The Book of Enoch?

[DeaconDean]

"And again the Lord said to Raphael: 'Bind Azazel hand and foot, and cast him into the darkness…the whole earth has been corrupted through the works that were taught by Azazel: to him ascribe all sin.'" [10:4&8] Seemingly all sin is ascribed to the leader of the band of fallen angels known as the Watchers – to just one entity. Not to the fallen angels or to any member of the human race. The Bible says, "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God (Romans 3:23) – but not according to 'Enoch'."

Source

And just in case you say I'm making this up:

"Again the Lord said to Raphael, Bind Azazyel hand and foot; cast him into darkness; and opening the desert which is in Dudael, cast him in there. Throw upon him hurled and pointed stones, covering him with darkness; There shall he remain for ever; cover his face, that he may not see the light. And in the great day of judgment let him be cast into the fire. Restore the earth, which the angels have corrupted; and announce life to it, that I may revive it. All the sons of men shall not perish in consequence of every secret, by which the Watchers have destroyed, and which they have taught, their offspring. All the earth has been corrupted by the effects of the teaching of Azazyel. To him therefore ascribe the whole crime." -Enoch 10:6-12

The whole world was corrupted by the act of one "fallen angel".

And that contradicts Romans 5:14:

"Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression,"

Continued...

 

[DeaconDean]

Lets backtrack for a second.

Earlier you posted:

The fallen angels are the serpent.

In a way, you are correct. But in another, you are dead wrong.

Here is one time I really have to hand it to Catholicism. They wrote the definitive articles on "Angelology".

Satan/Lucifer in a very real sense was an "angel" but he was of a totally different order.

Lucifer was a cherubim. The "anointed cherub" (Eze. 28:14)

Lets make this short, angels come in basically ten classes, seriphims, cherubs, thrones, dominions, virtues, powers, arch-angels, principalities, and plain old angels. Lucifer was the only cherub in heaven that held two offices, he covered the throne of God, and was heavens "music director".

He was cast down when he and an unknown number rebelled against God.

As shown, you said: The fallen angels are the serpent."

I suggest you need to read more scripture.

The Book of the Revelation of Jesus Christ, written by "John", "John The Revelator", John of Patmos" tells us specifically who "that old serpent" was:

"And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him." -Rev. 12:9 (KJV)

"And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years," -Rev. 20:2 (KJV)

So not only are you wrong, but Enoch as well.

Enoch said:

"All the earth has been corrupted by the effects of the teaching of Azazyel." -Enoch 10:12

Continued...

 

[DeaconDean]

Now, after this, you still insist that Enoch should be held as truth, should be in the canon?

Sorry, not gonna happen.

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[DeaconDean]

One last note.

The Book of Enoch proves the New Testament writers were/are lying to us.

Shocked?

Let me prove it.

In John 3:13, we read:

"And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven."

John Gill comments:

"John 3:13

And no man hath ascended into heaven
Though Enoch and Elias had, yet not by their own power, nor in the sense our Lord designs; whose meaning is, that no man had, or could go up to heaven, to bring from thence the knowledge of divine and heavenly things; in which sense the phrase is used in ( Deuteronomy 30:12 ) ( Romans 10:6 ) , and which may be illustrated by ( John 1:18 ) ; wherefore inasmuch as Nicodemus had acknowledged Christ to he a teacher come from God, our Lord, would have him know, that he was the only teacher of heavenly things, as being the only person that had been in heaven, and in the bosom of the Father; and therefore, if he, and the rest of the Jews, did not receive instructions from him, they must for ever remain ignorant; for there never had been, nor was, nor could be, any mere man that could go up to heaven, and learn the mysteries of God, and of the kingdom of heaven, and return and instruct men in them:"

Source

Yet Enoch teaches contrary to the New Testament saying:

"And he said to me: “Oh Enoch, look at the book of the Tablets of Heaven and read what is written upon them, and note every individual fact. And I looked at everything that was written and I noted everything. And I read the book and everything that was written in it, all the deeds of men, and all the children of flesh who will be upon the Earth, for all the generations of eternity. And then I immediately blessed the Lord, the Eternal King of Glory, in that he has made all the works of the world, and I praised the Lord because of his patience, and I blessed him on account of the sons of Adam. And at that time I said: “Blessed is the man who dies righteous and good, concerning whom no book of iniquity has been written, and against whom no guilt has been found. And these three Holy ones brought me and set me on the earth in front of the door of my house, and said to me: “Tell everything to your son Methuselah, and show all your children that no flesh is righteous, before the Lord, for He created them. For one year we will leave you with your children, until you have regained your strength, so that you may teach your children and write these things down for them, and testify to all your children. And in the second year we will take you from amongst them." -Enoch 80:1-7

And not only that, but taken "as is", Enoch was taken up twice!

Again, I ask anybody to show scripture to support this.

Enoch directly contradicts what John wrote.

You still want to argue that Enoch should be included in the canon and that it is correct?

Sorry!

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[Devin P]

Lets backtrack for a second.

Earlier you posted:



In a way, you are correct. But in another, you are dead wrong.

Here is one time I really have to hand it to Catholicism. They wrote the definitive articles on "Angelology".

Satan/Lucifer in a very real sense was an "angel" but he was of a totally different order.

Lucifer was a cherubim. The "anointed cherub" (Eze. 28:14)

Lets make this short, angels come in basically ten classes, seriphims, cherubs, thrones, dominions, virtues, powers, arch-angels, principalities, and plain old angels. Lucifer was the only cherub in heaven that held two offices, he covered the throne of God, and was heavens "music director".

He was cast down when he and an unknown number rebelled against God.

As shown, you said: The fallen angels are the serpent."

I suggest you need to read more scripture.

The Book of the Revelation of Jesus Christ, written by "John", "John The Revelator", John of Patmos" tells us specifically who "that old serpent" was:

"And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him." -Rev. 12:9 (KJV)

"And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years," -Rev. 20:2 (KJV)

So not only are you wrong, but Enoch as well.

Enoch said:

"All the earth has been corrupted by the effects of the teaching of Azazyel." -Enoch 10:12

Continued...

I don't really get how you're saying that I and Enoch are wrong. I said that satan is the serpent. Satan is a fallen angel no? That's literally calling a fallen angel the serpent. So I mean.. In Enoch it matches up with that chaining them up for 1000 years, at the very earliest, 300 years prior to that scripture being written, so I don't really get your point.

 

[Devin P]

One last note.

The Book of Enoch proves the New Testament writers were/are lying to us.

Shocked?

Let me prove it.

In John 3:13, we read:

"And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven."

John Gill comments:

"John 3:13

And no man hath ascended into heaven
Though Enoch and Elias had, yet not by their own power, nor in the sense our Lord designs; whose meaning is, that no man had, or could go up to heaven, to bring from thence the knowledge of divine and heavenly things; in which sense the phrase is used in ( Deuteronomy 30:12 ) ( Romans 10:6 ) , and which may be illustrated by ( John 1:18 ) ; wherefore inasmuch as Nicodemus had acknowledged Christ to he a teacher come from God, our Lord, would have him know, that he was the only teacher of heavenly things, as being the only person that had been in heaven, and in the bosom of the Father; and therefore, if he, and the rest of the Jews, did not receive instructions from him, they must for ever remain ignorant; for there never had been, nor was, nor could be, any mere man that could go up to heaven, and learn the mysteries of God, and of the kingdom of heaven, and return and instruct men in them:"

Source

Yet Enoch teaches contrary to the New Testament saying:

"And he said to me: “Oh Enoch, look at the book of the Tablets of Heaven and read what is written upon them, and note every individual fact. And I looked at everything that was written and I noted everything. And I read the book and everything that was written in it, all the deeds of men, and all the children of flesh who will be upon the Earth, for all the generations of eternity. And then I immediately blessed the Lord, the Eternal King of Glory, in that he has made all the works of the world, and I praised the Lord because of his patience, and I blessed him on account of the sons of Adam. And at that time I said: “Blessed is the man who dies righteous and good, concerning whom no book of iniquity has been written, and against whom no guilt has been found. And these three Holy ones brought me and set me on the earth in front of the door of my house, and said to me: “Tell everything to your son Methuselah, and show all your children that no flesh is righteous, before the Lord, for He created them. For one year we will leave you with your children, until you have regained your strength, so that you may teach your children and write these things down for them, and testify to all your children. And in the second year we will take you from amongst them." -Enoch 81:1-6

And not only that, but taken "as is", Enoch was taken up twice!

Again, I ask anybody to show scripture to support this.

Enoch directly contradicts what John wrote.

You still want to argue that Enoch should be included in the canon and that it is correct?

Sorry!

God Bless

Till all are one.

Yes, he was taken up twice. Going up to heaven of their own accord as Jesus did, is different than being translated by God.

Genesis 5:24 - And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.

He didn't die, because in this passage, all those mentioned were described to have died. All of them, yet not Enoch. He just "was not"

Hebrews 11:5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

The scripture you posted is truth. No one has gone up to heaven. Because that implies that (of their own accord, doing so) but with Enoch it wasn't so. God did it all for him. God informed him. God justified him. God took him. Not him going up on his own accord, it was his destiny.

 

[SummaScriptura]

Source

So DD do you agree with your source too that the books of Daniel and Zechariah are inter-testamental books? See page 3, paragraph 4 in your source. That would make them pseudepigraphon. Do you believe, as your source does, that the Bible contains pseudepigraphal books?

 

[SummaScriptura]

Just listen to the hysteria of Jeremy James, DeaconDean's source,

Yet again we see how The Book of Enoch diminishes the stature of Christ and contradicts the Word of God in the most outrageous fashion. Its demonic origin is also evident in a cleverly blasphemous statement in chapter 18. On one of his many celestial journeys 'Enoch' claimed to have seen "the firm foundations of the earth", including "the corner-stone of the earth" [18:2] The cornerstone is an important Messianic figure, familiar to all who love God's Word, but here it is deliberately stripped of its redemptive connotations and presented merely as an inert lump of matter. The dark angel who channeled this work must have taken great satisfaction in this.

This guy is histrionic in his approach.

Here is the truth...

The section of the Book of Enoch called the Book of the Parables spends quite a few chapters describing a heavenly person whom Enoch sees. When we consider the descriptions Enoch uses for this individual, an astounding picture emerges. In Enoch, this heavenly person is said to ‘accompany the Ancient of Days’,(46:2) and is destined to become a light to the nations.(48:4) This person, portrayed in imagery as a heavenly shepherd, is shown watering his flock by an “inexhaustible Fountain of Righteousness.”(48:1) The name of this heavenly One is to be revealed only by God to His elect, and it is only in this name the elect will be saved.(48:7) It is also stated by Enoch this One existed before the creation of all things,(48:3) and is destined to take his seat on a glorious throne for the purpose of judging the world,(45:3) and it is God Himself who will seat this One on the throne of God’s own glory.(51:3) Enoch states, ultimately the entire world will bow down before this heavenly One and worship him.(48:5)

Obviously, the only person who fits this description in all those ways is Jesus Christ, who lived, died, rose from the dead, and ascended to the right hand of the Father, from where he will come again to judge the living and the dead!

In Enoch, we also learn a lot about the identity of this heavenly person from the names or titles by which he is known. Enoch calls him the Righteous One,(38:2) the Elect One,(39:6) God’s Anointed,(48:10) and the Son of Man.(46:2) All titles applied to Jesus Christ in the gospels.

 

[Devin P]

Just listen to the hysteria of Jeremy James, DeaconDean's source,
This guy is histrionic in his approach.

Here is the truth...

Beautiful response brother!

 

[yeshuasavedme]

...

"They then take one wife each and, after defiling them, teach them "charms and
enchantments, and the cutting of roots, and made them acquainted with plants." (7:1) This conflicts with the account in Genesis where Adam was created with the skills he needed to carry out the job that God had given him, which would have included a knowledge of botany (just like his knowledge of zoology). So it was not an occult skill that could be acquired only through the intervention of fallen angels, but a gift that mankind had already received from God."
...
Continued...

You've done no research of your own, but have pasted great amounts of text written by those who can easily be refuted by one acquainted with the Torah and prophets and writings (Tenach), and the book of Enoch.
In the above, for instance, the "cutting of roots" translated is speaking of gene splitting, which is how the fallen watchers got their own remnant/residue of their spirit to multiply in the stolen Adam flesh of their Adam wives.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

...

In John 3:13, we read:

"And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven."
...

Your sources keep you from really doing eye opening research into what the Word of God teaches us about the creation of Adam, and the restoration of all things in the New Man name, which New Name is "Israel", as to the DNA flesh, that Jesus will "write" upon the regenerated flesh of every redeemed believer's regenerated body, which is to be made for the Glory to indwell.

1. Adam was made in the exact bodily image of God: Genesis 1:26-28, and without sin, and the New Creation Human being flesh was the exact image of God which was to come is that image of God that the body of Adam was made in: Romans 5:14 states that Adam was made in the exact image of God who is now come in flesh of the same likeness as the first Adam, but without sin.
Adam was made to live a thousand year "day", populating the earth with sons of God of the Adam kind, who would in turn "plant the heavens"(Isa 51:16) with those sons after each fulfilled his "day" and was transformed to the Glory flesh, and to be the "temple not made with hands, for the Glory to indwell". The New man is n ow the second temple of human being kind, and God come in flesh is the Firstborn Son of God for that purpose, and the Foundation Stone laid in Zion (Jerusalem above), so that Zion, personified as a woman from Genesis 3:15 to the end of Revelation, is no longer a "barren widow", but is "married in Spirit, to the New Creation Man...So the bride of Christ is that temple not made with hands, but got by adoption of all born in Adam who will be redeemed and regenerated.
Malachi 2:15 shows us that the purpose for Adam being made male and female (Genesis 5:2) was because God sought sons (of the Adam flesh kind), to be the building stones for the "temple not made with hands" for the Glory to fill, so as to "plant the heavens" with those sons in their glorified bodies.

Adam flesh became defiled for that purpose. In the Law we learn there is no way to cleanse a clay vessel, once defiled, But God promised a total dissolving of the clay and a total regenerated flesh body for all believers by the Atonement promised at the fall, in Genesis 3:15.
The first creation human being, Adam, was created to sit on a throne with the Son of Man in heaven, ruling over the earth forever. No man has ascended to that throne, but the Son of Man is there, as God the Word, in Enoch, and now is there as the Firstborn Son of the human being kind, who is come in a New Creation name (ISrael is the name, and Jacob got the sign of the regenerated adoption flesh, as Abra"H"m got the sign of the regenerated/adopted in Spirit, sons.
So the Son of Man was reported by Jesus to be in heaven, in John, even as He was, in the flesh of New creation human being flesh on earth.
Now that He is ascended, He is back with the Father, and promises that all the regenerated sons will also sit with Him, ruling.
So the ascension Jesus spoke of was to the throne that Adam lost.
Enoch is transformed in body as the firstborn adopted son of the Living Spirit/Christ (who was the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world), and Enoch is in heaven, ruling with the Watcher angels: see him in Daniel 10 and in Revelation, as one of the seven messengers who come out of the temple with bowls of wrath in the tribulation, and who shows John the things to come, and who tells John, twice, not to worship him... and that he is a fellow prophet and kinsman, a human being, a brethren.
Enoch is a prophet, even in Revelation, when he shows John the things he had been shown...

When Enoch saw the Son of Man sitting on the throne with God, but not seen by angels or any human, Enoch saw that throne as made for that Son of Man who was with God, and who was God. "No man has ascended" (to that throne), Jesus said, "but the Son of Man who is in heaven". Jesus said that even as He was, simultaneously on earth incarnate as God the Word whom Enoch saw, and in the New Creation Human Being flesh of the New Creation "Son of God" name.
Adam was the first creation human being son of God name (Luke 3:38), and Adam fell from that position, died in spirit, to the Glory, that day, and all his seed in his loins died in that fall, as to being sons of God.

God the Word is the "Son of Man", whom Enoch saw, "in secret, with God and who was God and who was to come and who made all things and who was to be revealed and whose name was secret" in Enoch's revelation, but which name would be revealed to the redeemed who would be saved in that name.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

I don't really get how you're saying that I and Enoch are wrong. I said that satan is the serpent. Satan is a fallen angel no? That's literally calling a fallen angel the serpent. So I mean.. In Enoch it matches up with that chaining them up for 1000 years, at the very earliest, 300 years prior to that scripture being written, so I don't really get your point.

Actually, no. Satan is a whole army of created evil spirits in heaven, with one chief. The myth that satan is one being, and is a fallen angel is not Bible doctrine.
Enoch makes it plain that there are many satans, and the one who tempted Eve is named Gadreel.
The OT shows us there are many satans, which are named evil spirits in heaven, in Enoch 14, and in the OT.
Their purpose is to try, test, and tempt the angels in heaven and the sons of Adam. Their reward is the fallen as their food for eternity, in the lake of fire, for their food is to torment those who fall into their evil temptations, and in the case of the Adam creation, do not repent and receive the Atoning cleansing so that they may have eternal life, instead of eternal second death in the Lake of Fire, which is the kingdom of darkness created for the chief satan and his angels. The fallen watcher angels cannot repent, for were in heaven, and are spirits created there to do God's will. They can appear as men, in flesh that looks like men, and eat and drink....and in the case of the fallen ones, who took oaths to be cursed to never enter their own domain again, but remain in those flesh bodies, and commit fornication.
Enoch said they did that at the temptation of the satans and will be subject to them forever, in the Lake of Fire.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

...
Funny. I don't remember reading that part when Cain slew Abel.
...

Sin lay at Cain's door, tempting, trying to enter, but God the Word told Cain "you must master it/him".
Cain didn't master it/him, and became a "child of the devil by that spirit entering him", just as Judas did when Sin/Satan entered him.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

According to Enoch, "And the name of the third is Gadreel; this is the one that showed all the deadly blows to the sons of men. And he led astray Eve. And he showed the weapons of death to the children of men, the shield and the breastplate, and the sword for slaughter, and all the weapons of death to the sons of men." -Enoch 69:6
...Not to mention, we hear nothing, absolutely nothing prior to Genesis 6 of "fallen angels".

Gadreel is the name of an evil spirit, a "satan", not a fallen angel.
Enoch shows plainly that the angels descended in the days of Jared. The evil angels had control of earth and of the chambers in Sheol for torture of the unrepentant dead and the fallen angels who would be chained ,from the time of the fall of the high king and high priest of earth, the first, firstborn son of God on the human being kind, the Adam.
the passage in Genesis about the serpent eating dust is about corrupting all flesh on earth with death, and going belly of earth, in the Hebrew, in context, is getting control of the belly of the earth where the departed souls would go, who died in the first death of separation from the Glory.
The unrepentant go there in torments, and the angels went there at the flood as a sign and warning to other angels not to do the same, says Jude, but some did do the same after the flood, not heeding the warning, just as men who were warned by the sign of the everlasting fire in the nuking of Sodom & CO for the wicked fornication did do the same and do the same per Jude.

Abaddon is the name of the satan in charge of the pit/Sheol, for now.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

What is "fallen angel"?

And even at best, the text says "he taught them all the secrets of their wisdom."

Deny it all you want, the text teaches the that "fallen angel" (demon) taught man to sin.

God Bless

Till all are one.

Nope. It was an evil spirit - a Satan, named Gadreel.
The Watchers did not fall until the days of Jared.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

...

Lucifer was a cherubim. The "anointed cherub" (Eze. 28:14]..

Nope. He was not a cherub. That is not Bible doctrine.

Never, ever, ever! Will you find any scripture teaching that satan is a Fallen cherub.
You have been deceived to believe a western church doctrine that is made up, and is a big myth with no foundation in the word of God – A fairy tale.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

Mount Eden is in the third heaven. Paradise is there, and Paul tells us it is in the third heaven. The only person in the Word who is cast down from Paradise to earth below, and cannot return there, is the first, firstborn son of God of the human being kind. Adam got cast down, and in The book of Ezekiel, the spirit of the kind, the Adam, is mocked in the Adam person addressed as the prince of Tyre/ the king of Tyre.
We are all one Spirit, in Adam, and dead, in the spirit, and former sons of God, defiled in the Adamkind flesh, and we cannot return to Paradise in the defiled flesh.

 

[SummaScriptura]

I always assumed Gadreel was a Watcher and this was describing some post-Edenic temptation and sin for Eve.

 

[SummaScriptura]

I just remembered something that has puzzled me... Enoch 85:5 indicates Eve went to live with Cain in the land of Nod. Perhaps she felt sorry for him that his punishment was too much to bear? Anyway one way to read the passage is that Cain had children by his mother. Sounds bad. If that's the right way to read this, it would answer that question we've heard so often, "Where did Cain get his wife"?

 

[DeaconDean]

I don't care what you say, bottom line is:

Is it in the canon of scripture?

No?

Fact is, it wasn't discovered until the 1800's. And only in fragments at best.

The canon of scripture closed right after the last book of the OT was written.

Some 2449 years later, comes a cry to teach and/or accept it as truth.

It ain't happenng.

Its not in the canon, its not going to be added to the canon of scripture.

So you better learn to deal with it.

Case closed.

As a Baptist, in 1742 we said:

"Under the name of Holy Scripture, or the Word of God written, are now contained all the books of the Old and New Testament, which are these:

1. Of the Old Testament:
   
2. Genesis Exodus Leviticus Numbers Deuteronomy
   Joshua Judges Ruth 1 Samuel 2 Samuel
   1 Kings 2 Kings 1 Chronicles 2 Chronicles Ezra
   Nehemiah Esther Job Psalms Proverbs
   Ecclesiastes Song of Solomon Isaiah Jeremiah Lamentations
   Ezekiel Daniel Hosea Joel Amos
   Obadiah Jonah Micah Nahum Habakkuk
   Zephaniah Haggai Zechariah Malachi
3. Of the New Testament:
   
4. Matthew Mark Luke John Acts
   Romans 1 Corinthians 2 Corinthians Galatians Ephesians
   Philippians Colossians 1 Thessalonians 2 Thessalonians 1 Timothy
   2 Timothy Titus Philemon Hebrews James
   1 Peter 2 Peter 1 John 2 John 3 John
   Jude Revelation
5. The books commonly called Apocrypha, not being of divine inspiration, are no part of the canon (or rule) of the Scripture, and therefore are of no authority to the church of God, nor to be any otherwise approved, or made use of than other human writings.

Source

For the last 275 years in America, this has been what Baptists said they believe. It hasn't changed, its what I believe to this day. And I don't foresee it changing in the near or far future.

God Bless

Till all are one.