at approximately the same time. And Lev 23:3 commands them to have "holy convocation" on the 7th day Sabbath. What is more that is the Law written on the heart under the Jer 31:31-34 "NEW Covenant" according to Jeremiah.

That is one more example of a Bible detail where Bible scholars on both sides of the Sabbath debate agree.

=================================

And just in case there is a shred of doubt Is 66:23 seals it, saying that even in the case of all eternity after the cross in the New Earth - "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL mankind come before Me to worship"



All of it is in the Law of Moses and the Lev 23:3 statement was not "chiseled in stone" next to Ex 20:11 -- but it is included in what Christ called "the Word of God" regarding the Sabbath "made for mankind". And having this aspect of Sabbath observance stated in scripture to be continued for all mankind for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth - clarifies the point that it is not "just for the OT"

How do scholars explain the fact that few Christians observe the Sabbath?

 

[BobRyan]

The answer to that is determined by what the Word of God -- so let's take a look.

1. Do the TEN Commandments still exist as part of the moral law of God written on the heart under the New Covenant? This is where Bible scholars on BOTH sides agree that the answer is "yes".
2. Does God's Word dictate that the Sabbath as given in scripture was a day of "holy convocation" Lev 23:3 Bible scholars on BOTH sides agree that the answer is "yes".
3. Does the Word of God predict that for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth - the Sabbath continues to be a day of worship "for all mankind"? - Is 66:23 says the answer is "yes"

Where everyone differs is when it comes to the question "can the Word of God be edited by tradition"?

How do scholars explain the fact that few Christians observe the Sabbath?

In my post above I explain that as follows:

Where everyone differs is when it comes to the question "can the Word of God be edited by tradition"? Some say "yes" and others say "no".

in Mark 7:6-13 Jesus says "no".

And that leads to the final question given as the ending of the OP

Now let me ask you a question - reading this post- can you now see why this topic gets such a high level of Bible Sabbath keeping Christians interest ( many of whom used to observe week-day-1 but now observe the seventh day)??

 

[OldWiseGuy]

In my post above I explain that as follows:

Where everyone differs is when it comes to the question "can the Word of God be edited by tradition"? Some say "yes" and others say "no".

in Mark 7:6-13 Jesus says "no".

And that leads to the final question given as the ending of the OP

Didn't the Romans change the "day of the Lord" to Sunday back in the fourth century when they appropriated Christianity as a favored religion?

 

[BobRyan]

Didn't the Romans change the "day of the Lord" to Sunday back in the fourth century when they appropriated Christianity as a favored religion?

They did make some changes to bring the Empire together. And part of that was regarding the "Venerable day of the Sun".

On March 7 321 AD, Constantine approved the “day of the sun” as a day of rest for the Western Roman Empire (at this time, he did not control the Eastern Empire). This was not to honor God or Jesus Christ, but to honor the sun god. Sunday became a civil day of rest for urban areas, but the law did not grant rest to farmers. Below I have provided an English translation from the Codex Justinianus (which was issued in 529 AD).

“All judges and city people and the craftsmen shall rest upon the venerable day of the sun. Country people, however, may freely attend to the cultivation of the fields, because it frequently happens that no other days are better adapted for planting the grain in the furrows or the vines in trenches. So that the advantage given by heavenly providence may not for the occasion of a short time perish.” (Codex Justinian 3.12.2: Imperator Constantinus; Translation from Ayer, 284-285)

https://sabbathsentinel.org/2016/10...te for Roman Emperors, especially Constantine.