The book that the "Passion" was based on

[ShirChadash]

What would God say about us cutting down the efforts of our brothers and sisters??

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"Father, forgive them... they know not what they do..."​

I think you have answered your question yourself, with your sig line below ​

Forgiveness Is The Final Act Of Love!

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I will say this though... it is important that we believers, who are supposed to be reaching the world with the gospel, address and deal with the issues that cause us/others concern over even "just" a movie, like this one... even the most well-intentioned or seemingly innocuous happenings/actions in the world can have far-reaching effects beyond what many (most) people consider.​

 

[Higher Truth]

Pray 4:

Care to comment on this?

HT:

Already did:

"Parts of the movie may glorify God, but it teaches another Gospel because of its error. God is not in the fruit mixing business. If they had not said that it was scripturally accurate, it probably wouldn't matter so much."

Even a stopped clock is correct twice a day, and every once in a while a blind squirrel finds a nut. The Catholic faith is a mixture of Truth and tradition like many other faiths these days, and it is this that the movie is based on, coupled with the visions of a catholic mystic named Catherine Ann Emmerich, and the prayers of a Catholic saint who is also veiwed as a mystic by their own church. If you want to review parts of the script for the movie, just read her book. What is so hard to comprehend when I have given you the resources to prove this for yourself?


http://www.emmerich1.com/THE_PASSION2.htm#CHAPTER XXII


Read all of the chapters and see if you notice anything familiar

 

[blessed2]

I don't mean to be difficult. I want to understand what exactly you find opposable about this movie and the scriptures or incorrect scriptures. You said that it would take a long time but in parts...addressing one issue at a time would be helpful and informative.
1st I think it would be helpful to know which version of the bible you personally use. Clearly each version is different, add too that the catholic church cannonized the bible following in part the Jewish but choosing which books to admit and omit from the cannonized version. Note: the book of Enoch not to be found as well as others I sure but having more books in all than the KJV....you follow my thoughts I hope.

 

[Higher Truth]

I use many translations, including Hebrew, Greek, and sometimes reference Aramaic and Latin.

1) Did Messiah Scripturally confront satan and have dialog with "her" in the garden.

2) Did Messiah Scripturally say " Hear me Father...rise up and defend me...save me from the traps they have set" in the garden.

3) Did "she" ask Him "who is your father, and who are you?"

4) Did Messiah Scripturally fall over the side of a bridge and face Judas?

5) Scripturally did they beat Messiah from the garden to the cross?

Let's just start with a few and work our way up to speed.

 

[simchat_torah]

xxx

 

[simchat_torah]

In my opinion, none of this is changing the truth of Y'shua's salvific work and the redemption of the christian message.

You are only hung up on a Catholic expression HT, nothing more, nothing less.

shalom,
yafet

 

[Higher Truth]

Pray4:

There's my few answers, keep 'em coming.

HT:

Answers based on feelings mean nothing. Please quote some scripture to prove this. [Ann Emmerich's writings , although almost considered scripture by the Catholic church, do not qualify]

Simchat:

You are only hung up on a Catholic expression HT, nothing more, nothing less.



HT:

I am hung up on the truth...Scriptural Truth...nothing more, nothing less.


Accept no substitute....

 

[ShirChadash]

Ann Emmerich's writings , although almost considered scripture by the Catholic church

HT, that is blatantly false, my brother. I care very much that Gibson's use of a "mystic's" writings *might* give people (to any degree) misleading impressions or false "facts" and ideas about how the Passion went... however, as a former Catholic I just have to speak up and state that your comment, "almost considered scripture", is just plain incorrect. Not even near true; it just isn't, I'm sorry.

 

[Higher Truth]

Zemirah:

HT, that is blatantly false, my brother.

as a former Catholic I just have to speak up and state that your comment, "almost considered scripture", is just plain incorrect. Not even near true; it just isn't, I'm sorry.


HT:

You argument is not with me Zemmy, it is with the Catholic brethren. It is their statements that I draw my information from. If you like, I will give you a list of other sites that state this as well.




But as the canon of the Cathedral of Loybach put it: "At first I did not believe Catherine Emmerich's statements. I went to work to find out all the falsehood she was telling, and to my surprise, I found that in the light of tradition, geography, topography, and history, Anne Catherine Emmerich knew more than all our so-called savants.
*** After Holy Scripture, there is no book that contains so many words of eternal truth and life than the revelations of A. C. Emmerich." ****


Such is crucial as a movie based at least partly on her visions is ready to make an international splash and as the Vatican prepares to consider her beatification.

http://www.spiritdaily.com/emmerichlife.htm

 

[Higher Truth]

Of interest:

http://cacsi.com/ThePassionOfChrist5.htm#_ftn13

 

[blessed2]

1) Did Messiah Scripturally confront satan and have dialog with "her" in the garden.

Hm.....I did miss the first 5 min of the movie. However satan did not appear as female to me. I thouht throughout that it was male. I do not recall Y answering or coversing with satan at all during that time only that satan continued to tempt. The only interaction I recall was Him crushing the head of the serpent with His heal.
I intend to see it again Monday and will pay closer attention.
However, The question of scripture still remains.........
What has been left out of (not cannonized) what has been altered (JKV) what has been lost in translation.
Too, the bible is full of feelings.....Y wept, love, joy, compassion, mercy.

 

[blessed2]

P.S. To your credit though...
I'd have to say that if I did not know and have read the scriptures myself,
I may have been lead to believe things that were not absolutely correct.

 

[Mordechai18]

When my wife asked me what I thought of The Passion, I told her that it was a very human portrayal of Yeshua. I didn't really see much of G-d at all, except maybe in his amazing ability to take punishment. In fact, I thought the depictions of suffering were so extreme, so extensive, that they bordered on parody after a while. It came dangerously close to slapstick, in my likely unpopular opinion.
I told her that I can't imagine coming to believe in Yeshua as Moschiach after this film. On the other hand, the Jesus movie did move me, and put his suffering into context by showing his ministry.

 

[Higher Truth]

Blessed 2

Hm.....I did miss the first 5 min of the movie. However satan did not appear as female to me.

I do not recall Y answering or coversing with satan at all during that time only that satan continued to tempt.

HT:

He did not answer back, but He allowed "her" to speak to Him. Scripturally He was ministered to by an angel and strengthened. Why was that not shown? That errant teaching is another one of the visions from Emmerich's book. Did you not see the posed satanic mother and child scene while they were in the crowd in the movie? Look at how the women were dressed in the movie and compare. Eveyone has their own interpretation. Mine was feminine.

 

[simchat_torah]

I too didn't think HaSatan was a female. I thought it was a man. Some people may have been confused because of the robe, but it was a man playing the role.

Also, I felt it was a real powerful moment when Y'shua crushed the head of the snake with his heel. I saw it coming, and even though I knew it was going to happen it still took my breath away.


very cool indeed.

He was ministered to by an angel and strengthened. Why was that not shown?

Film is often symbollic. There's no possible way to show every detail of a historic story. Often what is shown on film is expressive of something deeper. In this case, I quite enjoyed the opening scene. It was a powerful moment that spoke volumes of scriptural prophecy.

 

[simchat_torah]

I can imagine that it would take many many many more movies to put onto film the entire Ministry of Yeshua. How awesome would it be if Mel were able to go back and create movies on Yeshua's miracles, works and ministry as recorded in the B'rit Hadasha!

I think he was questioned on it once, and he said this movie was more than enough... he didn't want to endure any more than he did in just doing this film.

Don't quote me on that though... I only vaguely remember that interview.

shalom,
yafet

 

[Higher Truth]

Simchat:

I too didn't think HaSatan was a female. I thought it was a man. Some people may have been confused because of the robe, but it was a man playing the role.

Pray4:

I agree with all of the above.



HT:

satan was played by an Italian woman actress with shaved eyebrows named Rosalinda Celentano

 

[Hix]

Is it a tradition for Italian ladies to shave their eyebrows? scary...

Regardless, since Satan is neither male nor female, just as HaShem is neither male nor female then a female actor for Satan wouldnt be any more unusual than a male actor.

Shalom and G-d bless
~Hix~

 

[Higher Truth]

Pray 4:

Does G-d need to be confined to a box where He is not allowed to work outside of it?

HT:

We wouldn't want to box God into His written word, would we? I am glad that Mel could help Him "break out".

Pray 4:
And I believe Mel to have been inspired in many of the things he portrayed in the movie, such as the serpent, the torment of Judas, the teardrop at the end, etc etc etc

HT:

"Inspired" directly from the pages of the Catholic mystic Cathering Emmerich's book. Have you read it yet Pray 4? If Mel wins any awards for this movie, she should get best screen writer posthumously.

 

[simchat_torah]

satan was played by an Italian woman actress with shaved eyebrows named Rosalinda Celentano

I think you missed my point HT. I wasn't referring to the actor/actress... but rather the portrayal of HaSatan. She was obviously in costume and makeup to play the role of a male figure. You only knew it was a female b/c of the credits and/or a feature on the film. IN THE FILM HaSatan was obviously portrayed as a male. Thus the shaved eyebrows, fake teeth, etc. You see, through history, angelic hosts, while male... have had feminine qualities. Thus a female actress donned as a male fits historical interpretations of Angelic beings perfectly well.

That was all I inteded to say.

shalom!
yafet

p.s. I personally disagree with feminine representations of angels.