The Bible does not say the Earth Is 7,000 Years Old

[SuperCow]

is it fair to consider that if the 'days' of creation mean anything, they at least delineate periods of equal time? so each day of cretion is the same length of time be it 24 hours, 1000 years or 1 million years.

That is a fair and reasonable position to take. Would you consider it a fair position to believe that God is in control of the entire universe? And if this is the case, then time dilation (The parts of Einstein's theories that have been proven by experiment) could also play a factor? And if God created the universe, its initial phases and ongoing expansion would change the fabric of time and space within it. If God can manage our planet and also one 14 billion light years away, then the time constant of a "day" being a fixed length of time becomes somewhat meaningless. Scriptures like Psalms 90:4 are a simplification (as is the creation account) to allow us to have a conceptual grasp of God's frame of reference.

if we can agree on this, then how does that affect our consideration of the length of each day? Adam was created on the 6th day. is it fair to consider that the fall happened after the 7th day? if so then if we believe ech was say 100 million years long, then Adam was potentially 200 million years old at the fall! is this reasonble?

No, because Genesis 5:5 tells us that Adam only lived 930 years. It also implies that Cain killed Abel before Seth was born. (but considering the way the Bible tells stories in other parts of the Bible, it would be conceivable to me to appreciate an argument that it was outside of the first 130 years, even though it is definitely not written that way.)

Also, if Adam and Eve were living together for a significant period of time before the fall, it is not reasonable to think that they would not be multiplying as they were gifted to do in Genesis 1:28. As for your second question, the answer is yes. The fall could have happened after the 7th day even though the evening and morning clause is omitted, but there is just as much reason to think otherwise.

another ussue if we are teying to reconcile the genesis 1 account with science is that of the chronology of genesis 1. God created day and night before the sun was created, God created the earth and even plnt life before the sun was created - which must requirw that the was some other source of heat to replce the sun. this might all be possible and reasonable frim a scientific perspective, but not according to current theories of the universe, I believe.

Actually, according to current scientific theories as I understand it, the sun and the various planets were created concurrently. That being said it is a common fallacy to say that the Genesis account says that the earth and plant life were created before the sun. The sun existed as long as the earth did. It ignited in Genesis 1:3. It would not have been light in general from the aftermath of the Big Bang, because that happened 9 or 10 billion years earlier when there were no complex elements to make up our solar system. It is written that way, because visually, that is the way it appeared. Day and night existed from Genesis 1:5, again confirming it is the sun. However, just like you cannot see what the shape of the sun or moon is on an overcast day, you also cannot see it whenall over the earth this is going on:

 

[BeyondET]

Seasons are an artificial delineation of time created by man. (Perhaps originally by God, but it doesn't matter.) Everywhere on earth has weather related cycles that repeat (on average) annually, Whether they refer to them as a rainy season, dry season, typhoon season is irrelevant. We only have spring/summer/fall/winter, because it was influential countries based in temperate zones that propagated that.

The sun still causes seasons. They wouldn't exist without it and would be much different in a binary or trinary star system, regardless of the earth's tilt. The moon can affect climate, but since its revolutionary period is much shorter, I don't think I'd say it affects the seasons.

Seasons are apart of time, the whole universe is. If seasons are artificial delineation created by man then so is 24 hours.

Spring, summer, fall, winter, is only at certain latitudes not all places on earth have those four seasons that's a fact. If you live in an area that has four seasons you'll experience four seasons, not all people experience such things to a degree that's noticeable to delegate four distinct changes in temperature and how nature responds to those changes dubbed seasons.

When leaves on trees die off and fall to the ground that's fall to some to others they've never experience temperature changes witness leaves dying and a tree that looks dead, springs to life in warmer seasons. They only know wet or dry seasons or constant wet or dry, hot, cold. All that diversity in different types of seasons across the planet is mostly because of one thing, a 23 degree tilt.

There is no seasons on the closet planet to the sun just extreme heat and radiation. A planets proximity to the sun has the upmost influence on climates throughout the solar system including earth. Each with its own spin rate tilt size satellites etc., that also influence seasons to a lesser degree.

The sun is super dangerous nothing can live anywhere near it, it's only season is death.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

And God said: Let there be lights made in the firmament of heaven, to divide the day and the night, and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days and years:
[Gen 1:14]

 

[BeyondET]

And God said: Let there be lights made in the firmament of heaven, to divide the day and the night, and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days and years:
[Gen 1:14]

Constellations

Job 38:32
Can you bring forth the constellations in their seasons or lead out the Bear and her cubs?

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

Constellations

Job 38:32
Can you bring forth the constellations in their seasons or lead out the Bear and her cubs?

What does your reply mean? are you implying that seasons should really be constellations?

 

[BeyondET]

What does your reply mean? are you implying that seasons should really be constellations?

That's what people in Job's time used, today no we have atomic clocks ran off the timing of an atom.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

That's what people in Job's time used, today no we have atomic clocks ran off the timing of an atom.

Your replies are very confusing. the verse in Genesis that I quoted uses the word seasons. It is a reference to seasons that the people of Israel would use for farming and other purposes in the coming centuries. And since it is God who gave seasons to the people it follows that it is not humans that invented seasons.

 

[BeyondET]

Your replies are very confusing. the verse in Genesis that I quoted the. uses the word seasons. It is a reference to seasons that the people of Israel would use for farming and other purposes in the coming centuries. And since it is God who gave seasons to the people it follows that it is not humans that invented seasons.

Yes, each month a new constellation is in the night sky, they used the moon cycle also, star rise counting, big dipper counterclockwise etc.

Indeed God created the earth to be tilted thus invented seasons along with the lights in the expanse to appear at different intervals in their seasons.

 

[SuperCow]

Seasons are apart of time, the whole universe is. If seasons are artificial delineation created by man then so is 24 hours.

Spring, summer, fall, winter, is only at certain latitudes not all places on earth have those four seasons that's a fact. If you live in an area that has four seasons you'll experience four seasons, not all people experience such things to a degree that's noticeable to delegate four distinct changes in temperature and how nature responds to those changes dubbed seasons.

Yes, hours and minutes and seconds are artificial delineations as well. There's no reason why we couldn't rework a day to a metric like system where there is 10 hours in a day, composed of 100 minutes per hour and 100 seconds per minute. A second would then be 86.4% as long as a current second.

Furthermore, we could call Oct.1 - March 31 winter and April 1-Sept. 30 summer if we wanted to. It's artificial to the whim of whoever first came up with the current system.

When leaves on trees die off and fall to the ground that's fall to some to others they've never experience temperature changes witness leaves dying and a tree that looks dead, springs to life in warmer seasons. They only know wet or dry seasons or constant wet or dry, hot, cold. All that diversity in different types of seasons across the planet is mostly because of one thing, a 23 degree tilt.

There is no seasons on the closet planet to the sun just extreme heat and radiation. A planets proximity to the sun has the upmost influence on climates throughout the solar system including earth. Each with its own spin rate tilt size satellites etc., that also influence seasons to a lesser degree.

The sun is super dangerous nothing can live anywhere near it, it's only season is death.

A season is a season, regardless of how long it is. And remind me how this is an argument against the sun creating seasons on earth? It has escaped me what the original point of your argument was?

 

[BeyondET]

Yes, hours and minutes and seconds are artificial delineations as well. There's no reason why we couldn't rework a day to a metric like system where there is 10 hours in a day, composed of 100 minutes per hour and 100 seconds per minute. A second would then be 86.4% as long as a current second.

Furthermore, we could call Oct.1 - March 31 winter and April 1-Sept. 30 summer if we wanted to. It's artificial to the whim of whoever first came up with the current system.



A season is a season, regardless of how long it is. And remind me how this is an argument against the sun creating seasons on earth? It has escaped me what the original point of your argument was?

Actually 24 hours is pretty accurate, the big dipper makes a complete rotation once every 24 hours though counterclockwise, That's another way of knowing a day length on earth. It's accurate with mechanical clocks

The sun doesn't create seasons its a ball of atomic fusion that's it. In Hawaii they have only two seasons summer and winter and that is just slight temperature change in afew degrees there is no spring or fall. I agree they are only words to describe changes in temperatures and or weather over periods of time. The names don't represent artificial accuracies.

 

[SuperCow]

Actually 24 hours is pretty accurate, the big dipper makes a complete rotation once every 24 hours though counterclockwise, That's another way of knowing a day length on earth. It's accurate with mechanical clocks
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I don't understand how that relates to what I said. The 10 hour day would be just as accurate. The hour would just be 2.4x longer.

The sun doesn't create seasons its a ball of atomic fusion that's it. In Hawaii they have only two seasons summer and winter and that is just slight temperature change in afew degrees there is no spring or fall. I agree they are only words to describe changes in temperatures and or weather over periods of time. The names don't represent artificial accuracies.

The earth's tilt does not create seasons either. Without a heat source like the sun, the earth is just a frozen ball in space. You need a partnership of the two to create different seasons.

 

[BeyondET]

I don't understand how that relates to what I said. The 10 hour day would be just as accurate. The hour would just be 2.4x longer.



The earth's tilt does not create seasons either. Without a heat source like the sun, the earth is just a frozen ball in space. You need a partnership of the two to create different seasons.

So there's no point in going to 10 hour day because as you said 24 hour day is just as accurate to a complete rotation of earth.

O ok, like Venus and the Sun have a partnership and create such wonderful seasons? Yeah you don't understand how seasons are created on planets.

 

[Gary K]

Our perception of age is based on the hugh assumption that planet is in its current position all the times, in terms of spacetime. The Bible clearly said that God ever (at least once recorded) 'froze' time to allow the Jews to win. We don't know how our dating methods shall work under that situation.

God didn't freeze time or nothing would have happened that benefited the Israelites.. He froze the rotation of the earth.

 

[SuperCow]

So there's no point in going to 10 hour day because as you said 24 hour day is just as accurate to a complete rotation of earth.

Irrelevant. My point was that dividing the day into 24 hours is arbitrary, just like 10 would be. It could easily be some other division, but that what someone invented and now everyone does it that way, because that is what they learned. In the same way, people arbitrarily picked 4 seasons and 12 months, although some cultures picked 2 seasons and 13 months. It doesn't matter.

O ok, like Venus and the Sun have a partnership and create such wonderful seasons? Yeah, you don't understand how seasons are created on planets.

Again, Venus is irrelevant. Earth cannot have seasons without the sun, because otherwise the temperature would be the same all over the planet with the possible exception of geothermal activity which would not create a season. I don't see what's so hard to understand about that.

 

[BeyondET]

Irrelevant. My point was that dividing the day into 24 hours is arbitrary, just like 10 would be. It could easily be some other division, but that what someone invented and now everyone does it that way, because that is what they learned. In the same way, people arbitrarily picked 4 seasons and 12 months, although some cultures picked 2 seasons and 13 months. It doesn't matter.



Again, Venus is irrelevant. Earth cannot have seasons without the sun, because otherwise the temperature would be the same all over the planet with the possible exception of geothermal activity which would not create a season. I don't see what's so hard to understand about that.

Why not call cats dogs, you analogy is pointless. Besides Jesus used a 12 hour analogy not a 10 hour. And you know what it only happens twice.

John 11:9
Jesus answered, Are there not twelve hours in the day? If any man walk in the day, he stumbleth not, because he seeth the light of this world.

Like I said you have no idea about seasons. And of coarse the earth would just be a cold rock. Thats not creating seasons but the light and heat source.

If the earth didn't spin and was tidal locked to the sun, you know the two seasons there would be. One side baked the other side frozen.

Temperature fluctuates all over the planet because it's a sphere. The equator is the hottest because it's closer to the sun. There would be no life on earth without the sun I'd agree.

Earth's distance and angle and circumference determines the temperature across the globe and seasons. The only thing the sun does is produce light and heat, plasma, etc., in all directions in the solar system.

 

[BeyondET]

God didn't freeze time or nothing would have happened that benefited the Israelites.. He froze the rotation of the earth.

Or maybe He just moved the shadow and nothing else.

 

[SuperCow]

Why not call cats dogs, you analogy is pointless. Besides Jesus used a 12 hour analogy not a 10 hour. And you know what it only happens twice.

So what? It's still artificial like I said. There's no technical reason why we have to use 24 hours instead of any other number and no technical reason why we have 4 seasons and not 2 or 6 or 12. The weather in February is always different than March, even though they're both part of a season called winter by many humans. Therefore, you could call it another season.

John 11:9
Jesus answered, Are there not twelve hours in the day? If any man walk in the day, he stumbleth not, because he seeth the light of this world.

So what? Why would Jesus reference anything other than what was in common use because someone created a way to count time thousands of years earlier.

Like I said you have no idea about seasons. And of coarse the earth would just be a cold rock. Thats not creating seasons but the light and heat source.

Without a heat source, there are no seasons. Not sure why anyone would disagree with that.

If the earth didn't spin and was tidal locked to the sun, you know the two seasons there would be. One side baked the other side frozen.

Actually, there would be only one season, regardless of which side you lived on. Seasons are when the climate changes, which wouldn't happen in any particular spot in this scenario.

Temperature fluctuates all over the planet because it's a sphere. The equator is the hottest because it's closer to the sun. There would be no life on earth without the sun I'd agree.

And no seasons; because as you pointed out, there would be no temperature fluctuations.

Earth's distance and angle and circumference determines the temperature across the globe and seasons. The only thing the sun does is produce light and heat, plasma, etc., in all directions in the solar system.

Without the sun, the temperature would be uniform across the globe, and therefore there would be no seasons.

 

[BeyondET]

So what? It's still artificial like I said. There's no technical reason why we have to use 24 hours instead of any other number and no technical reason why we have 4 seasons and not 2 or 6 or 12. The weather in February is always different than March, even though they're both part of a season called winter by many humans. Therefore, you could call it another season.



So what? Why would Jesus reference anything other than what was in common use because someone created a way to count time thousands of years earlier.



Without a heat source, there are no seasons. Not sure why anyone would disagree with that.



Actually, there would be only one season, regardless of which side you lived on. Seasons are when the climate changes, which wouldn't happen in any particular spot in this scenario.



And no seasons; because as you pointed out, there would be no temperature fluctuations.



Without the sun, the temperature would be uniform across the globe, and therefore there would be no seasons.

You are really ignorant if you think a heat source creates seasons. That's stupidity sorry but your not thinking at all.

One season of hot and cold, that makes no sense. What's up with the desperation of wanting the sun to create seasons.

 

[SuperCow]

You are really ignorant if you think a heat source creates seasons. That's stupidity sorry but you're not thinking at all.

You're ignorant if you don't think that you need both.

One season of hot and cold, that makes no sense. What's up with the desperation of wanting the sun to create seasons.

If one side is always hot, and other side is always cold, then there is only one season on the hot side and one season on the cold side. It's not too hard to figure out.

 

[BeyondET]

You're ignorant if you don't think that you need both.



If one side is always hot, and other side is always cold, then there is only one season on the hot side and one season on the cold side. It's not too hard to figure out.

Haha, that would be two seasons on earth not one as you mentioned before, that isn't hard to understand.

SuperCow said
Actually, there would be only one season, regardless of which side you lived on.


The earth needs a light source and heat. Seasons are product of earth being a tilted spinning sphere at a certain distance from the sun which that alone allows for different seasons. Not the constant light and heat from the sun.