The Double Message of Eternal Security.

[stuart lawrence]

Stuart, you do not scare me. I only fear God. So either bring forth the posts or move on.


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Glad you didn't accuse me of making a false statement, that would be lying wouldn't it.
So when I say you have on numerous occasions stated the Christian is under a righteousness of observing 1050 NT commands, you do not deny that is the truth.

How many of those 1050 commands do you yourself strive to obey?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Are you lying about believing the Scripture that says, every man is a liar...?

You are misunderstanding Romans 3:4. The NLT says,
"Of course not! Even if everyone else is a liar, God is true. As the Scriptures say about him, "You will be proved right in what you say, and you will win your case in court."

Or, God saying "Am I a man that I should lie, or the Son of Man, that...?"

God Bless!

Jesus was a man. That does not mean he lied just because he was a man.
Numbers 23:19 is dealing with mankind as a whole.
The 144,000 were found without fault before the throne of God.

God means Hypocrisy, which if we were all to be honest were all guilty of sometimes, even after were saved and on our way, we can still be or act hypocritically occasionally if were aware of it, and frequently when were not...

Verses please.


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[Bible Highlighter]

Glad you didn't accuse me of making a false statement, that would be lying wouldn't it.
So when I say you have on numerous occasions stated the Christian is under a righteousness of observing 1050 NT commands, you do not deny that is the truth.

Either bring forth what I said in a previous post in your false accusation against me or be silent already.

How many of those 1050 commands do you yourself strive to obey?

Well, God's Word is true, whether I strive to obey all of them or not.
But yes, I do strive to obey every command of the NT that I encounter.
But again, the keeping of all of the NT commands does not relate to salvation.
How many of the 1,050 do you strive to obey?
Do you ever intend to obey them?
Ever?

BTW ~ The list is only suggestive. It is not exactly 1,050. I found more commands on their list and they repeat certain commands, too. So 1,050 is not an exact number or anything.


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[Neogaia777]

You are misunderstanding Romans 3:4. The NLT says,
"Of course not! Even if everyone else is a liar, God is true. As the Scriptures say about him, "You will be proved right in what you say, and you will win your case in court."



Jesus was a man. That does not mean he lied just because he was a man.
Numbers 23:19 is dealing with mankind as a whole.
The 144,000 were found without fault before the throne of God.



Verses please.


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Jesus was also God, we are not... And the 144,000 are virgins, and celibate all their life, do you fit in that category?, I don't... and I believe the correct meaning of every man being a liar, is that we will all be proven out to be such, by the time of the end and Christ's return, by a broader and more accurate understanding of sin, a flame lit by Christ that will not be put out... Which is the Spirit of and behind the Law, and also Grace afterward, the Holy Spirit's revelation, that is also God....

Anyhow, love to argue, but gotta go to bed...

God Bless!

 

[stuart lawrence]

Either bring forth what I said in a previous post in your false accusation against me or be silent already.



Well, God's Word is true, whether I strive to obey all of them or not.
But yes, I do strive to obey every command of the NT that I encounter.
But again, the keeping of all of the NT commands does not relate to salvation.
How many of the 1,050 do you strive to obey?
Do you ever intend to obey them?
Ever?


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Your righteousness is your justification, same thing.
So according to your oft repeated statement. The Christians righteousness/ justification before God is observing 1050 NT commands.

I'm not scrolling through previous threads to bring forth your previous statements.
The fact you do not deny it is the truth, confirms it is the truth

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Jesus was also God, we are not... And the 144,000 are virgins, and celibate all their life, do you fit in that category?, I don't... and I believe the correct meaning of every man being a liar, is that we will all be proven out to be such, by the time of the end and Christ's return, by a broader and more accurate understanding of sin, a flame lit by Christ that will not be put out... Which is the Spirit of and behind the Law, and also Grace afterward, the Holy Spirit's revelation, that is also God....

Anyhow, love to argue, but gotta go to bed...

God Bless!

Hey look. If you want to believe that you can sin and still be saved, then go right ahead.
But know that I have already warned you that such a thing is not of God.


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[stuart lawrence]

Hey look. If you want to believe that you can sin and still be saved, then go right ahead.
But know that I have already warned you that such a thing is not of God.


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But you believe you yourself can sin and still be saved for you admit to: little sins as you put it

 

[Neogaia777]

Hey look. If you want to believe that you can sin and still be saved, then go right ahead.
But know that I have already warned you that such a thing is not of God.


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Oh, and you do not sin at all of course, right...?

Any other answer than yes, I do, and your a liar...

And there are many examples of imperfect sinful folks being used by and therefore having something from or of God, scripture is full of them...

They represent the truth and story of our lives here...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

Hey look. If you want to believe that you can sin and still be saved, then go right ahead.
But know that I have already warned you that such a thing is not of God.


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Again, it will all come down to the heart and hearts of individuals.... How's yours...?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Your righteousness is your justification, same thing.
So according to your oft repeated statement. The Christians righteousness/ justification before God is observing 1050 NT commands.

No. I believe a Christian is initially and ultimatley saved by Jesus Christ and that the good fruits or works of Christ are done through the believer's life. This is in the form of obeying the New Testament commands.

Also, again, the list of 1,050 NT commands is only one suggestive list. I have found more commands on their list and they had repeated certain commands. So it is by no means an authorative number or anything.

I'm not scrolling through previous threads to bring forth your previous statements.
The fact you do not deny it is the truth, confirms it is the truth

Then my answer is ... "no." I did not say that every single 1,050 command in the New Testament is a command that relates to our salvation. So you are in error, and you are wrong barking up the wrong tree.


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[stuart lawrence]

No. I believe a Christian is initially and ultimatley saved by Jesus Christ and that the good fruits or works of Christ are done through the believer's life. This is in the form of obeying the New Testament commands.

Also, again, the list of 1,050 NT commands is only one suggestive list. I have found more commands on their list and they had repeated certain commands. So it is by no means an authorative number or anything.



Then my answer is ... "no." I did not say that every single 1,050 command in the New Testament is a command that relates to our salvation. So no. You are wrong barking up the wrong tree.


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I didn't say you used the words: relate to our salvation
You used the words:
The Christians righteousness/ justification before God is obeying 1050 NT commands.
At least it is good you have not denied that is the truth. Even if you don't have the courage to confirm it

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Again, it will all come down to the heart and hearts of individuals.... How's yours...?

Again, continue down your own path. I am not interested in debating with a person in who I believe is blatantly condoning an extreme doctrine of immorality.


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[stuart lawrence]

Again, it will all come down to the heart and hearts of individuals.... How's yours...?

Trust me. The people who most condone their own sin, are those who most earnestly preach the Christian is under a law of righteousness

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I didn't say you used the words: relate to our salvation
You used the words:
The Christians righteousness/ justification before God is obeying 1050 NT commands.
At least it is good you have not denied that is the truth. Even if you don't have the courage to confirm it

Again, please bring forth the post # and we can talk about it.
I never believed that the keeping of all 1,050 + commands of the NT relates to our salvation. Some do and some don't. A person's words can easily be misunderstood or taken out of context. Also, it is possible I did not double check the grammar in what I said. In either case, you are trying to make a case out of smoke and mirrors. I have made mistakes before on forums before and I am not afraid to admit them.


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[stuart lawrence]

Again, please bring forth the post # and we can talk about it.
I never believed that the keeping of all 1,050 + commands of the NT relate to our salvation. Some do and some don't. A person's words can easily be misunderstood or taken out of context. Also, it is possible I did not double check the grammar in what I said. In either case, you are trying to make a case out of smoke and mirrors.


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I don't have to scroll through previous debates to find what you know you stated.
For you are well aware that in numerous occasions you have written the Christian is under a righteousness of observing 1050 NT commands.
An honest, humble and sincere believer would not seek to deny or evade what they know to be true. They would admit it

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Trust me. The people who most condone their own sin, are those who most earnestly preach the Christian is under a law of righteousness

This is simply not true. If I believe I have committed something even minor, I confess such a sin to the Lord and I forsake it with His help.


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[stuart lawrence]

This is simply not true. If I believe I have committed something even minor, I confess such a sin to the Lord and I forsake it with His help.


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Oh it is very true Jason. I have seen the truth if this with so many years experience

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I don't have to scroll through previous debates to find what you know you stated.
For you are well aware that in numerous occasions you have written the Christian is under a righteousness of observing 1050 NT commands.
An honest, humble and sincere believer would not seek to deny or evade what they know to be true. They would admit it

You are trying to suggest something I said a long time ago (that I do not remember). You are trying to catch me up with words. But the fact that you are unwilling to bring up the post # shows that you really do not have any real case to make against me. I explained my position and you are now making up stuff that is imaginary.


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[Bible Highlighter]

Oh it is very true Jason. I have seen the truth if this with so many years experience

Sorry, my experience is not in any way related to your experience.
So I do not know what you are talking about.


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[stuart lawrence]

You are trying to suggest something I said a long time ago (that I do not remember). You are trying to catch me up with words. But the fact that you are unwilling to bring up the post # shows that you really do not have any real case to make against me. I explained my position and you are now making up stuff that is imaginary.


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Oh Jason, I'm afraid you show your true heart in the above.
It is always the same sadly. A law of righteousness leads to hypocrisy, demanding of others what you do not demand of yourself, untruthful statements and so much more.

Answer this then. You say the Christian is under a law of righteousness. How many laws does this involve?