The Double Message of Eternal Security.

[stuart lawrence]

Why don't you do this.

Make the point you are intending to make, and use scripture.

All you have done is state your opinion, and make insults.

Use scripture, or don't bother addressing me anymore.



JLB

I will stop addressing you, for you seem totally confused to me.
But if you want to prove to me you understand grace:

If while we seek to be justified in Christ it becomes evident that we ourselves are sinners, does this mean that Christ promotes sin? Absolutely not! If I rebuild what I destroyed I prove I am a lawbreaker
Gal2:16&17

What justification is Paul talking about in the above, for he is speaking of seeking justification over a a period of time? Justification of being saved is instantaneous, by faith in Christ when we repent..
Why would Paul ask the question? Does Christ promotes sin?
What has Paul sought to destroy?
And why would he prove he was a lawbreaker/ sinner if he rebuilt it?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I will stop addressing you, for you seem totally confused to me

There is nothing confusing in what he said. He is saying the 10 commandments are eternal moral laws and the 613 written commands of the Law of Moses (minus the 10) were temporary. Granted, I disagree with him on the Saturday Sabbath still being binding. I believe that to be a ceremonial law that has not been repeated in the New Testament. I also think there were other moral laws besdies the famous 9 out of the 10 commandments given to Moses on tablets of stone, too. Loving God and loving one's neighbor and helping a bird, etc. all fall under the eternal moral law, as well.


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[stuart lawrence]

There is nothing confusing in what he said. He is saying the 10 commandments are eternal moral laws and the 613 written commands of the Law of Moses (minus the 10) were temporary. Granted, I disagree with him on the Saturday Sabbath still being binding. I believe that to be a ceremonial law that has not been repeated in the New Testament. I also think there were other moral laws besdies the famous 9 out of the 10 commandments given to Moses on tablets of stone, too. Loving God and loving one's neighbor and helping a bird, etc. all fall under the moral law, as well.


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He said the law of Moses got abolished. And Within the law of Moses was the ten commandments. He did NOT state in his post they did not get abolished

 

[Bible Highlighter]

He said the law of Moses got abolished. And Within the law of Moses was the ten commandments. He did NOT state in his post they did not get abolished

He said the 10 commandments are eternal moral laws. He then essentially stated that the other laws within the Law of Moses was temporary. There is no contradiction in what he said.
I understood him just fine.

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[stuart lawrence]

There is nothing confusing in what he said. He is saying the 10 commandments are eternal moral laws and the 613 written commands of the Law of Moses (minus the 10) were temporary. Granted, I disagree with him on the Saturday Sabbath still being binding. I believe that to be a ceremonial law that has not been repeated in the New Testament. I also think there were other moral laws besdies the famous 9 out of the 10 commandments given to Moses on tablets of stone, too. Loving God and loving one's neighbor and helping a bird, etc. all fall under the eternal moral law, as well.


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Last time I will say it:

Galatians 5:18, specifically the word "law", is a reference to the law of Moses.

I said I'm not under the law of Moses, because I am in Christ, and the law of Moses was abolished in His flesh, having been nailed to the cross.

Within the law of Moses, were the 10 commandments, as well as the ceremonial law of sacrifices, special washing requirements, circumcision, feast days, Sabbath Laws, and so forth.


JLB

Just read it jason

 

[stuart lawrence]

He said the 10 commandments are eternal moral laws. He then essentially stated that the other laws within the Law of Moses was temporary. There is no contradiction in what he said.
I understood him just fine.

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Well if he said what you are now stating he said he was wrong wasn't he.

Love your neighbour was not temporary was it

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Just read it jason

I did. I understood him just fine. You did not understand him even after I explained it to you.


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[stuart lawrence]

I did. I understood him just fine. You did not understand him even after I explained it to you. You are being disruptive to the thread topic and are just looking to insult and see things that are not there.



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Lol

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Well if he said what you are now stating he said he was wrong wasn't he.

Love your neighbour was not temporary was it

Yes, as I said, I disgree with him on what are the eternal moral laws of God.
Loving God and loving one's neighbor are eternal moral laws.


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[stuart lawrence]

Were these temporary?
Do not deceive

Yes, as I said, I disgree with him on what are the eternal moral laws of God.
Loving God and loving one's neighbor are eternal moral laws.


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But you said yesterday the law in stone was what you referred to as old law, the ministration of death

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Lol

May God's love shine upon you.


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[stuart lawrence]

"But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away."(2 Corinthians 3:7).

Sounds like this is the Old Testament Law (the Law of Moses) and not New Covenant Law to me.


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The law you wrote about in the above are the TC

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Were these temporary?
Do not deceive

But you said yesterday the law in stone was what you referred to as old law, the ministration of death

You are looking to see problems and contradictions in what people say where none exist.

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[Bible Highlighter]

Again, no contradiction.
God has eternal moral laws.
The written law did include these moral laws because they were eternal laws.
Anything not an eternal moral law in the written law of Moses was temporary.
Do you get it?
Are you going to just see contradictions again where none exist?


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[ToBeLoved]

I see from this statement you don't understand the difference between the Torah [Law], the first 5 books of the bible, and the law of Moses.




The law of Moses was abolished in His flesh, being nailed to the cross, not the Torah, the first five books of the bible.

Genesis was before the law of Moses, and shows us the 10 commandments were the law of the Lord, before Moses was ever born, even though Moses wrote the account of Genesis.


Example:

4 And I will make your descendants multiply as the stars of heaven; I will give to your descendants all these lands; and in your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed; 5 because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.” Genesis 26:4-5

• Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.”

The 10 commandments are God's eternal Kingdom Law's.

The law of Moses was temporary, having been added to the Abrahamic Covenant because of transgression, until the Seed should come.


19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator.
Galatians 3:19

• It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come

By saying "until", the Spirit was indicating the law was temporary.


The law of Moses was in effect, until Messiah, the Seed should come, and abolish in His flesh the law of commandments contained in ordinances.

Not the Torah [law], but the law of Moses.

• The 10 commandments are God's eternal kingdom laws.

Satan was guilty of murder and lies, even before mankind.

You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. John 8:44


Again Jesus abolished the law of Moses, having nailed it to the cross, not the 10 Commandments.


having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. Colossians 2:14

• that was against us

This phrase "that was against us", is a quote from Deuteronomy, referring to the law of Moses.


“Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there as a witness against you; Deuteronomy 31:26


Understanding that the 10 commandments are eternal and did not begin with Moses is crucial.

Understanding that the law of Moses was abolished, and not the 10 commandments, is also crucial, otherwise we still need to sacrifice animals for our sins, and put to death those who violate the Sabbath, as well as those who commit adultery, and so on.



JLB

The Law of Moses did not exist for Abraham. Abraham had a diff covenant with God.

 

[stuart lawrence]

This is why it is impossible to talk with you.
You are looking to see problems and contradictions in what people say where none exist.
Have you ever had a hard time with communicating with people in the past before?
Or do you grille them falsely with them trying to fix what you falsey were thinking about what they said?


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You wrote concerning the law written on stone/TC, and I quote:

Sounds like this is the old testament law( the law of Moses) and not new covenant law to me
Unquote.

How can you then believe those laws are eternal?

I have every confidence you will come up with something

 

[stuart lawrence]

The Law of Moses did not exist for Abraham. Abraham had a diff covenant with God.

JLB said.
The TC existed in genesis. He then said: the law of Moses got abolished and within the law of Moses is the TC

The TC did not get abolished they got transferred into human hearts. The law of righteousness got abolished, and that includes concerning the TC. But God will not abolish the fact he wants you to love him with all your heart, not steal, covet, murder commit adultery etc

 

[ToBeLoved]

Again, no contradiction.
God has eternal moral laws.
The written law did include these moral laws because they were eternal laws.
Anything not an eternal moral law in the written law of Moses was temporary.
Do you get it?
Are you going to just see contradictions again where none exist?


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The Law given to Moses are not eternal
For the believer now. The Law was mankinds schoolmaster to Christ. Showing each persons guilt in not perfectly keeping it. That is. Where grace comes into play. After Christ's death. Grace is the free gift of spiritual life after the Law has shown us all guilty

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You wrote concerning the law written on stone/TC, and I quote:

Sounds like this is the old testament law( the law of Moses) and not new covenant law to me
Unquote.

How can you then believe those laws are eternal?

I have every confidence you will come up with something

Dear Stuart:

I am placing you on ignore for being disruptive and for seeing problems where none exist.



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[stuart lawrence]

I remember meeting someone like you before once in person. This person was never able to connect with me and a buddy of mine because he was falsley critical and he tried to change our normal every day conversations on various different occasions. It was like he was waaay off in left field somewhere.

Anyways, I am placing you on ignore for being disruptive and for seeing problems where none exist.


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Thank you for putting me on ignore, I appreciate it
I haven't been falsely critical of you BTW