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The Brian Williams Debacle

iluvatar5150

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Please...

Please what? Are you incapable of answering the question?


Pitiable attempt at deflection.

It's not deflection; it's pointing out your obvious hypocrisy and selective interpretation of events. Dan Rather's actions are apparently enough for you to paint all liberals as dishonest and willing to lie in order to attack conservatives, but you conveniently ignore (or worse, believe) all of the inane nonsense that conservatives have thrown at Obama.

I'm not defending Rather, but I am objecting to your broad mischaracterizations.
 
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USincognito

a post by Alan Smithee
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Spare us...

It's like a conservative can never make a criticism anymore without someone piping up to say that "fox news lies" or "Bush did it too", etc...

How about actually debating the topic at hand?


Sorry, not trying to lash out at you personally, it's just that this is the 4th post like this I've read in 24 hours where someone has chimed in and offered nothing more than a comment about Fox news.


It's almost digressed to the point where a conservative could start a thread about a car dealership ripping people off, and a handful of people would reply with "Oh, well you think Fox news has never done anything dishonest?!?!"

The OP:
Brian Williams admits that his story of coming under fire while in Iraq was false - The Washington Post

Yes, you've all likely heard of the story by now. It's totally despicable and clearly transparent what his motives were. There was no "misremembering". It's obvious he has no credibility at this point since he's willing to lie about something like this.

Should he be fired? How would this same story be viewed if the person involved was say, Sean Hannity of Fox News?

bold mine
 
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USincognito

a post by Alan Smithee
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Media Matters posting a list of comments they wish to categorize as lies hardly constitutes evidence Hannity lies.

I didn't post the Media Matters list and my own comments have nothing to do with them. If you want to reply to me, reply to what I post, not what someone else has posted.

The myth is when the AGW doom crowd attempts to deny the Global Cooling scare promoted in the 1970's.

Awesome! Yet another examples of Sistrin providing me a basket of links about a subject with which I am intimately familiar. :doh:

Sorry Sarge, but the myth is that Global Cooling or an impending Ice Age were the scientific consensus of the time. No one denies that the media made a glacier out of an ice cube. It's ironic that you're posting these links to "educate" me and the first one you chose is the infamous Time Ice Age story and the infamous Newsweek Cooling World cover.

Another Ice Age?

The Cooling World

Of course those are news magazines, not scientific journals. Time also suggested that Interferon could be a cure for cancer in 1980. Yet that is where Hannity gets everything he needs to know about climate science apparently.

From Scientific American and a story concerning the writer of the Newsweek piece, quote:

"Some climatologists predicted the trend would continue, inching the earth toward the colder averages of the "Little Ice Age" from the 16th to 19th centuries."

That's nice.
The Myth of the Global Cooling Consensus | RealClearScience
Aerosols only remain in the atmosphere for a short period of time compared to other greenhouse gases, so the aerosol cooling effect faded away as atmospheric carbon dioxide concentrations rose. Knowing this, the majority of climate scientists at the time still anticipated warming. A review of climate change literature between 1965 and 1979, undertaken in 2008, found that 44 papers "predicted, implied, or provided supporting evidence" for global warming, while only seven did so for global cooling.

"Global cooling was never more than a minor aspect of the scientific climate change literature of the era, let alone the scientific consensus..." the reviewers remarked.​

The majority of papers published in that time frame > Some climatologists. It's also quite funny that you would quote an article that agrees with the fact that ignorant, demagogic denialists like Hannity are getting everything they know about climate science from an article published when he was a teenager.
Nine paragraphs written for Newsweek in 1975 continue to trump 40 years of climate science. It is a record that has its author amazed​

From an article dated January 26th, 1970, quote:

"In fact, should a new Ice Age descend upon the earth in the centuries immediately ahead man,

Centuries ahead? An editorial by a small town newspaper? Now that's some weapons grade fear mongering and a complete red herring since the 1970s Global Cooling Myth suggest that science was predicting an immanent Ice Ace.

The claim was promoted on television as well:

In Search Of. :doh: Yeah, they "scientifically" promoted Yeti, Ancient Astronauts and Killer Bees.

If you're reduced to citing In Search Of, I think I can truncate my response at this point.

But hey it is an inconvenient truth for anyone to remember how science promoted global cooling back in the day...interferes with advancing the current agenda.

:doh: If Time, Newsweek, In Search Of and the editorial page of the Oswego Argus Press constitute science in your mind, I can see why you take some of the positions that you do. :doh:


Johnathan Gruber exposed the lies of Obamacare.

Cool (see what I did there) non sequitur. Any chance you can actually address the content of the linked thread or did you spend all your energy finding non-scientific news articles from the 70s?
 
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ThatRobGuy

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The OP:


bold mine

Did you see my response to that though when another poster mentioned what you're mentioning?

The person I was replying to wasn't addressing the question of the OP...they simply stopped by for a quick FOX-bashing and offered no content.

Stating "Oh please, like Fox never lies???" isn't addressing the topic, nor the question that was being asked.
 
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EdwinWillers

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I've never been a fan of his. I really don't care whether this millionaire is fired or not.
What does his being a millionaire have to do with anything? :doh:

...oh wait. He's "rich" and "rich = bad." I get it now. :o

Out of curiosity, what are your thoughts about whether this "news" reporter is fired or not?

Personally, I think he should be fired; not because he's "rich" but because he lied - he lied about the incident and then he even had the temerity to lie in his "apology" for lying.
 
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MachZer0

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Did you see my response to that though when another poster mentioned what you're mentioning?

The person I was replying to wasn't addressing the question of the OP...they simply stopped by for a quick FOX-bashing and offered no content.

Stating "Oh please, like Fox never lies???" isn't addressing the topic, nor the question that was being asked.

Notably nobody has answered the question about what the reaction would be if Sean Hannity had told a phony story about being shot down
 
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EdwinWillers

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Notably nobody has answered the question about what the reaction would be if Sean Hannity had told a phony story about being shot down
All one needs to do is look at the two asinine tags someone posted about the thread to get the answer to that - "conservative whining" and "Fox lies" :doh:

The left wing media can do whatever it wants, say whatever it wants, lie however it wants, distort however it wants, deflect, misrepresent, lie, slander, impugn - and they can do it openly, obviously, and blatantly and its defenders will never find, let alone admit any fault or wrong-doing.

Instead, they'll do precisely what whoever posted those tags did - ignore the blatant lies their media told and try to deflect by impugning someone else.
 
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iluvatar5150

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Notably nobody has answered the question about what the reaction would be if Sean Hannity had told a phony story about being shot down

I'll answer the question:

He'd be mocked by the left, defended by the right, and then business would go on as usual.
 
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DaisyDay

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What does his being a millionaire have to do with anything? :doh:
It has to do with the harm that befalls him for losing his job. He'll be ok.

...oh wait. He's "rich" and "rich = bad." I get it now. :o
That is your prejudice against me. Your interpretation is wrong but I did word it badly.

Out of curiosity, what are your thoughts about whether this "news" reporter is fired or not?
I don't particularly care about him as a person, but the news industry would be better off were he fired as this goes to credibility and accountability.

Personally, I think he should be fired; not because he's "rich" but because he lied - he lied about the incident and then he even had the temerity to lie in his "apology" for lying.
Ok.
 
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Avid

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... This one got caught.
Yes, he was getting worse by embellishing the lie with more falsehood, and now, more examples are coming to light. He said things, while covering the natural disaster of Hurricane Katrina (made worse by the local governments not using money correctly that they got to sure-up the levies,) that are as bad. There is no evidence of anything like what he said he saw or what he said happened to him being the case for ANYONE there, much less a protected Media Narrative Reader parked in a 5-Star Hotel.
 
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Sistrin

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Please what? Are you incapable of answering the question?

Are you incapable of looking it up for yourself?

It's not deflection; it's pointing out your obvious hypocrisy and selective interpretation of events.

What is selective about stating fact? Rather promoted a false story and to this day continues to defend what has been proven to be nothing but a pack of lies. You want to make a valid point, provide some other valid interpretation of the events in question.

Dan Rather's actions are apparently enough for you to paint all liberals as dishonest and willing to lie in order to attack conservatives...

That isn't what I said. Here is what I said:

"I expect much the same here, because as the liberal/progressive crowd has proven over and over and over again, lies told, no matter how gross or pathetic or obvious, only matter when they can be used in an attempt to destroy a conservative Republican."

Bill Clinton lied under oath and the response from the left was to attack Ken Star. Hillary Clinton lied about being under sniper fire and the response from the left was to claim she misremembered followed by attacking her critics. John Kerry lied about his service in Vietnam and the response from the left was to make him Secretary of State. Obama lied repeatedly concerning his health care plan and the response from the left was to call conservatives racist. Al Sharpton has built his career on promoting lies, and the response from the left was to give him a show on MSNBC. But at least he didn't change his name to Carlos Danger.

Williams is just another in a long line of prominent liberals caught with his pants on fire yet is being defended because the agenda must be protected.

However when it comes to lies and how the left reacts to lies on the part of their politicians, candidates, and/or icons, the standard was set with Bill Clinton. You can't run from it, you can't hide from it, the face of liberalism in general was forever established when Clinton shook his finger at the American people and blatantly lied, and the response of the left was to guffaw and snicker and point fingers at everyone else.

...but you conveniently ignore (or worse, believe) all of the inane nonsense that conservatives have thrown at Obama.

Another strawman. Obama has much to be legitimately criticized for, he has done more harm to this country than any foreign nation could short of nuclear Armageddon.

You have no evidence to support your claim I ignore anything.

I'm not defending Rather, but I am objecting to your broad mischaracterizations.

Object all you want, doesn't change a thing.

I didn't post the Media Matters list...

So? You made the same claim concerning Hannity.

If you want to reply to me, reply to what I post, not what someone else has posted.

Hubris.

Yet another examples of Sistrin providing me a basket of links about a subject with which I am intimately familiar.

Really? Couldn't tell that from your comments. Here is what you said:

Hannity is more credible when he's known to lie and distort constantly? Recently he's been spreading the old myth about Global Cooling in the 70s...

The promotion of Global Cooling in the 70's is a matter of fact, not myth. That is what I illustrated by posting the examples I did. I found over 200 articles and papers promoting the doom of the impending Ice Age published during the 1970's, yet employing retconning certain people want to use one photo-shopped cover from Time magazine in an attempt to prove no one ever said anything about it and anyone who brings it up is either an idiot or a liar. But you were wrong with your comment cited above, the issue was widely promoted and discussed by scientist, science writers, and news periodicals of the day.

Then you move the goalpost:

Sorry Sarge, but the myth is that Global Cooling or an impending Ice Age were the scientific consensus of the time.

Yet that is what was promoted.

Geologist Say Winters Getting Colder

"It doesn't look good, not in our lifetime, and its going to be even worse for future generations," said Madeleine Briskin of the University of Cincinnati, who specializes in researching long range whether cycles."

"We're entering a Little Ice Age..."

Source: Middlesboro Daily News - Google News Archive Search

Is Earth Headed For Another Ice Age?

"A group of prominent scientist last month finished a two year study which concludes changes in the earth's climate are inevitable and that mankind must learn to predict these variations."

"The most drastic potential change considered in the report is an abrupt end to the present interglacial period of relative warmth that has governed the planet's climate for 10,000 years."

"The panel reported that without doubt, colder climate will come..."


Source: Reading Eagle - Google News Archive Search

You can blather all you want concerning the sources, it won't change the fact the issue was widely promoted and the stories written were written by science writers based on the data being promoted.

From the Science News Article:

If global temperatures should fall even further, the effects could be considerably more drastic. According to the academy report on climate, we may be approaching the end of a major interglacial cycle, with the approach of a fulll-blown 10,000-year ice age, a real possibility. Again, this transition would involve only a small change of global temperature-2 or 3 degrees but the impact on civilization would be catastrophic.

Source: https://www.sciencenews.org/sites/default/files/8983

I understand why the issue of the promotion of Global Cooling during the 1970's is so heatedly denied by the AGW doom crowd. However the myth is still the claim that promotion was a myth, or there was no consensus on the matter.

No one denies that the media made a glacier out of an ice cube.

Did the media just make it all up? That your claim? Oh, wait...

A review of climate change literature between 1965 and 1979, undertaken in 2008, found that 44 papers "predicted, implied, or provided supporting evidence" for global warming, while only seven did so for global cooling.

Thanks for supporting my point.

Nine paragraphs written for Newsweek in 1975 continue to trump 40 years of climate science. It is a record that has its author amazed.

Yet within the same article is the admission global cooling and another ice age were being predicted.

The majority of your remaining comments are irrelevant as puerile attempts to demean. You should be able to understand that including a segment of a television show was only done to illustrate the notion was promoted on television, not to prove the climate scientist featured were either right or wrong.

Notably nobody has answered the question about what the reaction would be if Sean Hannity had told a phony story about being shot down.

That isn't true. I have discussed that. Additionally we all know how the left in general would react if Hannity told such a bold faced lie. They would demand he be removed from the airways, his sponsors would be targeted, and the story would be front and center for weeks.
 
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SummerMadness

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Science is not determined by consensus, in science something either exists or it doesn't exist. Nobody is arguing that climate doesn't change, what is being argued over is how much of an effect does man have on the climate.

Those "scientists" acting as though this is settled are not behaving as scientists, and as scientists know very well correlation does not equal causation.
You obviously don't work in any field of science. That's not how it works, I know, I'm a scientist.
 
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EdwinWillers

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It has to do with the harm that befalls him for losing his job. He'll be ok.

That is your prejudice against me. Your interpretation is wrong but I did word it badly.

I don't particularly care about him as a person, but the news industry would be better off were he fired as this goes to credibility and accountability.

Ok.
I'm not prejudiced against you Daisy. You are in fact one of the better posters here - more rational than most, less emotional than most. We just disagree on most things - me being right ;) (/joke). And when I read something that was written like that, I comment. I understand now what you meant to say. Fair enough. :thumbsup:
 
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Boondock_Saint

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I can still remember the look on his face when Bush defeated Gore. It's no surprise to me that he would report in such a way that was politically advantagous for his party. People like their ears tickled, and he was the political platform to do it.
 
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