The Drake equation... More than likely a race that is beyond this dimension we know...

[Neogaia777]

The Drake equation... More than likely a race that is beyond this dimension we know...

The Drake equation from Wiki: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...bBYq2udjpA3sotBCeaZfkA&bvm=bv.146094739,d.cGc

Even if there is only one other planet in our galaxy, (though it proposes between 1000 at the minimum and 100,000 maximum), even if there was only one or two, like us or once like us (and is now further than us) Anyhow, if there were only one or two in our galaxy, there are trillions of galaxies, meaning, well, you do the math, how many civilizations like or once like us...?

Say there are or were trillions, since there are trillions of galaxies, how far did they get... I'll get to my point... My point is, at least one of them had to go beyond this realm, this dimension, into perhaps a matterless, timeless, and a place where space, time, and distance and matter and material as we know it does not matter, so to speak...

The odds are totally in favor of it, mathematically speaking...

Anyone disagree...?

Comments...?

Maybe they gave rise to A.I., maybe they exist in another dimension or type of reality now, maybe they've existed before this entire universe was, and this universe is like a computer program, that uses biological machines, (bioelectrochemical) and this is all a simulation created by and managed by them...

Consider the possibilities...

God Bless!

 

[John Hyperspace]

Yeah but I would propose that math is a gigo system like logic; garbage in: garbage out. The Drake equation is an example of garbage out from garbage in. The problem is that the "probability of life" is a unknown variable, and an unknown variable is like a zero; everything in the equation turns to "unknown": this is a simple fact of the matter, until we know precisely the odds of life (by what process biogenesis takes place) we can't calculate the probability of life on earth, let alone elsewhere. Could be everywhere, could be few and scattered, could be just here. Impossible to determine in any probability-based manner.

Also I don't accept the idea of "matter" in the concept of a form of reality that is independent of conscious construct. In other words, you may knock on a table and say "This is a construct not emergent from consciousness" and I would reply, "That may well be, but you have no proof, and there is no legitimate reason to accept the statement": as illustration, I pull you into a dream. I knock on a table in the dream and say, the table is here, but it is a construct of consciousness. Thus there is no need of this hypothetical "construct not emergent from consciousness": in other words, there is no need of a hypothetical structure which is independent of consciousness in order to explain the table, since we know a table can and does exist as a construct of consciousness.

Thus, I reject "matter" (not in the linguistic sense, but in the sense of a hypothetical 'non-consciousness based construct' which exists independently of consciousness) since it cannot be proven, and is not necessary to explain the table. Therefore there is nothing that is not a construct of consciousness, and there is no one running anything independent of anything else (such as beings running a machine in which we exist) and everything in existence is emergent from a single conscious whole; the "root" consciousness of all variable consciousness "sets" contained within the whole. In other words, the substantial experience of anyone "outside the box" is identical to the experience of anyone "inside the box" and so there is no meaningful difference between the two experiences.

BUT, it is interesting to think about.

 

[Archie the Preacher]

My point is, at least one of them [other races or civilization in the Universe] had to go beyond this realm, this dimension, into perhaps a matterless, timeless, and a place where space, time, and distance and matter and material as we know it does not matter, so to speak...

The odds are totally in favor of it, mathematically speaking...

Anyone disagree...?

Your statement assumes there is 'somewhere' beyond this realm, etc. that is connected in some manner to this realm that is not blocked by God (Heaven, for instance) to 'go'.

If there is no place to go, then all those other civilizations went 'no place'.

Maybe they gave rise to A.I., maybe they exist in another dimension or type of reality now, maybe they've existed before this entire universe was, and this universe is like a computer program, that uses biological machines, (bioelectrochemical) and this is all a simulation created by and managed by them...

Just as possible, perhaps 'we' are the oldest race and civilization in the Universe. Perhaps 'we' evolved first after enough stars went nova to produce enough heavy elements to allow us to exist. That is a possibility.

Perhaps "...they've existed before this entire universe was..." So they were created, evolved, hatched or bred in a different Universe? How do they relate to God; who must be active in all possible Universes or is not God.

Consider the possibilities...

One such possibility is I now go to bed. Good night.

 

[Neogaia777]

Your statement assumes there is 'somewhere' beyond this realm, etc. that is connected in some manner to this realm that is not blocked by God (Heaven, for instance) to 'go'.

If there is no place to go, then all those other civilizations went 'no place'.

Quantum theories are just beginning to touch on this, though nothing solid yet, but, in time, and not very much more time, I believe, they will...

Just as possible, perhaps 'we' are the oldest race and civilization in the Universe. Perhaps 'we' evolved first after enough stars went nova to produce enough heavy elements to allow us to exist. That is a possibility.

Possible yes, but not as likely as the alternative...

Perhaps "...they've existed before this entire universe was..." So they were created, evolved, hatched or bred in a different Universe? How do they relate to God; who must be active in all possible Universes or is not God.

Theories of multiverses are beginning to crop up as well, as theories right now, but, again, in time...?

I believe, as I was shown in a vision also, that this universe is just "one", of an almost endless perhaps, very, very "many"... That this universe is a simulation, like a computer program, that uses matter and material (and space and time) that we know as it's "building blocks"...

One such possibility is I now go to bed. Good night.

K, good night...

 

[now faith]

How can we limit a limitless God?

 

[Neogaia777]

Yeah but I would propose that math is a gigo system like logic; garbage in: garbage out. The Drake equation is an example of garbage out from garbage in. The problem is that the "probability of life" is a unknown variable, and an unknown variable is like a zero; everything in the equation turns to "unknown": this is a simple fact of the matter, until we know precisely the odds of life (by what process biogenesis takes place) we can't calculate the probability of life on earth, let alone elsewhere. Could be everywhere, could be few and scattered, could be just here. Impossible to determine in any probability-based manner.

Also I don't accept the idea of "matter" in the concept of a form of reality that is independent of conscious construct. In other words, you may knock on a table and say "This is a construct not emergent from consciousness" and I would reply, "That may well be, but you have no proof, and there is no legitimate reason to accept the statement": as illustration, I pull you into a dream. I knock on a table in the dream and say, the table is here, but it is a construct of consciousness. Thus there is no need of this hypothetical "construct not emergent from consciousness": in other words, there is no need of a hypothetical structure which is independent of consciousness in order to explain the table, since we know a table can and does exist as a construct of consciousness.

Thus, I reject "matter" (not in the linguistic sense, but in the sense of a hypothetical 'non-consciousness based construct' which exists independently of consciousness) since it cannot be proven, and is not necessary to explain the table. Therefore there is nothing that is not a construct of consciousness, and there is no one running anything independent of anything else (such as beings running a machine in which we exist) and everything in existence is emergent from a single conscious whole; the "root" consciousness of all variable consciousness "sets" contained within the whole. In other words, the substantial experience of anyone "outside the box" is identical to the experience of anyone "inside the box" and so there is no meaningful difference between the two experiences.

BUT, it is interesting to think about.

Almost nothing is absolute zero, absolute zero does not exist...

You don't think there is other life, or other intelligent life here...?

 

[Neogaia777]

How can we limit a limitless God?

Yes, we should not limit him, but lift him, even higher than the highest things we can imagine, think and conceive of....

God Bless!

 

[John Hyperspace]

Almost nothing is absolute zero, absolute zero does not exist...

I'm not sure what you mean by that; what you mean the relevance to be in relation to the post. Are you meaning the equation?

You don't think there is other life, or other intelligent life here...?

Personally, I don't know. Maybe. Maybe not. But saying "There's a huge universe with so many stars" doesn't allow for mathematical proof/probability of anything until we know the probability of biogenesis. It could be that the odds are high (in favor), and the universe is teeming with life. It could be they are unimaginably low and life shouldn't even exist at all, anywhere; but life on earth hit the jackpot, defying the odds and is a miracle of probability.

Of course, I believe that the odds of biogenesis are equal to divine will, and so the odds that life is on the earth are 1:1. As for the rest of the universe?

 

[Neogaia777]

I'm not sure what you mean by that; what you mean the relevance to be in relation to the post. Are you meaning the equation?

I'm just meaning that unless the odds are absolute zero, then the odds of the OP being correct are pretty likely, especially for those who adhere to evolutionary theory with no God involved perhaps, and no seeding of life here, that it just "came about" and is not that special, in that case, it actually makes the case of the OP and Title statement, much more not only much more more possible, or probable but highly likely...

Personally, I don't know. Maybe. Maybe not. But saying "There's a huge universe with so many stars" doesn't allow for mathematical proof/probability of anything until we know the probability of biogenesis. It could be that the odds are high (in favor), and the universe is teeming with life. It could be they are unimaginably low and life shouldn't even exist at all, anywhere; but life on earth hit the jackpot, defying the odds and is a miracle of probability.

Of course, I believe that the odds of biogenesis are equal to divine will, and so the odds that life is on the earth are 1:1. As for the rest of the universe?

Your right of course, we have to know more about biogenesis first, it could be that we're very common, on and in, the universal scale of things (and my appeal in this was to adherents to evolution having to admit that, according to their theory, we would be very common universally speaking and all at different levels and stages and types of "life"), or just as equally possible right now, extremely, EXTREMELY "rare"...

We just don't know yet, but, I think we'll know more relatively soon though...

God Bless!

 

[mcarmichael]

Say there are or were trillions, since there are trillions of galaxies, how far did they get... I'll get to my point... My point is, at least one of them had to go beyond this realm, this dimension, into perhaps a matterless, timeless, and a place where space, time, and distance and matter and material as we know it does not matter, so to speak...

The odds are totally in favor of it, mathematically speaking...

Anyone disagree...?

Comments...?

Maybe they gave rise to A.I., maybe they exist in another dimension or type of reality now, maybe they've existed before this entire universe was, and this universe is like a computer program, that uses biological machines, (bioelectrochemical) and this is all a simulation created by and managed by them...

Consider the possibilities...

God Bless!

Yeah but [....]

 

[Neogaia777]

Life from non-life...? Relatively Common or extremely rare...?

It hinges on that... Either way we were either created by a much, much higher lifeform or ("Q like" to put it in Star Trek terms) entity(s), and we are very, very rare... Or this world was seeded by more advanced life... Or, we and life like, us is pretty common, and you still then run into the very likely possibility, then, of a much, much higher lifeform or ("Q like" to put it in Star Trek terms) entity(s) what most would call "God" or "gods" or God and angels...

God Bless!

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

at least one of them had to go beyond this realm, this dimension, into perhaps a matterless, timeless, and a place where space, time, and distance and matter and material as we know it does not matter, so to speak...

Why?

And what does that even mean?

The odds are totally in favor of it, mathematically speaking...

How can you calculate odds about things that are unknown / incomprehensible?

Anyone disagree...?

Yes, heavily.

 

[Neogaia777]

Why?

Many reasons, the limitations of such for one... And the need of life to go beyond it...

How can you calculate odds about things that are unknown / incomprehensible?

It is not incomprehensible, or unfathomable, especially if life is pretty commonplace...

Yes, heavily.

Why?

God Bless!

 

[Aryeh]

How can we limit a limitless God?

Anthropomorphism.

Humans are very good marginalizing things of important "matter" (excuse the pun @John Hyperspace.)

 

[Neogaia777]

Anthropomorphism.

Humans are very good marginalizing things of important "matter" (excuse the pun @John Hyperspace.)

But all life, including "God" or "gods" does have a mind, heart, possibly will, and emotions, in that way we can relate to all lifeforms no matter how big or small, and they can relate to us, hence the connection...

God Bless!

 

[Armoured]

But all life, including "God" or "gods" does have a mind, heart, possibly will, and emotions,

Trees? bacteria?

 

[Aryeh]

But all life, including "God" or "gods" does have a mind, heart, possibly will, and emotions, in that way we can relate to all lifeforms no matter how big or small, and they can relate to us, hence the connection...

God Bless!

I am not so sure I would necessarily agree.

Even culturally, both the gods and angels are at best ambivalent to human emotion. Often times, they find them degenerate reasoning parameters. Sometimes, even, they are shown to be completely ignorant of certain fundamental human emotions - like compassion, humor, or heartbreak.

Even sensations are extremely dulled, or nonexistent for the gods and angels. Often, they are depicted as feeling no pain, or on the other side of the spectrum: extremely sensitive, SUPERHUMAN sensations.

Either way, a consensus would say that the mythos of angels and gods are emotionally divergent from humans.

 

[mcarmichael]

Life from non-life...? Relatively Common or extremely rare...?

wrong question, because it is speculation. the correct question is: plausible, or implausible?
the correct answer is implausible.

 

[Neogaia777]

Trees? bacteria?

It's possible with plant life, maybe, but most definitely with bacteria and cells, they feel...

I guess I should have said conscious, intelligent life, if not intelligent, at least life that has it own consciousness, like insects for example, they "feel", and we would have to define those terms, wouldn't we, but definitely all or any "higher" form of life than us does, of that, I'm certain...

God Bless!

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Many reasons, the limitations of such for one...

The limitations of what? Physics?

And the need of life to go beyond it...

Beyond physics? None of this is making any sense.

It is not incomprehensible, or unfathomable, especially if life is pretty commonplace...

You know what is commonplace about life? It's matter based and subject to physics.

I'ld say that "beyond this realm, this dimension, into perhaps a matterless, timeless, and a place where space, time, and distance and matter and material as we know it does not matter" is pretty incomprehensible.

And that also didn't answer my question. How can odds about any such unobserved, unknown thing be calculated? Especially considering that everything we know about biology and physics, makes this rather impossible?

Why?

Because it makes no sense at all.